Isra: Muhammad or Musa?
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Hello fbahadir
I truely elieve that the purpose of Israa was to support the Mirajj, .... so if it was only the Mirajj that happeded then no one would have believed the prophet, but because he proved his Israa (as you know from the history) then there is no reason to disbelieve what he said about the Mirajj
Allah knows best
Salam (greeting)
So you think that if people can believe in a nocturne journey between two earthly locations, it will be easier for them to believe in a journey to heavens where prophet Muhammad had a conversation with God during which he bargained the number of prayers per day (with the instruction and supervision of Moses)?
You always ask for "evidence" from the quraan for the smallest information, yet you come with a huge story like this, attribute it to the prophet, and do not give even one verse to support your claim?
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So you think that if people can believe in a nocturne journey between two earthly locations, it will be easier for them to believe in a journey to heavens where prophet Muhammad had a conversation with God during which he bargained the number of prayers per day (with the instruction and supervision of Moses)?
You always ask for "evidence" from the quraan for the smallest information, yet you come with a huge story like this, attribute it to the prophet, and do not give even one verse to support your claim?
you are truely a manipulator
here is what I said again
I truely elieve that the purpose of Israa was to support the Mirajj, .... so if it was only the Mirajj that happeded then no one would have believed the prophet, but because he proved his Israa (as you know from the history) then there is no reason to disbelieve what he said about the Mirajj
Allah knows best
can you bloody see that O said "I truely elieve that the purpose of Israa was to support the Mirajj"
can you also see that I said "(as you know from the history)", i.e. I didn't associate anything to the prophet as you do
can you also see that I ended my comment by "Allah knows best"
finally, someone calling himself a Muslim like you who does not even understand the smallest guidance in it which if been greeted you should the leastt reply with the same greeting if not better and I have seen other greeting you and you dont reply the greeting so you have proven to be ignorant and only wants to pick on me therefore you have been dismissed
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but because he proved his Israa Allah knows best
I didn't associate anything to the prophet as you do
Then who is "he" in "he proved his israa"?
You say
I truely believe that the purpose of Israa was to support the Mirajj, the Mirajj was the main mircale to raise the prophet spitit after he was opposed hard in the first few years of his mission,
I say
So you think that if people can believe in a nocturne journey between two earthly locations (i.e. isra), it will be easier for them to believe in a journey to heavens (i.e.miraj) where prophet Muhammad had a conversation with God during which he bargained the number of prayers per day (with the instruction and supervision of Moses)?
(words in brackets are addition to make it easier or you to understand)
But if you don't understand English, nor do you know logic, don't accuse people of manipulation. Blame it on your shortcomings.
And finally, what's the point of greeting people when you use such language
you are truely a manipulator
can you bloody see
you have proven to be ignorant
you have been dismissed
What to call this one
I have seen other greeting you and you dont reply the greeting
(If you have nothing to do/say, be a judge)!
All this, and no constructive reply!!
And finally
only wants to pick on me
Stop being paranoid.
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Bla blah
http//free-islam.com/extraimages/dismissed.gif
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you know ahmed it's a thread - a continuing conversation, so is there really a need to give you a salam on every post?
i notice a few posts above she actually said "salam ahmed" when she began addressing you... but you ignored that apparently and just started to crap on her... haha
you know there's probably not much sense in you even saying salam or peace or anything to people if you don't really mean it anyways.
as far as i can see it, giving no greeting at all in reply to someone who gives a greeting they don't even mean is actually a better greeting, so perhaps it meets the criteria after all
do you believe that a man called muhammad flew from a city called mecca to a city called jerusalem on the back of a horse with the head of a lady? (see descriptions of buraq)
you're so funny, when you want people on this site to believe stuff you call it history instead of hadith, but it's still hadith... i hope these kids are on to you
dissed... but not missed
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you know ahmed it's a thread - a continuing conversation, so is there really a need to give you a salam on every post?
i notice a few posts above she actually said "salam ahmed" when she began addressing you... but you ignored that apparently and just started to crap on her... haha
you know there's probably not much sense in you even saying salam or peace or anything to people if you don't really mean it anyways.
as far as i can see it, giving no greeting at all in reply to someone who gives a greeting they don't even mean is actually a better greeting, so perhaps it meets the criteria after all )
Hello
Well, I didn't really mean that she has done it with me rather with others, now the Quran tells when you are greeted reply wiith the same or better, it doe not say when you are in the mid of a discussion you should not
also forum discussions is not like real face to face discussions
do you believe that a man called muhammad flew from a city called mecca to a city called jerusalem on the back of a horse with the head of a lady? (see descriptions of buraq)
Well, I believe that he was caused to travel between the two places, how?, I have no idea, but sure I believe 100% that it happened as the Quran told us
you're so funny, when you want people on this site to believe stuff you call it history instead of hadith, but it's still hadith... i hope these kids are on to you P
dissed... but not missed
Hmm, well if the history does not contradict the Quran then there is no reason to reject that history, on the other hand accepting that old history that does not contradict the Quran is far safer than accepting the fairy tales stories by many in here which contradict the Quran
Here is an example
Moses Asra bi Ibad Allah as 171 says, hahahaha
But 171 never mentioned Moses nor it mentioned Ibad Allah (Plural)
Can you see the clear cut and invented fairy tale that clearly contradicts the Quran?
At least it contradicts the Quran because 171 said, "Bi Abdihi" (Singular)
Looks like you are confused yourself
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Peace bro AhmedBahgat,
now the Quran tells when you are greeted reply wiith the same or better, it doe not say when you are in the mid of a discussion you should not
Does Quran say anything about the good manners? How to behave with others, what kind of behaviour and language we should use when engaged in a discussion?
Does Quran allow such kind of behaviour?
you are truely a manipulator
Quote
can you bloody seeQuote
you have proven to be ignorantQuote
you have been dismissedPeace all, Hamsa
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Peace bro AhmedBahgat,
Does Quran say anything about the good manners? How to behave with others, what kind of behaviour and language we should use when engaged in a discussion?
Does Quran allow such kind of behaviour?
Peace all, Hamsa
Salam (Greeting)
Good that you brought this up, of course the Quran told us about the good manners, however the good manners with those who dont manipulate the religion to suit their own low desires and mislead thousands of others, I consider those the enemy of my religion, as simple as this
Cheers
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also forum discussions is not like real face to face discussions
lucky for you, sad for your local dental surgeons.
Looks like you are confused yourself
haha what am i confused about? you're the one who assumed the because i don't agree with your view that i automatically agree with the other view... maybe i don't agree with either, how's that grab you?
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Salam (Greeting)
Good that you brought this up, of course the Quran told us about the good manners, however the good manners with those who dont manipulate the religion to suit their own low desires and mislead thousands of others, I consider those the enemy of my religion, as simple as this
Cheers
Peace bro Ahmed
As far I know, wrong is he who deliberately mix falsehood with the truth and deliberately misguide others. Am I wrong?
242 And do not mix up the truth with the falsehood, nor hide the truth while you know (it).
How can we judge what the real intentions of those people who are sharing their knowledge with all of us on this forum? Only God can judge others, we can always make a mistake while judging others. IMHO, you can be more effective if you are humble in your approach while discussing.
May Allah guide all of us to the right path.
Hamsa
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lucky for you, sad for your local dental surgeons.
hmmm
haha what am i confused about?
a lot, how about you debate me in anything that is Quran related and I will prove it to you inshaallah?
you're the one who assumed the because i don't agree with your view that i automatically agree with the other view... maybe i don't agree with either, how's that grab you?
hmmm, then tell us what you believe in as we told you what we believe in or do you feel ashamed to tell us what you believe in?
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a lot, how about you debate me in anything that is Quran related and I will prove it to you inshaallah?
why would i waste my time in a debate with you when you already have an established belief system to which you adhere stoically?
i've watched you obviously outmatched in debates for years and never give up your position so i'd rather use my energy for something more fun than frustrating myself with you
hmmm, then tell us what you believe in as we told you what we believe in or do you feel ashamed to tell us what you believe in?
shame? haha is that an effort to try to appeal to my egotistical side to engage in a discourse of this nature with you?
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Peace bro Ahmed
As far I know, wrong is he who deliberately mix falsehood with the truth and deliberately misguide others. Am I wrong?
Salam (Greeting) brother Hamsa
Of course, however if they deliberately mix falsehood with the truth then that is enough to convict them as deliberately;y misguiding others, see when someone insist that Abdihi (Singular) is Ibad Allah (Plural) then that person must be deliberately mixing falsehood with the truth, it might not be in their intention to misguide others but surely it is in their intention to Yahrifo (Manipulate) the Singular word Abdihi and make it plural (Ibad Allah), i guess a smart kid should recognise their fatal mistake
242 And do not mix up the truth with the falsehood, nor hide the truth while you know (it).
Exactly, now you need to tell your pals who do just that by telling us that Abdihi (Singular) is Ibad Allah (Plural)
Regarding the part of red, of course they know it, THEY BLOODY KNOW THAT A SINGUALR CAN'T BE PLURAL unless Allah is talking about Himself by using (Nahnu) i.e. (We) yet they cone to us and tell us Abdihi (Singular) = (Ibad Allah (Plural)
your argument will be valid if they lack the knowledge that a single human can't be a group of humans, if they are ignorant to that degree then I will concede to you regarding the above verse
How can we judge what the real intentions of those people who are sharing their knowledge with all of us on this forum?
Very simple, we can know when they come with non sense that defies common sense, like a single human = a group of humans then bloody use the Quran to justify their fatal mistake
Only God can judge others,
It depends what type of judgment you are talking about, if you mean everything then sorry you are only following the feel good religion concept, of course we can judge what others say using our brains that Allah gave it to us, now my bloody brain tells me that a single can't be plural if we talk humans, do you agree with that?
we can always make a mistake while judging others.
True, but it can't be a mistake when we say that person (who claims that a single human = a group of humans) is a clear cut ignorant and is misleading others, his/her ignorance though is affecting something very vital in the religion of Islam which is the miracle of Israa and indirectly accuses all Muslims of being fools, yet he/she provided no evidences but their wishful thinking
IMHO, you can be more effective if you are humble in your approach while discussing.
I can only be effective if I'm myself, I can't pretend to be humble so others like what I say, I really care less if they like it. respect me or not, I will continue to expose anyone even my father if they come and tell us non sense like a single human is a group of humans then bloody use the Quran to justify that while the Quran clearly exposes them yet they turn a blind eye and not admit their fatal mistake, that is why their action must be deliberate and they know it if they insist that a single = a plural
May Allah guide all of us to the right path.
It is not gonna happen over night with magic, it can only happen if we stick to His guidance in His words without manipulating it
Salam
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i've watched you obviously outmatched in debates for years and never give up your position
Why don't you show us JUST BLOODY one link to one debate if you are truthful?
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Why don't you show us JUST BLOODY one link to one debate if you are truthful?
what, will you concede victory based on my standards? i doubt it... when have i seen you admit to being wrong? haha
you sure get riled up in a hurry though... and use the "if you are truthful" line... why how scriptural of you
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what, will you concede victory based on my standards? i doubt it... when have i seen you admit to being wrong? haha
you sure get riled up in a hurry though... and use the "if you are truthful" line... why how scriptural of you
my request stands, show a url if you are truthful
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anyone who wants to can just click on your profile and look at a history of all your posts and see when you have "lost" a "debate" and failed to concede victory... oftentimes you end those posts which you failed to win with something like "dismissed" or calling people liars or wrongdoers, or accusing people of twisting the quran to their own desires.
sadly for you ahmed my being truthful has very little to do with whether i post a url or not
enjoy yourself, it's a celebration P
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anyone who wants to can just click on your profile and look at a history of all your posts and see when you have "lost" a "debate" and failed to concede victory... oftentimes you end those posts which you failed to win with something like "dismissed" or calling people liars or wrongdoers, or accusing people of twisting the quran to their own desires.
sadly for you ahmed my being truthful has very little to do with whether i post a url or not
enjoy yourself, it's a celebration P
LOL
Yeh every one knows that they can click my profile and see my threads, what's new?, come on are you that novice?
on the other hand I have never lost a debate, bring your evidences if you are truthful, if you dont then you will be claissfied as a clear cut liar
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haha classified by who? by you? big deal
if i wanted to burn up my time sifting through your previous posts i'm pretty sure i could find a post where anwar schooled you on arabic linguistics and you refused to concede on the grounds that you are a so called native arabic speaker.
i don't have to bring forth any evidence - like i said, anyone can look at your previous posts and let you speak for yourself... the evidence is already brought forth dude, it's all right there for anyone who wishes to check.
see? you claim that you have never lost a debate... that's your own (unwarranted) opinion of yourself and your posts
if you had any truth to yourself you would at least be able to admit the times you lost
anyways enjoy yourself with this isra issue - don't fall off the soap box
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Peace Fahad and all,
Yes it does make sense but how do you interpret 'al-masjid al-haram' then?
Thanks, Hamsa
Hmm.. interesting, based on Fahad's assumption that 171 is referring to Moses and people of Israel migration from Masjdil Haram to Masjidil Aqsa.
I can add that there are ancient legends on Jewish community which state that their "first kiblah" (direction) is somewhere in the southern region (HebrewNegev). Which can be Egypt or Sinai... The southern kiblah was used before the first temple period, to commemorate them that God has performed miraculous work to release them from the "land of slavery" (Mitsraim / Egypt).
If you read the Tanakh there are some verses which indicate that Moses and David were prostrating to the "Negev" (Hebrew South/Southern) direction as an act of gratitude / saying thanks to God.
Salam