Ramadan
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Greetings lk,
Interesting....
Also, I was just looking, and 1926 came to my attention. Here, it is clearly stated in Arabic that 'S-w-m' is to abstain from speaking. No interpolations, no assumptions, no reading between the lines.
Verily I have vowed to the Most Gracious abstinance I am not speaking 'in-see-yann' -- Samia, please help me out....can this be seen also as a form four active participle of the root 'n-s-w' or 'n-s-y'?? If so, then we can tie this in to my message above....
in that case the translation might be something like
Verily, I have vowed to the Most Gracious abstinance I am not speaking in the way of forgetting (as an active participle -- can that be?)
Please, Arabic grammarians help me out!
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Salaam all
I will address your posts by trying to explain the root for these problematic words
Women In the quraan, two words were used for women
1- nisaa' from the root nuun seen hamza, which means the late, the left behind. Also used in the prohibited usuary "rib al-nasee'a", where the first agreement is changed when the one in debt asks for more time (delay of payment).2- nuswa from the root nuun, seen wau to forget the forgotten.
Some linguists refer the word "insaan and insiyyun " to this root; but the majority refer it to the root alif nuun seen, the opposite of wild.The two meanings (tamed and forgotten) might be related somehow being quiet (tamed/ not wild) will lead to being forgotten (my understnding)..
Seen wau meem stagnation, opposite of movement; and used for abstaining from eating and drinking (movement of the digestive system), talking (movement of the buccal apparatus) and walking (movement of motor muscles). The object of abstaining, therefore, has to be mentioned (absatining from talikg, eating, moving).
References http//www.baheth.info/all.jsp?tm=
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Peace ILisa,
Yes, I did see this before and realized what it is. That is what is so convincing. This is a very, very good point. In fact, this year during the time of the 'scorching heat', I thought about fasting, but didn't -- for whatever reason. Despite this, I admit that I do have it in my mind to fast the next upcoming one to see how I fare -- how it feels and what benefit I reap from it. I'm planning to do this not only because your thesis is so sound, but I did some research and there is a long history of other groups of people recognizing the significance of the full moon closest to the summer solstice --that it is a time to receive guidance and spiritual insight, so they fast or perform specific rituals. This point in particular adds significant weight to the validity of your understanding as far as I'm concerned.
Indeed, this moon is very dramatic and noteiceable. It is natural that people all over used it as a marker because everyone can easily witness it and you don't need some self-proclaimed religious authority to tell you "now is the right time". The picture in my avatar is from the first time I observed it and abstained accordingly. It is funny because someone was mentioning that "Ramadan is here a couple of weeks ago" in front of my daughter and her natural reaction was that she got very excited and said "can we go see the red moon?" Of course, the person was talking about the sectarian meaningless Ramadan and not the meaningful "shahr ramadan". This dramatic sighting of the red moon is a marker even for young children. I bet you that no Sunni adults (let alone kids) ever say "let's go witness "shahr ramadan"".
Additionally, as I have mentioned in another posting here, I feel that to fast a 'ramadan' at different times every year -- out of sync with the earth and its seasons, is very disorienting. I did it for 18 years and it just never felt 'right', always a bit out of balance. In general, I found it to be very 'off-putting'.
I have still not come to a conclusion which understanding is best. I guess that what I'm hoping for in my heart, is that when I abstain from food and drink next year at the time of the 'scorching heat' that I will gain particular guidance or insight that will help improve my spiritual 'lackings'. That, certainly, would be a most satisfying outcome to this for me on a personal level. Then I will feel that I 'know' and truly understand what it means to 'witness shahr ramadan' and what Sawm means. Until then, I guess I'm still hanging.....
But thank you for your post, and giving me the opportunity to think about this yet again.
handshakePersonally, I find that the correct course of action (in this and all issues) is to follow the best available understanding while keeping in mind that no human understanding is absolutely perfect and so be open to better understandings as they become available.
Peace,
Ayman
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WHY WE HAVE TO FAST ????????????
It may sound weired to most of you but after going through most or all of the verses in the great reading I could not find one clear verse which tell us to fast.I will put below the verses to show that actually fasting is a punishment from GOD for disobeying his laws.We can start with
Ramadan is the month during which the Quran was revealed, providing guidance for the people, clear teachings, and the statute book. Those of you who witness this month shall fast therein. Those who are ill or traveling may substitute the same number of other days. GOD wishes for you convenience, not hardship, that you may fulfill your obligations, and to glorify GOD for guiding you, and to express your appreciation.
In the above verse we can see that GOD is addressing to a group of people by referring to THOSE OF YOU and not ALL OF YOU.Had he meant the entire population to fast he would have clearly asked everyone of us to fast in the month of Ramadan.We would see in the following verse that who are THOSE people whom GOD is asking to fast.
BREAKING STATE OF IHRAAM
You shall observe the complete rites of Hajj and
Umrah for GOD. If you are prevented, you shall send an offering, and do not resume cutting your hair until your offering has reached its destination. If you are ill, or suffering a head injury (and you must cut your hair), you shall expiate by fasting, or giving to charity, or some other form of worship. During the normal Hajj, if you break the state of Ihraam (sanctity) betweenUmrah and Hajj, you shall expiate by offering an animal sacrifice. If you cannot afford it, you shall fast three days during Hajj and seven when you return home - this completes ten - provided you do not live at the Sacred Masjid. You shall observe GOD, and know that GOD is strict in enforcing retributionIn 2196 God is asking those people to fast who are prevented from performing Hajj or Umrah ( there is saperate debate on this issue ) and also those people who breaks the state of Ihraam.Now we move to another verse
KILLING A BELIEVER
No believer shall kill another believer, unless it is an accident. If one kills a believer by accident, he shall atone by freeing a believing slave, and paying a compensation to the victim's family, unless they forfeit such a compensation as a charity. If the victim belonged to people who are at war with you, though he was a believer, you shall atone by freeing a believing slave. If he belonged to people with whom you have signed a peace treaty, you shall pay the compensation in addition to freeing a believing slave. If you cannot find* a slave to free, you shall atone by fasting two consecutive months, in order to be redeemed by GOD. GOD is Knower, Most Wise
We can clearly see in 492 that again GOD is referring to those people who are unable to pay compensation and yet have to fast for two consecutive months.
OATH VIOLATION
GOD does not hold you responsible for the mere utterance of oaths; He holds you responsible for your actual intentions. If you violate an oath, you shall atone by feeding ten poor people from the same food you offer to your own family, or clothing them, or by freeing a slave. If you cannot afford this, then you shall fast three days. This is the atonement for violating the oaths that you swore to keep. You shall fulfill your oaths. GOD thus explains His revelations to you, that you may be appreciative.
KIILING GAME DURING PILGRIMAGE
O you who believe, do not kill any game during pilgrimage. Anyone who kills any game on purpose, his fine shall be a number of livestock animals that is equivalent to the game animals he killed. The judgment shall be set by two equitable people among you. They shall make sure that the offerings reach the Ka`bah. Otherwise, he may expiate by feeding poor people, or by an equivalent fast to atone for his offense. GOD has pardoned past offenses. But if anyone returns to such an offense, GOD will avenge it. GOD is Almighty, Avenger.ESTRANGE THEIR WIVES AS MOTHERS
Those among you who estrange their wives (by declaring them as forbidden in sex) as their mothers know full well that they are not their mothers.* Their mothers are the women who gave birth to them. Indeed, they are committing a blasphemy and a falsehood. GOD is Pardoner, Forgiver.
Those who estrange their wives in this manner, then reconcile thereafter, shall atone by freeing a slave before resuming their sexual relations. This is to enlighten you. GOD is Cognizant of everything you do.If you cannot find a slave to free, you shall fast two consecutive months before resuming sexual relations. If you cannot fast, then you shall feed sixty poor people. You shall believe in GOD and His messenger. These are GOD's laws. The disbelievers have incurred a painful retribution.
With reference to above verses we can see a pattern where GOD is asking those people who have violated above laws to fast for respective days.This also gives us a clear picture of 2184 where GOD is mentioning SPECIFIC DAYS these specific days are 10days , 3 days and 60 days depending on the violation committed.
May be my opinion defers with rest of the people on free minds but this is my understanding , please give your views and suggestions
I agree with you 100% bro! Exactly my thoughts too!
I wonder why people here ignore this.
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Hello everybody...
Sometimes I wonder if the month of Ramadhan was added later to the names of the months and might not have existed prior to the quran's revelation.It may not be a reptitive month,that is not like December which comes every year. If Ramadhan is a super special month, how to identify it? Remember God says he does not want to impose any hardship. Back to the special month, this is equavalent to a thousand months..I wonder if everyone else besides myself is so very unclear about what this means. It is to indicate a sort of a count? Every one thousandth month,bingo!! (1 month 30 days , naturaly 30,000 days or every 83+years). Is there any astronomical phoenomenum that corresponds to this?And that heralder mentioned in the quran,that is bit quite a bit of a mystery.
each day the quran/this community bring some kinda excitement and I am not ashamed about throwing away old notions about this fasting thingy. even about the scorching moon we see different viewsthe reddish moon during the hottest month(now) and the red moon we see(so far only in pictures for me) during an eclipse..I may be entirely wrong but if there is no compulsary fasting month, here are the things we/biz communities will miss
saying "happy Eid"
sending cards
Ramadhan Baazars and an excuse to buy new things and....offtopic I donno ..in where I live (Singapore), right now the none monothestic chinese folks have started burning their joss papers/incence to welcome the hungry ghost month.The muslim world will be fasting soon.I just wonder why the theme of food has become so prevalent during the hottest month of the year..
salam and rock on...(I will post a mp3 of a song for my rock album in the Trash section this week..it's ok if you don't give a rat's tail.....)
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Peace Rajah,
Sometimes I wonder if the month of Ramadhan was added later to the names of the months and might not have existed prior to the quran's revelation.
You are partially right. Both the word "month" and the name "Ramadhan" are later additions.
According to Classical Arabic dictionaries, the word "shahr" which is wrongly translated as "month" actually means "the moon when it is apparent and nearly full". Here is the extract copied and pasted from Lisan Al-3arab
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The word "ramadan" means "scorching", i.e. red and hot.
So the term "shahr ramadah" actually means "scorching full-moon".
In ancient times people used to describe the full moons using terms such as "harvest moon", "red moon", "strawberry moon", etc. The moon around the summer solstice was called "red moon" because it appears reddish in color. This is also a time of heat. So this would naturally explain the expression "scorching full-moon". This has nothing to do with calendars and their named months. See more info here
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/science/timing.htm
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace
Something that recently came to me whilst reading and discussing the Qur'an with people is the use of stand alone words to disguise the true meaning. Words like Qur'an, Islam, Muslim, Ramadhan are words that should be driectly translated to english as well so that a fuller meaning can be gained. Otherwise it appears like they are words common only to Arab muslims which removes the universality of the Message. It also removes the true meaning of the words. Muslim essentially means monotheist. Islam means devotion wholly to the God. Qur'an means THE Recitation. An arab person would read these words and understand the meaning whereas a non-arab would read these words and inherit the meaning they know from the world and culture around them, not what the words actually mean. When we translate Ramadhan to Scorching Heat we have to ask ourselves, what does this mean now? Instead of looking to our calendars for an arbitrary month.
Peace
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Hello Ayman,
So the whole thing was about the moon..mm.I have read the article before but this morning made it a lot more clearer.So it is like
12 full moons = 30 days x 12 months = 360 days
Year starts with the full moon bearing the title ?Shahr Ramadhan? Red Full Moon ? in the summer solstice.(Happy New Year?!!)
This Red Full Moon and the following 3 full moons are the restricted months, i.e the 4 restricted full moons.
(90 for the first 3 full moon + 10 total days, the period from full-moon to crescent for the 4th full moon=100 day restriction). Those who witness the red moon should be able to fast 10 days..or do other duties as instructed in the quran.What a way to start the new yearI wonder if anyone is living in the equatorial region has ever witnessed this red moon if at all?
So where do we stand now? What "calendar" are we following? Does it matter if we still keep to the mainstream one?
I know this may sound _______, we have count to the full moons to know our real age. Compared with the mainstream calender, we all are a lot older even in terms of years....
peace -
I would like to revoke my line "Those who witness the red moon should be able to fast 10 days.."
I could not sleep last night and also today I could not concentrate on what I was supposed to do.In the Quran God did not explicitly impose a 10 day fast(or whatever number) to anyone.He only said fast "therein".No 10 days,no siree..I am convinced, I spent some hours reading the Quran...ONLY those who violated some laws were to fast during this period of time-the red moon thing.
..so no Eid Festival and forget about making money selling stuff at the ramadhan bazaar "scorching heat bazaar,that's freaking bizarre". I salute those brothers/sisters who have the courage to go against the norm...but please do be careful though...
Hope God would grant me peace during the time when the muslim world starts fasting while I would just munch away..Hopefully no "holier than thou coz I am fasting and you aint" look given to my face...AND not forgetting the non muslims freaks/busybodies/scums who ever called me liar/hypocrite/"not
"serious about his religion" each time I tried to explain why I stopped doing certain things when I stopped being a sunni.God damn them!!!!!! I am sure I have to fight off their p_ _ k breadthed inquiring minds....they laugh at what they don understand...JIHAD!!I hope the sunni brothers/sisters would find how easier life would be with regards to following the quran on such things like fasting..
offtopicI still remember the time how the local muslim authority talked down at me for getting married via a civil ceremony. They told me my marriage was void..I gave them my infamous "f... y.." letter-Of course I did no use profanity but I challenged them at producing any evidence from the quran regarding how one should getting married.I totally disregarded their stupid views --and oh yeah I am not circumcised!!!!OOOH yeah!!!
O0
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Peace all;
It is one month according to your Lord; let me tell you why?(٥
Ramadan month is the in which was sent down the Qur'an as a guide to mankind also clear (Signs) for guidance and judgment. So everyone of you witness that month should fast it, but if anyone is ill, or on a journey, the prescribed period (should be made up) by days later. Allah intends every facility for you He does not want to put you to difficulties. (He wants you) to complete the prescribed period, and to glorify Him in that He has guided you; and perchance ye shall be grateful. (2-185)Thus, the fasting is for a month of Ramadan.
Now how long is one month?
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The number of months in the sight of Allah is twelve so ordained by Him in the day He created the heavens and the earth; of them four are sacred; that is the straight usage. So wrong not yourselves therein and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together. But know that Allah is with those who restrain themselves. (9-36)
Thus, one year is 12 months. And as we know, one year is the time when 4 seasons are completed (Spring, Summer, Fall, and Winter), 365 days. Thus, one month is about 30 days. And if one month is ten days, then the year would be 12 month X 10 = 120 days (two seasons only).
Moreover, the following would show the length of one month
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We have enjoined on man Kindness to his parents in pain did his mother bear him, and in pain did she give him birth. The carrying of the (child) to his weaning is thirty months. At length, when he reaches the age of full strength and attains forty years, he says "O my Lord! Grant me that I may be grateful for Thy favor, which Thou hast bestowed upon me, and upon both my parents, and that I may work righteousness such as Thou mayest approve; and be gracious to me in my issue. Truly have I turned to Thee and truly do I bow (to Thee) in Islam." (46-15)
Is that how long does it take and not 30 month X 10 days= 300 days
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Such of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the prescribed period, if ye have any doubts, is three months, and for those who have no courses (it is the same) for those who carry (life within their wombs) their period is until they deliver their burdens and for those who fear Allah, He will make their path easy. (65-4)
As we all know, the woman gets her period every month (average every thirty days)
Thus, we have to Fast for one Month that equals 30 days average.
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They ask thee concerning the New Moons. Say they are but signs to mark fixed periods of time for men, and for pilgrimage. It is no virtue if ye enter your houses from the back; it is virtue if ye fear Allah. Enter houses through the proper doors and fear Allah that ye may prosper. (2-189)
Thus? the mark of Ramadan month is the beginning of new moon.
Peace
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They ask thee concerning the New Moons. Say they are but signs to mark fixed periods of time for men, and for pilgrimage. It is no virtue if ye enter your houses from the back; it is virtue if ye fear Allah. Enter houses through the proper doors and fear Allah that ye may prosper. (2-189)
Thus? the mark of Ramadan month is the beginning of new moon.
Peace
Salaam belal, all
These are "genuine" questions
1- Why is fasting or "ramadan" not mentioned when God is giving the reply for questiong about "crescents "?
2- What's the relation between "ahilla crescents" and entering houses through their proper doors? -
Peace Soof,
Something that recently came to me whilst reading and discussing the Qur'an with people is the use of stand alone words to disguise the true meaning. Words like Qur'an, Islam, Muslim, Ramadhan are words that should be driectly translated to english as well so that a fuller meaning can be gained. Otherwise it appears like they are words common only to Arab muslims which removes the universality of the Message. It also removes the true meaning of the words. Muslim essentially means monotheist. Islam means devotion wholly to the God. Qur'an means THE Recitation. An arab person would read these words and understand the meaning whereas a non-arab would read these words and inherit the meaning they know from the world and culture around them, not what the words actually mean. When we translate Ramadhan to Scorching Heat we have to ask ourselves, what does this mean now? Instead of looking to our calendars for an arbitrary month.
I agree with you. Those invented proper names mask the true universal message.
Muslim essentially means monotheist. Islam means devotion wholly to the God.
The relationship between salam, islam, muslim is a fairly common one in the Arabic language. Those forms have the following meaning peace, peacemaking, peacemaker. They don't mean monotheism or devotion to the god. Of course when one is monotheistic and devoted wholly to the god, then one is making peace with the god and the truth but this is an implication, not the primary meaning.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace Rajah,
I could not sleep last night and also today I could not concentrate on what I was supposed to do.In the Quran God did not explicitly impose a 10 day fast(or whatever number) to anyone.He only said fast "therein".No 10 days,no siree..I am convinced, I spent some hours reading the Quran...ONLY those who violated some laws were to fast during this period of time-the red moon thing.
The god tells us in 2184 that the fast is for a few days (ayam ma3doodat). A few days is 3-10 days. Then we are told in 2185 to complete the count of "a few days". What does completing the count of 3-10 mean? It means ten days.
This is confirmed by 2196 where we hear of a "complete 10" and 2827 which talks about completing the count by reaching 10.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace sister Samia,
The answer to the first question is obvious so I will try to answer the second one.
2- What's the relation between "ahilla crescents" and entering houses through their proper doors?
The front doors (full-moons) are clear and obvious while the back door (hilal) is not very clear and visible. However, there is no problem if we exit from the back door. So the "hilal" can be used to time the "exit" but not the "entry".
Peace,
Ayman
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Salaams All,
w.r.t brother Aymans view, here is an alternative translation.
Using lanes and Quranic Dictionary;
2189
The ayat?s are following one from the other
2188
And do not consume your money between unjustly by bribing the decision makers so that you may consume a part of the other peoples money sinfully while you know.
2189
They ask you of the company of such , say they the slanderers to mankind and the/ir Desire and is no virtue that you enter into affairs from the wrong way but the righteous he who fears and enters into affairs from the right way and fear Allah so that you may attain success.God Bless.
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Peace sister Samia,
The answer to the first question is obvious so I will try to answer the second one.
The front doors (full-moons) are clear and obvious while the back door (hilal) is not very clear and visible. However, there is no problem if we exit from the back door. So the "hilal" can be used to time the "exit" but not the "entry".
Peace,
Ayman
Thanks Ayman
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peace , all
Weather you fast 3, 10, or 30 days for Rahmadan, it is acceptable...
And if you redeem fasting by feeding a poor person because of difficulty, it is acceptable, but it is better for you if you fast if you only knew...
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9596892.msg176228#msg176228
peace