Virgin Birth of Isa
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Peace Bel,
Okay.
You agreed that everything is created in the same method so if you will make the comparison between Jesus and Adam with that method then it should correspond to you, me, and everyone else since we just agreed that this method is not just one used with Jesus and Adam.
Then you say they both had no father. Do you believe Adam had no mother, or that he too had a mother? If you are going to make a comparison between them that they both have no father than it ends there if Adam has no mother but Jesus does. One had at least one biological parent. Also, as I mentioned above, if we like Jesus and Adam are also created by this method and destroyed thereby, than it no longer becomes a unique situation for Jesus and Adam and then Jesus and Adam become less alike, Adam as far from Jesus as Jesus is from us if Jesus had one parent and Adam had none. This is all speculation because you must confirm your positions before we can move on from here and try and clear up any contraditions.
Joe
AS I said to Tay before
If God did not reveal the decisive verses that show the story of the Spirit that came to Mary and Blew in her to make here pregnant, then you are right; but because of such verses, I'm entitled to use them as very important supporting evidences.
I will say again, if it were not for the desicive verses that tell us about how Jesus was created by God Spirit, and when Mary Said that How can she have a baby when no men touched her, then using the Adam and Jesus creation example would be usless.
But because of these verses, I can use it as a very strong proof to support Jesus creation without a Father.
But if you choose to use it as a supporting proof that Jesus had a Father, then you are committing the Sin of using non-well-established verses to cancel out well-established verses.If not than Adam was like no other human, including Jesus, because he had no parents.
Than that leaves the question, what really is the similitude between the two?
Joe
Adam is not like any other human, therefore, God never said that Adam creation is like an example of any human creation (including Jesus).
But when God wanted to give example of a creation like Jesus creation, He used the only example of human that had no Father--Adam (the only similar example of creation).
By the way why you ignored to comment on my other proof
There are two true stories, in the Quran, about Zakaria and Mary in Chapter 3 as follow
In the Case of Zakaria
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While he was standing in prayer in the chamber, the angels called unto him "Allah doth give thee glad tidings of Yahya, witnessing the truth of a Word from Allah and (be besides) noble, chaste, and a Prophet of the company of the righteous." (3-39)In the Case of Mary
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Behold! the angels said "O Mary! Allah give thee glad tidings of a Word from Him his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary held in honor in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah. (45)Conclusion
Both Zakaria and Mary were given glad tidings by the Angels.
Zakaria was about a Son by the name of Yahia and Mary a Son by the name of Jesus.
Yahia witnessing (Believing) the truth of a Word from Allah.
Jesus is a Word of Allah. Thus, Yahia will be a believer and witness of Jesus.In the Case of Zakaria
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He said "O my Lord! how shall I have a son, seeing I am very old, and my wife is barren? He said (the Angel) "Doth Allah do what he willth (wants, wishes)." (3-40)In the Case of Mary
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She said "O my Lord! how shall I have a son when no man hath touched me?" He said (the Angel) "Doth Allah createth what He willeth (wants, wishes); when He hath decreed a plan, He but saith to it `Be', and it is! (47)Conclusion
Zakaria said ?how can I have a Son when a) I?m an Old Man, b) My Wife is Barren (can?t have a baby).
Mary said ?how can I have a Son when a) No Men has Touched Me.
The Angel answered Zakaria by Saying ?Allah DO What He Wishes?
The Angel answered Mary by Saying ?Allah CREATES What He Wishes by using BE-AND- IT-IS? METHOD. (it is the same method he Created Adam with)THESE ARE TRUE SIGNS FROM YOUR LORD, IF YOU WISH, BELIEVE OR DISBLIEVE.
peace
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Salaam Bilal, all
Please do not treat us (who do not agree with your rendition on this subject) as idle people who have much time on their hands and just want to argue. I know you did not say that explicitly, but everytime I read a post by you, I feel intimidated. Maybe it's just me.
I, for example, look at it from many points meaning of words , implication or/and significance of the "virginity" understanding, as well as from the most important point, because it's the least subjective and the most direct the comparison between adam and Jesus. Maybe this IS the difference between you and the opponents. If you believe adam is us, and not a prehistoric man created suddenly, then the comparison will make Jesus a man created just like everyone of us. Then all other problems linked to meanings of words will fall into prespective. Otherwise, I do not see any meaning for this discussion and we would better start from (how was adam created?).
And just off-topic I do not understand why a virgin pregnant woman is to be considered a miracle and sign of purity, as if God did not creat us in pairs in order to keep each other's company. As for virgin pregnants, I personally knew, first hand, three cases, and many people I know knew at least one, thanks to the female genital mutulation. As for being pregnant without being touched by a man, and of course be a virgin (if the woman so wishes), this is now possible through artificial insimination; and a complete no-man-in-any-form pregnancy can be realized through cloning. Al these ways of conceiving are defective in a way or another, so why would Jesus be born without a father? Is it a sign that fathers are not important and that we can just dispose of them, and still give birth to prophets. Maybe this is the hidden message. I would not mind then She was virgin yay
The other problem of thinking along this understanding is what traditionalists concluded Mary never menstruated! Why, they argue, would she need something she would never use? A womb was all she needed. I will go why a womb? If God can creat a child without a sperm, He can without a womb...Then after a short thought, I will go and why a woman then? Why not use the method Be and he is, just like the creation of Adam? Only then, can we say that the example of Jesus is like the example of Adam.
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I think that the way things happened for Mariam must have been atypical, not kosher, and difficult for her, probably with a lot of gossip and incredulity as to "how she got pregnant" from what the Quran says, which is why her submission in accepting her lot was modelic and an inspiration for all all muslims. On the "how", not being touched by male, I also tend to think that it was "natural", although atypical, may be unique, but still "natural". Also if you are to produce matter, a material means must be there. Matter itself is miraculous, the fact of "being" is miracolous, so I cannot see that a material means is less miraculous than a way where you think there appears something when there was nothing. Every moment the universe goes on is miraculous because everything could not be instead of being. So I really do not care much as to the the technical part of it. I am sure it is there and it is efficient. It is the sense and significance of it all that should touch us.
Also, I do not think that 3isa really spoke with full words like older persons being a new born. The fact that he was there, and may be the way he was must have spoken to people's hearts, and his mothers faith and submission must have made the baby "speak" that way, specially since from Maryams family side there was so much piety and trust in God.
Again, it is as a spiritual language I think that the whole is best understood... Finally, that God can create averything and anything anytime anywhere we already know and take for granted. So the creation of 3isa by itself does't say anything new, so what is the particular thing God is showing us with this hadith or with these hadith series?
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I think the main reason for the comparison between Jesus and Adam is to emphasise that Jesus is a man just like us and not Godly like the Christians believe. I believe Mary is a sign for people in the sense that she was chaste and she kept her honour, she was not led astray by temptation and observed God's limits. God is telling us that chastity is what he wants for the believers until they marry, he used Mary as an example of a chaste believer (God always uses examples of pious people in the Qur'an for us to learn from) who gave birth to Jesus. Whether she was a VIRGIN when she gave birth to Jesus or not is not important to the whole message of the Qur'an and the parable of Jesus. It is only important when people are trying to assert his Godliness or the miracle of his birth. It may have been miraculous, it may have been a virgin birth but the message of Jesus in the Qur'an and the example of chastity in Mary does not change if Jesus was born of a virgin or not, therefore it does not matter.
This is probably why it is ambiguous. Because people try and read meanings into sentences and draw out long and unnecessary points that detract from the message of the Qur'an. What is clear is that Mary was chaste and honourable (God also refers to MALES being chaste and honourable as well greatest example being Joseph) and that Jesus was a mortal messenger who performed miracles by God's leave AND was taught the Gospel. These are the clear facts. God tells us to hold fast to the cornerstones of the book, i.e the non-ambiguous points and take the best meaning out of the ambiguous. But when the ambiguity of a statement does not effect the overall message then it is not necessary to take any meaning out of it. Maybe it is more simple than we make out.
Peace
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Salaam Soof
I totally agree with you, except in the part of "chastity". Don't get me wrong. I do not say that God does not command us to be chaste, but what's being undrestood by the story of Mary is more than chastity. It's celebacy, and this I do not believe God orders us to do. And if the message is to show us that Jesus is human like us, then again it cannot show us at the same time that he is not like us. Already the misunderstanding of adam being a human not born gave him in traditional literature super human abilities such as being very tall or giving the most important birth in the world of the first female.
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Christians know Adam started out sinless but was the first man to sin. Jesus the second sinless man, but the also first completely sinless man.
I know how we got Jesus from Yeshua- greek translaton of that name, but how did Quran get Isa when Christian arabs call Jesus Yeshua?
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Salaam Soof
I totally agree with you, except in the part of "chastity". Don't get me wrong. I do not say that God does not command us to be chaste, but what's being undrestood by the story of Mary is more than chastity. It's celebacy, and this I do not believe God orders us to do. And if the message is to show us that Jesus is human like us, then again it cannot show us at the same time that he is not like us. Already the misunderstanding of adam being a human not born gave him in traditional literature super human abilities such as being very tall or giving the most important birth in the world of the first female.
Ya I agree. God does not tell us about celebacy, in fact I believe God is against it. God tells us to send something good ahead of ourselves and that men and women are as garments to each other. That we should find peace and tranquility with our spouses. He also tells us our wives are like our fields so go into your fields as you please. All the statements are pro-sex pro-creation as long as its within the bounds of marriage. So if Mary was a sign of celebacy and this was seen as a sign for us to follow - which all of the parables represent examples to follow - then it would be a startling contradiction or misleading, which is against the nature of the Qur'an. Therefore Mary's sexual career has no relevance at all except for the fact that she "guarded her chastity" not that she died a virgin. Mary is not even called the Virgin Mary in the Recitation, therefore Celibacy is not an issue. If Mary was called the Virgin Mary in the Qur'an then I would have serious doubts...
However with your point you are trying to say that all humans have equal duties or equal powers (unless I misunderstood, sorry). In the Qur'an God is telling us there are people he chose so that they can be signs for all time they may have had powers and more duties than us, they may have had larger burdens and concerns than us. IF Jesus was born without semen at the time then it is by God's will. At this point in time our technology has surpassed our humanity so we can always look to science or experiments and almost denounce things that occur in the Qur'an, we begin to lose respect for "miracles" or the "will of God" because we see miracles performed in science all the time. But we must understand that not one of us on the face of this earth can Create. GOD tells us this, he tells us the sperm we spill out, WE didn't make it, God did. The IVF you talk about, the sperm and ovum used is from God not us. Therefore if God was to create a child from a womb there should be no arguments because ALL we do is from God's creation, every single thing. Even the manipulation of our very genes or the very quarks, leptons neutrinos, all the fundamental particles we have no partaking in their creation. We study them and can bang them together really fast and see what happens, but all we are doing is investigating God's will.
When discussing God's Will or his Acts we must take utmost humility in the matter, because we are only 3-Dimensional beings with limited perceptions and there was a time when we were not even mentioned. We are only His servants given the free will and sentience to investigate and understand.
The point I'm trying to say is if truly Jesus was born without a father then thats IT. God never tells us to marvel at his birth, he tells us to marvel at the alternation of night and day, the livestock we raise and kill, the creation of ourselves. The birth of the Christ is not important therefore if he was born without a father it would not add any EXTRA value to his message. If it was the case then He was a man like us, but was born a different way like Adam. God tells us what He does, we can refute and deny or denounce it, but our own existence is his Will and that is probably the most incredulous thing of all. The act of being. So if God will us into being to our very fingertips, if He willed He could will Jesus to be born from a Virgin, but it does not matter from a Qur'anic point of view. It obviously does from a Christian or Secular-trying-to-disprove-Christianity point of view.
Peace
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Salaam Soof and all
No one is contesting God's will or ability. The point is that God did not call Mary virgin, nor told us that Jesus did not have a father, so it is not denying God's will or power if we discuss this.
Secondly, God gave example of the believers Mary and the wife of the pharoh. What would be the lesson we should learn from Mary? Being chaste is not synonymous of being pious. The rule is that women are chaste until they get married, for fear of God or for fear of the society, the family and/or honour killing. What else would you think of? If I want to follow Mary's example, what should I do? It's easier with the wife of the pharoh she stood in the face of her powerful husband and fllowed the command of God. Maybe it's the same case with Mary she stood in the face of traditions and obeyed the command of God by getting married (a7Sanat farajaha). Remember that a7Sana and Mu7Sana are of the same root, the latter usually means married or can/will be married
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nor told us that Jesus did not have a father, so it is not denying God's will or power if we discuss this.
Peace everybody
Samia, I do not know why you are insisting that God did not say that Jesus had no father.
All the well-established verses show that Jesus was created without a Father.
I also showed two examples, from the Quran, about the creation of Yahia and Jesus (which you did not commont on). And now I will add another example, which the creation of Isacc, the Son of Sara and Ibrahim.( ( (
And his wife was standing (there), and she laughed but We gave her glad tidings of Isaac, and after him of Jacob. (71) She said "Alas for me! Shall I bear a child, seeing I am an old woman, and my husband here is an old man? That would indeed be a Incredible thing!" (72) They said "Dost thou wonder at Allah's decree? The grace of Allah and His blessings on you, O ye people of the house! for He is indeed worthy of all praise, full of all glory!" (11-73)
Samia, I would like to share with you and everybody another Signs from the Quran regarding Jesus Birth without a Father.
There are two true stories, in the Quran, about Zakaria and Mary in Chapter 3 as followIn the Case of Zakaria
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While he was standing in prayer in the chamber, the angels called unto him "Allah doth give thee glad tidings of Yahya, witnessing the truth of a Word from Allah and (be besides) noble, chaste, and a Prophet of the company of the righteous." (3-39)In the Case of Mary
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Behold! the angels said "O Mary! Allah give thee glad tidings of a Word from Him his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary held in honor in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to Allah. (45)Conclusion
Both Zakaria and Mary were given glad tidings by the Angels.
Zakaria was about a Son by the name of Yahia and Mary a Son by the name of Jesus.
Yahia witnessing (Believing) the truth of a Word from Allah.
Jesus is a Word of Allah. Thus, Yahia will be a believer and witness of Jesus.In the Case of Zakaria
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He said "O my Lord! how shall I have a son, seeing I am very old, and my wife is barren? He said (the Angel) "Doth Allah do what he willth (wants, wishes)." (3-40)In the Case of Mary
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She said "O my Lord! how shall I have a son when no man hath touched me?" He said (the Angel) "Doth Allah createth what He willeth (wants, wishes); when He hath decreed a plan, He but saith to it `Be', and it is! (47)Conclusion
Zakaria said ?how can I have a Son when a) I?m an Old Man, b) My Wife is Barren (can?t have a baby).
Mary said ?how can I have a Son when a) No Men has Touched Me.
The Angel answered Zakaria by Saying ?Allah DO What He Wishes?
The Angel answered Mary by Saying ?Allah CREATES What He Wishes by using BE-AND- IT-IS? METHOD. (it is the same method he Created Adam with)now, can you draw an honst conclusion that God and his Angles will witness; and then share it with us.
And know that well-esablished verses show the meaning of non-well-established verses (that is how Quran should be understood).
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Salaam Belal
The story of Moses was the most told one, yet no mention whatsoever of his father. Even when his mother was directed by God to throw him in the river, the description of sadness was the sadness of his mother 2810, and the promise of God to return him to his mother was so that she would be happy (not his parents) 2813; 2040. We followed the story of Moses since he was a toddler, his marriage and until he became messenger and an old man, but nothing about his father. Same thing with Ibrahim, no mention of the mother. The examples you drew is of prophets having chilren who were prophets also. Maybe it's just that the parent who has no role (whether positive or negative) on the life of the prophet is just simply ignored. And yes, God did not tell us that Jesus did not have a father, otherwise this thread - and other ones- would not have continued this long. If it was important, God would have mentioned it explicitly as He does with all the other miracles which were mentioned in details, especially that nobody was born without parents before or after. Even adam had parents and was not the first human, but the first "insan". And Eve/the female was not created from adam's rib.
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Peace,
I am sorry if I repeat what was already said by other members.
I have asked the brother Aymans view about my first message in this thread (p10), he said
One thing you might want to consider in the god's laws is that we are told that we should call children after their fahers. Why is Isa called son of Mary, after his mother?
My answer is
The word 'abaihim' included the fathers and / or the mothers.
In 4 11, we read, abawayhi wich imply the mother and the father. The same word is used in 1299
Falamma dakhaloo AAala yoosufaawa ilayhi abawayhi waqala odkhuloo misrain shaa Allahu amineenaBest regards.
Marie
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Salaam Belal
The story of Moses was the most told one, yet no mention whatsoever of his father. Even when his mother was directed by God to throw him in the river, the description of sadness was the sadness of his mother 1028, and the promise of God to return him to his mother was so that she would be happy (not his parents) 1328; 2040. We followed the story of Moses since he was a toddler, his marriage and until he became messenger and an old man, but nothing about his father. Same thing with Ibrahim, no mention of the mother.
Salam everybody
True, Moses Father and Mother had no problem in having kids, nor Moses were called the son of God; thus Moses story was not revealed to clairfy misunderstandings.
The examples you drew is of prophets having chilren who were prophets also. Maybe it's just that the parent who has no role (whether positive or negative) on the life of the prophet is just simply ignored.
The three stories that I mentioned were about three cases in which "Having a baby were not possible (according to human common sense).
In the Storey of Ibrahim and Sara Ibrahim was an Old Man and Sara a Barren Old Woman. The porn Son was a Prophet
In the Story of Zakaria and his wife Zakaria was an Old Man and his Wife was Barren Women. The porn Son Was a Prophet
In the Story of Mary (no male mentioned) Mary was not Married nor touched by a Men. The Porn Son Was "A WORD OF GOD" "A SIGN OF GOD"
Only in the case of Mary Story, the Angles replied to her (after she was questioning the possibility of having a Baby), by Saying "GOD CREATES WHAT HE WISHES IN THE WAY HE WISHES (BE-AND-IT-IS Method).Therefore, the conclusion from such stories matches with the well-established verses. The well-established verses that show the Story of Mary pregnancy and her delivering of her baby under the Tree, and her approaching of her people when carrying a Baby while she was not a married woman. (Please note that if she had a husband, he would have showed up to protect her reputation, and God would have mentioned him in such case or another case (such as being a coward husband).
Moreover, when God used Adam as an example of Jesus creation, it shows a conclusion that would match with the well-established verses; also, when God calls Jesus by ?the Son of Mary? in many verses, my conclusion matches with the well-established verses.As I told you before, and Arnold, and others, If you use the Modern Science theory that indicate ?There are no Miracles in our universe? to interpret the Quran, you will be rejecting many Well-established- Verses that show God direct intervention in his universe?the Miracles. You will be using non-well-established-verses to interpret the well-established ones; and the result will be distorting will-established Quranic meanings.
This is my true advice to you and others, be aware of such a great Sin that we can commit unintentionally.Peace
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Peace everyone,
Don't you find it strange that how Zakaria was earnestly praying to God for a son and when his prayers were answered"GOD gives you good news of John", suddenly Zakaria reminded God "how is it possible I am old and my wife is barren as well", like God didn't know that before or Zakaria himself didn't know God can do anything...
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Peace Hamsa
If you'll note God tends to be underestimated .
Someone mentioned about direct intervention with God and I should like to say that God always has a hand in all things. God does not just decide to intervene here and there for the performance of "miracles". He is the straw that stirs the drink.
Joe
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As I told you before, and Arnold, and others, If you use the Modern Science theory that indicate ?There are no Miracles in our universe? to interpret the Quran, you will be rejecting many Well-established- Verses that show God direct intervention in his universe?the Miracles. You will be using non-well-established-verses to interpret the well-established ones; and the result will be distorting will-established Quranic meanings.
Peace
Salaam,
God speaks of ayas, not of miracles, am I wrong?
Next, what makes you think that usual existence, every bit of it every moment has not the direct intervention of God? For me that is a given. I recall ayat al cursi. He is not tired and it is easy for him, he sustains everything all the time, He is rabb al alameen. However 3isa came to this world, is a miracle, just as the way I came to the world is a miracle and the way you came to the world. Everything is a miracle. But some things God explains as ayas.
So you want to see in the hadith about Maryam and 3isa an aya of God's, ability to create ex nihilo... May be it is good for you to see it that way. To me and I believe that to many others it doesn't add anything, since we take that for very much granted and conclusively prooved, but the aya God is shows us is in other things that have already been told in this thread.
Salaam
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Salaam Belal, all
God says (865-6)-
Now let man but think from what he is created!
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He is created from a drop emitted-
Jesus was not created from a drop of simen, therefore Jesus is not human
Is this what you want to arrive to? Why did Christians consider him god? Because they came to the same conclusion that he is different from humans, i.e non human, therefroe divine. Add to this, some "Muslims" believe God blew into the private parts of Mariam (farajaha). Link the dotts and Jesus is the son of God.
This is not science (well, a little bit of common knowledge), but simple logic
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Salam all
Jesus was not created from a drop of simen, therefore Jesus is not human
Is this what you want to arrive to?
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Al-Jinn (Chapter 72)
In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the MercifulSay It has been revealed to me that a company of Jinns listened (to the Qur'an). They said
We have really heard a wonderful Recital! (72-1) It gives guidance to the Right, and we have believed therein We shall not join (in worship) any (gods) with our Lord. (2)And exalted is the Majesty of our Lord He has taken neither a wife nor a son. (3)There were some foolish ones among us, who used to utter extravagant lies against Allah; (4)But we do think that no man or spirit should say aught that is untrue against Allah. (5)That is the Message that Jinns understood, and believer should to. Mary is not Gods' wife, nor Jesus is his Son.
( (
And behold! Allah will say "O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst thou say unto men,
worship me and my mother as gods in derogation of Allah"? He will say "Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, Thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, though I know not what is in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden. (116) "Never said I to them aught except what Thou didst command me to say to wit,Worship Allah, my Lord, and your Lord'; and I was a witness over them whilst I dwelt amongst them; when Thou didst take me upThou wast the Watcher over them and Thou art a Witness to all things. (4-117)And that is what Jesus will say in JD, and what I believe
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O people of the Book! commit no excesses in your religion nor say of Allah aught but truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an Messenger of Allah and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a Spirit proceeding from Him so believe in Allah and His Messengers. Say not "Trinity" desist it will be better for you for Allah is One Allah glory be to him (for Exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belongs all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is Allah as a Disposer of affairs. (171) Christ disdaineth not to serve and worship Allah, nor do the angels, those nearest (to Allah) those who disdain His worship and are arrogant He will gather them all together unto Himself to (answer). (4-172)
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In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Christ, the son of Mary. Say "Who then hath the least power against Allah, if His Will were to destroy Christ the son of Mary, his mother, and all everyone that is on the earth? For to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth and all that is between. He createth what He pleaseth. For Allah hath power over all things." (5-17)And that is how God wants us to pictuer Jesus, and that is what I believe, No More and No Less.
Jesus is the "WORD OF GOD", Jesus is "One of the Creatures that GOD GREATED". Jesus is "Abed ALLAH"
Add to this, some "Muslims" believe God blew into the private parts of Mariam (farajaha).
Anybody says any thing about the Unseen that is not revealed in Quran (or the original Bible and Torah) is commetting a Great SIN.
Salaam,
God speaks of ayas, not of miracles, am I wrong?
True (you are not wrong), but the common used word is Miracle.
Next, what makes you think that usual existence, every bit of it every moment has not the direct intervention of God? For me that is a given.
What makes you think that is what I believe? It is given for all believers; each breath I take is by God direct intervention. But in this thread and others, some people think that God has created the Universe and its Laws that he will never change; thus, Jesus had to be created by Father and Mother.
So you want to see in the hadith about Maryam and 3isa an aya of God's, ability to create ex nihilo... May be it is good for you to see it that way. To me and I believe that to many others it doesn't add anything, since we take that for very much granted and conclusively prooved, but the aya God is shows us is in other things that have already been told in this thread.
Salaam
I do not understand every thing you wrote, but for me it is not a big deal that God created Jesus without a Father, because GOD can do any thing He wants.
But the big deal is when somebody claims a lie about God, such as "the Quran supports that Jesus had a Father"; then I will have to strive to show the truth (it becomes very very Big Deal ;D)
Peace everyone,
Don't you find it strange that how Zakaria was earnestly praying to God for a son and when his prayers were answered"GOD gives you good news of John", suddenly Zakaria reminded God "how is it possible I am old and my wife is barren as well", like God didn't know that before or Zakaria himself didn't know God can do anything... )
That is how all humans are, including profits, we forget and tend to underestimate God's Power. hail (as per the following quote from Joe's post, which I agree with)
Peace Hamsa
If you'll note God tends to be underestimated .
Peace all
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`But we thought that no man or spirit would say aught that is untrue against Allah. (5)
Sorry I had to change the translation, which I copied from Yousuf Ali, of 72-5 from "man or Spirit", to Men and Jinns.
`But we thought that no men or Jinns would say aught that is untrue against Allah. (72-55)
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Peace Hamsa
If you'll note God tends to be underestimated .
Someone mentioned about direct intervention with God and I should like to say that God always has a hand in all things. God does not just decide to intervene here and there for the performance of "miracles". He is the straw that stirs the drink.
JoePeace
Do you mean he underestimated God's power? He was asking God to give him something while underestimating His powers? Does that make sense? Can you think any better interpretation why he asked such a strange question?