Washing and wudu in the quran?
-
Salaams Br's,
I used to thing he did! but not now.
Amazing the rest of the world doesn't need telling or something- to wash! really?
Wujooh is not face in the quran , a perfect example for you.
Wamin haythu kharajta fawalliwajhaka shatra almasjidi alharami wahaythuma kuntum fawalloo wujoohakum shatrahu li-allayakoona lilnnasi AAalaykum hujjatun illaallatheena thalamoo minhum falatakhshawhum waikhshawnee wali-otimma niAAmatee AAalaykumwalaAAallakum tahtadoona
So from whencesoever Thou startest forth, turn Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque; and wheresoever ye are, Turn your face thither that there be no ground of dispute against you among the people, except those of them that are bent on wickedness; so fear them not, but fear Me; and that I may complete My favours on you, and ye May (consent to) be guided;
002.150
YUSUFALI So from whencesoever Thou startest forth, turn Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque; and wheresoever ye are, Turn your face thither that there be no ground of dispute against you among the people, except those of them that are bent on wickedness; so fear them not, but fear Me; and that I may complete My favours on you, and ye May (consent to) be guided;You cannot face the masjid al haram always ? can you?hence its not face.
But your 'self,actions,deeds' can be in accordance to certain commands always.
From 38.41-43
The Gusl isn?t a physical washing , but a spiritual cleansing to remove the evilness within ? so the whole ayah is mistranslated to concuct the ritual.there arn't any rituals in the quran,check this out
What is washed off of the flesh and the blood of the inmates of fire.
Wala taAAamun illamin ghisleenin
"Nor hath he any food except the corruption from their washing,
Waothkur AAabdanaayyooba ith nada rabbahu annee massaniya alshshaytanubinusbin waAAathabin
Commemorate Our Servant Job. Behold he cried to his Lord "The Evil One has afflicted me with distress and suffering!"
42.
Orkud birijlika hathamughtasalun baridun washarabun(The command was given) "Urge people here is wherein to wash, cool and refresh."
43.
Wawahabna lahu ahlahu wamithlahummaAAahum rahmatan minna wathikrali-olee al-albabiAnd We gave him (back) his people, and doubled their number,- as a Grace from Ourselves, and a thing for commemoration, for all who have Understanding.
Please note -I have corrected the ayah 3842 above.
56 ? using The quran,lanes and the quranic dictionary.
O you who believe when you raise up for the salaat then wash your-selves,actions and your earnings till the thing by which you gain benefit/services you provide holds back from doing evil with a firm setting and your people till they do likewise and when you are under an obligation/in sin then purify yourself and if you are morally sick or trying to find out or has come one of you from the vying/ contending with one another or you not been able to have contact with women and not you find essence then look for the learned, ascended, good
And you wipe your-selves,actions and your earnings from it does not want Allah to lay upon you any hardship but He wants to purify you and to complete His favour upon you so that you may give thanks.Where does salaat and wudu concepts come from
http//www.free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=1799.0
Salaams All.
-
i see it that 56 clearly refers to washing with water (ideally) before prayer (which can involve bowing, prostrating, and dhikr).
2277 and other ayat refer, as i see it, to physical motions to be done in prayer. this is, after all, a deen. a religion for (and of) life, a system, a path that is to be walked, not simply looked at.
i respect others' inclinations towards more abstract interpretations of these verses, but i incline towards the literal on this point.
-
Yeah, it really needs raw cross-reference. Any other translation/attempt WILL run into problems or will mislead. Let's trust the rather clear concept in the quran, that it is self-consistent.
-
Yeah, it really needs raw cross-reference. Any other translation/attempt WILL run into problems or will mislead. Let's trust the rather clear concept in the quran, that it is self-consistent.
Salaams Br's,
Cross referencing is good but can't end in itself as we are looking at someones translation, ain't we?
God didn't send this translation Br.
But Br. Ayani to you it looks as though this translation is God sent- not to me absolutely not.
On the other hand cross referencing by referring to the Arabic meanings is more credible but takes a lot more time- but is the best method and i do use that when i have spare time.
check who did the first ever translations.
it'll surprise us all.
Thanks All.
-
In other words, you did not use cross-referencing nor work within rules of Arabic grammar for your proposed translation?
simple, you often post translations, nearly all of which ignore cross referencing and rules of Arabic grammar. Please note, that does not make then incorrect, simply poorly researched and presented.
On the other hand cross referencing by referring to the Arabic meanings is more credible but takes a lot more time- but is the best method and i do use that when i have spare time.
If I may re-word a famous quote...
"It is the path of least resistance that makes rivers and translations crooked." - re-worded B.J Palmer quote
-
In other words, you did not use cross-referencing nor work within rules of Arabic grammar for your proposed translation?
simple, you often post translations, nearly all of which ignore cross referencing and rules of Arabic grammar. Please note, that does not make then incorrect, simply poorly researched and presented.
Why do you think that? I believe everybody does this within their capacity of understanding - it is the most basic ingredient for this type of work- apart from the meaning being in line with reality - which i can say with my hand on my heart most of the currant translations ain't.
You may i think accept cuckoo birds talking, people changing into monkeys and swine or sticks changing to snakes - unfortunately i think that is a very very poor capacity of understanding of life itself and quite simply poorly researched and presented- don't you?
God Bless.
-
Rather than conjecturing upon what I may or may not think, how about actually backing up your translations with cross-referencing and working within Arabic grammar?
If that is too much to ask of you, then just say so.
That is a good point- i will try to do more in future if i can.
God Bless Waqas.
-
Peace "simple",
You may i think accept cuckoo birds talking, people changing into monkeys and swine or sticks changing to snakes - unfortunately i think that is a very very poor capacity of understanding of life itself and quite simply poorly researched and presented- don't you?
JK- Well as for cuckoo birds talking obviously all or most life forms communicate with each other in one way or another and obviously the Arabic word "kalaam" does not apply exclusively to human speech. As for solomon communicating with other life forms this is very inline with reality considering learned pattern recognition. The zebras are a marvellous example who can detect whether a lion is hungry and out to get them whilst he is still lying calm in the field merely by studying his facial patterns. Regarding the changing into monkeys and pigs this is a well known idion in Arabic, as also pointed out by bro Edp, and it does not men a physical change, though it should be noted that BOTH pig and ape DNA are very similar to ours. As for the stick turining into snakes here ill agree that the translation of "asak" is probably wrong as bro Arnold has pointed out. Overall i tend to agree with you and that supernatural interpreations of certain Quranic verses are wrong as well as salat, hajj etc being ritutals which i do NOT agree with anymore. regarding the washing we'll just have to wait and see to which conclusions further indepedent research leads. GOD Bless!
-
my main concern is an overemphasis on codified grammar that was codified with an obvious axe to grind - and while overemphasising this grammar people tend to ignore an interpretation which doesn't fit their worldview but makes perfect sense all the same.
like do people seriously need god to tell them to take a bath?
is anyone even considering what simple wrote here as a possible interpretation? like read it and think about it... that's my concern
-
peace Aaron, all,
Didn't know if the question was to me, but I don't know who codified the grammar or for what purpose. I've read some names and some reasons, but they are irrelevant to me.
Perhaps I should have said, a translation that works within Quranic grammar/possibilities/boundaries.
With a poorly researched and presented translation, this is very difficult to judge, hence my line of questioning.
