Washing and wudu in the quran?
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i agree with ayaani,
O you who believe! when you rise up to prayer, wash your faces and your hands as far as the elbows, and wipe your heads and your feet to the ankles; and if you are under an obligation to perform a total ablution, then wash (yourselves) and if you are sick or on a journey, or one of you come from the privy, or you have touched the women, and you cannot find water, betake yourselves to pure earth and wipe your faces and your hands therewith, Allah does not desire to put on you any difficulty, but He wishes to purify you and that He may complete His favor on you, so that you may be grateful...pikthall
other translation use
when ye prepare for prayer. ali
When you are about to pray. asaddoes anyone know if 'when you rise up' is a good translation...could it mean when you arise in the morning only? i cant speak a lip of arabic.
i remember being told (from hadith) that if you had made your first wudu of the day and put on socks (some say only leather) then you only needed to wipe your socks with water on your next wudu, but the quran says 'wash your feet up to your ankles' and even sunni will attest that no hadith can supercede an aya, but still its done. i do it even though i know it makes a hypocrite out of me but 'Allah does not desire to put on you any difficulty' and taking off and on your socks throughout the day proves a small nuissance. perchance i should change. what do you guys do?
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i agree with ayaani,
O you who believe! when you rise up to prayer, wash your faces and your hands as far as the elbows, and wipe your heads and your feet to the ankles; and if you are under an obligation to perform a total ablution, then wash (yourselves) and if you are sick or on a journey, or one of you come from the privy, or you have touched the women, and you cannot find water, betake yourselves to pure earth and wipe your faces and your hands therewith, Allah does not desire to put on you any difficulty, but He wishes to purify you and that He may complete His favor on you, so that you may be grateful...pikthall
other translation use
when ye prepare for prayer. ali
When you are about to pray. asaddoes anyone know if 'when you rise up' is a good translation...could it mean when you arise in the morning only? i cant speak a lip of arabic.
i remember being told (from hadith) that if you had made your first wudu of the day and put on socks (some say only leather) then you only needed to wipe your socks with water on your next wudu, but the quran says 'wash your feet up to your ankles' and even sunni will attest that no hadith can supercede an aya, but still its done. i do it even though i know it makes a hypocrite out of me but 'Allah does not desire to put on you any difficulty' and taking off and on your socks throughout the day proves a small nuissance. perchance i should change. what do you guys do?
I have sometimes thought why stand up!
good you brought it up.
in lanes the root is Qam not Qama.
and it says "to take/ eat/ devour something"
vow!
page 2003.
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peace,
does anyone know if 'when you rise up' is a good translation...could it mean when you arise in the morning only? i cant speak a lip of arabic.
Not knowing Arabic will only hold you back in some cases, but since there are tools available online like never before, this can be minimised. See www.studyquran.org where you will find a link to an online word for word translation (http//www.studyquran.co.uk/Quran_ArabicEnglish_WordforWord_Translation.htm / http//www.quraninenglish.com/cgi-local/pages.pl?/contents). Alternatively, you may wish to use http//www.studyquran.co.uk/PRLonline.htm and find the root in that specific form and see its other usage. Use the "which root is being used?" as a starting point. If no luck, see Qaf-Waw-Miim.
in lanes the root is Qam not Qama.
and it says "to take/ eat/ devour something"
Firstly, who said the root is "qama"? And by saying the root is "qam" I assume you mean Qaf-Alif-Miim. (often the Waw/Alif/Ya are interchanged depending on how the lexicographer classifies it)
Also, you said it was in Lane page 2003. Do you mean this page of Lane http//www.studyquran.org/LaneLexicon/Volume5/00000288.pdf ?
If so, where exactly?After you clarify the above, is your suggested translation "O you who believe, if you eat to the counsel..." ?
When you post, please bear in mind rule 2 of the forum rules
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=8177.0 -
Dear Waqas,
When you post, please bear in mind rule 2 of the forum rules
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=8177.0whether i follow you rules or i don't is my right- but you can ban me if you or your bosses think i am breaking too many of them.
Thanks. confused
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as far as i recall every time "show us your proof if you are truthful" is used it is in reference to a claim by non believers... and while you may not always agree with what simple may say i think it's far fetched to claim unbelief on his part
that's the problem i have with the verse chopping and using verses against eachother as weapons... it's neither fair nor accurate
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Speaking of far fetched, I did not imply/claim unbelief on his part P
However, by its nature of usage in AQ, the phrase "show us your proof if you are truthful" is usually in response to a claim by non believers, I will give you that.
Bringing proof/burhan is the point, and so far I've seen very little to none from 'simple'.
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when he is providing what he feels are valid translations what would constitute proof for you?
Speaking of far fetched, I did not imply/claim unbelief on his part
but you did use a phrasing that is consistently used in quran against non believers, that is why i am concerned... i don't see throwing around "show us your proof" as being very constructive
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i see it that 56 clearly refers to washing with water (ideally) before prayer (which can involve bowing, prostrating, and dhikr).
2277 and other ayat refer, as i see it, to physical motions to be done in prayer. this is, after all, a deen. a religion for (and of) life, a system, a path that is to be walked, not simply looked at.
i respect others' inclinations towards more abstract interpretations of these verses, but i incline towards the literal on this point.Peace,
Respectfully.I agree with you.
I mean, that's why there's more water on Earth then dry soil. So no one can complain, that he or she cannot wash himself or herself.I believe that washing is literal because God mentions specific parts of the body. When you get angry, it's all in the brain, the anger and hate start in the brain so how can one wash brain, right? Yeah, you can stop being angry and hateful but God tells us in 56 how to wash ourselves to perform the prayer. It's about obediance.
Peace.
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Salaams Br.AaRon, Waqas, All,
Sorry the page of lanes was 2993 not 2003 - i havn't been here for a while otherwise i would have corrected it.
We are and have been indoctrinated into the traditional system of belief so much so that we aren?t inclined to think with common sense when it comes to our belief systems? just like any other religionist, a Hindu, a Sikh, a Buddhist e.t.c you may well have a hard time reasoning with a Sikh to remove his turban or with a Hindu to stop drinking urine or a Buddhist to stop bowing to idols. For some reason a person indoctrinated will feel afraid to give up what took years to indoctrinate.
It is only a very few people even here who may think with a truly open mind and reason.Even a buffalo will splash out to wash according to its feelings - as with most other animals.
Similarly people of all races wash themselves, AND THEY DIDN?T NEED A SCRIPTURE TO TELL THEM, it isn?t that a Muslim wash and no body else does.
People in most of the advanced nations wash at least once a day.
I remember most of the time I used to look for soap before going to the toilet in a masjid- at the time of wudu in case you don?t find it after wards. You will be lucky to find soap in any public toilet in Pakistan now is that hygienic.
The quran repeats over and over again to up take counsel and agree to the best there-of and tread accordingly.
56 Using the quran, lanes and the quranic dictionary.
O you who believe when you take to counsel then wash/cleanse yourselves- actions and your earnings till the thing by which you gain benefit/services you provide holds back from doing evil with a firm setting and your people till they do likewise and when you are under an obligation/in sin then purify yourself and if you are morally sick or trying to find out or has come one of you from the vying/ contending with one another or you not been able to have contact with women and not you find essence then look for the learned, ascended, good
And you wipe your-selves, actions and your earnings from it does not want Allah to lay upon you any hardship but He wants to purify you and to complete His favor upon you so that you may give thanks.God Bless.
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peace simple,
Thanks for the advice on indoctrination. One way to determine the degree of indoctrination, if any, is to weight up evidence and scutinise the info.
Since you did not answer most of the questions I asked you in this thread, the above cant be done.
