Neptin

Could you please give me an example of a factual error in the Quran? What did you exactly mean?

Jonny_k

If a false teaching can lead people to God's truth, then even bible can be a false teaching. Or any other book. While, from the other side any of them can be true. It's all simply just assumptions and following one's feelings.

But, a more important thing is WHY would God give such a complex system of finding out the truth, so that only few people are able to find it. Billions of people who think they are rightly guided and all of them believe different stuff. I mean, who can claim they are 100% right.

Hello dear brother

In my opinion, numbers and codes in the holy books were never intended by God. Especially because the Quran was not given as a whole book, but it was being collected and who knows how many things were lost, added or changed. There are differences in multiple Qurans (not just huruf, but different words and meanings, different number of verses...). People were putting verses and surahs in any place they wanted. So how on earth then you could take number of some verse, surah, or number of times some word was mentioned as relevant?

Second thing, if that verse about Jesus brought you to Christianity, then you admit Quran is true. If it's true, then Jesus is not God or son of God. But if Quran is a false book, then how can you use it's code 19 to prove anything?

The way you are describing your conversion and finding the truth is the same for everyone in every other religion. All of them had an opened heart, looking for the truth, researching, enlightenment, signs, dreams etc. Even Christians who become muslims say that Jesus led them to islam. And everyone thinks they are rightly guided and special.

So basically, after all these years I don't rely on personal experiences.

Life provides us with teachings through both pain and pleasure. Going through these events is what makes us or breaks us. It changes us for the better or the worse depending on how we face these events.

Both pain and pleasure are neither good nor bad. If you call pleasurable things good and painful things bad you are deeply mistaken.

So we should not feel sorry when someone is in pain. Then why should we help anyone to get better in any situation?

tutti fruti

Actually those verses that you mentioned..I had problem with understanding that as well.

Because, how can you be thankful if you don't know if what happened happened because of your prayer? Sometimes I ask for something, and it happens, then I'm happy and thankful, and then after some time I see it wasn't actually what I thought it was. So, you get confused.

For example if you ask for rain, and it rains, but maybe it's not because of your prayer. Maybe it would rain anyway, or for some other reason. So how will you be specifically thankful? Or you don't know the intention towards you..whether it is mercy or not. Because some verse said that God gives property and children to certain people only to make them sin more...

I don't know..it just makes sense to be thankful if someone really helped you sincerely. Like, when God protected the prophets with his mercy, there it's very easy and logical to feel thankful. But about general blessings.. you might say thank you God, but you dont even know if this was given to you as a mercy, or if it was given because you asked for it..or it's only fitnah. Then how can you feel happy getting a blessing if it's only fitnah

Salam and thanks everyone for answers

Jkhan, hmm I know.. but I mean what if in everyday life we do something which is also not big, or we think it's not big and then we lose our deeds? Just like they didn't know it was so important..

And then how can you relax through life if you're not safe from losing good deeds. Deeds are everything you have in order to be ok in the afterlife..

What's bothering me is the verse number 2, Surat Hujurat

O you who have believed, do not raise your voices above the voice of the Prophet or be loud to him in speech like the loudness of some of you to others, lest your deeds become worthless while you perceive not.

This is not shirk, or some other big sin (kebire, for which there is punishment mentioned in Quran) but still it seems it will cancel all the good deeds. You can stay away from one thing, but how to stay away from endless stuff that you mistake every day while you don't even pay attention...

Hi Huruf

Thank you for your reply, but I can't see how is that related to what I asked. You didn't understand my intention. I didn't say I want to get illuminated to see stuff, I said I have problem with what people saw when these spiritual eyes opened for them (from the stories and sayings I heard about). And I'm trying to see if there's any chance that it's not correct what they interpreted...

No, but if many pious people said to have seen the same thing.. it becomes difficult to just ignore these sayings.

It has to do with religious people who got purification and were able to see the reality of stuff. For example, they saw some bad person in an ugly shape (that person looked pretty in material world)

Hi

Please, bring it on. I'd like to see how you got to this result.

Salam Amra94

Sure sister You are welcome to text me

ade_cool, thank you. I sent her message, she didn't reply yet.. Hmm people are not really active on this forum

Good logic,

thank you brother but I think you misunderstood my post a little bit. How do you know that I don't consider people from all races and religions submitters to God? Actually that's what I wish, and that's what I've been struggling with for 10 years. That why would someone go to hell just because they believe in something wrong?? These fears and feelings are still inside my heart, and actually what I would do if I could is put everyone in heaven.

So...when I say I'm looking for "Quran only follower" friends, it doesn't mean that I don't consider other people to be muslims or mumins or that I don't love them, or that they should go to hell. It means that I've been trough all these different sects and I don't fit in anywhere unfortunately and I don't have anyone who could be similar to me in some important stuff in faith, even online.

We are all on different stages in looking for the truth, and obviously that doesn't make anyone better than the other..but from my experience it's really difficult having close friends and fitting in to some group when your basic beliefs an practices colide (hanging out together, living together, being married etc). It's ok to consider people muslims, but how to fit in with others if you will be under pressure of their beliefs and practices.

I feel similar. If you like to talk and share experience you are welcome )

Ade, thank you. Still, my problem is there..that how will I implement salat in my everyday life, in cases when It's inconvenient for any reason. If I shorten it, maybe He will not forgive. If I pray it later, maybe it will not be forgiven, if I try to try to pray full (2 hours) then this will be hardship every time..and just all of this is like living a hell. Because you live in a insecurity of God's punishment..

I feel as it was me who wrote the post. I had the same situation..wahabi, sunni, shia...it's all just too much. I'd like to know more about what you went trough, maybe we can share our experiences. God bless

I'm just scared that if I do less than what is written or recommended as you say, that maybe it would be reducing from salat..just like in the verse where it says it's ok to reduce from it while in fear. So I'm affraid if not in fear, then it has to be full. Actually what scares me is the difficulty in performing this daily, and struggling in many situations.. I guess there is no solution for my problem..

Good logic, I'm not a brother ;D lol
Anyway, are you saying that this ila ghasaqi leyli means towards the night? Like, pray at the noon (which goes) towards the night. I'm not sure if that word can have that meaning. So when would this prayer time end?

Good logic, it's just not logical to me when I take all the verses about the salat that this dulook al shamsi means sun declining from the highest point in the noon.. Because other verses mention salatul isha by name and then there are 3 privacy times for the believers, the last one of them is after salatul isha.. So it just makes sense that this salat is from that close period before the sunset till darkness of the night. If it was said to pray from noon till the night, then it would be too long to perform this prayer..