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omar_e19

@omar_e19
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Recent Best Controversial

  • Queen Rania Rejects Hadiths??
    O omar_e19

    Wa alaikum assalam,

    All I know is that Queen Rania, a long time ago, submitted an article to the Arab Times which was plagiarised in its entirety from submission.org which defends the Quran alone and attempts to prove that the head scarf is unecessary.

    She received lots of criticism for it and the followers of teh Quran Alone made a big stink of it rushing to embrace her as "one of them"

    What I do know about the Queen si that she seems to be a very decent and intellegent women who most probably has a more sophisticated understaning of Islam. She probably does believe that the Quran is all we need as many more educated middle easterners believe, as the baselessness and historical inaccuracy of hadith is readily apparent. However most people are unable to say this publicy in a soceity where even athiests go to the mosque regularly for fear of persecution and social isolation. The fact that she published that article is brave enought.

    Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • THEFT PUNISHMENT
    O omar_e19

    Salaam Fahad,

    Interesting point. I must admit you got me there!! I still dont understand then what the difference would be in that case between "Yadaahunna" and "Aydiyahunna"

    One possible explanation, might be that "Aydiyahunna" (A plurality of 3 or more) is referring to the general word used in the plural, without necessarily emphacising whether they cut one of their hands, or both of their hands, but simply, their hands in general. However, in the case of 538 God would have wanted to be more clear as to whether both or a single hand should be cut off, if you intend to view it in the literal sense.

    Interestingly, the scholars of Sunnah have had debates on this...and out of their extra sources they have unanimously concluded only 1 hand is enough....bizarrly the verse seems to indicate all hands if you are to take it in the literal sense...so even if if you still believe it is physical hands, that means that RK is wrong and that both hands must be chopped off or marked. Arabic grammar can be pretty tricky sometimes...God willing I will enquire into this with someone who knows more arabic. peace

    Omar

    Questions/Comments on the Quran

  • THEFT PUNISHMENT
    O omar_e19

    Dear Fahad,

    Gramattically verse 538 cannot possibly refer to physical hands. The reason being that Aydeeahooma, is a plurality of 3 or more hands for each one of the two pple

    Yadhumaa --> One hand each of the 2 people

    Yadaahumaa--> Both hands of each of the 2 people

    Aydeeyahumaa--> The 3 or more hands of each of the 2 people

    The reason why this is confusing for many ppl is because this form "Aydeeyahumaa" apprears extremely rarely, and so ppl are not familiar with it. In conclusion, from a purely grammatical perspective, it cannot be physical hands. The word is used metaphorically to refer to wealth/resources. Please see how the exact same word is used in an obvious metaphorical sense in teh following verse

    Be patient in the face of their utterances, and remember our servant David, the resourceful (Thul- Aydee); he was obedient.

    This verse is referring to one person, and says he has Aydee (plural of three or more) hands. Rashad translated it as "resourceful" The only differenece between this and 538 is that 538 is referring to 2 people.

    HOpe this clarifies things. Peace,

    Omar

    Questions/Comments on the Quran

  • wow
    O omar_e19

    That's strange,

    This post was supposed to be a reply under Salikah's post...

    Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Errors in RK's translations ?
    O omar_e19

    Salaam Fahad,

    Good idea....There many many errors in RK's translation...the more I read the Arabic the more I see them...I am currently reading an Arabic book by the brilliant Quran Alone scholar Ahmad Subhi Mansoor who was kicked out of Al Azhar university for exposing their corruption...I believe he has finally given us the correct and most thorough answer to explaining the difference between prophet and messenger but unfortunately it is in Arabic available on free-minds website. Therefore inshallah I hope to work on translating it, at list the large section on prophethood and messenership so that the debate regarding RK's messengership is finally put to rest. I plan to write a separate article just on this issue and reviewing some of RK's "proofs" of messengership as well.

    Basically according to the author, the word prophet is always repeatedly used in the Quran to describe God's chosen person in the Quran in all his worldly affairs and all that they entail. Whereas the word messenger is strictly in relation to delivering of the message. Thus the prophet does not need to be followed all the time and can make mistakes whereas the messenger does not make mistakes becuase he is carrying out God's duty. This is why you will never find God saying follow the prophet...always follow the messenger....additionally the word messenger can mean the message of the Quran itself, or the angels....his evidence is soo clear and overwhelmingly consistent that I am finally convinced now prophet muhammad was final prophet and messenger. God does not call him final messenger because the Quran is the final messenger and God may still choose to communicate to ppl through angels meaning messengers that come to carry out God's duty after Muhammad, but no more human messengers amongst us... GOd willing much more on this soon.

    Here is the list of verses mistranslated off the top of my head

    5349
    Khalifa He is the Lord of the galaxies.

    Yusuf Ali That He is the Lord of Sirius (the Mighty Star);

    4912

    RK O you who believe, you shall avoid any suspicion, for even a little bit of suspicion is sinful. You shall not spy on one another, nor shall you backbite one another; this is as abominable as eating the flesh of your dead brother. You certainly abhor this. You shall observe GOD. GOD is Redeemer, Most Merciful.

    Usuf Ali O ye who believe! Avoid suspicion as much (as possible) for suspicion in some cases is a sin And spy not on each other behind their backs. Would any of you like to eat the flesh of his dead brother? Nay, ye would abhor it...But fear God For God is Oft-Returning, Most Merciful.

    The above verse does not say you shall avoid any suspicion what so ever. It says do not be "overly suspicious" because SOME suspicion is sinful...Thus God according to this verse allows us to be suspicious in some cases when it is justified unlike RK translates it.

    Then there verses such as 538 about hand cutting which is not talking about hand cutting due to the grammatical tense in which the word "aydiyahuma" is referring to 3 or more hands of each of the two ppl mentioned....thus it can only mean to cut off their wealth....as th word hands is used to mean wealth in other parts of the Quran.

    And similarly Edip Yuksel has a very interesting interpretation of the verse on wife beating which is completely mistranslated and badly explained by RK (434)

    Apart from obvious verses like the above, he consistently translates verses without sticking to the original arabic words though the meaning is usually more or less the same... But I dislike this practice because I think every word in Quran is chosen with care and precision and so we must be careful to be as literal as possible in the translation. Thats it for now.

    Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • OCD
    O omar_e19

    Peace Blue Rose,

    Yea I think you could say I have experienced mild OCD. At least when I was a sunni, I used to be abnormally obsessive about following the sunnah that I think it was affecting me psychologically. I can totally relate to the idea of repeating something spiritually until "it feels right" as you put it...I had a phase where I would repeat the salat soo many friggin times cause I wasnt 100% I did things perfectly. Its definatley unhealthy.

    Personally I think this could be something satanic. My faith was definatley what got me out of this mess. I also suffered in highschool for a brief period of an anxiety disorder where I would have abnormal panic attacks over simple things such as reading a line infront of hte class....amazingly, all this has pretty much completely disappeared after teaching myself that God doesnt care about our actions/words but whats in the heart and that if you put your faith in God He can heal just about anything. Key is to let go and learn to put matters in God's hands and to repeat in your mind that if God is truly with you then nothing can or should bother you

    If anyone thinks that GOD cannot support him in this life and in the Hereafter, let him turn completely to (his Creator in) heaven, and sever (his dependence on anyone else). He will then see that this plan eliminates anything that bothers him.

    The way I see it OCD, obsession, anxiety is the control of body/desire over spirit/intellect or mind, and the key is to work at revresing that through faith in God... cause you're right it definately does affect you spiritually....I know for my anxiety, the doctor, and the pills werent what finally did it...it was faith. Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Wht natural explanation do u have 4 GOD appearing at Sinai?
    O omar_e19

    A refutation to Jabal Al-Lawz theory taht I found on the net

    http//www.ldolphin.org/franz-sinai.html

    Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Wht natural explanation do u have 4 GOD appearing at Sinai?
    O omar_e19

    Im confused, isnt mount Sinai in Egypt? And doesnt God mention it by name in Quran?

    Peace,

    Oamr

    General Issues / Questions

  • Lets look at this all over again shall we?`
    O omar_e19

    Peace Idolfree,

    I have read the concept of using the the reptilian brain and find it a more plausible theory...I simply outlined the similarity in the conclusion made with layth about a reptilian race that is visible to humans and mingles amongst them. Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • (By Imran Khan)In Pakistan We Have Selective Islam
    O omar_e19

    Mashallah....really enjoyed reading the article...just goes to show you can attain true Islam without knowing about RK, the miracle or "Quran Alone' God guides the sincere in different ways. Notice how truly spiritual Muslims, even if they are of sunni backgrounds, naturally tend to focus on Quran more. Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Lets look at this all over again shall we?`
    O omar_e19

    Peace Noah,

    I honestly support your cause. However, the single biggest problem for us right now is we have no plan and we dont exactly have unity. Talk is dandy and all but unless we get going and actually do something then talk about choosing or rejecting a system is a fruitless waste of time. Ive tried addressing this issue broadly in my post "beating around the bush" which you probably read and was disappointed at the lack of cosntructive suggestions and working towards implementing a strategy. But hey, I can understand how we are all busy with our own lives....Im so loaded with exams, and social commitments at my own local front here in Ottawa that I dont have the resources at my disposal to do anything substantial.

    We have to start talking more about how we can pool our resources together.....and honestly I dont see anything happenining of any meaningful substance unless we join together under one banner and hold an international conference that addresses where we wish to go from here. We need to start thinking that we are God's party. Thats's the paradigm we need to use as our model...Doesnt God say he always supports His party against all others? We have to strive and believe that God can make us His vehicle of justice and good in this world if we are truly committed wink So we can all do our own little bit by hammering it in. It starts with the simple question SHOULDNT WE DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT??

    See Im on this Anti Arab racism conference planning committee...And we all know how monsterous the obstacles are for progress in teh Arab world on all fronts...its mostly due to their own faults cause Arabs tend to be very apathetic about anything that doesnt give them immediate gratification i.e, money...infact for most Arabs the word "volunteering" doesnt exist in their vocab. So one of our activist sponsors, an Arab professor, said that he will have nothing to do with supporting us until we actually add the words "Stop complaining. Start Contributing" to our student organization's logo. (S.C.S.C.) Thats the philosophy that gets you somehwere. I mean its common sense no?

    Peace.

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Lets look at this all over again shall we?`
    O omar_e19

    Peace Noah,

    Thanks for sharing...wow, this definately cannot be coincidental. Just one question, what are your views on Ike's and other theorists' ideas about the reptilian humans, whom they claim most of the Illuminati are? I say this because of a very interesting observation, regarding Layth's article on the Jinn which you can read at free-minds under the articles section.

    Layth concludes that the Jinn are reptilian creatures, decendents of the dinosaurs who are more advance than the human race and who envy us for being God's inheritors of the earth as per 230. However, this doesnt mean they are all evil... I did some research on the net and there is tons of talk, especially from the history of past civilizations of a reptilian like human race... I just couldnt help but see the striking similarities between layths' thorough analysis on the Jinn and what David Ike has to say about the reptilians...

    Having said that however, I do not fully support Ike's theory which as you said is probably exaggerated and over done in some aspects...But I did like Layth's analysis and we must always keep an open mind. Anything is possible wink

    Peace

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Ishmael: Hadith or History?
    O omar_e19

    Peace Salikah,

    The article you gave by Layth, is very interesting. Here is an article suggesting archeological evidence of very early mosques actually pointed to Jerusalem as the Qiblah. Layth may be interested in adding some of this info in his article

    http//debate.org.uk/topics/coolcalm/qibla.html

    The Qibla
    According to the Qur'an, the direction of prayer (the Qibla), was canonized (or finalized) towards Mecca for all Muslims in or around 624 AD (see Sura 2144, 149-150).

    Yet, the earliest evidence from outside Muslim tradition regarding the direction in which Muslims prayed, and by implication the location of their sanctuary, points to an area much further north than Mecca, in fact somewhere in north-west Arabia (Crone-Cook 197723). Consider the archaeological evidence which has been and is continuing to be uncovered from the first mosques built in the seventh century

    According to archaeological research carried out by Creswell and Fehervari on ancient mosques in the Middle East, two floor-plans from two Umayyad mosques in Iraq, one built at the beginning of the 8th century by the governor Hajjaj in Wasit (noted by Creswell as, "the oldest mosque in Islam of which remains have come down to us" - Creswell 198941), and the other attributed to roughly the same period near Baghdad, have Qiblas (the direction which these mosques are facing) which do not face Mecca, but are oriented too far north (Creswell 1969137ff & 198940; Fehervari 196189; Crone-Cook 197723,173). The Wasit mosque is off by 33 degrees, and the Baghdad mosque is off by 30 degrees (Creswell 1969137ff; Fehervari 196189).

    This agrees with Baladhuri's testimony (called the Futuh) that the Qibla of the first mosque in Kufa, Iraq, supposedly constructed in 670 AD (Creswell 198941), also lay to the west, when it should have pointed almost directly south (al-Baladhuri's Futuh, ed. by de Goeje 1866276; Crone 198012; Crone-Cook 197723,173).

    The original ground-plan of the mosque of ?Amr b. al ?As, located in Fustat, the garrison town outside Cairo, Egypt shows that the Qibla again pointed too far north and had to be corrected later under the governorship of Qurra b. Sharik (Creswell 196937,150). Interestingly this agrees with the later Islamic tradition compiled by Ahmad b. al-Maqrizi that ?Amr prayed facing slightly south of east, and not towards the south (al-Maqrizi 13266; Crone-Cook 197724,173).

    If you take a map you will find where it is that these mosques were pointing. All four of the above instances position the Qibla not towards Mecca, but much further north, in fact closer possibly to the vicinity of Jerusalem. If, as some Muslims now say, one should not take these findings too seriously as many mosques even today have misdirected Qiblas, then one must wonder why, if the Muslims back then were so incapable of ascertaining directions, they should all happen to be pointing to a singular location; to an area in northern Arabia, and possibly Jerusalem?

    We find further corroboration for this direction of prayer by the Christian writer and traveler Jacob of Edessa, who, writing as late as 705 AD was a contemporary eye-witness in Egypt. He maintained that the ?Mahgraye? (Greek name for Arabs) in Egypt prayed facing east which was towards their Ka'ba (Crone-Cook 197724). His letter (which can be found in the British Museum) is indeed revealing. Therefore, as late as 705 AD the direction of prayer towards Mecca had not yet been canonized.

    Note The mention of a Ka?ba does not necessarily infer Mecca (as so many Muslims have been quick to point out), since there were other Ka?bas in existence during that time, usually in market-towns (Crone-Cook 197725,175). It was profitable to build a Ka?ba in these market towns so that the people coming to market could also do their pilgrimage or penitence to the idols contained within. The Ka?ba Jacob of Edessa was referring to was situated at "the patriarchal places of their races," which he also maintains was not in the south. Both the Jews and Arabs (?Mahgraye?) maintained a common descent from Abraham who was known to have lived and died in Palestine, as has been corroborated by recent archaeological discoveries (see the earlier discussion on the Ebla, Mari and Nuzi tablets, as well as extra-Biblical 10th century references to Abraham in McDowell 199198-104). This common descent from Abraham is also corroborated by the Armenian Chronicler, Sebeos, as early as 660 AD (Sebeos 190494-96; Crone-Cook 19778; Cook 198375).

    According to Dr. Hawting, who teaches on the sources of Islam at the School of Oriental and African Studies (SOAS, a part of the University of London), new archaeological discoveries of mosques in Egypt from the early 700s also show that up till that time the Muslims (or Haggarenes) were indeed praying, not towards Mecca, but towards the north, and possibly Jerusalem. In fact, Dr. Hawting maintains, no mosques have been found from this period (the seventh century) which face towards Mecca (noted from his class lectures in 1995). Hawting cautions, however, that not all of the Qiblas face towards Jerusalem. Some Jordanian mosques have been uncovered which face north, while there are certain North African mosques which face south, implying that there was some confusion as to where the early sanctuary was placed. Yet, the Qur'an tells us (in sura 2) that the direction of the Qibla was fixed towards Mecca by approximately two years after the Hijra, or around 624 AD, and has remained in that direction until the present!

    Thus, according to Crone and Cook and Hawting, the combination of the archaeological evidence from Iraq along with the literary evidence from Egypt points unambiguously to a sanctuary not in the south, but somewhere in north-west Arabia (or even further north) at least till the end of the seventh century (Crone-Cook 197724).

    What is happening here? Why are the Qiblas of these early mosques not facing towards Mecca? Why the discrepancy between the Qur'an and that which archaeology as well as documents reveal as late as 705 AD?

    Some Muslims argue that perhaps the early Muslims did not know the direction of Mecca. Yet these were desert traders, caravaneers! Their livelihood was dependant on traveling the desert, which has few landmarks, and, because of the sandstorms, no roads. They, above all, knew how to follow the stars. Their lives depended on it. Certainly they knew the difference between the north and the south.

    Furthermore, the mosques in Iraq and Egypt were built in civilized urban areas, amongst a sophisticated people who were well adept at finding directions. It is highly unlikely that they would miscalculate their qiblas by so many degrees. How else did they perform the obligatory Hajj, which we are told was also canonized at this time? And why are so many of the mosques facing in the direction of northern Arabia, or possibly Jerusalem? A possible answer may be found by looking at archaeology once again; this time in Jerusalem itself.

    The Dome of the Rock
    In the centre of Jerusalem sits an imposing structure (even today) called the Dome of the Rock, built by ?Abd al-Malik in 691 AD One will note, however, that the Dome of the Rock is not a mosque, as it has no Qibla (no direction for prayer). It is built as an octagon with eight pillars (Nevo 1994113), suggesting it was used for circumambulation (to walk around). Thus, it seems to have been built as a sanctuary (Glasse 1991102). Today it is considered to be the third most holy site in Islam, after Mecca and Medina. Muslims contend that it was built to commemorate the night when Muhammad went up to heaven to speak with Moses and Allah concerning the number of prayers required of the believers (known as the Mi'raj in Arabic) (Glasse 1991102).

    Yet, according to the research carried out on the inscriptions on the walls of the building by Van Berchem and Nevo, they say nothing of the Mi'raj, but state mere polemical quotations which are Qur'anic, though they are aimed primarily at Christians. The inscriptions attest the messianic status of Jesus, the acceptance of the prophets, Muhammad's receipt of revelation, and the use of the terms "Islam" and "Muslim" (Van Berchem 1927nos.215,217; Nevo 1994113). Why, if the Dome of the Rock were built to commemorate that momentous event, does it saying nothing about it? Perhaps this building was built for other purposes than that of commemorating the Mi'raj. The fact that such an imposing structure was built so early suggests that this and not Mecca became the sanctuary and the centre of a nascent Islam up until at least the late seventh century, (Van Bercham 1927217)!

    From what we read earlier of Muhammad's intention to fulfill his and the Hagarene?s birthright, by taking back the land of Abraham, or Palestine, it makes sense that the caliph ?Abd al-Malik would build this structure as the centre-piece of that fulfillment. Is it no wonder then, that when ?Abd al-Malik built the dome in which he proclaimed the prophetic mission of Muhammad, he placed it over the temple rock itself (Van Berchem 1927217).

    According to Islamic tradition, the caliph Suleyman, who reigned as late as 715-717 AD, went to Mecca to ask about the Hajj. He was not satisfied with the response he received there, and so chose to follow ?abd al-Malik (i.e. traveling to the Dome of the Rock) (note not to be confused with the Imam, Malik b. Anas who, because he was born in 712 AD would have been only three years old at the time). This fact alone, according to Dr. Hawting at SOAS, points out that there was still some confusion as to where the sanctuary was to be located as late as the early eighth century. It seems that Mecca was only now (sixty years after the Muhammad?s death) taking on the role as the religious centre of Islam. One can therefore understand why, according to tradition, Walid I, who reigned as Caliph between 705 and 715 AD, wrote to all the regions ordering the demolition and enlargement of the mosques (refer to Kitab al-uyun wa'l-hada'iq,' edited by M. de Goeje and P. de Jong 18694). Could it be that at this time the Qiblas were then aligned towards Mecca? If so it points to a glaring contradiction to the Qur'an which established Mecca as the sanctuary and thus direction for prayer during the lifetime of Muhammad some eighty to ninety years earlier (see Sura 2144-150).

    And that is not all, for we have other archaeological and inscripted evidence which point up differences with that which we read in the Qur'an.

    General Issues / Questions

  • A new project.
    O omar_e19

    Peace truth,

    Just want to give my 2 cents about the translation of "Allah" into "The God"

    In Arabic the word "god" standing for any god is "Ilaah" Therefore "The God" would be "Al-Ilaah" which is not the same as Allah...thats my understanding of the term. Therefore I think it is more correct to simply translate it as God. It also sounds better in my opinion... Just my take. Keep up the good work and God bless you for your efforts. Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • time to chose a system
    O omar_e19

    Peace Noah,

    Ive read about much of what you say, and I think it very well may be true...the plan of the New World Order elite is to depopulate the planet to a managable level, in order to create a powerful world government. Certainly the choice of weapons in Iraq, such as the high use of depleted uranium in virtually all the bombs and ammunation, which then turns into a fine microscopic dust will make cancer rates and deformed births sky rocket in the region. This dust ofcourse is carried around by wind currents and deposits in people's lungs and organs, radioactively contaminating everything in its path...Environmentalists call this overwhelming destruction, worse than genocide, and have termed the word "Ecocide" as a fitting description. Thats cause, the radioactivity, will be with us for billions of years to come, as uranium has an extremley long half life.

    Here's a good site you might like on the illuminati, and NWO

    www.savethemales.ca

    Ive read that many of these elite families are the primary funders of population control programs in organizations such as the UN...so this theory is definately corroborated by different sources.

    As for fighting this system of hate and destruction which seems pretty overwhelming, how can we achieve anything if we are selves are still weak and divided roll

    Which is why I suggested our goal should be first to organize ourselves and build an ambitious united and inclusive organization. Please see my post on this issue

    http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3267

    Once we are organized we will be able to educate and reach out to more poeple, and we will have greater funds to pursue more ambitious projects that comprehensively address issues such as those you raise...we basically need to make ourselves a credible voice first....people will join us in throngs because truth and logic always prevail. God bless,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Beating around the bush and Paving the Way Forward
    O omar_e19

    Salam Bahaman,

    Thanks for sharing your views. You are absolutely right. The www is the best way to spread the message. This is in line with the prophecy of 2782....we see this process as the information superhighway is now the safest and most efficient way for people to learn share information and express "subversive" views that are against the established order...today because of the internet, people like Aidid Safar can express their views safely to millions without fear of persecution...I believe this is the full implications of 2782

    I appreciate your stance of leading by first being examples ourselves and trying to bring this information out to others....But the whole point of my suggestions was to get us more organized and to start feeling like we are a nation...a confernce builds more lasting connections, ties and networking...furthermore, how do you expect us to be taken seriously as a community of believers by the rest of the world? How our we going to bring our views to the academic communities, how are we going to effectively engage in dialogue with the rest of the world? By having some organization that strictly adhere's to consensus building and the Quran as it standard (even if we dont agree on everything), then we will be taken more seriously and come out to the rest of the world more effectively...Internet is perhaps the most important tool, but it is only one tool out of a more comprehensive strategy that we should develop...You are right however, with organization, there is always the danger of greater corruption. Which is why transparency and consensus building are essential, so that what is bad can always be critiqued and rooted out.

    Peace,

    Omar

    PS. God willing once my exams are over by the end of April, we can meet Inshallah! Initially, when I was still under the strong influence of the submitters, and praying 5 times a day, I had the impression that you were misguided, may God forgive me for such hasty judgements.

    General Issues / Questions

  • Caliph Umar Ibn Al-Khattabs speech after conquering Jersusal
    O omar_e19

    Wow very inspirational....Traditionalists should be made aware of how the Quran was the only focus in the early days. Thanks for sharing.

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • A humble request to ALL brothers and sisters
    O omar_e19

    God bless you Natu,

    I fully support your endevour. Without unity on the most essential issues we can forget about being taken seriously and becoming a serious force for God's good that can be reckoned with..there is way too much disunity on the fundamentals, and some ppl who may be interested in endless debate would rather keep it that way. Let us all unite as God commands and follow his simple prescription

    They are the ones who examine all words, then follow the best. These are the ones whom GOD has guided; these are the ones who possess intelligence.

    People need to remember this more often and the other verses where God commands us to stay united like the bricks of one wall.

    Unity can be acheived with hard work and persistence...it is the devil's false ideas that inform us there is no truth, its all subjective...this is one of the most destructive philosophies ever known, the philosophy of "post-modernism"

    While there is truth, we must accept there are different shades of it. Only by a rigorous and OPEN MINDED analysis of the verses can we reach a conclusion... WOULD IT MAKE ANY SENSE FOR GOD TO SEND US A SCRIPTURE OF GUIDANCE IF IT WERE NOT MEANT FOR US TO DERIVE A CORRECT UNDERSTANDING AND UNITE BEHIND IT?????

    I have tried to address some of the issues regarding unity, in a long post of mine that got buried under the endless raging debates on this forum.. I have outlined a blue print based on Quran on short term and long term objectives that I think we must follow and have asked for people's feedback. I encourage everyone to revive that discussion, which in many ways relates to your aims as well...on how we can proceed to constructively tackle the controvertial issues that divide us. Please check it out here

    http//www.free-minds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3267

    If we all learn to be honest with ourselves and strive hard to reach the truth sincerely then God will show it to us as this is a divine guarantee

    None can grasp it (the Quran) except the sincere.

    Therefore any failure to reach a common consensus, is due to ignorance or a failing on our part?.Many reasons for this include following our own egos, prejudices, or prejudging certain issues all cloud our minds. The truth is out there for us to grab. And only concern for our faith and sincere devotion will truly free our minds and lead us to God?s guidance.

    For example, for those who still say they follow Quran Alone according to 638, 114, 115 and many other verses, and YET STILL choose to pray 5 times a day as if it were a divine decree, why don?t you show us where you reach your conclusions from? This is the whole point of your project on debating?by debating we introduce new verses we were not aware of that will nullify preconceived notions in our minds, and by following the best argument we will draw nearer and nearer to the truth as 3918 commands. We cannot just sit by and accept the status quo which is currently interpreting God?s religion into oblivion!!

    Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • I suggest we make a freemind grp at paltalk so we can talk
    O omar_e19

    Salam Khizar,

    Count me in...just what is pal talk exactly>?

    Peace.

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions

  • Confused !?
    O omar_e19

    Peace,

    I think people are voicing opinions without addressing what hte Quran has to say on the subject. The idea that God allows men only to marry people of the book is a traditional Islamic myth.. However, there are believers amongst to the people of the book who are dedicated to God Alone. These are acceptible and belong to the greater community of submitters to God. The name of a religion is nothing more than a tag or a distraction...there can be believers devoted to the one true God from any religion. This is what is allowed for us in marriage. Even if they choose to worship God Alone without a formal religion, obviously they are also acceptable in marriage. Why?? Because Islam itself is not a religion.... It is a univeral and inclusive concept which means "to submit to the will of God" Therefore it is a state of being that can be attained by anyone intuitively without knowledge of the scripture and whether or not you associate yourslef with any inherited religion. The scripture itself is a guidance which helps us better achieve and maintain this state of being to reach a higher level of spritual excellence. Knowledge of the scripture is not a prerequisite to be a Muslim.

    Thus in short, all believers in God Alone irrespective of religious background is acceptable, and marrying any disbeliever or idol worshipper is forbidden.

    Do not marry idolatresses unless they believe; a believing woman is better than an idolatress, even if you like her. Nor shall you give your daughters in marriage to idolatrous men, unless they believe. A believing man is better than an idolater, even if you like him. These invite to Hell, while GOD invites to Paradise and forgiveness, as He wills. He clarifies His revelations for the people, that they may take heed.

    True believers in God alone from people of the book are truly hard to find especially since many chrisitians idolize Jesus...but Muslims are no better since a majority of them idolize Muhammad, or the shias idolize Husseign Ali and their 12 Imams, the community of submitters idolize Rashad Khalifa, and the sunnis also idolize their great scholars of the different schools of thought...

    Remember God in the Quran says He does not care what we utter. He only cares about what is in the heart...Therefore, if I utter the shahada "La Ilaha Illa Allah Muhamad Rasool Allah" because this is all I have been taught to be true in my life, yet I still devote myself entirely to God, knowing Muhammad cannot guide me in the least, then that means I am still a believer and I am not actually confessing to idol worship of Muhammad...Basically what these rituals associated with religion do is cloud the mind and distract us from remembering God,....there are people from every religious background who can overcome these distractions and know deep down that the emphasis should be on God alone, including christians. This is what one must assess before choosing his or her spouse...such people will naturally see the light in the Quran once they are introduced to it particularly if they are open minded, which is a quality of most believers. As God says, only the pure or sincere will be able to appreciate the Quran. Peace,

    Omar

    General Issues / Questions
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