How do you pray?
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Peace,
Only kharra lil-adhqaani can imply prostration. However it is literally falling to ones chin! Adhqaan is the plural of chin or beard. When you prostrate do you prostrate on your chin? Furthermore those verses that mention that mention the reaction of the faithful to the message. No one literally falls to their chins! This is obviously an expression. If we are going to look at it literally the word can only mean 'to fall to your chin' in whch case I can only image someonee sitting down holding their chins in through or awe.
Also sajada can mean to prostrate or to venerate. I think from its usage in the Quran its primary meaning is to venerate and that the old way of doing this was to prostrate. Especially considering that masjid is a place of veneration can apply to any place of worship. So honestly I think that the real meaning here is the veneration, as well as the bowing or even prostration in veneration. In my eyes all of these count. and raka&a is the real command to bow or kneel with no ambiguities.
Godbless,
Anwar -
Peace to all,
I understand what your saying progod, i have no problem with anyone who doesnt actually prostrate themselves physically, i myslef do it and believe its important but thats just me, i feel need to submit myslef physically not just mentally, also doesnt a verse in the Quran say that you will see the marks of the submitters on their foreheads because of their prostration, this cant be metaphorical too can it.
PICKTHAL Muhammad is the messenger of Allah. And those with him are hard against the disbelievers and merciful among themselves. Thou (O Muhammad) seest them bowing and falling prostrate (in worship), seeking bounty from Allah and (His) acceptance. The mark of them is on their foreheads from the traces of prostration. Such is their likeness in the Torah and their likeness in the Gospel - like as sown corn that sendeth forth its shoot and strengtheneth it and riseth firm upon its stalk, delighting the sowers - that He may enrage the disbelievers with (the sight of) them. Allah hath promised, unto such of them as believe and do good works, forgiveness and immense reward.
Kurt
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Peace,
I hate to say but yes this can also be literal or metaphorical. wajh does not necessarily have to be face. the Quran uses wajhun sometimes more like selves or souls. The verse literally says "seemaa hum fee wujoohihim min athari sujoodihim"
If you look up marks in a Quran search and see seemaa this doesn't have to be physical mark, it can also be a characteristic. Wajh as i explain can be face, countenance or self/soul and sujood veneration. Is it possible to see the marks/characteristics of worship/veneration in a a person or even in his face when you come across him. Very possible. Especially since the sentence before that is 'taraa hum rukka&an sujjadan yabtighoona fadlan min allahi wa ridwaan' This is indicating that you will see the signs and affect of worship on them when you see them bowing and worshipping.' I can't really even add to that, and I don't think I should have to .
Godbless,
Anwar -
= Waw-Jiim-ha = to face/encounter/confront, face, will, course/purpose/object one is pursuing, place/direction one is going/looking, way of a thing, consideration/regard.
wajh n.m. (pl. wujuh) 2112, 2115, 2144, 2144, 2144, 2149, 2150, 2150, 2177, 2272, 320, 372, 3106, 3106, 3106, 3107, 443, 447, 4125, 56, 56, 5108, 652, 679, 729, 850, 1026, 1027, 10105, 129, 1293, 1296, 1322, 1450, 1658, 177, 1797, 1828, 1829, 20111, 2139, 2211, 2272, 23104, 2534, 2790, 2888, 3030, 3038, 3039, 3043, 3122, 3366, 3924, 3960, 4317, 4727, 4829, 5129, 5448, 5527, 6722, 6727, 7522, 7524, 769, 8038, 8040, 8324, 882, 888, 9220wajih n.m. (adj) 345, 3369
wijhah n.f. 2148
wajjaha vb. (2) perf. act. 679
impf. act. 1676tawajjaha vb. (5) perf. act. 2822
Lane's Lexicon, Volume 8, pages 304, 305
From http//www.studyquran.co.uk/PRLonline.htm
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Salamun Alaykum brothers and sisters,
I voted "I pray by bowing and prostrating but dont add the Mohammad is the messenger part" because this is what I believe and what I and my family have been doing after some time of confusion and floating along.
Insha Allah with more information we will be able to reconcile our salat with what is in the Quran when it points to three contact prayers.
I found the link http//www.quran-islam.org/165.html very useful.
Peace... jedi
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Salam,
Respectfully.I pray according to The Quran.
When i tried to pray 5 times a day, sunnis said that a person who works in the kmitchen doesn't have the time for 5 prayers.Occasionally i would hear this sentence"Alen, if you're gonna go pray, pray, but make it quick."
Peace.
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Peace.
I am under the impression that prayer is twice a day, based on the so many references to those who glorify there Lord morning and evening.
YTV
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Peace.
I am under the impression that prayer is twice a day, based on the so many references to those who glorify there Lord morning and evening.
YTV
ya. me too , have finally come to the same conclusion.
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first light to sunrise, and sun set to last light , seem like two precise natural/celestial parameters, specially when these two have been given proper names , isha and fajar.
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The whole day is left for you to work (because that is what you are here for). other times you can remember him , in anyway , where ever you are.
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Isha as per traditional understanding cannot have the whole night time span, cause that would overlap the optional tajhood salat, and would not match with the other two clear/precise and resonable time spans to carry out an extremly important specific duty for him , and him only.
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The whole night has been given to you, if you want to earn some extra credit, Only the very interested would like to do that , seems very logical to me.
5.The necessary cleansing (ablution ), very logically, has been attached with when you get up in the morning, and before you retire after a working day
siki
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ya. me too , have finally come to the same conclusion.
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first light to sunrise, and sun set to last light , seem like two precise natural/celestial parameters, specially when these two have been given proper names , isha and fajar.
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The whole day is left for you to work (because that is what you are here for). other times you can remember him , in anyway , where ever you are.
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Isha as per traditional understanding cannot have the whole night time span, cause that would overlap the optional tajhood salat, and would not match with the other two clear/precise and resonable time spans to carry out an extremly important specific duty for him , and him only.
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The whole night has been given to you, if you want to earn some extra credit, Only the very interested would like to do that , seems very logical to me.
5.The necessary cleansing (ablution ), very logically, has been attached with when you get up in the morning, and before you retire after a working day
siki
I agree, although I believe everyone should try and pray at least part of the night, because in one verse it mentions all 3 times (before sunrise, before sunset -> sunset and Night)
I thought ablution was before every prayer?
Peace
Al -
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Off course , it is.
i may clarify/add " when you retire,,,, after isha prayer"
Peace.
To my understanding it would be 2 times for Salat, but If I recall correctly the night time is when we should reflect additionally on what we've read. Correct?
Can someone post the numerous verses indicating what we have stated, so others who may not be aware can have those quranic references.
Jazak Allah Khairan
TYV
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As Salaamu Alaikum forum,
For those who are new, or haven't read this part of the forum, I pray like this
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=14094.0
start at the ninth post down for those who can't or don't want to download anything.
I intend to update a few minor changes in the near future, Allah willing.
As Salaamu Alaikum, peace
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All the words of the Salat should be from the Quran.
7- In 17111 we read the following words
"Al-Hamdu l'Allah alazee lam yatakhez waladan, wa lam yakun lahu shareek fee al mulk, wa lam yakun lahu waleyon min al zol."
These words translate to
"Praise be to God who has never begotten a son, nor does He have a partner in His kingship, nor does He need an ally out of weakness" 17111
In 17110 God commands us to use a moderate voice in our Salat, immediately after which God commands us
"AND SAY, 'Praise be to God, who has never begotten a son??."
The words "AND SAY"at the beginning of verse 111 indicate that the subject is STILL Salat (the subject of 110). This means that God is commanding us to utter these specific words during our salat.
It is interesting to note that these 3 phrases have significant meanings
1- "Praise be to God who has never begotten a son,"
These words purify us from the claim of the Christians who gave God a son.
2- "nor does He have a partner in His kingship,"
These words purify us from the corrupt Muslims who made Muhammad a partner with God in everything they say or do ........
3- "nor does He need an ally out of weakness"
These words purify us from the Jewish scholars who claim that God is not able to do certain things ... etc
In effect, by uttering these words, and constantly being aware of the danger and corruption of these groups, we purify our souls and maintain the purity of our religion.
These words must be uttered during our salat.
To follow these words we should then magnify God frequently (Allah Akbar) ....
Salamun Alaykum all sun
I'd like some clarification on the "salat words" derived from AQ17111. My copy of the arabic transliteration of this verse is as below
"Wa qulil-hamdu lillahil-lazee lam yattakhiz waladan wa lam yakul-lahoo shareekun fil-mulki wa lam yakul-lahoo waliyyum-minaz-zulli wa kabbirhu takbeeraa."
Now the salat words above
"Al-Hamdu l'Allah alazee lam yatakhez waladan, wa lam yakun lahu shareek fee al mulk, wa lam yakun lahu waleyon min al zol."
My question is on the acceptability of the derivation because obviously "wa qulil" can't be used and we also have to cut "wa kabbirhu takbeeraa".
Any thoughts?
Peace. jedi
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Peace,
I can't remember if I clarified how I pray. But I either pray with the traditional rakas just at dawn and at dusk, saying either whatever I want or reciting the Fatihah and the Quran and other various supplications that I remember from the Quran. Or I kneel before my bed or a chair and pray to God that way with my hands outstretched like in a traditional dua. I've tried folding my hands like Christians as well or bending on one knee and praying. The most comfortable for me is the quasi-traditional way or in dua form on my knees. I believe in praying as many times as I would like, but Quranically fix the two prayers of dawn and dusk to be prayed everday. I often pray with my wife in the evening kneeling down. I recite the fatiha then she recites the Padre Nuestro (Our Father in Heaven) and then we do our own supplications. When praying more traditional style I often break out in innovated prayers in Arabic. And go between English and Arabic, and sometimes Spanish. That is just my style though. I have no problems going to the mosque and praying with other Muslim food to shoulder. Or praying with Christians with head bowed as long as they pray to the Father and in his name. Otherwise I refrain from the prayer and will not say Amen as sort of a protest.
Godbless,
Anwar
