How many verses are there in the quran ?
-
Peace again "Eid",
Rearding the "initial" waw i want to make a comment i didnt do above. Waw is NOT an initial of itself. It's the letter NOON which is spelled out so as to give it's pronounciation. Without "waw" how would you say "possesor of Noon"? You cant say "zan NN" for that is not the correct pronounciation of NOON. This doesnt make waw into an initial of its own. Think of sura 68 having ONLY ONE INITIAL SPELLED OUT AS PRONOUNCED. GOD Bless! -
Peace jonny,
JK- They ARE CONTROVERSIAL and you not knowing this just shows your ignorance on the subject.
Yes I am fully aware of their need to manipulate hamza and alif to manipulate the count and people who believe nineteen are the most ignorant on the planet.
JK- "Liar" means one who delibaretely puts up false information. This is a big accusation your hurling at them and hence your appealing to emotions rather than reason.
INSTEAD OF BEING A PARROT -- COUNT!
JK- I believe you ignored the subtle "ya"s as in "la-In" in 1946 for example. The auto count wont give you that easily. http//www.submission.org/quran/reader/arabic/v-19.htm
DO YOU EVER READ WHAT PEOPLE POST?
NOTHING from submission.org is reliable -- they are known manipulators and liars!
Forgot to include (y hamza) gv =10 changes count although still not multiple.
19 KHYAS 137 + 175 + 349 + 117 + 26 = 804 NOT MULTIPLE!
36 YS 242 + 48 = 290 NOT MULTIPLE!
y hamza gv=10 (total 11 )
y? mu?jamah gv=10 (total 211)
y? muhmalah gv=10 (total 20 )11 + 211 + 20 = 242
sn gv=60 (total 4
MAN these counts have BEEN VERIFIED BY BRO LAYTH AND OTHERS AS WELL. Your not paying attention to the subtle "ya"s.
JK- You must be using a wrong counter or some other manuscript.
Here I've color coded the different ya's simply COUNT!!!
19 K H Y A S 137 + 175 + 349 + 117 + 26 = 804 NOT MULTIPLE!
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1998 -
Peace jonny,
Waw is NOT an initial of itself.
Why NOT, you want to change N the pen to fit that stupid code of the ignorants.
JK- There are IFNINTE RANDOM COMBINATIONS YES BUT NOT REAL ARABIC WORDS. Thats what your not getting so either your fooling around with me by not addressing this or you didnt get my point.
Again -- DO YOU READ WHAT PEOPLE POST?
ARE THESE NOT REAL ARABIC WORDS FROM QUR'AN?
Alright, had time to waste look at this 2698 stuff plastered on the web.
http//www.quran.org/math.htmRemoving 9128-129 is ONLY (illa) fitna and here are more "attributes" also multiples...
3152 ?and God full of grace on the believers.
waAllahu thoo fadlin AAala almu/mineena700 + 6 + 80 + 800 + 30 + 70 + 30 + 10 + 1 + 30 + 40 + 10 + 40 + 50 + 10 + 50 = 1957 / 19 = 103
3163 and God seeing with what they do.
waAllahu baseerun bima yaAAmaloona(2 + 90 + 10 + 200) + (2 + 40 + 1) + (10 + 70 + 40 + 30 + 6 + 50) = 551 / 19 = 29
866 and God (is) with the patient.
waAllahu maAAa alssabireena40 + 70 + 1 + 30 + 90 + 1 + 2 + 200 + 10 + 50 = 494 / 19 = 26
1219 and God knowledgeable with what they make/do.
waAllahu AAaleemun bima yaAAmaloona70 + 30 + 10 + 40 + 2 + 40 + 1 + 10 + 70 + 40 + 30 + 6 + 50 = 399 / 19 = 21
Peace,
-
Peace "eid",
Peace jonny,
Yes I am fully aware of their need to manipulate hamza and alif to manipulate the count and people who believe nineteen are the most ignorant on the planet.JK- And you aree not manipulating to get your count? I admitted alif counts are not that clear. Theyr still too ambiguous so we'll have to wait.
INSTEAD OF BEING A PARROT -- COUNT!
JK- See below.
DO YOU EVER READ WHAT PEOPLE POST?
NOTHING from submission.org is reliable -- they are known manipulators and liars!
JK- CHECK it out for yourself as bro layth, myself and others did. Go and count them manually. Also ive shown you below an example in regards to sura 19.
Here I've color coded the different ya's simply COUNT!!!
19 K H Y A S 137 + 175 + 349 + 117 + 26 = 804 NOT MULTIPLE!
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1998JK- Ok i forgot to notice. This time you probably made the mistake of overlapping counts. When you just enter ya with hamza you get 16 results, 8 of which are ALREADY INCLUDED in the dotted ya count e.g. "waraai" in 195 which has one ya NOT two. Moreover you probably ignored the count of 1924 ?fanadA(ya)ha? and 1930 ?atA(ya)niya. Thats how you came up with 804. THATS WHY i stressed the fact that you need to count them MANUALLY. Now go and pick a manuscript and do that. GOD Bless!
-
Peace "eid",
Peace jonny,
Why NOT, you want to change N the pen to fit that stupid code of the ignorants.
JK- Ive explained this very well. In order to pronounce "noon" you spell NON WAW NOON. Think of it as an initial spelled out.
Again -- DO YOU READ WHAT PEOPLE POST?
ARE THESE NOT REAL ARABIC WORDS FROM QUR'AN?
JK- Sorry fail. These are elongated phrases NOT attributes anymore. "wallahu zu fadhlnl 'alal mumineen" is a phrase NOT an attribute. The attribute here is "zu fadlin." PERIOD. Same goes or the rest. GOD Bless!
-
Peace again "eid",
My guess was correct. You did count two yas in "waraai" 195 when the word has ONE ya only. Heres a non submission.org arabic quran excerpt
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/10_19/19_1-6.htm
Do you see two yas in that word? Same goes for the rest of the 7 words. "shaiyan(5 times)", "israeel" and "warian" ALL of which have only ONE YA. Also before even looking at your list i guessed you didnt count the YA of the terms "nadaaha" and the middle one of "'ataa(ya)nia" in 1924 and 1930 repectively.
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/10_19/19_20-25.htm
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/10_19/19_26-30.htm
Your confusing yas with alifs. Whenever theres a non dotted WAVE in between a word that is a YA, doesnt matter what vowel marks are on top or below it. GOD Bless! -
Peace jonny,
..."waraai" in 195 which has one ya NOT two.
y hamza written as above a dotless y or alone
If you want to exclude then...
19 K H Y A S 137 + 175 + 349 (-15) + 117 + 26 = 789 / 19 = 41.5263158 NOT MULTIPLE!
Moreover you probably ignored the count of 1924 ?fanadA(ya)ha? and 1930 ?atA(ya)niya.
Not interested how the manipulators from the land of the clueless write it.
Fanadaha min tahtiha alla tahzanee qad jaAAala rabbuki tahtaki sariyyan
1924Qala innee AAabdu Allahi ataniya alkitaba wajaAAalanee nabiyyan
1930JK- Ive explained this very well. In order to pronounce "noon" you spell NON WAW NOON. Think of it as an initial spelled out.
An initial spelled out? Think of it as MANIPULATION!
Why am I wasting time with this? lol
JK- Sorry fail. These are elongated phrases NOT attributes anymore. "wallahu zu fadhlnl 'alal mumineen" is a phrase NOT an attribute. The attribute here is "zu fadlin." PERIOD. Same goes or the rest. GOD Bless!
You claim otherwise with Zul fadlil 'azeem
How can these not be attributes?
3163 baseerun bima yaAAmaloona
866 maAAa alssabireena
1219 AAaleemun bima yaAAmaloona
-
Peace "Eid",
Peace jonny,
y hamza written as above a dotless y or alone
If you want to exclude then...
19 K H Y A S 137 + 175 + 349 (-15) + 117 + 26 = 789 / 19 = 41.5263158 NOT MULTIPLE!
JK- MAN why are you turning hamza into a YA? What is this game your playing now? Admit that you were wrong. It doesnt matter whether hamza or not. That is just how the count computer works OTHERWISE you have to see for yourself whether there is a YA there or not. "waraai" has ONE YA ONLY. PERIOD. The rest of the counts ive stated already.
Not interested how the manipulators from the land of the clueless write it.
Fanadaha min tahtiha alla tahzanee qad jaAAala rabbuki tahtaki sariyyan
1924Qala innee AAabdu Allahi ataniya alkitaba wajaAAalanee nabiyyan
1930JK- It begins to look like your the dishonest one here. Is islamicity.org working with s.org??? DEFINITELY NOT. Theyr sunnis and strongly against code-19. They also have 9128-129 on there. Go llok it up. YET you can clearly see the YA wave in those verses on their site. SO WHICH QURANIC MANUSCRIPT DO YOU TRUST? Perhaps the modern persian one?
An initial spelled out? Think of it as MANIPULATION!
Why am I wasting time with this? lol
JK- YES the initial NOON is special. Why else would GOD mention "zan-noon" in that other verse? Try to offer a better explanation if you can.
You claim otherwise with Zul fadlil 'azeem
JK- Theres a difference btw "zul fadlil 'ALA..." and "zul fadlil azeem" the latter of which indeed is a compound attribute. Thats exactly what im trying to say. You have to recognize by rules of the language which are attributes and which arnt not just use random adding of words to form phrases.
How can these not be attributes?
3163 baseerun bima yaAAmaloona
866 maAAa alssabireena
1219 AAaleemun bima yaAAmaloona
JK- Because of the conjunction "bima" and in 866 you posted the ending which goes "allahu MAASABIREEN" meaning "GOD is with the ones who persevere". What has this got to do with an attribute? It's a stateement. The attributes here would be "aleem" and "baseer". GOD Bless!
-
Peace jonny,
JK- MAN why are you turning hamza into a YA?
y hamza written as and makes no difference whether you count them or not still NOT MULTIPLE!
Not playing, no need, not my fitna -- you are the ones playing games injecting letters, removing verses...
you probably ignored the count of 1924 ?fanadA(ya)ha?
SO WHICH QURANIC MANUSCRIPT DO YOU TRUST?
This one!
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1h09fef92QI'm done conversing with the clueless manipulators of the book.
-
Peace "eid",
Peace jonny,
y hamza written as and makes no difference whether you count them or not still NOT MULTIPLE!
Not playing, no need, not my fitna -- you are the ones playing games injecting letters, removing verses...
JK- Yes and there is no two yas in "shaiyan", "israeel" or "warian". ALL HAVE ONLY ONE whilst you showed two in each. I showed you clearly how the yas add up to 343. Your not even bothering to correct your counts. If your mistakes are corrected youll see that 8 of your terms will need to be subtracted from 804 making it 796 and 2 added(1924&30) and youll have a xple. Simple as that.
This one!
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=-1h09fef92QJK- This is not a manuscript. Only a recital and only in part. There are many recitals btw amongst which warsh and hafs vary ocassionally.
I'm done conversing with the clueless manipulators of the book.
JK- Your done because you cant bear your defeat. This nothing but arrogant rhetoric. It will not convince anyone. people are smart enough to check the facts i provided. GOD Bless!
-
Peace jonny,
JK- This is not a manuscript. Only a recital and only in part. There are many recitals btw amongst which warsh and hafs vary ocassionally.
So what, there are many renditions of the song ?my way? including by Sinatra and Elvis.
JK- Your done because you cant bear your defeat. This nothing but arrogant rhetoric. It will not convince anyone. people are smart enough to check the facts i provided. GOD Bless!
I could not bear your nonsense any longer and you provided NOTHING!
Post the entire chapter 19 in Arabic (no links) and tell us which you are including in your count...
y hamza gv=10
y? mu?jamah gv=10
y? muhmalah gv=10I want to see how you come out with 343
-
Peace "Eid",
Peace jonny,
So what, there are many renditions of the song ?my way? including by Sinatra and Elvis.
JK- Yes but that reading changes the grammar. HERE look at some of the differences btw hafs and warsh
http//www.submission.org/quran/warsh.html
http//www.submission.org/quran/protect.html
http//www.answering-islam.org/PQ/ch6-index.html
http//www.answering-islam.org/PQ/PlateWH1-index.htm
Moreover you relying on a sunni/shia recital of the Quran is real childish. Anyone can teach their children tor recite someting and call it Quran. How do you distinguish? By beating them whenever he doesnt recite something against what you previously heard was Quran? COMMON. There has to be a mechanism.I could not bear your nonsense any longer and you provided NOTHING!
Post the entire chapter 19 in Arabic (no links) and tell us which you are including in your count...
y hamza gv=10
y? mu?jamah gv=10
y? muhmalah gv=10I want to see how you come out with 343
JK- IM including all yas YOU included MINUS EIGHT yas from terms "shaiyan(sheen YA hamza alif, occuring 6 times in 199,27,42,60,67,89)", "israeel(alif seen ra hamza YA lam, in 195" and "warian(waw ra hamza YA alif in 1974)" all of these having only ONE YA AND NOT TWO LIKE YOU MR.EID SHOWED IN YOUR LIST. PLUS i added TWO yas, one from the word "nadaaha(noon daal YA ha alif)" in 1924 and the other "ataania(hamza alif ta YA noon YA)" from 1930 see (http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/10_19/19_20-25.htm) and
(http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/10_19/19_26-30.htm). So 8-2=6. Minus 6 from your result 349 and you get exactly 343. CLEAR? GOD Bless! -
Peace jonny,
Moreover you relying on a sunni/shia recital of the Quran is real childish. Anyone can teach their children tor recite someting and call it Quran. How do you distinguish?
Nothing to distinguish, they are the same stories which you got the same book the same way through memorizing 5417 and now shred to pieces removing verses, changing words, and even conjecture about order of revelation to fit a code for na?ve cattle and other nonsense from the land of the clueless obsessed with all things nineteen.
JK- IM including all yas YOU included MINUS EIGHT yas from terms "shaiyan(sheen YA hamza alif, occuring 6 times in 199,27,42,60,67,89)", "israeel(alif seen ra hamza YA lam, in 195" and "warian(waw ra hamza YA alif in 1974)" all of these having only ONE YA AND NOT TWO LIKE YOU MR.EID SHOWED IN YOUR LIST.
My list included y hamza and what no problem with wara-ee?
195
PLUS i added TWO yas, one from the word "nadaaha(noon daal YA ha alif)" in 1924 and the other "ataania(hamza alif ta YA noon YA)" from 1930
http//www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=19&vid=24
http//www.islamawakened.com/Quran/19/24/
http//www.searchtruth.com/chapter_display.php?chapter=19&translator=7#11924 Fanadaha - So he called her?
Keep manipulating to make nineteen like your idol for the na?ve?
http//bruceadumas.com/db2/00111/bruceadumas.com/_uimages/Curious-Cows-13-x-19.jpg
"Curious Cows"
13" x 19"
-
Peace "eid",
Peace jonny,
Nothing to distinguish, they are the same stories which you got the same book the same way through memorizing 5417 and now shred to pieces removing verses, changing words, and even conjecture about order of revelation to fit a code for na?ve cattle and other nonsense from the land of the clueless obsessed with all things nineteen.
JK- So now you rely on memorization? So say if tomorrow people accepting Quran Alone will start memorizing the Quran without 9128&129? What would you say then? OR say tomoroow some people also accepting only Quran would memorize the Quran with an additional verse appended to sura fatiha which doesnt contradict the rest of the Quranic verses either? Would you accept it as Quran? If you dont then how come your accepting the memorization of hadith followers as Quran? Doesnt that make you a hypocrite trusting those people more about what the Quran is than those who strive to follow Quran Alone?
My list included y hamza and what no problem with wara-ee?
JK- YES THERE IS A PROBLEM. LOOK IT UP. WARAEE DOES NOT HAVE TWO YAS. HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU THAT?
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_5.htm
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_5.gif
See "waw ra ALIF hamza YA". NOT two yas. DO U SEE IT?195
JK- There is NO WAVE connecting the last ya. Here SEE http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_5.htm
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_5.gif
Where are you getting this from? Your probably using a later persian manuscript.http//www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=19&vid=24
http//www.islamawakened.com/Quran/19/24/
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_24.htm
http//www.searchtruth.com/chapter_display.php?chapter=19&translator=7#1JK- islamicity CLEARLY shows a wave before HA in fanadaaha upon which theres a small standing alif. DONT U SEE IT? That is a YA. http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_24.gif. Openburhan is probably a persian manuscript not original.
1924 Fanadaha - So he called her?
JK- This is NOT how its spelled at islamicity.
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_24.gifKeep manipulating like your idol for the na?ve?
http//bruceadumas.com/db2/00111/bruceadumas.com/_uimages/Curious-Cows-13-x-19.jpg
"Curious Cows"
13" x 19"
JK- I think your not looking correctly or your deliberately hiding the truth. We shall see. GOD Bless!
-
Peace jonny,
JK- So now you rely on memorization? So say if tomorrow people accepting Quran Alone will start memorizing the Quran without 9128&129? What would you say then? OR say tomoroow some people also accepting only Quran would memorize the Quran with an additional verse appended to sura fatiha which doesnt contradict the rest of the Quranic verses either? Would you accept it as Quran? If you dont then how come your accepting the memorization of hadith followers as Quran? Doesnt that make you a hypocrite trusting those people more about what the Quran is than those who strive to follow Quran Alone?
Those who remove verses are known liars same as the missionaries and heretics who spread lies about God and Quran ? they will be punished in this world and the next.
5417 And We have made the Quran flexible to the remembrance, so is there from a rememberer?
JK- YES THERE IS A PROBLEM. LOOK IT UP. WARAEE DOES NOT HAVE TWO YAS. HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO TELL YOU THAT?
This was not on your list which you said is the same as mine!
195
What?s the count again 343?
JK- islamicity CLEARLY shows a wave before HA in fanadaaha upon which theres a small standing alif. DONT U SEE IT? That is a YA. http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_24.gif.
No I do not see it in that picture, here http//www.islamicity.com/QuranSearch/
Verse Search
Search By Verse RefNoble Quran
IslamiCity
Displaying Verse 1 through 1 of 1 Verse(s) found. ( 1 Verse(s) displayed). Back - Print This Page
YOU MAY LISTEN TO THE VERSES DISPLAYED ON THIS PAGE
BY CLICKING ON THE RECITING OPTIONS BELOW.
RECITING OPTIONS
Search For 1924 - -
(1924)
Baset - Hussari - Minshawi
Fanadaha min tahtiha alla tahzanee qad jaAAala rabbuki tahtaki sariyyanTopics discussed in this Verse
1924 (Asad) Thereupon called out to her from beneath that "Grieve not! Thy Sustainer has provided a rivulet beneath thee;
SEE YA!?
-
Peace "eid",
Peace jonny,
Those who remove verses are known liars same as the missionaries and heretics who spread lies about God and Quran ? they will be punished in this world and the next.
5417 And We have made the Quran flexible to the remembrance, so is there from a rememberer?
JK- Known by WHOM? Sunni/shia? Dont compare those who accept Quran Alone with Christian missionaries now. Once again you didnt answe my questions. HOW do you determine which is the true Quran? Do you do this based on what the MAJORITY say? If so your going against the Quran itself
12106 The majority of those who believe in GOD do not do so without committing idol worship.This was not on your list which you said is the same as mine!
195
What?s the count again 343?
JK- AGAIN your showing waraai with TWO YAS. Your using a persian quranic script. Openburhan IS PERSIAN SCRIPT. YOU CAN SEE THIS BY LOOKING AT HOW THEY SPELL THE WORD "SALAT". Salat should be spelled "sad lam WAW ha" as in the original NOT "sad lam alif ha". See for example
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/2/2_3.htm
ALL other sites you quoted except islamicity have the same problem.No I do not see it in that picture, here http//www.islamicity.com/QuranSearch/
Verse Search
Search By Verse RefSEE YA!?
JK- MAN I QUOTED THE VERSE RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU. HERE
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_24.gif
DO YOU SEE THE WAVE BEFORE THE "HA" IN NADAAHA? The small alif on top is a VOWEL MARK NOT A REAL LETTER ALIF JUST LIKE THE ONE IN RAHMAN ABOVE THE MEEM. GOD Bless! -
Peace again "Eid",
The verse reference serach at islamicity you showed me also has the same problem. Just look at how they spell "rahmat" in 192
http//www.islamicity.com/QuranSearch/
(192
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_2.gif
They spell it "ra ha meem HA" isntead of "ra ha meem ta" as THE VERY SAME ONE THEY HAVE on the image script of the Quran. The latter image is correct. Look at that only. GOD Bless! -
Peace "eid",
I can show you another example with "salat" in sura 23. Here compare
From http//www.islamicity.com/QuranSearch/
23 23From http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/2/2_3.htm
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/2/2_3.gif
Do you see now that the quran search counting script is wrong? You need to look at the image one. I havnt yet found a correct Arabic searchable script online with which you can search with letters like in the original image script. GOD Bless! -
Peace again "Eid",
See now how the same mistake is made with the word "ataani" in 1930.
From http//www.islamicity.com/QuranSearch/
(1930)
From http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_30.htm
http//www.islamicity.com/mosque/arabicscript/Ayat/19/19_30.gifDO YOU SEE CLEARLY IN THE IMAGE THE YA WAVE IN THE WORD "ATAANI" BETWEEN THE WAVES OF TA AND NOON UPON WHICH THERES THE SMALL VOWEL MARK ALIF? NOTICE IN THE SAME VERSE THERES NO WAVE BTW TA AND BA IN THE WORD "KITAAB" DESPITE THERE BEING A SMALL VOWEL MARK ALIF IN BTW. The undotted wave is NOT just for placing an alif on it. It is a genuine letter A YA. YAs dont need to be dotted and in the earliest manuscripts infact nothing was. GOD Bless!
-
Peace jonny,
Once again you didnt answe my questions. HOW do you determine which is the true Quran?
...Salat should be spelled "sad lam WAW ha" as in the original NOT "sad lam alif ha".
....Just look at how they spell "rahmat" in 192
They spell it "ra ha meem HA" isntead of "ra ha meem ta"...See now how the same mistake is made with the word "ataani" in 1930.
YAs dont need to be dotted and in the earliest manuscripts infact nothing was.These are the same missionary type of questions to create doubt.
http//www.answering-islam.org/Green/seven.htm
It makes little difference; the meanings of the words are known.
Here is a suggestion, instead of being ALL OVER THE PLACE, tell us about the two smallest chapters ? tie #of words/letters to the chapter # and prevent someone from flipping verses between chapters or deleting and adding words and letters within each chapter etc and tell us how nineteen prevents this.
1081
1082
10831101
1102
1103One can fix most problems by breaking it down to simplest components and if you cannot solve this for the smallest chapters don?t even waste time with the larger ones with this numerology nonesense.