There is No God.

nsws1988

*No god but the god?No bus but the bus?.No book except the book..etc etc..One is both denying and accepting something at the same time.

The word 'but' means you are making an exception. So by saying 'there is no god but The God', The God is the exception to 'there is no god'.
In my opinion, there is one God who is The God but different people have different views on God depending on their personal beliefs. That doesn't mean that we all have different gods.

Abdun_Nur

Salaam,

If you consider the same phrase using the word ignorance, which I personally consider the concept of God to be, it makes an interesting view

No ignorance but the ignorance.

There is one ignorance that is the ignorance.

There is no ignorance. Except the ignorance.

Now using the correct translation with the word God exchanged

There is no ignorance. Except who is not ignorance.

There is no ignorance. But who is not ignorance.

It seems no matter the information, logic or reason presented the God delusion can not be removed, I will keep trying.

Abdun_Nur

Salaam,

Surah 114 has been posted on servant of the light, which clarifies one of the verses presented within this thread, eventually all the Qur'an will be translated, here's the link

http//servantofthelight.com/content/view/95/126/

nsws1988

Salaam Bedouin,

this is the problem, you say an entity, and therein lies the truth, Allah is not an entity.

You must conceptualise the idea, all realities are manifest, meaning created, instant to instant, without this constant re-invention nothing would exist.

Realities exist through the pure imaginative thought of a single consciousness, so we are simply the thought of Allah, this concept of God as the controlling entity is within this concept impossible, as Allah is an emanating force not an entity of any sort.

Consider it another way, your own thoughts are an extension of this process, a differential fractal order, are you the thought or is the thought you?

How about the verses he gave? What do you say about those?

The verses below indicate to me that Allah has no issue with calling Himself God.

Surely your God is One,
Lord of the heavens and the earth and all that is between them and the Lord of the sun?s risings.

Abdun_Nur

Salaam,

as the work is completed, the verses will be posted,you'll have to have patience, it takes time to go through the Qur'an, however as you can see from a similar verse in Surah 114, these other verses you sight are simply mistranslations.

abdullah_m

salam alaykum

The reason this discussion is so fuzzy and hard to grasp is because we are here in the realm of mysticism and metaphysics. At first it seems like a translational word choice problem between God and Allah. Then the discussion shifts into the problems related to any conception of the Deity by human minds. Let's go to the Tao Te Ching first.

The system that can be described is not al-deen al-haqq
The name that can be named is not al-ism al-haqq

This is a principle in the Universe like gravity and momentum. What can we do? We can either refer to the Deity as "the un-namable" or we can just agree on a convention and call it something convenient. One important point that Schuon makes in this regard is that a name invokes a doctrine. This means that using the word "God" invokes the deity of the Bible and its doctrine by default. While using the word "Allah" invokes the deity described by the Qur'an.

The universal recreation at every instant theory of Ibn 'Arabi is just one way of looking at things. It's not the Truth. It's a view. The Real Truth - "The Reality" - is indescribable and inconceivable by a finite mind. Our minds can only understand tiny fragments of the totality of what is. If you accept the fragments that have been sent down from the Creator, then you are orthodox. If you go off in search of your own direct fragmentary view, then you are esoteric.

Both ways are valid. However, the mystic has two dangers. On the one hand, he runs the risk of deceiving himself if he does not stay grounded in the orthodox teaching, if he loses the framework of an established tradition. On the other, he will quite surely be misunderstood by his fellows in the mainstream, possibly to the point of violent rejection.

I feel the distress for you brother Abdun, and it makes me sad, but learn from other mystics past and present. Your views are not going to be accepted by very many. This is not due to their ignorance! This is due to the nature of esoteric knowledge. There is no way I could convince even another mystic of what has been shown to me in altered states. Gnosis is experiential and not discursive.

nsws1988

Salaam,

as the work is completed, the verses will be posted,you'll have to have patience, it takes time to go through the Qur'an, however as you can see from a similar verse in Surah 114, these other verses you sight are simply mistranslations.

I look forward to your translation.

salam alaykum

The reason this discussion is so fuzzy and hard to grasp is because we are here in the realm of mysticism and metaphysics. At first it seems like a translational word choice problem between God and Allah. Then the discussion shifts into the problems related to any conception of the Deity by human minds. Let's go to the Tao Te Ching first.

The system that can be described is not al-deen al-haqq
The name that can be named is not al-ism al-haqq

This is a principle in the Universe like gravity and momentum. What can we do? We can either refer to the Deity as "the un-namable" or we can just agree on a convention and call it something convenient. One important point that Schuon makes in this regard is that a name invokes a doctrine. This means that using the word "God" invokes the deity of the Bible and its doctrine by default. While using the word "Allah" invokes the deity described by the Qur'an.

The universal recreation at every instant theory of Ibn 'Arabi is just one way of looking at things. It's not the Truth. It's a view. The Real Truth - "The Reality" - is indescribable and inconceivable by a finite mind. Our minds can only understand tiny fragments of the totality of what is. If you accept the fragments that have been sent down from the Creator, then you are orthodox. If you go off in search of your own direct fragmentary view, then you are esoteric.

Both ways are valid. However, the mystic has two dangers. On the one hand, he runs the risk of deceiving himself if he does not stay grounded in the orthodox teaching, if he loses the framework of an established tradition. On the other, he will quite surely be misunderstood by his fellows in the mainstream, possibly to the point of violent rejection.

I feel the distress for you brother Abdun, and it makes me sad, but learn from other mystics past and present. Your views are not going to be accepted by very many. This is not due to their ignorance! This is due to the nature of esoteric knowledge. There is no way I could convince even another mystic of what has been shown to me in altered states. Gnosis is experiential and not discursive.

One God, one creator, different perceptions.

Abdun_Nur

Salaam,

Ibn Arabi, was correct, in fact when I wrote transfinite Consciousness I had never read anything that Ibn Arabi had written, or expressed, my view was based on evidence based science, the structure of reality is as Ibn Arabi had described in the middle of the 13th century, how he knew this make me ponder the loss of the Islamic knowledge through the removal of Islam from the world. It was a friend of mine who told me about Ibn Arabi have the same view.

The universe is built from differential fractal structures, that function upon magnitudes of scale, but remain a fractal of the system, if viewed from this perspective it all is very clear and everything flows, and has a reasoned pattern, one quiet easy to discern.

Now the Qur'an is being translated correctly on my website, what I have discovered through physics, is the reality of the Qur'an, if you wish to follow tradition Islam, the first requirement is the removal of reason.

Someone

Peace Abdun Nur,

I am still trying to understand your view on this issue, and would like to ask you weither you consider this statement as true or false

If I say to you "You are not god"

Am I having it right? Is it a true statement?

--

Abdun_Nur

Salaam,

no God of any sort exists, especially the added idea of a personified God, however I suspect you have some smart answer you have thought up, but it really has no bearing on the issue.

nsws1988

Now the Qur'an is being translated correctly on my website, what I have discovered through physics, is the reality of the Qur'an, if you wish to follow tradition Islam, the first requirement is the removal of reason.

Who said that your translation is correct? I'm sure other translators say the same about their own translations.

Someone

Salaam,

no God of any sort exists, especially the added idea of a personified God

What about the creator the initiator? is he not the god, the true and real god?

--

Abdun_Nur

Salaam nsws,

my perspective is not based on a single book, or the translation of that book even, but the physical evidence, that the Qur'an when correctly translated agrees with the physical evidence, is the only reason I believe the Qur'an is correct, if it didn't agree with the physical evidence it would not be the Qur'an.

Salaam Somebody,

if you read the thread you will see the answer to your question. you should additionally read 'God and Allah', on my website, to help in considering the true nature of Allah.

abdulraffi_

Salaam

Unbelief is rather if one does not believe in Allah at all.

i mentioned wrong belief not unbelief...

as a muslim i feel it is my duty to warn about the dangers of wrong belief

i also suspect nobody contemplated on those ayats i mentioned due to there own interpretation of the quran i.e via sufism

(&#1639
Then do they not reflect upon the Qur?an, or are there locks upon hearts? (4724)

ok we all would agree that illah means god right????

then if so as i mentioned before in ayat surah Nisaaa (women) (4 ayat 171)
Allah says that hu is the god regardless of your beliefs, Allah says it look for yourself properly.. again for you to see in arabic

(&#1633
O People of the Scripture, do not commit excess in your religion or say about Allah except the truth. The Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, was but a messenger of Allah and His word which He directed to Mary and a soul from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers. And do not say, "Three"; desist ? it is better for you. Indeed, Allah is but one God. Exalted is He above having a son. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. And sufficient is Allah as Disposer of affairs.

Allah

(is) God

One.

Allah (is) God One.

I hope this clears up the God confusion

my perspective is not based on a single book, or the translation of that book even, but the physical evidence, that the Qur'an when correctly translated agrees with the physical evidence

what more evidence do you want that i have presented from surah 4 ayat 171 is more then enough proof unless you don't believe illah means God?
It is man that makes God a dirty word or corrupts its true meaning, and God is interpretered differently by different people .
God is language for all people ,you will also find God is also translated in every language...

Now the Qur'an is being translated correctly on my website, what I have discovered through physics, is the reality of the Qur'an, if you wish to follow tradition Islam, the first requirement is the removal of reason.

Allah makes things easy to understand and remember, you don't have to be a mathematician , scientist or rocket scientist , a sufi ,a priest , a imam and so on so on to be able to learn the quran and get right translations
surah 54 (al-qamar) ayat 17

(&#1639
And We have certainly made the Qur?an easy for remembrance, so is there any who will remember?

again

surah 54 (al-qamar) ayat 22

(&#1634
And We have certainly made the Qur?an easy for remembrance, so is there any who will remember?

and again

surah 54 (al-qamar) ayat 32

(&#1634
this ayat is repeated 3 times if not more throughout the quran...
god gave us a brain , intellect to think for ourselfs so we must use it..

if anyone wants a online word for word translated from arabic to english Quran look
http//www.allahsquran.com/learn/
very easy..

salaam

Rajah

Hello....
Allah the word in question. Well for the record, if anyone gives a rat tail (IAGART), I for one did not derive at my ideas via Sufi means.

The concept of one God is a seductive one (i believe someone will chide me for sayimg that IAGART). What is the point in that?

Okay back to subject proper...I mentioned this before and I mention it again. I am using the quran and the quran only. The creator addressed itself as Al Haqq, Al Rahman, etc etc but never Al-Ilah. Al-Ilah is so explicit! Why would not the creator address itself as just that...becoz it is not that!!! (pardon for me for using 'it' for the creator)...

Step outside the quran for a while, maybe whoever writing it down was trying to deceive us? The prophet/messenger/messenger of the covenant/scribe was living in the midst of jews and catholics who could have been very powerful and influential and could have injecting ideas..i am just thinking out loud! Just imagine,1400 years and look at the 'muslim world'. if the quran was easy to read and and not just easy to read but could be understood easily the world would be a better place. God is imaginary..You can challenge any atheist and they will show you their spaghetti monster....
Sorry for side tracking....peace !!!!

Someone

Salaam Somebody,

if you read the thread you will see the answer to your question. you should additionally read 'God and Allah', on my website, to help in considering the true nature of Allah.

Peace Abdun Nur,

I am actually reading this thread and your article, and trying to make sense of it, thus my questions.

I would like to keep our discussion purely in English language without injecting other words from other languages (ex "allah&quot to avoid confusion. It is the case for your article, it is hard to read because you are mixing Arabic and English, and causing confusion in the reader's mind and maybe yours also..

So please, let's keep it in English.

Again to my previous question What about the creator the initiator? Is he not the god, the true and real god?

Please answer this simple question with your own words and in short statements, no need to refer to lengthy articles. At worst, a simple yes or no would suffice. If you can?t, I would understand.

--

Abdun_Nur

Salaam Someone,

no a God was not the creator, if you want to understand Allah, you must examine the physical evidence, the universe functions in patterns, these repeat throughout creation, they are known as differential fractals, a fractal is a copy, where it is the same but the scale of the copy can alter, a differential fractal is copies that have tiny variations, like a snow flake, every one is the same yet unique.

So the universe is ordered in this method, Allah could be considered a dichotomy, again dichotomy is a fundamental aspect of all reality, an example of the organisation of Allah would be light, which is a dichotomy following the same organisation, as everything is a copy of a copy, a fractal order.

Light overwhelms the blackness, but always the blackness exists beneath the light, the light must always return to the blackness.

Another example would be sound, sound overwhelms the silence, but always the silence exists beneath the sound, the sound must always return to the silence.

Allah is the result of pure nothingness, in a state of dichotomy, just as light must overwhelm the blackness, Allah must manifest all reality instant to instant, this has been proved experimentally as being the case in addition.

So if we examine the idea of light again, it can be split into its component parts if sent through a prism, you get all the colours of the rainbow, the full spectrum of light.

When the full spectrum is combined, then you get the blinding white light, likewise Allah is the combination of all the attributes of Allah, if you call Allah the creator, it is but a single attribute, not the whole, for example.

Allah manifests all realities instant to instant through pure imaginative thought, we are the thought of Allah, this is not a God, Allah is reality itself.

These ideas are explained in greater detail in the essay's on my website, and should be clear, well to me they seem clear, but like you say it is alien to the minds of most so may take some grasping.

Someone