Quranists became Quranists because of their lack of understanding Quran.
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And we are thus contributing to this conversation which you are so thoroughly enjoying. Isn't that great?
http//foolstown.com/sm/leb.gif http//foolstown.com/sm/kap.gif http//foolstown.com/sm/leb.gif
its time to move on!
http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2572hLy7AA
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In war, not in Islam .
read this
And hold fast, all together, by the rope which Allah (stretches out for you), and be not divided among yourselves; and remember with gratitude Allah's favour on you; for ye were enemies and He joined your hearts in love, so that by His Grace, ye became brethren; and ye were on the brink of the pit of Fire, and He saved you from it. Thus doth Allah make His Signs clear to you That ye may be guided.
"Verily those who split up their religion and became sects, you have absolutely nothing to do with them."
you see what God said about who split up and became sects . He orders us (you have absolutely nothing to do with them).
You're a sect that has been slpited up not me .
Subhanallah POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK rotfl laugh
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Salam Thereformer1
Wa Alaykom Asalam
Now if 'quranists' have a lack of understanding of alquran, do you then claim the sunni's or other traditionalists have a true pure understanding of alquran all because of hadith?
No, not everything up to hadith, Do you know how must be the interpreting of Quran ? there are rules, do you know them?
P.S I want your answer, don't go look on the internet .
Why is it that people like you claim your sect have the greatest understanding? i mean if you were so great i'd assume a muslim state with pure true islamic laws would be implemented. there are so many of you and if you have grasped the quran so wonderfully i wonder what is the hold up?
These answers are already answered, please read the thread .
Not all hadith interpret quran, alot is subjective to scholarly opinion and lack of hadith.
Yes, you're right. Not all of hadith interpret the Quran , did I say the opposite ? there are other things that hadith stated not existed in Quran literally .
not all hadith is in relation to quranic verses, for what purpose are those hadiths?
The purpose is the second ligeslations after the first ligeslations from God . And the second ligeslations are the ligeslations that are God left for prophet to point the out to human and give them the ability to "" and find ligeslations according to the book of Allah. so basically the second ligeslation and the ligeslations that will the Sahaba made are according to the book of Allah .
also early muslims lived without ahadith do you claim theyre not good enough?
Examples ? please . the verse is clear who created a sect alone he is not from Muslims . Or he will be by definition .
I could use your argument against your sect and it would be more relevant, let me demonstrate; because of the close of ijtihad majority of Muslims have resulted to taqleed and have blindly followed medieval scholars. apparently today we're all too human to be appropriate scholars.. back then there were some other kind of humans, must have been the water or something? so anyway because of our lack of understanding and lack of willingness to learn and take on ijtihad to obtain truth because under some invisible doctrine it's haram, Muslims do taqleed to understand quran. without taqleed the muslims would have to rely on studying and learning about truth. of course you have a minority who believe that taqleed is wrong, yet they still implement taqleed by blindly following scholarly work without re-evaluate it or verifying work
what do you mean by Taqleed ? and who are the scholars that are "Moqaledin" ? and please I'm waiting to use my arguments against my sect , let's see your understanding of the thread .
So what's the truth? majority of Muslims result in blind following others, by blind following others and by blind following others who apparently claim to have studied and verified the truth. When is a Muslim going to step up and prove this so called truth of the medieval scholars? BTW accepting someone's work on the grounds of "they're more knowledgeable" doesn't prove anything that's not a valid claim.
peace.As I see, you didn't understand the Thread . You know that the scholars know that any word from them can mislead people and can makes them the dweller of hell. So let's see one knows that if he say a word will be killed, so he will see this word or not ? the answer is by Yes, or no ..your answer will make you understand, if not I have nothing to do . you're in your own, and I'm in my own
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The ?fundamentals of Islam? is never even discussed by the majority of the Muslims. Most Muslims are content running their lives under the ulema. Don?t speak in their name.
No, it is . I think you should read the verse . By the way in arabic is too specific and with strong meanings, I imply that the language is the barrier for you .
Quranists are NOT a new sect. You only need to lie to comfort your ego which is obviously unable to deal with us. We?ve been there from the beginning. Our leader was the Prophet himself.
I don't need to lie to say that I'm right . The white page doesn't need someone to correct it, because there is nothing in it.
If your leader was the prophet as you claimed what do you sayd about this- With clear signs and Books (We sent the Messengers). And We have also sent down unto you (O Muhammad م the Dhikr , that you may explain clearly to men what is sent down to them, and that they may give thought."
46/9 Say "I am no bringer of new-fangled doctrine among the messengers, nor do I know what will be done with me or with you( . I follow but that which is revealed to me by inspiration
this verse is for the Jewish and Christians and the non-believers .Because they have accused the prophet of bringing a new thing to prevent them for praying to their gods and to separate them from their families.
He then made predictions about the future like nostradamous?! This is as bad as the flying donkey story. Btw, that?s what a buraq is, reformer. The Prophet wrote the buraq to heaven to meet Allah.
I said respect the Angel Gabriel, he is the one who holds the prophet .And the word Buraq doesn't mean Donkey .
and if you don't believe this story, well you have just denied what God said about this story Read- Glorified (and Exalted) be He (All?h) Who took His slave (Muhammad م for a journey by night from Al-Masjid-al-Har?m (at Makkah) to Al-Masjid-al-Aqs? (in Jerusalem), the neighbourhood whereof We have blessed, in order that We might show him (Muhammad م of Our Ay?t (proofs, evidence, lessons, signs, etc.). Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Seer.
Narrated J?bir bin ?Abdull?h that he heard All?h?s Messenger saying, "When the people of Quraish did not believe me , I stood up in Al-Hijr and All?h displayed Jerusalem in front of me, and I began describing it to them while I was looking at it. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Vol.5, Hadith No.226).
Look at how this person twists the ayat of Allah. He should be ashamed of himself. The ayah says ?aqtasimoo bi hablillahi jami?a? (hold fast by the rope of Allah together? and this person says this means we join hands with the LARGEST GROUP.
hhahahaha, do you know what the word means by " Bi Habli Lahii jamii'ah"? do you know the meaning of "Hable"(the rode)"? do you know what God means by the word "I'etasimo" ?
I think the verse that you have stated is translated word by word, which is not allowed and which is not going to give you the real meanings of the words . well that's not a surprise for me , it is where exactely your lack of understanding of the words of Allah standing.
Where is the largest group even mentioned here?!
The point is do not be sects .
Naturally? What?s so natural about it? At one point there were over 500 madhabs (consult Prof Mashood Baderin ? Human Rights and Islam) but it was the Abbasids who were trying to gain popular support who supported the Sunnis and allowed them to become the majority (consult The Formative Period of Islamic Thought by WM Watts).
So how do we know who is splitting up from whom?Well, first of all when you are going to talk about History , please try to know the different stages of every nations that have passed and their reasons of being in that way or in the other way . The reason that Abbaseyine got supported is because they have made the sunnah alive again from the view of "Shoura" which has been deleted by the nation of Omaweying who they made the governor inhert the governor in governing . And this thing was not allowed in the existence of the prophet .
Well lets first begin with 3/103
3/103 tells us to cling to the rope of Allah and not be divided (wala tafarraqoo)
This phrase ?and do not divide? also appears in 42/13 which tells us to establish ad-deen and ?and not be divided in it? (wala tatafarrqoo fihi). Therefore, the rope of Allah is realised by the establishment of ad-deen.
How is ad-deen realised? By taking Allah as a judge (see 12/40 which links ibada with following the laws of Allah) and taking Allah as a lawmaker is done by accepting his fully explained book (6/114).
6/159 talks about those who split their deen (farraqoo deenahum ? the opposite of 42/13 above). If the deen is fully detailed in the Book,, then splitting the deen must be ignoring parts of the book. These are the people mentioned in 30/31-32 who are happy with their sects.I've met people that write something but they don't understand it, you're one of them . The only thing that was before is sunnah . who is the persons that splited up and became sects . the first one are Shi'a then after them are Khawareje then after them Al-Muatazila then after them the Quranists, the other sects mentioned before have not changed their opinions but the sect of Quranists that have showed themselves in the age of SHAFI'AI, have changed their opinions because they have been attacked by arguments and proofs from Quran and sunnah that what they did is a sin and a spliting of the way of Allah because they were arabic, so basically theu understand the arguments and the proofs, but for you gguys, you have took Islam in english language and it is full of distortion and mistranslation and misinterpreting of the verses, because you're in the 21th century where everyone wants to get famous and be with the ennmies of Islam because of money .
So reformer, very sorry but it looks like the Quran doesn?t agree with your ?majority? theory. It has a very specific idea about who a sectarian. Anyone who ignores parts of the book and splits up is a sectarian. Much like your abrogation friends.
Of course this post is right but for you, because we're the true Muslims that prophet left, you have showed yourself in the 21th century as free mind or the modernists of Quran, who they rejected the sunnah not because as they claimed contradict with the Quran but because it is a new projects of Satan and the ennemies of Islam to split up this great nation .But they will not win neither they can win, we are talking about 1.5 billion Muslim sunni in the world who they are in a great increase.
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Subhanallah POT CALLING THE KETTLE BLACK rotfl laugh
that was not funny because there is no relation between the idiom and what we said (me and mazhar) . and I'm not accusing him, I explain to him his misunderstanding of majority .
and one more thing I know that your mind is empty, so riding a donkey will not make you better than him.
P.S Subhanallah is not a collocation .
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If your leader was the prophet as you claimed what do you sayd about this
- With clear signs and Books (We sent the Messengers). And We have also sent down unto you (O Muhammad م the Dhikr , that you may explain clearly to men what is sent down to them, and that they may give thought."
Muhammed recited the Quran, word for word as it was given to him, the Quran IS the explanation and the reminder. The Quran is clear, it does not say "And We have also sent down unto you (O Muhammad م the Dhikr , (and hadith) that you may explain clearly to men (with hadith) what is sent down to them (in hadith), and that they may give thought.(on hadith)"
He (All?h) Who took His slave (Muhammad م for a journey by night from Al-Masjid-al-Har?m (at Makkah) to Al-Masjid-al-Aqs? (in Jerusalem), the neighbourhood whereof We have blessed, in order that We might show him (Muhammad م of Our Ay?t (proofs, evidence, lessons, signs, etc.). Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Seer.
Narrated J?bir bin ?Abdull?h that he heard All?h?s Messenger saying, "When the people of Quraish did not believe me , I stood up in Al-Hijr and All?h displayed Jerusalem in front of me, and I began describing it to them while I was looking at it. (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Vol.5, Hadith No.226).
does this verse say 'by donkey'? Did they not know of 'dreams' back then or are dreams the devils work?hhahahaha, do you know what the word means by " Bi Habli Lahii jamii'ah"? do you know the meaning of "Hable"(the rode)"? do you know what God means by the word "I'etasimo" ?
why dont you tell us instead of laughing arrogantly?I think the verse that you have stated is translated word by word, which is not allowed and which is not going to give you the real meanings of the words . well that's not a surprise for me , it is where exactely your lack of understanding of the words of Allah standing.
nooo you cant say not allowed on this again, you still didnt explain the last time you used that where it says translating word for word is not allowed!
The point is do not be sects .
WE are not, YOU are.Well, first of all when you are going to talk about History , please try to know the different stages of every nations that have passed and their reasons of being in that way or in the other way . The reason that Abbaseyine got supported is because they have made the sunnah alive again from the view of "Shoura" which has been deleted by the nation of Omaweying who they made the governor inhert the governor in governing . And this thing was not allowed in the existence of the prophet .
did that answer the question asked? Not asking transformer but someone with a brainI've met people that write something but they don't understand it, you're one of them .
and you're another one! rotflThe only thing that was before is sunnah . who is the persons that splited up and became sects . the first one are Shi'a then after them are Khawareje then after them Al-Muatazila then after them the Quranists, the other sects mentioned before have not changed their opinions but the sect of Quranists that have showed themselves in the age of SHAFI'AI, have changed their opinions because they have been attacked by arguments and proofs from Quran and sunnah that what they did is a sin and a spliting of the way of Allah because they were arabic, so basically theu understand the arguments and the proofs, but for you gguys, you have took Islam in english language and it is full of distortion and mistranslation and misinterpreting of the verses, because you're in the 21th century where everyone wants to get famous and be with the ennmies of Islam because of money .
So, if the first was 'sunnah' that would have been the same path Muhammed was on which was the path of Allah as detailed in Quran. Muhammed followed 'sunnatAllah', the sunnah of Allah as described in Quran, and so did his companions (most of them), then there were splits after his death, shia, sunni etc. So WE are actually following the 'sunnah' as Muhammed did and YOU have split into sects and follow another 'sunnah' other than 'sunnatAllah and YOU are misinterpretting the verses and having petty fights about toilet usage and nose washing. YOU are in fact an enemy of Islam! http//foolstown.com/sm/obm.gifOf course this post is right but for you, because we're the true Muslims that prophet left, you have showed yourself in the 21th century as free mind or the modernists of Quran, who they rejected the sunnah not because as they claimed contradict with the Quran but because it is a new projects of Satan and the ennemies of Islam to split up this great nation .But they will not win neither they can win, we are talking about 1.5 billion Muslim sunni in the world who they are in a great increase.
yes satan increases his army against Allah, but we will win bravo
Just to remind you that YOU belong to a SECT, WE Dont
- With clear signs and Books (We sent the Messengers). And We have also sent down unto you (O Muhammad م the Dhikr , that you may explain clearly to men what is sent down to them, and that they may give thought."
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that was not funny because there is no relation between the idiom and what we said (me and mazhar) . and I'm not accusing him, I explain to him his misunderstanding of majority .
and one more thing I know that your mind is empty, so riding a donkey will not make you better than him.
P.S Subhanallah is not a collocation .
so now 'majority' doesnt mean what it says? hypno
Hadithists became hadithists because of their lack of understanding Quran. If they DID understand Quran they wouldnt say you need hadith to EXPLAIN it rotfl
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Muhammed recited the Quran, word for word as it was given to him, the Quran IS the explanation and the reminder. The Quran is clear, it does not say "And We have also sent down unto you (O Muhammad م the Dhikr , (and hadith) that you may explain clearly to men (with hadith) what is sent down to them (in hadith), and that they may give thought.(on hadith)"
does this verse say 'by donkey'? Did they not know of 'dreams' back then or are dreams the devils work?
why dont you tell us instead of laughing arrogantly?
nooo you cant say not allowed on this again, you still didnt explain the last time you used that where it says translating word for word is not allowed!
WE are not, YOU are.
did that answer the question asked? Not asking transformer but someone with a brain
and you're another one! rotfl
So, if the first was 'sunnah' that would have been the same path Muhammed was on which was the path of Allah as detailed in Quran. Muhammed followed 'sunnatAllah', the sunnah of Allah as described in Quran, and so did his companions (most of them), then there were splits after his death, shia, sunni etc. So WE are actually following the 'sunnah' as Muhammed did and YOU have split into sects and follow another 'sunnah' other than 'sunnatAllah and YOU are misinterpretting the verses and having petty fights about toilet usage and nose washing. YOU are in fact an enemy of Islam! http//foolstown.com/sm/obm.gif
yes satan increases his army against Allah, but we will win bravo
Just to remind you that YOU belong to a SECT, WE DontI said do not disturb me . I'll wait his reply .
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so now 'majority' doesnt mean what it says? hypno
Hadithists became hadithists because of their lack of understanding Quran. If they DID understand Quran they wouldnt say you need hadith to EXPLAIN it rotfl
Well, I think you like playing games. I'm not the type of guys that you would like to play with him.
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Well, I think you like playing games. I'm not the type of guys that you would like to play with him.
Oh I dont know, I think you're great fun group
and you didnt tell me not to disturb you, and you dont have to reply if you cant or dont want to, but you will not stop me posting what I want, when I want, so give up ordering me about, mahshy ya mufti?
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http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/047.%20Muhammad%20Salla%20Allah%20alaih%20wassalm/47.03.gif
This is because of the reason that those who refused to accept/believe they consciously made themselves to follow the conjecture and scum
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/047.%20Muhammad%20Salla%20Allah%20alaih%20wassalm/47.03a.gif
and that those who accepted/believed they made themselves follow, in letter and spirit, the Absolute Fact from the Sustainer Lord of them.
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/047.%20Muhammad%20Salla%20Allah%20alaih%20wassalm/47.03b.gif
Like it/in this manner Allah quotes/strikes/narrates for the people their examples/similitude.What is Al Haqq which they wholeheartedly followed?
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/047.%20Muhammad%20Salla%20Allah%20alaih%20wassalm/Temo%2001%2047.02.gif
and they acknowledged/accepted which has gradually been sent/communicated to Muhammad Sal'lallaa'hoalaih'wa'salam,
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/047.%20Muhammad%20Salla%20Allah%20alaih%20wassalm/Temo%2001%2047.02c.gif
and that is the statement of proven fact from their Sustainer Lord;Shapter47
Reformer, dear here two types of people are contrasted, you did not comment, though you keep naming me here and there.
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that was not funny because there is no relation between the idiom and what we said (me and mazhar) . and I'm not accusing him, I explain to him his misunderstanding of majority .
and one more thing I know that your mind is empty, so riding a donkey will not make you better than him.
P.S Subhanallah is not a collocation .
Yes you are right on that my mind is not loaded with crap
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Reformer, dear here two types of people are contrasted, you did not comment, though you keep naming me here and there.
I didn't want to comment your post because you know that I disgust your translation of the verses , you distorted them.
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Yes you are right on that my mind is not loaded with crap )
When I said your mind is emty, know that neither the crap is in it .
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... says the person who posts Muhsin-Khan translations. rotfl
Mushsin Khan did not add his own understanding in quran rather the certified one, thats the difference dear sister.
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... says the person who posts Muhsin-Khan translations. rotfl
Muhsin khan is the best translation from all the translation that I have seen .