Article on Angels

loxbox13

Controllers or controlling forces of nature, etc..

1795 can't abide on earth?
351... as messengers?
2275 messengers are both human and in malayka form.

Insightful posts/threads
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=8122.15
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=8122.msg19564#msg19564
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9428.msg37654#msg37654

Peace

RASSOUL = Receivers and not messengers, a messenger in the quran is called MABAOUTH. someone sent.

RASSOUL ALLAH = RECEIVERS OF THE LAW.
RASSOUL = RECEIVER
RISSALA = A RECEPTION , always mentioned is pluriel RISSALATE , ( RECEPTIONS ) , if it was message, we know that the message is only one, but rissalate is pluriel, therefore rissalates is receptions
KITAB = MESSAGE / CONTENT
MABAOUTH. = Messenger
NABI = INFORMER
ANBAA = Informations
NABAA = information

MALAIKA = Communications with the word of Allah in them. communications receivers , Kalam is a synonym of malak
malaika are all the communications, between matter and law of nature.
exemple, equations are malaika , kalam is a small part of malaika , that we can accept or reject.

ALLAH KNOWS BEST

Someone

Salaam Someone,

How will reply to the above reply # 5 about malaika?

And where did you get the idea of Adam being humans from? Adam is singular not plural.

May Allah guide us all to His only path pr
Mohammed M. Khan

Peace mmkhan,

Anyone of us can be considered as an "Adam", especially considering the development of our intelectual abilities from complete ignorance and a state of hapiness when children in this big garden Earth, then we accumulate knowledge about our environment for sometime, then we face tests during our adult life... In many ways, we are similar to Adam.

Peace

mmkhan

I seek refuge in Allah from Shaitaan alrajeem

Please translate for me the following aayaats

RASSOUL = Receivers and not messengers, a messenger in the quran is called MABAOUTH. someone sent.

622

RASSOUL ALLAH = RECEIVERS OF THE LAW.
RASSOUL = RECEIVER

933

RISSALA = A RECEPTION , always mentioned is pluriel RISSALATE , ( RECEPTIONS ) , if it was message, we know that the message is only one, but rissalate is pluriel, therefore rissalates is receptions

567

Also used singular in 567, 6124, 779, etc.

KITAB = MESSAGE / CONTENT
MABAOUTH. = Messenger

255
256

MALAIKA = Communications with the word of Allah in them. communications receivers , Kalam is a synonym of malak
malaika are all the communications, between matter and law of nature.
exemple, equations are malaika , kalam is a small part of malaika , that we can accept or reject.

4251

Kalam is a synonym of malak

Is the below synonym correct as per your understanding?

Baraqa = Qaraba
Baqara = Raqaba
Balagha = Ghalaba

Just to quote the few and like to your understanding.

May Allah guide us all to His only path pr
Mohammed M. Khan

mmkhan

Salaam Someone,

Peace mmkhan,

Anyone of us can be considered as an "Adam", especially considering the development of our intelectual abilities from complete ignorance and a state of hapiness when children in this big garden Earth, then we accumulate knowledge about our environment for sometime, then we face tests during our adult life... In many ways, we are similar to Adam.

Peace

Can you please quote me some of the aayaats from which you extract the meaning of Adam?

"this big garden Earth" it is called "Duniya" a derivative of "Adna" in Arabic.

May Allah guide us all to His only path pr
Mohammed M. Khan

Wakas

peace mmkhan,

And where did you get the idea of Adam being humans from? Adam is singular not plural.

What do you make of

And We created you (plural), then We shaped you (plural), then We said to the Angels "Submit to Adam;" so they submitted except for Iblees, he was not of those who submitted.

warner

Peace

I have few doubts on using 711 to cite Adam being plural.

In 711 ?Thumma? can be ?then? as well as ?and? so the creating, fashioning and prostrating to Adam does not have to be in a sequence to mean that it was to Adam that the early part of the verse is referring to. Also, does khalaqnakum (creation) and sawwarnakum ( fashioning) have to be two independent actions from each other or these actions can be related and simultaneous ?

Moreover, in the next verse 712 Adam is referred to in singular (him) twice.

Wakas

peace warner,

I dont mind your hypothesis, but as I requested Mazhar in a previous thread, what is the evidence for it. Ideally, several, or at least one, Quranic reference where a seemingly sequential verse is not so.

Also, in my view, I have no problem with "adam" being addressed in the singular and the plural, as he is both individual and collective simultaneously, as I have discussed previously.

mmkhan

Salaam Wakas,

peace mmkhan,

What do you make of

And We created you (plural), then We shaped you (plural), then We said to the Angels "Submit to Adam;" so they submitted except for Iblees, he was not of those who submitted.

To me 711 is addressing to us all initially then referring to Adam as singular. You can also look at 7172 and 237-38.

7172

237
238

Hope this helps inshaAllah.

May Allah guide us all to His path pr
Mohammed M. Khan

Mazhar

238

mmkhan, the point you are makin might be supported also by this "dual". Personal names like "Adam" represent and refer to ONLY one person.

Jack

238

mmkhan, the point you are makin might be supported also by this "dual". Personal names like "Adam" represent and refer to ONLY one person.

http//www.tnellen.com/cybereng/lit_terms/allegory.html

loxbox13

Salaam Wakas,

To me 711 is addressing to us all initially then referring to Adam as singular. You can also look at 7172 and 237-38.

7172

237
238

Hope this helps inshaAllah.

May Allah guide us all to His path pr
Mohammed M. Khan

Hello my friend
There is nothing that say Adam is not equal man in the quran
Adam is a word that translated in the 19th century in my coutry to HOMO
Adam isn't a name of a single person, but a name of a kind ( us ) modern name HuMan, in the quran, we're still caled adam, and our parents, direct parents are called adam, ya bani Adam , meaning oh Son of Man.

the story of the earliest adam is the same that is repeating today to you and to me and to everybody, we don't realise because we don't understand the quran

warner

Peace Wakas

Now that we agree that 711 is not sufficient evidence for the plurality of adam, can you please point a verse fom the Al quran which supports this opinion ?

Wakas

peace warner,
Nowhere did I agree that. I am not saying 711 by itself is 100% proof of the viewpoint I highlighted. I think it is significant and asked for your explanation of it, to which you responded by saying "thumma" can also mean "and". Fair enough. It does not seem to read like that, but it is possible.

From PRL
thumma - then, afterwards, moreover, mostly used as a conjunction indicating a sequence in line or order to be rendered as then/thereafter, also used as a more simple conjunction - and.

For me, there does seem to be an interplay between the individual and collective, due to the story of adam being an allegory/parable.

Also see 20123
He said "Descend from this, all, some of you (plural) are to others enemy. So, when My guidance comes to you (plural), then, whoever follows (singular) My guidance, he (singular) will not go astray nor suffer."

Also see part 10 of this book
http//www.scribd.com/doc/37354743/Understanding-Quran-Themes-and-Style-by-Abdel-Haleem

Mazhar

Also see 20123
He said "Descend from this, all, some of you (plural) are to others enemy. Wakas

the pronoun is for dual, both of you

warner

Peace Wakas

Please direct me to any discussion on support of allegorical nature of the story of adam.

In my opinion 20123 may refer to

Adam and his partner, satan and his group (the jinns, since he was one of those)
or
The symbolic reference to paradise lost for all mankind, due to the actions of their first father and mother ( again, single father, adam)

Both cases above can justify the use of plurals in 20123.

Also if mazhar is correct on the use of the pronoun for dual the argument is stronger.

Wakas

peace,

I already linked you to a book that dedicates a part to this topic. You can opt to read it or not.

Yes it is dual for that verb, but the rest Mazhar did not comment on. See corpus.quran.com for the grammar.

warner

Peace Wakas

I already started reading the book.

Thanks for the recommending the corpus.quran. Great tool.

Mazhar

Yes it is dual for that verb, but the rest Mazhar did not comment on. See corpus.quran.com for the grammar. Wakas

Word by word Analysis of 20123

Word by word Analysis of 236

Difference between imperative command, and a general pronouncement giving information applicable to all in future needs to be noted.

gazzali

Salaam bro,

It does not mean that what ever others believe is wrong in total and we have to create a new meaning for each and every word and change all the stories.

I translated 'Malak' as 'King' already in another thread which is very close the above translation, please take a look http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9602167.msg277408#msg277408

Now you have to show me how did you extract those meanings? The meaning of 'Malak' that you made above is something similar that I believe is the meaning of wahi.

May Allah guide us all to His only path pr
Mohammed M. Khan

Salam brother

would you be able to help me with this

What is the meaning WaL Malaaikathu
and Wa Malaaikati

warner

Thanks Mazhar for the links. Although the grammatical analysis is excellent here it would be more user friendly if each
cell with the Arabic word contains the English translation as well.