Is there a single Muslim on this whole website?
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Peace Recluse,
For me Islam is simply a powerful reminder of universal / moral human values, such as peace, not killing, not stealing, doing good deeds. Rituals etc. on the other hand are not and simply cannot be the basis (pillars) of Islam as argued by traditional Muslims.
bravo Agreed!
I am assuming you meant "islam" with a small "i" rather than Islam with a capital "I".
Islam is the religion of Muslims (capital M) and rituals are the basis of that Islam.
Islam is not the same as "islam".
Islam or Muslims are never mentioned in al-quran, but "islam" and "muslims" are mentioned.
Please see the following for what islam means according to al-quran
http//www.free-minds.org/introduction-peacefulness
http//www.quran4peace.org/en_index.html
You should have phrased your statement as follows
"For me "islam" is simply a powerful reminder of universal / moral human values, such as peace, not killing, not stealing, doing good deeds. Rituals etc. on the other hand are not and simply cannot be the basis (pillars) of "islam" as argued by traditional Muslims"
Muslims (capital M) actually violate a lot of commandments of al-quran.
Peace and may the infinite Creator bless you.
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Peace Recluse,
You should have phrased your statement as follows
"For me "islam" is simply a powerful reminder of universal / moral human values, such as peace, not killing, not stealing, doing good deeds. Rituals etc. on the other hand are not and simply cannot be the basis (pillars) of "islam" as argued by traditional Muslims"
Muslims (capital M) actually violate a lot of commandments of al-quran.
Peace and may the infinite Creator bless you.
Peace truthseeker11,
Sorry, I don't know Arabic.. but I'll check your link, thank you..
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Peace Recluse,
If praying 5 times a day was the most important aspect of Islam (which it absolutely cannot be), then how come the "Islamic world" is in such a terrible mess?
Praying 5 times a day is the most important aspect of Islam (capital I).
However, praying 5 times a day is not even present in the quraanic "islam" (small "i".
Salaat doesn't mean "prayer" in al-quran.
Nowhere does al-quran say to "pray" 5 times a day.
The word for "pray" in al-quran is "du'a" and not "salaat".
This is why I was telling you that Muslims (capital M) violate al-quran.
For more details of what "salaat" means in al-quran please see the following by Ayman and Wakas
http//www.quran4peace.org/documents/Quran4peace-English-part3.pdf
http//www.mypercept.co.uk/articles/disproved_traditional_salat.htm
Peace and may the infinite Creator bless you.
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Peace Recluse,
Praying 5 times a day is the most important aspect of Islam (capital I).
However, praying 5 times a day is not even present in the quraanic "islam" (small "i".
Salaat doesn't mean "prayer" in al-quran.
Nowhere does al-quran say to "pray" 5 times a day.
The word for "pray" in al-quran is "du'a" and not "salaat".
This is why I was telling you that Muslims (capital M) violate al-quran.
For more details of what "salaat" means in al-quran please see the following by Ayman and Wakas
http//www.quran4peace.org/documents/Quran4peace-English-part3.pdf
http//www.mypercept.co.uk/articles/disproved_traditional_salat.htm
Peace and may the infinite Creator bless you.
Thank you truthseeker,
I'm still undecided about salat, but I'm merely seeking the truth. Thanks so much for the links, I will bookmark them.
May God bless you too...
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Is it that you think I'm not thinking?
Adam and Eve were right, they were forgiven immediately, there was nothing wrong with eating the fruit, it wasn't the "cause" of anything, it was an event which demonstrated the techniques of Satan in a harmless way, they became guilty after they did it. I would not be guilty if I killed my enemies to survive.
What those brothers did was very wrong and had bad intentions as well, and they hid it and hurt their father for years, yet it had good things come out of it.
Allah is writing all these stories. Allah says to repent if you make a mistake, and does not give the message of handing yourself over to your enemies. Your sense of justice may be a bit skewed or too extreme. God can do anything and make anything true and can forgive anything, or is it you believe in the God locked in a legalistic mire, who needs a human sacrifice to forgive the sins of mankind? Are you one of those who might say Allah's hand is fettered? What do you think the partners people used to make with God were? The ancient God's were just words for things, like "Time" and "Justice" and God is not fettered, so if you make a mistake, then continue to survive to do good another day is my advice and even seems to be the advice of the Qur'an. Were Adam and Eve immediately killed? No, not even Satan was immediately killed. Allah is the one who gives reprieve and gives a chance to amend, not a strict legalistic God because God is free of such things and can do anything and it is on God who we rely for everything, so if one makes a mistake, they should ask for forgiveness. Was Cain killed immediately? No, he was guided. Allah is the greatest.
You need to learn English properly then go back to understanding the translation of the Quran. God is bound by his own Words. He is just no matter what the situation.
Are you born Muslim or a convert?
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You need to learn English properly then go back to understanding the translation of the Quran. God is bound by his own Words. He is just no matter what the situation.
Are you born Muslim or a convert?
FreedomStands so you are a born Muslim. Very good to hear. What is your purpose in life and how should you live it? I'd advise you to understand the Quran properly before you answer.
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Salamun Alaikum.
Is all the debate totally based on one single remark ?Allah is our greatest potential enemy??
Can we not see the word ?potential? in the sentence.If I choose to repress my faith then yes Allah is the greatest potential enemy that I need to be worried about..
298 Who would be an enemy of Allah and His angels and His messengers and Gabriel and Michael? Then indeed Allah is an enemy of the ones who repress (faith).
(My personal translation, cross checking is recommended.)
What is the debate again?
May Allah guide us all to the straight route.
Regards,
Arman -
Salamun Alaikum.
Is all the debate totally based on one single remark ?Allah is our greatest potential enemy??
Can we not see the word ?potential? in the sentence.If I choose to repress my faith then yes Allah is the greatest potential enemy that I need to be worried about..
What is the debate again?
May Allah guide us all to the straight route.
Regards,
ArmanThat's just stupid. No one can never be consider God to be an enemy. That is one of the stupidest things I have heard. You're obviously not a muslim. Even Satan does not consider God as his enemy.
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God's purpose for everything is that they do and be exactly as God intends them, and that is always the case no matter what.
My purpose is to seek pleasure and avoid suffering at all costs (and God is the true source of both that can ultimately provide lasting forms of each, so to deal with God in order to achieve pleasure and avoid suffering in all ways and every way particularly in the most lasting and ultimate ways).
This is achieved generally first by surviving and living, eating etc, shelter, defense, clothing, then of course to do good and worship and ask for Allah for guidance and whatever we want and to spare us from suffering and work diligently in the cause of goodness and charity and decreasing suffering around us too. Do unto others as you would have God do unto you. So to give mercy within reason if you want mercy, to give gifts if you want gifts, to be gentle with creatures because you too are in the same plight and are a creature in need, and not to frighten or cause anxiety in them, etc.
Do you really think I don't know the Qur'an or understand it, yet you are under the impression that whereas I do not understand the Qur'an, you do understand it? Certainly that is a wonderful gift you have been given.
So your purpose is to seek pleasure and avoid suffering. Where in the Quran or Bible does it say that? I think I may have got it all wrong. Please do teach me.
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That's just stupid. No one can never be consider God to be an enemy. That is one of the stupidest things I have heard. You're obviously not a muslim. Even Satan does not consider God as his enemy.
Well once you are done with your name calling... (stupid, stupidest ets.) perhaps you could clarify exactly what part of "Allah is an enemy to the faith repressors ( َ you find difficult to understand?
May Allah guide us all to the straight route.
Regards,
Arman -
Well once you are done with your name calling... (stupid, stupidest ets.) perhaps you could clarify exactly what part of "Allah is an enemy to the faith repressors ( َ you find difficult to understand?
May Allah guide us all to the straight route.
Regards,
ArmanSalaam Arman,
It looks Ted misunderstood your question. I think its Freedomstands who said God can be considered the potential enemy of man, which needs further clarifications. May be I am wrong.
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Salam Amin.
If someone said that "God can be considered a potential enemy of entire mankind" then of course that is absurd. Somehow I am feeling nobody is saying that here. However, God can be our enemy if we choose to repress our faith - and from that perspective God is our greatest potential enemy if we choose or fancy to be willfully disobedient. That is clearly implied in Qur'an.
I just think lot of the debate on this thread is simply result of misunderstanding of what others are saying.
May Allah guide us all to the straight route.
Regards,
Arman -
Ok I guess we should ask FreedomStands to clarify.
FreedomStands, please do clarify.
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Nobody is a born Muslim, that would be unfair to all those born in other nations.
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Peace Recluse,
Do you also have links for me about Ramadan, Zakat and Hajj? If so, I would really appreciate if you shared.
Zakat
http//www.free-minds.org/zakat-quran
Ramadan (read up to reply #5)
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9188.msg34302#msg34302
Hajj
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=13271.msg175304#msg175304
http//www.free-minds.org/how-did-it-come-part-1
May the love and light of the infinite Creator be with you.
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Peace Recluse,
Zakat
http//www.free-minds.org/zakat-quran
Ramadan (read up to reply #5)
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9188.msg34302#msg34302
Hajj
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=13271.msg175304#msg175304
http//www.free-minds.org/how-did-it-come-part-1
May the love and light of the infinite Creator be with you.
Thanks, you're right, I saw all those articles on the home page of the website after I had asked.
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Nobody is a born Muslim, that would be unfair to all those born in other nations.
Hi Recluse
How about "Everybody is born muslim and they continue to be muslim as long as they continue to surrender to their Creator by consciously upholding the sense of right and wrong their Creator has gifted them irrespective of which religion / sect / culture they belong to".
Does it still sound unfair?
Regards,
Arman -
Hi Recluse
How about "Everybody is born muslim and they continue to be muslim as long as they continue to surrender to their Creator by consciously upholding the sense of right and wrong their Creator has gifted them irrespective of which religion / sect / culture they belong to".
Does it still sound unfair?
Regards,
ArmanWould that not make the pagans at the time of the prophet Mohammed muslim aswell? In fact that would make everyone muslim.