RULES:
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Hi Jaxal,
. We just follow the truth.
thats what i meant.
do we take the principles behind the rules and accordingly incorporate in our system or do we consider those rules to be followed to the dot by people of all eras?
are we to learn that we should not be unjust, wrong doers, etc and use appropriate rules to safeguard the principles?
or should we just follow the same rules like cut a thief's hand as punishment instead of imprisoning him etc? -
SaLaM peacefulmuslim
We take the principals behind the rules and incorporate them in our system. For example, cutting of a theif's hands. Perhaps that was appropriate 1400 years ago. Now, times have changed. Now, we dont cut people's hand off if they steal. Now we put them in prison. Infact, i dont think cutting off the hands was the right punishment in the first place. There is a thread on this i think started by marie. God has given us a moral code in all his scriptures i.e Torah, Gospel and Quran. Times change and so do the ways we handel things. If not, we will be stuck in the stone age like the saudis or iran. We dont go around stoning monkeys anymore.
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Salaam.
The verses were interpreted with bias and prejudice in regards to cutting off a thiefs hand. I read somewhere it should be translated as "mark" rather than "cut off". As the same word/derivative was used when Prophet Yusuf walked in and the ladies were so shocked due to his beauty when they saw him walk in that the knives they were cutting the fruits with "cut" their hands. Now tell me if your cutting a fruit and end up cutting yourself is all your hand going to be cut off lol or it will leave a mark on their hand.
It's merely a marker on the hand to estabilish who is a theif and not to decapitate a hand is cruel and barbaric. !
PEACE
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Hi PeacefulMuslim
The punishment which seems to you are cruel are good for me even at present time. The way I looked at them is the perfect way to eliminate crime. Can we implement these laws in any of the so called Muslim country? We can't implement these laws because we don't have any country which is based on Allah Taala laws. We can't just implement the punishment without building a society which is based on equality justice, welfare for unemployed, job opportunities for the people who wanted to work. The society where nobody go to sleep hungry, this is what the social system Allah Taala has given us in Qur'an, when we impleted the system of Allah Taala than we are justified to implement cutting of thieves hands and again look at the verses where it says to be merciful if you see that they want to change. It will be cruel if you cut the hands of hungry poor man who steel the bread to feed himself or his children.
Pologmy is made lawful by Allah with limits are very well defined in Qur'an. Mormons practice pologmy, the only one group which I remember right now.
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Hi PeacefulMuslim
The punishment which seems to you are cruel are good for me even at present time. The way I looked at them is the perfect way to eliminate crime. Can we implement these laws in any of the so called Muslim country.
You should live in Afghanistan when Talbian ruled it then. They were textbook Suni Muslims implementing these type of laws of cutting peoples hands and legs and stoning. Is this the system God described in the Quran. HELL NO!! It may seem perfect way to eliminate crime in your opinion but Gods Law is Gods Law we cannot change that. Please explain in the Quran how God is telling us to follow the law of cutting off peoples hand when they steal. It's not a law God is telling us to do. PERIOD!!!!
PEACE
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SaLaM
I used to steal. I have stolen some expensive stuff like gold and silver and some just for the heck of it like chocklates ( i beleived that the supermaket was being unfair by charging that much price for it. So i decided to steal and share it ith those who couldnt afford it. Like robin hood. D ) If my hands were cut off, i woulnt have been able to earn a living for my family. If my hands were cut off, i dont beleive i would be here praising God so much. Cutting of hands is a puinishment for those like to stone monkeys. Are you one of them KGB?
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hi zenje,
Sorry to take you back a bit, but why a you calling quran "final guidance"? ?
propably becoz of this
53This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion
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hi 2 pac,
It's merely a marker on the hand to estabilish who is a theif and not to decapitate a hand is cruel and barbaric. !
what about other rules, some of them that i have quoted?
should we be following the principles/message behind them and make up appropriate rules or merely follow the same rules which was told to people of a very primitive age?
and yeah, if God sent Quran now, would it have appropriate rules or would it be the same?
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hi KGB,
The punishment which seems to you are cruel are good for me even at present time. The way I looked at them is the perfect way to eliminate crime.
Pologmy is made lawful by Allah with limits are very well defined in Qur'an. Mormons practice pologmy, the only one group which I remember right now.u think chopping a thief's hand is better than imprisonment?
and polygamy, yeah, they are specific for mothers of orphans etc, and like i said, at that time, becoz of the battle, most of the men were dead leaving behind orphans and widows, and those days, most women didnt earn their livelihood and required to be taken care of by male members.
applies today?so, are u saying if God sent Quran now, it would have exactly the same rules to the dot?
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SaLaM PM and Joe
Joe
If you believe in killing people for denouncing islam,
I have not once said that. Whose missing the point now? wink
SM
are u saying if God sent Quran now, it would have exactly the same rules to the dot?
No it wouldnt. It would be different.
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Hi PeacefulMuslim
I am not saying anything. This is the punishment given in Qur'an for steeling. The question what would be the law can't be answered because none of us know the answer.
I only commented on what we have in Qur'an. You are free to call these punishments prescribed by Creator Lord The Most Wise - All Knowing - Most Merciful as cruel. I will accept them and please read carefully what I said about implementing these laws again.
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hi jaxal,
I have not once said that. Whose missing the point now? wink
i guess he(nabi) is talking of ur message in an other topic where u said the guy who said it was ok to leave islam should be shot
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People of saudi and iran will agree with you KGB. They too take the message as whole wink
Sure go ahead delete them from Qur'an. These are not my punishments. You certainly lack intelligence who do not understand what I said regarding implementing these laws.
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Hi PeacefulMuslim
I am not saying anything. This is the punishment given in Qur'an for steeling.
Please study the verse and not just look at a translation and assume its the right one. If you think cutting off someones hand is a punishment in the Quran then you may as well stick to translations of the Quran and not study the arabic behind the text. Please be open minded and study the Quran objectively and not be stuck in your own way. We're all here to learn brother.
what about other rules, some of them that i have quoted?
should we be following the principles/message behind them and make up appropriate rules or merely follow the same rules which was told to people of a very primitive age?
and yeah, if God sent Quran now, would it have appropriate rules or would it be the same?
Gods laws are clear in the Quran and are part of the literal verses as God stated and should not be taken metaphorically but literally. The Quran is for past present and future so your idea of making rules up ourself for this age is not supported by Quran at all.
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hi kgb,
Sure go ahead delete them from Qur'an. These are not my punishments. You certainly lack intelligence who do not understand what I said regarding implementing these laws.
not talking of deleting anything from Quran. the rules were propably the best for that time, those people.
but today? when the times are different, the people are different?