Chapter 106 translation

truth

Peace,

Some may remember some translations I have posted before. I have been prevented from much progress for some months; but found some time to look at 106 tonight. After three hours or so I think I found a reasonable translation for this otherwise difficult chapter.

Chapter 106

In the name of God, Ar Rahman, The Most Merciful

1 They cherish the victorious,
2 They cherish the journeying in the winter and summer,
3 Let them serve the Lord of this house (instead),
4 Who feeds them against hunger, and secures them against fear.

unknownuser

Salaams All,

Sorry for the slight differance in the Trans

From QD. BY omar.

Quraish = big fish/victorious.
Rihlat = journeying/journey.
Ilaf = Unity/compact/Alliance/Covenant for the purpose of trade/obligation involving responsibility for safety and protection.

Covenant for the purpose of trade ( is ) victorious, their covenant for trade journeying (of/the)winter and summer. So let them serve the lord (of) this House ( trading -providing). Who has fed them against hunger and has made them safe from fear.

And i think i know why they would journey in the winter and summer!?

I think All people who have herds of animals do DO this sought of thing moving to greener pastures and trading-aswell.

Abraham had herds of animals -as you know .

God Bless.

truth

Peace,

I actually thought about it and believe the 'winter and summer' to be a phrase meaning continuously or throughout the year. Just like two ends of the day also has the meaning of continuously, throughout the day.

Chapter 106

In the name of God, Ar Rahman, The Most Merciful

1 They cherish the victorious,
2 They cherish journeying throughout the year,
3 Let them serve the Lord of this house (instead),
4 Who feeds them against hunger, and secures them against fear.

unknownuser

In the name of God, Ar Rahman, The Most Merciful

Peace Oben

I wonder why you translated the folowing into english

God
The Most Merciful

and you left Ar Rahman, in arabic?

peace

Wakas

peace Oben, all,

I used to think providing a translation without notes was a good thing, but not anymore. It is crucial to show reasoning for various choices made and giving the reader enough information to verify the translation.

raheem does not mean "most merciful", that is "arham", it simply means "merciful". That is solid, see 1264.

literal word-for-word

Li-eelafi1 (for the safeguarding/keeping) qurayshin2 (of the victorious/Quraish)
Eelafihim (their safeguarding/keeping) rihlata*3 (journey/caravan) al shshita-i (the winter) wa al ssayfi (and the summer)
FalyaAAbudoo4 (so they should serve) rabba (lord/owner) hatha (of this) albayti5 (the house/establishment/household)
Allathee (Who has) atAAamahum (fed them) min (from) jooAAin (hunger) wa amanahum (and secured them) min khawfin (from fear)

see PRL
*1 root Alif-Lam-Fa
*2 root Qaf-Ra-Shiin
*3 root Ra-Ha-Lam
*4 root Ayn-Ba-Dal
*5 root Ba-Ya-Ta

translation/interpretation

For the safegaurding/keeping of the victorious,
their safeguarding/keeping of the summer and winter's journey,
so they should serve the lord/owner of this house/establishment/household,
who fed them against hunger and secured them from fear.

notes

1061 begins with fi/for thus implies for a certain thing (safeguarding/keeping), another thing is expected which is explained in 1063 (serve the lord/owner of this house/establishment/household).
1064 is similar to Abraham's request in 2126, and al bayt is mentioned prior, there may be a link.

chapter 106 could be read as specific to a tribe called Quraish, but its message is not time-limited. For giving safety & provision, one should serve the lord of this bayt (whatever you think "bayt" is).
A house is known for providing shelter/security, provision, with people of the same descent (family/kindred), a dwelling to allow one to live and grow. Is it coincidence that food & security are mentioned in the context? These concepts are fairly synonomous with the function of a house.

Today the phrase "put a roof over your head" is referring to a house and means to take care of someone.

Wakas

truth

Peace Wakas,

The reasoning for 'cherish' came from comparing the various translations used for the A-L-F concept. People have variously translated it as covenant, taming, and cherishing (Khalifa).

When studying the reasoning behind each, there was some problems in the meaning being rendered.

The safeguarding concept is not something I considered because the root has a meaning of unification, togetherness, attachment. And that's the key that allowed me to understand Khalifa's choice of "cherish" for this concept. The idea of attachment to things.

The problem with using tribal names or understanding qurayshin to be a tribal name is that not only does it freeze the concept in time; it requires acceptance of a source outside to know who the tribe was. The traditionists have them as the enemy (for a time). As an enemy, the concept of 'taming' for A-L-F is appropriate as Pickthall has chosen.

I understood the cherishing to be 'valuing' above the God and His ability to provide; an 'attachment' or 'cherishing' of worldly things.

So that in the first verse the people are cherishing or valuing their ability to be victorious - their heroes to keep them safe from attacks and fear of being attacked.

In the second verse they are valuing the ability of their caravans and journeying related to this enterprise throughout the year to feed them.

While the God is the one who should be served, and who provides and continues to provide those things of food/needs and security from fear.

I hope that has made it clearer now.

Regards.

unknownuser

Peace,

Some may remember some translations I have posted before. I have been prevented from much progress for some months; but found some time to look at 106 tonight. After three hours or so I think I found a reasonable translation for this otherwise difficult chapter.

Chapter 106

In the name of God, Ar Rahman, The Most Merciful

1 They cherish the victorious,
2 They cherish the journeying in the winter and summer,
3 Let them serve the Lord of this house (instead),
4 Who feeds them against hunger, and secures them against fear.

Brother Wakas is right....you must provide the reasoning behind your rendering, otherwise it carries no weight.

Apply our exegetical methodology to this sura, and see what it is really telling you...

truth

Peace,

Some may remember some translations I have posted before. I have been prevented from much progress for some months; but found some time to look at 106 tonight. After three hours or so I think I found a reasonable translation for this otherwise difficult chapter.

Chapter 106

In the name of God, Ar Rahman, The Most Merciful

1 They cherish the victorious,
2 They cherish the journeying in the winter and summer,
3 Let them serve the Lord of this house (instead),
4 Who feeds them against hunger, and secures them against fear.

Brother Wakas is right....you must provide the reasoning behind your rendering, otherwise it carries no weight.

Apply our exegetical methodology to this sura, and see what it is really telling you...

Brother Wakas has been provided above with my reasoning.

When you say "our exegetical methodology" I'm presuming that you are advocating your own groping for meaning by looking blurrily at all things through the "christ lens".

unknownuser

Peace,

Some may remember some translations I have posted before. I have been prevented from much progress for some months; but found some time to look at 106 tonight. After three hours or so I think I found a reasonable translation for this otherwise difficult chapter.

Chapter 106

In the name of God, Ar Rahman, The Most Merciful

1 They cherish the victorious,
2 They cherish the journeying in the winter and summer,
3 Let them serve the Lord of this house (instead),
4 Who feeds them against hunger, and secures them against fear.

Brother Wakas is right....you must provide the reasoning behind your rendering, otherwise it carries no weight.

Apply our exegetical methodology to this sura, and see what it is really telling you...

Brother Wakas has been provided above with my reasoning.

When you say "our exegetical methodology" I'm presuming that you are advocating your own groping for meaning by looking blurrily at all things through the "christ lens".

Our exegesis covers each and every word, in each and every ayah, of the surah under scrutiny.

Each word is then concorded with other similar word/root-based derivatives as they are used in the Koran.

Definitions are given from the world's highest quality lexical aids (even the ones promoted by this forum), front and center and highlights the ones that are chosen as pertaining to the text in question.

Comparisons to other scriptures (outside of the Koran) are also given.

Only after all this, are conclusions drawn....

There is nothing hidden.

No punches are thrown.

All is shown.

Your reaction to this honesty is to simply turn your head... shock

truth

Your reaction to this honesty is to simply turn your head... shock

Because you have a false paradigm, you see everything in a false way.

It's like illuminating everything with a blue light and attempting to discern the correct hues. You end up identifying things incorrectly or not seeing them at all.

Regards.

ayman

Peace Truth, MZ, Wakas, all,

2 They cherish the journeying in the winter and summer,

their covenant for trade journeying (of/the)winter and summer

their safeguarding/keeping of the summer and winter's journey,

Although in Modern Arabic, the word "sayf" means "summer", in Classical Arabic it means "spring". According to Classical Arabic dictionaries (see Lisan Al-3arab) the pre-quranic Arabs had the following seasons

Shitaa Winter
Sayf Spring
Qayth Summer
Kharif Fall

The problem with using tribal names or understanding qurayshin to be a tribal name is that not only does it freeze the concept in time; it requires acceptance of a source outside to know who the tribe was.

I completely agree. The Arabs were very proud of their tribal affiliations. Hence, there are many inscriptions through out Arabia that name all sorts of tribes and NONE is named Quraysh. So this cannot be the name of what was supposed to be one of the most famous tribes of the time.

In the name of God, Ar Rahman, The Most Merciful

From pre-quranic Christian inscriptions in Southern Arabia such as the inscription of Abraha, we can see that "al-rahman" means the Almighty.

I hope this helps.

Peace,

Ayman

unknownuser

Your reaction to this honesty is to simply turn your head... shock

Because you have a false paradigm, you see everything in a false way.

It's like illuminating everything with a blue light and attempting to discern the correct hues. You end up identifying things incorrectly or not seeing them at all.

Regards.

We show all possible definitions in our exegesis.

You show zero.

None.

No references whatsoever.

You have no basis for your position....only your hardened opinion...

truth

Unfortunately there's been some data loss.

I know this thread had more.

Ayman had posted here as well as another regarding the black stone which are now gone.

Wakas

peace Oben, all,

Not to worry, I read your post before it got deleted.

Mine also got deleted. In brief, it said

I was unsure about the influence of "fi" at the start, as it may tee up the rest of the signs. It may need clarified.

Also, I asked Ayman how he rendered 1061

Wakas

ayman

Peace Wakas,

literal word-for-word

Li-eelafi1 (for the safeguarding/keeping) qurayshin2 (of the victorious/Quraish)

With respect to the above translation, "quraish" doesn't have the definite article while in your literal translation "the victorious" does.

Please let me know if you know of another example in the great reading that can be translated in a similar way.

Thanks,

Ayman

Wakas

peace brother Ayman,

It seems that was a mistake on my part. There is no "al" hence "the" should be removed.

Does this weaken the argument for Quraysh (as in the tribe)?

Please let me know if you know of another example in the great reading that can be translated in a similar way.

Unfortunately, I'm not familiar enough with 'the reading' to recall/know examples.

Wakas

ayman

Peace brother Wakas,

Thank you for your quick reply on this issue.

It seems that was a mistake on my part. There is no "al" hence "the" should be removed.

Does this weaken the argument for Quraysh (as in the tribe)?

According to Lane's Lexicon (from your excellent site), QaRaSha means gained/earned/acquired and collected for his family. So another way to render the passage could be

1061-4. For keeping on earning, their keeping is the journey of the
winter and spring. So they should serve the Lord of this house who fed
them against hunger and secured them against fear.

Now, like the original passage, both "ilaf" and "quraysh" in 1061 are in the indefinite. I think this meaning of keeping on/maintenance of "earning" is more in line with the commercial activity of traveling in winter and spring. The "victorious" doesn't seem to fit because there is no conflict or war in the passage to warrant victory but there seems to be commercial travel.

Please let me know what you think.

Peace,

Ayman

Wakas

peace brother Ayman,

That translation makes more sense and is in line with the jist of the signs.

Wakas

gclandcp

Salam Brother Ahmed,

Peace Oben

I wonder why you translated the following into English

God
The Most Merciful

and you left Ar Rahman, in arabic?

I think Brother Oben got a point there. Please refer to http//www.free-minds.org/articles/gods_system/rahman.htm . What do you think?

Regards

unknownuser

Salam Brother Ahmed,

Peace Oben

I wonder why you translated the following into English

God
The Most Merciful

and you left Ar Rahman, in arabic?

I think Brother Oben got a point there. Please refer to http//www.free-minds.org/articles/gods_system/rahman.htm . What do you think?

Regards

Salam brother gclandcp

Actually bro i'm in favour of not translating His names at all

i just thought that if you will trnaslate something then the rest of the sentence should be translated

Salam