are you and me going to heaven?
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is believing in god and doing good deeds without knowing about the messengers and the sriptures enough for salvation?
can monotheistic people but not formally labelled as muslims go to heaven?
can people who believe in god but not do any rituals get any salvation?
are there any chance for non-monotheistic people but doing righteous deeds in their whole lives get the salvation?
what about people who believe in god and labelled themselves as muslims but opressing and hurting other people, directly or indirectly? which one better, a good non-believer or a bad believer? -
Peace
Allah told us that this is what we need to believe in to be saved
O you who believe! believe in Allah and His Messenger and the Book which He has revealed to His Messenger and the Book which He revealed before; and whoever disbelieves in Allah and His angels and His messengers and the last day, he indeed strays off into a remote error.
(136)
Peace
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peace topo and all. I believe good deeds are sufficient without a belief in monotheism,or prophets,or certain religious doctrines.(or what is generally meant as monotheism) I think a good non-believer is happier than a bad believer.(in the generally used idea of believer).I dont think there is any such thing as eternal salvation or damnation,just a continous flux between the two for all people..( between happiness and un-happiness)
Peace all. -
peace topo and all. I believe good deeds are sufficient without a belief in monotheism,or prophets,or certain religious doctrines.(or what is generally meant as monotheism) I think a good non-believer is happier than a bad believer.(in the generally used idea of believer).I dont think there is any such thing as eternal salvation or damnation,just a continous flux between the two for all people..( between happiness and un-happiness)
Peace all.Hi
according to 4136 above, you are not a believer
do you agree?
cheers
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what about people who were born without any knowledge of any scriptures, the case when the world wasn't globally wired yet or even today in remote areas, and lived their lives righteously until they died, what would be the parameter of their salvation then?
I believe Allah said clearly that He will NOT punish anyone who has not received the message, as well He siad He will not punish those who will commit sins while being ignornat as llong as they don't insist on it
i will try to find the verses later today
edited Added missing NOT
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Peace ahmedbhaghat and all. I have stated before i am not a believer in the traditional idea of monotheism.(an all-powerful,all-knowing creator.)
Peace. -
Peace ahmedbhaghat and all. I have stated before i am not a believer in the traditional idea of monotheism.(an all-powerful,all-knowing creator.)
Peace.Hi
please take the word traditional out of it as the above verse is not a traditipomnal or human made, you have no point to call it as such
the arabic and english words are damn clear, and is directed to those who call themselves believers
you will not be able to kid me bro
please don't call yourself a muslim and a quran follower, because you are not a muslim neither a quran follower, you are just a kind and good person that's all, now if you tihnk that is enough to be saved, good for you but the Quran contradict you and it says clearly that the good deeds to be considered in the judgment day the perosn MUST BE A BELIEVER
peace be with you
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Peace all,
peace topo and all. I believe good deeds are sufficient without a belief in monotheism,or prophets,or certain religious doctrines.(or what is generally meant as monotheism)
While I'm in total agreement about religious doctrine, I'm not quite sure what you meant by belief in monotheism. If one doesn't believe in God at all, or believes in many gods, etc... then the deeds are for nought.- The example of those who reject their Lord is that their works are like ashes, on which the wind blows strongly on a stormy day, they cannot get anything of what they earned. Such is the farthest misguidance.
what about people who were born without any knowledge of any scriptures, the case when the world wasn't globally wired yet or even today in remote areas, and lived their lives righteously until they died, what would be the parameter of their salvation then?
This is not about scriptures. The belief in god is inherent in every human. Even animals and rocks know this, so if a human says they dont, then they are rejecting that notion, not ignorant of it. I hope I'm clear.Did Abraham require or have any scriptures to find God? idea
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Salam,
Follow the book of Allah. Keep on correcting ourselves through the guidance from the book of Allah. Face hardships/trials with the best we could do, again with the guidance from the book of Allah. Then I think me a you will be successful in this life and the hereafter.
Peace P
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Peace ahmedbhaghat,zenje and all.
1)ahmedbhaghat;i agree with you. According to your translation i am not a believer.And i am not a quran follower either. You stated ;you are just a kind and good person,thats all.' Well thats all i aspire to be.2)zenje;I do not subscribe to monotheism.By monotheism i mean one all-powerful,all-knowledgable creator. I believe a god is anything that has life(or will),and by this definition everthing is a god. It has been called infintheism.(an endless number of gods or life-forms).
I am currently at the happiest,most logical understanding of religion that i have had so far in my life.(in my opinion). But as always,there can be/and is more to learn. )
Peace all.
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Peace elke and all. I can understand all being one metaphorically(eg all life is called 'existence',and existence is one word.)But i find it strange that
all is one because that would mean we are all one being,then what is the point of free-will and individual experience?Why would one part of the 'being' oppress or disagree with another part of it,if it was all one?
I would be interested in your theories and thoughts on this issue.(as well as anyone else).
Peace all. -
please don't call yourself a muslim and a quran follower, because you are not a muslim neither a quran follower, you are just a kind and good person that's all, now if you tihnk that is enough to be saved, good for you but the Quran contradict you and it says clearly that the good deeds to be considered in the judgment day the perosn MUST BE A BELIEVER
peace be with youLet his "Creator" Judge him on that and let yourself be judged by the Quran...
Regards,
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Aw... this is indeed a great topic.
if i were a remote tribe inside a jungle and nobody was with me, or even if i had comrades they had not had the luck of being wise and prophetic (what kind of luck is that?? but let's just say it is possible as we are so barbaric and know nothing of God, revelation and whatever spirituality).
Yet we will know about God for sure. Why? Because my definition of Book of Allah is the nature! Yes, the nature of universe, the nature of mere grain of sand, and even the nature of human mind and heart.Look at the universe and surely there be sign for those who think. idea
Even without anything, surely God would give something. So there are no case that was not vulnerable to this approach. As i said to my friend If one to enter heaven must study and learn the depth of scriptures, surely the idiots and imbeciles would be eliminated. My wise friend responded calmly, "It took only a line of scriptures to be fully understood to enter heaven, and if it didn't take that, there's a whole world of Truth out there for the blind, the illiterate, etc. Surely the God is all-merciful." oops
So what's book? What's God? What's heaven? What's hell? If we straightened up our own definition surely the answer to our case-study will reveal. wink
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exactly, that was how abraham found god, by observing the nature and listening to the deepest of his heart and conscience.
he didn't have any knowledge of either scriptures or messengers.
the nature and universe, including our own beings, are signature of god. one who observes it will find his way to realization of the creator existence. -
peace enquirer
Sorry not much time to spare
one could consider it either as one being, or as the one creation of the one god. i don't see the problem for free will here. It has been more than once discussed on the forum. IMO we have free will because if not there would be no basis for judgment, but still god, not being concerned by our time and space, already knows our decisions
lk
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Peace Zenje,
If one doesn't believe in God at all, or believes in many gods, etc... then the deeds are for nought.
What do u think the difference between 'one who believes in God' and 'one who doesnt' is ? And if possible can u give examples from the period of Quranic revelation?
Peace!
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"What do u think the difference between 'one who believes in God' and 'one who doesnt' is ? And if possible can u give examples from the period of Quranic revelation?"
Read the following; those who do the opposite are those destined for hell. (If you wanted sources other than the Quran for the "period of Quranic revelation", then maybe check out some Hadith? cry )Successful indeed are the believers;who are reverent during their Contact Prayers (Salat).And they avoid vain talk.And they give their obligatory charity (Zakat).And they maintain their chastity.Only with their spouses, or those who are rightfully theirs, do they have sexual relations; they are not to be blamed.Those who transgress these limits are the transgressors.When it comes to deposits entrusted to them, as well as any agreements they make, they are trustworthy.And they observe their Contact Prayers (Salat) regularly.Such are the inheritors.They will inherit Paradise, wherein they abide forever. 231?2312 ... See also 2177