Did Lot offer her daughters for sex?
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Am I the only one who has a hard time understanding Naxus's posts? Not trying to be mean but....
Perhaps! His posts seem quite rational and well thought out, perhaps not exactly in the way 'others' would understand (i.e grammatically)!
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Opinion of every person matters but we got started on the wrong foot here i was quoting u becausie u agree with that other fellow n i want to hear opinion of u too regarding the issue in this thread thats why i quoted both of u
ok I agree that every different opinion matters as long as the opinion had merit not just out of another planet, in the case here, I agreed with the other opinion, i will be stupid if i just repeat what they said, also I considered that they put it in better words than if I tried to do it hence i agreed with them and kept it short and brief
Regarding Jesus u seems n inteligent person
thanks but i will be also happy if you consider me an average IQ human
asked u,r own self if a person came to u an claims that he is the son of god n he was born to a virgin mother wut will be u,r reaction to that forget about Jesus any person who will came to u with this claim wut will be u,r reaction r u going to accept his claim just be rational leave the emotion on one side n think rationally
of course i will accuse that person of being crazy even if it was jesus himself, but you are missing the point here really
There is other entity that told me Jesus is not a god neither there is any gods but Allah, this entity is Allah "the only God", Allah also told me that Jesus was born of a virgin woman, and because I take what Allah says for granted even if it does not make sense, i have to believe 100% that Jesus is not a god neither a son of a god but I also have to believe 100% that he was born of a virgin woman, why? because no human told me as such but Allah "our God " was the one who claimed to have done it, as well according to the Bible and the Quran, Jesus never claimed to be as a son of a god
you can call me crazy, or ancient story tales follower but i won't care really because i will believe what the God says and take it for granted but will never do this with any human even if it was Jesus himself
cheers
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Opinion of every person matters but we got started on the wrong foot here i was quoting u becausie u agree with that other fellow n i want to hear opinion of u too regarding the issue in this thread thats why i quoted both of u
ok I agree that every different opinion matters as long as the opinion had merit not just out of another planet, in the case here, I agreed with the other opinion, i will be stupid if i just repeat what they said, also I considered that they put it in better words than if I tried to do it hence i agreed with them and kept it short and brief
Regarding Jesus u seems n inteligent person
thanks but i will be also happy if you consider me an average IQ human
asked u,r own self if a person came to u an claims that he is the son of god n he was born to a virgin mother wut will be u,r reaction to that forget about Jesus any person who will came to u with this claim wut will be u,r reaction r u going to accept his claim just be rational leave the emotion on one side n think rationally
of course i will accuse that person of being crazy even if it was jesus himself, but you are missing the point here really
There is other entity that told me Jesus is not a god neither there is any gods but Allah, this entity is Allah "the only God", Allah also told me that Jesus was born of a virgin woman, and because I take what Allah says for granted even if it does not make sense, i have to believe 100% that Jesus is not a god neither a son of a god but I also have to believe 100% that he was born of a virgin woman, why? because no human told me as such but Allah "our God " was the one who claimed to have done it, as well according to the Bible and the Quran, Jesus never claimed to be as a son of a god
you can call me crazy, or ancient story tales follower but i won't care really because i will believe what the God says and take it for granted but will never do this with any human even if it was Jesus himself
cheers
Ahmad every religion claims the same if i ask a Hindu about things in his religion which seems illogical to me he will give me the same answer because God told me if i ask a Christen a Jew or a Budhest etc etc all of them have the same answer n that is "God told us" keeping this in mind wut is the difference b/n all of those religions when they use the same logic.
U rejected hadiths because it doesn,t make sense to u but u r accepting Quran which is not making sense either.I,m not going to judge u.U should judge u,r ownself .
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peace
Naxus makes a good point. This is the trap most "quran aloners" get into. They select what they want to judge objectively. Never questioning the quran, but questioning (and making fun of) every other book on the planet. The quran is "the best" book. I don't know if it claims to be perfect, though. Even if it is, we must look at the quran objectively and verify everything it says before we follow it. That's the only way we will know what these verses mean or what they can mean.
so is the quran the word of God? not technically. But if it is from God, the only way we can know is by examining it critically.
BUT i know some people have already found something(s) in the quran that has helped them make up their mind about this.
I'm not accusing anyone of anything. Just making a point. If it doesn't apply to you, ignore it. -
Ahmad every religion claims the same if i ask a Hindu about things in his religion which seems illogical to me he will give me the same answer because God told me if i ask a Christen a Jew or a Budhest etc etc all of them have the same answer n that is "God told us" keeping this in mind wut is the difference b/n all of those religions when they use the same logic.
Hello naxus
Firstly, I agree with your comment that most religion followers if not all will defend their religion hard even if it does not make sense to the common sense that that religion is corrupt, including Muslims, Christians, Jews, Hindus and Buddhists, even Atheists will defend their Atheism hard
However you assumed that everyone of all these followers is following blindly without deploying the common sense via the brain, I?m sure most follow blindly, but I can assure that a lot also put reasoning in place and think accordingly, it is not fair by you to assume that all these religions followers are dumb, I know many who are smarter than even Einstein, see being smart is not about being exceptional in science, being smart is to calculate the chances of a god existence then make your bet accordingly, I will explain this later,
What I?m trying to say that it is not easy not to be unbiased but there are many who are still unbiased, at least they are not biased to themselves, those people can sit down and spend years analysing the messages from so called god that we have in our hands, and I?m sure if they deploy reasoning the truth will be crystal clear, it does not happen over night though
Now let?s work my chances and yours, I assumed that you reject the existence of God, i.e. an atheist, please correct me of I?m wrong
Let?s also assume for argument sake that there are 4 possible religions that one of them must be true, those religions are
- Hinduism
- Judaism
- Christianity
- Islam
what I meant by being true, i.e. the message that was sent is still preserved and not corrupted by its followers
Let?s now add you religion to the above 4 which is assumed Atheism, each one will have a probability, let?s make all of them equal, i.e.?
- Hinduism 20%
- Judaism 20%
- Christianity 20%
- Islam 20%
- Atheism 20%
i.e. there is a 20% chance for each of the above 5 probabilities to be true
all the first 4 say that there will be severe punishment for the rejectors, as well will be a generous reward for the followers
Atheism on the other hand say there is nothing after death, i.e. there is no punishment nor reward
Now let?s assume there is a god
My chance to be severely punished will be 60%
Your chance will be 80%
See, I?m better
Now for the reward, I have 20% chance
And you have zero chance
I?m still better, LOL
Now if there is no god
Well who cares about chances here bro, me and you will be safe i.e. non existents anymore
Now if we say the chanceof a god is 50%
Then the final chances for me and you if the 50% probability is to pass
Me will have ? * 3/5 = 3/10 = 30% chance to be punished
You will have this chance ? * 4/5 = 4/10 = 40% chance to be punished
See how I will always be in better situation
The ironic note is this
If there is no god, what the hell I lost?, nothing for sure, I might even had a better life than yours ?I wish you the best of course?, I mean, I might had resources in life that enabled me to enjoy it better than you while keeping the faith in God
See an god rejector has 40% chance to be humiliated bad with no chance of winning even if there is no God, they are the ultimate losers in my eyes, and for me they earned the title Dumb very well, sorry
U rejected hadiths because it doesn,t make sense to u but u r accepting Quran which is not making sense either.I,m not going to judge u.U should judge u,r ownself .
That?s is not true, because I never rejected the hadith as a whole, I only accept from them what the Quran qualifies, the rest is straight into the rubbish bin, and even the accepted ones are nothing but a mere history record for me and in no way can be compared to the God?s words,
I always play it safe and if I will bet, I have to make sure that most likely I will win at the end, there is no blind following in my life, even to my parents, in fact my parents hardly taught me anything, I was taught the real life by the best teacher, that teach is our God
Peace bro
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it is not fair by you to assume that all these religions followers are dumb, I know many who are smarter than even Einstein,
I don,t know any one smarter than Einstein. He has done more good for humunity than any one else in human history.
However you assumed that everyone of all these followers is following blindly without deploying the common sense via the brain, I?m sure most follow blindly, but I can assure that a lot also put reasoning in place and think accordingly, it is not fair by you to assume that all these religions followers are dumb,
I,m not asuming any thing i believe wut i observe the fact that religion is an obstruction in the advancement of humanity is not a hidden secret from Christinity Islam to Hinduism these beliefs r still hindering humans from advancement the fact that the countries with secular laws r more advanced and safe for living a god life is a reallty n the fact that theostatic states r failiers is a fact you can not deny.
What I?m trying to say that it is not easy not to be unbiased but there are many who are still unbiased, at least they are not biased to themselves, those people can sit down and spend years analysing the messages from so called god that we have in our hands, and I?m sure if they deploy reasoning the truth will be crystal clear, it does not happen over night though
The message of God is for every one to understand. When it is confines to a specific language specific peoples or i may say a specific sex than it is bias and something bias is not from God.
Now let?s work my chances and yours, I assumed that you reject the existence of God, i.e. an atheist, please correct me of I?m wrong
No i have rejected the charlatans not God i believe on God but i don,t believe on any religion for that.
Let?s also assume for argument sake that there are 4 possible religions that one of them must be true, those religions are
- Hinduism
- Judaism
- Christianity
- Islam
what I meant by being true, i.e. the message that was sent is still preserved and not corrupted by its followers
Let?s now add you religion to the above 4 which is assumed Atheism, each one will have a probability, let?s make all of them equal, i.e.?
- Hinduism 20%
- Judaism 20%
- Christianity 20%
- Islam 20%
- Atheism 20%
i.e. there is a 20% chance for each of the above 5 probabilities to be true
all the first 4 say that there will be severe punishment for the rejectors, as well will be a generous reward for the followers
Atheism on the other hand say there is nothing after death, i.e. there is no punishment nor reward
Now let?s assume there is a god
My chance to be severely punished will be 60%
Your chance will be 80%
See, I?m better
Now for the reward, I have 20% chance
And you have zero chance
I?m still better, LOL
Now if there is no god
Well who cares about chances here bro, me and you will be safe i.e. non existents anymore
Now if we say the chanceof a god is 50%
Then the final chances for me and you if the 50% probability is to pass
Me will have ? * 3/5 = 3/10 = 30% chance to be punished
You will have this chance ? * 4/5 = 4/10 = 40% chance to be punished
See how I will always be in better situation
I didn,t know whether to laugh or cry on the above statement of yours.You are talking about probablities,Probablility is likeliwood of something happening it is not certain.
My stance on God is that if there is a God than that God will treat every one on the merit of good rather than on beilieves.Every person in this world has there own problems there own circumstances.We could not judge every one with the same glasses.A person born in Africa has his own situations a person in Asia or any other part of world can not judge him according to there own circumstances.
Qualty of good which a God can judge veries from a person to person.
For example there is a millionier who give a grant of 10,000 dollars to a charity organization n a simple person who just has one bread to eat but when he saw a hungry child he give half of this bread to that poor child.On papper half of a bread is in no comprision to 10000$ but on the base of Good deed those 10000$ has no chance against that peace of bread that simple person is more richer than that millionier he sacrifice his own wish or cumfort for some one else the millionier doesnot have any effect on him self while the simple person does get effected n he have sleep with a empty stomach on that night .Its only God who can judge both of them to perfection.
What i mean to say is that will you want to know the religions of these guys or you will just see there deed i believe that God will judge us on our deeds rather than believes.
Religion is an easy way out any thing you do bad you have Satan to blame
If there is no god, what the hell I lost?, nothing for sure, I might even had a better life than yours ?I wish you the best of course?, I mean, I might had resources in life that enabled me to enjoy it better than you while keeping the faith in God
See an god rejector has 40% chance to be humiliated bad with no chance of winning even if there is no God, they are the ultimate losers in my eyes, and for me they earned the title Dumb very well, sorry
What you are doing is competing others.On the other hand i don,t need that competition i beleive only my own deeds will effect me rather than the deeds of others .Your belief have no effect on me .You need to win to satisfy your self i,m already satisfied .
That?s is not true, because I never rejected the hadith as a whole, I only accept from them what the Quran qualifies, the rest is straight into the rubbish bin, and even the accepted ones are nothing but a mere history record for me and in no way can be compared to the God?s words,
Infact i have the same believe as you but offcourse with a difference i only accept the good from any religion or any person n the rest is in rubbish bin just like you do
I always play it safe and if I will bet, I have to make sure that most likely I will win at the end, there is no blind following in my life, even to my parents, in fact my parents hardly taught me anything, I was taught the real life by the best teacher, that teach is our God
Again you want to win well best of luck for that. What you do is blind following whether you accept it or not when you accept Jesus born to a virgin mother it is blind following you can not give any logical explaination for that to me
Peace
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Peace naxus. Some excellent points made. idea
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peace kgb and all. Its also the common hearsay,misinterpretation and idolisation of the quran which is a hindrance to humanity...,and thus the quran is made into a tool for exploitation,oppression,justification of evil, and ignorance...
Peace all. -
Nexus
Religions are humanity not the otherway around Nexus. Islam is not hinderance to anything at all its the common popular interpretation hearsay hadiths which are used as effective tools for exploitation and oppression.
Peace KGB n all
sorry i tend to dissagree with you.Religions is a tool of ignorence it stops humanity from developing .
A common factor in all religion is that they are sexist all of them are mainly addressed to males in one way or another .They permote inequality and suppression .Its just one example and there are many others.
Peace
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peace kgb and all. Its also the common hearsay,misinterpretation and idolisation of the quran which is a hindrance to humanity...,and thus the quran is made into a tool for exploitation,oppression,justification of evil, and ignorance...
Peace all.Peace Enquirer
Good points.I will add another if Quran or any other book which is claimed to be universal guidence to God why are they misinterpreted why are they hard to understand why are they like riddles.Its because they are not what they claim they are not universal they are not simple hence they are not a guidence to God.
Peace
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Nexus and Enquirer I have nothing further to say.
I believe laughing won't offend you guys. lol lol lol
Well actually you have nothing further to say because you have nothing to say
Laughing is a good way to release tension and stress and you certainly need that
twisted
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I don,t know any one smarter than Einstein. He has done more good for humunity than any one else in human history.
oh yeh he was a very good jew, he created the atomic bomb that killed thousands and thousands of innocent humans
he must be in heaven now
I,m not asuming any thing i believe wut i observe the fact that religion is an obstruction in the advancement of humanity is not a hidden secret from Christinity Islam to Hinduism these beliefs r still hindering humans from advancement the fact that the countries with secular laws r more advanced and safe for living a god life is a reallty n the fact that theostatic states r failiers is a fact you can not deny.
a typical atheist statement, nothing new really, sorry
The message of God is for every one to understand. When it is confines to a specific language specific peoples or i may say a specific sex than it is bias and something bias is not from God.
a baseless and unfounded statement, Allah created thel anguages and it is up to Him to choose which one to use to send His messages, and I?m sure He used more than one language for His consistant messages to humanity that were sealed by the Arabic Quran
For the sex issue, yeh you are right, the corrupt Bible discriminate between men and woman for no logical reason, now show me how the Quran did the same, I can show you how the bible did it and I?m sure you will agree, now I?m not saying that the bible "as is now" is the true inspiration of God, in fact it is not after it got corrupted by sick humans
No i have rejected the charlatans not God i believe on God but i don,t believe on any religion for that.
yeh right, the man made god you made according to your own desires, well, what you are going to say to the real God when He hold you responsible for your belief?, I mean if it comes true, you know the theory of propability still give it a chance logically speaking
but I know what you will say
?I?m guilty my God, is there is a way out?
I didn,t know whether to laugh or cry on the above statement of yours.
if you laughed, I guess you should thank me for making you laugh
if you cried, then you have to take what I said very serious indeed
You are talking about probablities,Probablility is likeliwood of something happening it is not certain.
excuse me, the probability is 100% correct, if you have a bag with red ball and a white ball in it
what is your bloody chance to randomly pick the red ball?
A child will answer 50%
Not sure mate, did you go to school or you left early as many western kids do?, just kiddin bro
My stance on God is that if there is a God than that God will treat every one on the merit of good rather than on beilieves.
well, the Quran said that your god is the man made god that many humans make for themselves according to their own desires and sometimes these desires are really low indeed
what did your god do to you?, did he just created you then left you alone?
Did your god create the earth?, and if so, did he tell you that in a book that he sent you?
When you answer these questions, I will take your god seriously
Now regarding the required belief alonge with the good deeds
Well if you think this is injustice then bad luck, what are we going to do if our god is really unjust god and he is just playin with us?, can you do anything about it if it is the case?, please let me know if you can do something about it when you discover that so i will try and do it with ya but I'm sure whatever it is, it will fail. aren't we dealing with a God?
Every person in this world has there own problems there own circumstances.We could not judge every one with the same glasses.A person born in Africa has his own situations a person in Asia or any other part of world can not judge him according to there own circumstances.
of course, glad we agreed on somthin
Qualty of good which a God can judge veries from a person to person.
of course, but we are not talking details, we are only talking general in here
For example there is a millionier who give a grant of 10,000 dollars to a charity organization n a simple person who just has one bread to eat but when he saw a hungry child he give half of this bread to that poor child.On papper half of a bread is in no comprision to 10000$ but on the base of Good deed those 10000$ has no chance against that peace of bread that simple person is more richer than that millionier he sacrifice his own wish or cumfort for some one else the millionier doesnot have any effect on him self while the simple person does get effected n he have sleep with a empty stomach on that night .Its only God who can judge both of them to perfection.
sure and that is what the Quran is telling us exactly
What i mean to say is that will you want to know the religions of these guys or you will just see there deed i believe that God will judge us on our deeds rather than believes.
which god first?
Religion is an easy way out any thing you do bad you have Satan to blame
that is the manipulation the similar like you keep blabbering it, this is in fact not true at all, it is just a lie, because satan can?t be blamed as the Quran told us, see, Allah told us the truth in advance
What you are doing is competing others.On the other hand i don,t need that competition i beleive only my own deeds will effect me rather than the deeds of others .Your belief have no effect on me .You need to win to satisfy your self i,m already satisfied .
I believe Allah described the test we are taking now as a competition indeed, I need to win to save my arse if you don't mind
Infact i have the same believe as you but offcourse with a difference i only accept the good from any religion or any person n the rest is in rubbish bin just like you do
not sure if it is the same belief really, are you sucking at my belief?, just kiddin again
bro, you are free to believe in what you want but that does not mean I should not convey the message to you, especially if the message is not from me, it is like thanks but no thanks from your end,
Again you want to win well best of luck for that. What you do is blind following whether you accept it or not when you accept Jesus born to a virgin mother it is blind following you can not give any logical explaination for that to me
Peace
Of course man, I want to win according to Allah guidance sent to us, but my winning is simply avoiding hell, I was never really looking forward to the garden neither to sleeping with hoor eins in there, I fear God with every single atom in my body that He created and consequently I can?t imagine myself burning in hell for eternity, I love Him very much though, because "at least" of the followings
- He is not going to throw the people He created in Hell regardless while He can do this easily
- He told me exactly what He is going to do with me if I do whatever
- He promised me with mercy for my sins if I believed in Him and not insist on the sin
- He promised me with some other unbelievable rewards
- And He sent me the guidance in a book to help me through this struggle of a very tough test
So why I should reject Him and loose?
I will be a dumb bum if I do
Salam
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oh yeh he was a very good jew, he created the atomic bomb that killed thousands and thousands of innocent humans
he must be in heaven now
And his creation electrcity has save the lives of million and millions and improve the lives of million and millions.This Jew benefited every one regardless of religion ethinicty and creed.
a typical atheist statement, nothing new really, sorry
A typical Islamic statement ,nothing new really,sorry.
a baseless and unfounded statement, Allah created thel anguages and it is up to Him to choose which one to use to send His messages, and I?m sure He used more than one language for His consistant messages to humanity that were sealed by the Arabic Quran
Unfortunatlly almighty was unable to protect those messages and was only able to protect the Arabic one as Muslim claims yet there is Hafs and Warsh versions to disqualify that claim.
For the sex issue, yeh you are right, the corrupt Bible discriminate between men and woman for no logical reason, now show me how the Quran did the same, I can show you how the bible did it and I?m sure you will agree, now I?m not saying that the bible "as is now" is the true inspiration of God, in fact it is not after it got corrupted by sick humans
Why should i care about Bible.Quran and Bible looks same to me alot of illogicall things combine with some good thoughts.About the discrimination b/n man n woman in Quran certainly i will show you some proof .
002.228
YUSUFALI Divorced women shall wait concerning themselves for three monthly periods. Nor is it lawful for them to hide what Allah Hath created in their wombs, if they have faith in Allah and the Last Day. And their husbands have the better right to take them back in that period, if they wish for reconciliation. And women shall have rights similar to the rights against them, according to what is equitable; but men have a degree (of advantage) over them. And Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise.004.034
YUSUFALI Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance) For Allah is Most High, great (above you all).There are other verses too but for the time being i think you should take care of the above verses.
yeh right, the man made god you made according to your own desires, well, what you are going to say to the real God when He hold you responsible for your belief?, I mean if it comes true, you know the theory of propability still give it a chance logically speaking
but I know what you will say
?I?m guilty my God, is there is a way out?
Ok i,m still better even if i made God according to my own desires unlike you who belives on a God created on the desire of a person who lived 1400 years ago.
if you laughed, I guess you should thank me for making you laugh
if you cried, then you have to take what I said very serious indeed
Ok i will prefer to laugh thanks for that.
excuse me, the probability is 100% correct, if you have a bag with red ball and a white ball in it
what is your bloody chance to randomly pick the red ball?
A child will answer 50%
Not sure mate, did you go to school or you left early as many western kids do?, just kiddin bro
Thats why a child is a child and an adult is an adult.What if some one make a hole in the bag and all of the balls are gone what will you pick out from the bag than a white or a red ball ?
You are excused but the probability is still a probability likeliwood of something happening for which conditions are necessary. If condition changes the probability will seaze to exist.
what did your god do to you?, did he just created you then left you alone?
Well my God left me with a conscience which is a guidence for me to live my life.
Did your god create the earth?, and if so, did he tell you that in a book that he sent you?
My God has left me with undenible signs .I feel love but i cant see it or measure it.Do you need a book to learn what is love.In the same way i feel God but i cannot see that God or touch that God but still i know that there is a God.
When you answer these questions, I will take your god seriously
For me its enough that i believe and i don,t need to force it on any one.
Now regarding the required belief alonge with the good deeds
Well if you think this is injustice then bad luck, what are we going to do if our god is really unjust god and he is just playin with us?, can you do anything about it if it is the case?, please let me know if you can do something about it when you discover that so i will try and do it with ya but I'm sure whatever it is, it will fail. aren't we dealing with a God?
If the God is unjust than what can i do but the problem is we all are left with wealth of love and compassion which increase when you spend it .When you explore this wealth than you have peace of mind and a peacfull soul can go through any ordeal.
which god first?
For me Allah ,Eswar,Khuda etc etc is name of the same God regardless of what they literally means.
that is the manipulation the similar like you keep blabbering it, this is in fact not true at all, it is just a lie, because satan can?t be blamed as the Quran told us, see, Allah told us the truth in advance
Good for you but do you really need a book to learn about that.
I believe Allah described the test we are taking now as a competition indeed, I need to win to save my arse if you don't mind
Good luck than.
not sure if it is the same belief really, are you sucking at my belief?, just kiddin again
bro, you are free to believe in what you want but that does not mean I should not convey the message to you, especially if the message is not from me, it is like thanks but no thanks from your end,
Well at least i said thanks.
Of course man, I want to win according to Allah guidance sent to us, but my winning is simply avoiding hell, I was never really looking forward to the garden neither to sleeping with hoor eins in there, I fear God with every single atom in my body that He created and consequently I can?t imagine myself burning in hell for eternity, I love Him very much though, because "at least" of the followings
- He is not going to throw the people He created in Hell regardless while He can do this easily
- He told me exactly what He is going to do with me if I do whatever
- He promised me with mercy for my sins if I believed in Him and not insist on the sin
- He promised me with some other unbelievable rewards
- And He sent me the guidance in a book to help me through this struggle of a very tough test
So why I should reject Him and loose?
I will be a dumb bum if I do
Salam
Well i was just discussing things to share thoughts but not to stop you from doing good if you think you need fear to do good well than i,m not going to stop you. Atleast you are trying to get the best out of Quran .
Best of luck.
Peace