The Message - Update

adley

Salaam Layth,

I took this from the previous version (Updated August 21st, 2005).
The numbering of ayats, of course, will be different from the current version.

The Scripture and The Quran
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Some of the features of the ?Quran? have been recorded as follows

Quran can humble a mountain (5922).
Quran cannot be replicated by men and Jinn (1789).
Quran contains a healing for the hearts (1783).
Quran is what the prophet?s followers have abandoned (2531).
Quran is without doubt revealed by a higher power (277).
Quran is to be paid attention to when read (7205).
Quran disturbs the disbelievers with its words (1016).
Quran gives detail to the Scripture (103.
Quran is related to the 7 pairs (158.
Quran creates a barrier of for those who disbelieve to understand it (1746).
Quran alone makes the disbelievers run away in aversion (1747).
Quran is recited at dawn (1779).
Quran is full of examples cited for mankind (1790).
Quran contains the ?Zikr?/Reminder (382).
Quran disturbs the rejecters, they seek to speak over it (4126).
Quran is to be used to warn people with (621).
Quran has been made easy to learn (541.
Quran is preserved in a tablet (8522-23).
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Hope that helps.

=adley=

Al_Khidr

Salaam Wakas

I capitalize the "S" in Salaat to place emphasize on the word.

Wakas are you one of the members of the Progressive Muslims who helped translated the Qur'aan in English?

Can anybody in here provide myself with a list of names of the people who translated the Qur'aan for the Progressive Muslims?

adley

Salaam Al Khidr,

I thought Layth has already answered your last question. Just check his post above. Or you can use the search feature of this forum. Just input "the message" (quotes inlcuded) and choose the General and the Projects forum. You should hit some helpful threads. Hope that helps.

=adley=

Al_Khidr

Salaam adley

Thanks for highlighting that for me, I must of over looked it. I got a chance to read it and Layth answered my question.

Salaam Al Khidr,

I thought Layth has already answered your last question. Just check his post above. Or you can use the search feature of this forum. Just input "the message" (quotes inlcuded) and choose the General and the Projects forum. You should hit some helpful threads. Hope that helps.

=adley=

Al_Khidr

Salaam Layth

Thanks for the response to my question. I have another question. If I'm not mistaken you and Edip worked together on his up coming translation that will be out soon, right? If so what are some of the unique differences between that translation and the Progressive Muslim translation of Qur'aan?

Peace,

Can anybody here who is directly involved with the Progressive Muslims organization provide myself with a list of names of the ones who are responsible for translating the Qur'aan for the Progressive Muslims?

I did the base translation originally, then amendments/changes were continually made based on the input and suggestions of a large number of members (you can see who if you search for old posts with the title or wording The Message.

Layth

Salam Khidr,

Thanks for the response to my question. I have another question. If I'm not mistaken you and Edip worked together on his up coming translation that will be out soon, right? If so what are some of the unique differences between that translation and the Progressive Muslim translation of Qur'aan?

The upcomming translation uses the last version of The Message as its base with some changes introduced on certain words & phrases. The key difference is the presence of footnotes and explanations (written by Edip) while The Message is just a literal translation which leaves the reader to find his/her meanings.

unknownuser

Peace Layth

It would be nice if you answered my question. What is the significance of changing the translation from contact-method to bond?
Thanks Sis Elke for your reply, hopefully i could find out from him an explanation.
Peace All

Layth

Peace,

It would be nice if you answered my question. What is the significance of changing the translation from contact-method to bond?

Sorry, I overlooked your question in my responces.

The argument put forth by Wakas is that Salat is an ubmrella word which means different things in the context it is placed...

For example

When speaking to the Mumineen, it means the 2 unit Salat as we identify it that requires abulution, reading the Scripture specific times, etc.
When speaking about the birds, it means their intinctive knowledge to fulfil the requirement to praise God in their own way.
When speaking of the Mushrikeen/idolators in chapter 9, it means them fulfilling their obligations that they gave not to betray the believers and not to conspire against them.

Therefore, if we used only contact-method, then we create a dilema in the verses that are not talking about the specific Salat that is meant to be carried out by the mumineem. However, when we use the literal translaiton of bond/link/obligation then the reader can see the meaning being given based on the context of the verses/situation.

unknownuser

Peace all,

Also, I think the numbering of verses should be reinstated as before. With all due respect as to how and why you have come to your conclusions on the verse numberings and order, it is still an inescapable fact that those who claim to follow the qur'an are familiar with the standard verse numbering, and thus, makes for much more conveniant referencing when having discussions with others about the qur'an and it's verses.

This has already been done nearly 2-3 months back...If you check the on-line version of The Message you will see it follows the old Hafs numbering.

Oh I see, I guess I stand corrected. -X

Salaam,
Damon.

Elke

Peace layth,

reading your above post, the sens of commitment - obligation would imo fit fine in each case - at least the three you mentionned. But bond as well...

Is there a specific reason you chose bond above the other meanings ?

lk

SwedenMajidah

Peace all,

Bonds seems totally OK to me atleast better than contact- method.

Sis Maria

unknownuser

peace,

do we ever use the term "contact-method" in real life? i know we use the term " the bond" for exampleJames Bond, Chemical bond, relationships etc...) D

who coined the term "contact-method"?

peace, rifat

Al_Khidr

As Salaamu Alaykum Layth

I have another question for you. When you made the base translation for the Progressive Muslims can you provide a list of the English Qur'aanic translations that you used to help you develop your translation?

Salaam

Layth

Salam,

I have another question for you. When you made the base translation for the Progressive Muslims can you provide a list of the English Qur'aanic translations that you used to help you develop your translation?

I remember looking mainly at YUSUFALI, PICKTHAL, SHAKIR and KHALIFA side-by-side.

There was also a fifth translation I used, but I can`t recall the name.

Al_Khidr

Salaam

Thanks for the answser.

Salam,

I have another question for you. When you made the base translation for the Progressive Muslims can you provide a list of the English Qur'aanic translations that you used to help you develop your translation?

I remember looking mainly at YUSUFALI, PICKTHAL, SHAKIR and KHALIFA side-by-side.

There was also a fifth translation I used, but I can`t recall the name.

lovelymoslems

Refers to QS.33/56 salat means bonds or commitment (not salawat) to prophetr.

QS.24/41 salat means doing anything according to its function (birds are to spread seeds etc).

QS. 8/35 salat means to musreek as only rituals.

QS.4/103 salat means should be promulgated when to be implemented.

Conclusion, shalat shall be bond between mu'meen with prophet in commiting to undertake life according to respective function of Allah's cretures which has to meet Allah's deen, without prophet, implementation of salat means only whistle and claps of hands.

Layth

Salam,

Are there any other comments/changes other than what has been pointed out here on this thread?

If not, then I will take this as an agreement to proceed.

One matter which did come-up was that the word Jinn was left untranslated. I have no issue with translating it if a suibtible word can be arrived at that conveys the best meaning of these alternative beings.

Regards,

arnoldyasin

Peace,

I rather keep that as jinn, as i believe it refers to something else in every verse it is mentioned, others will believe it is a title. So to keep the translation as approachable as possible for all different minds, i rather have it un-translated. Maybe you can put an explenation in the beginning of the translation about why you left it un-translated and mention the different views people have on it, this you can also do with salat maybe.

Layth

Peace,

So to keep the translation as approachable as possible for all different minds, i rather have it un-translated. Maybe you can put an explenation in the beginning of the translation about why you left it un-translated and mention the different views people have on it, this you can also do with salat maybe.

Keeping words in Arabic defeats the purpose of having a translation.

arnoldyasin

Peace,

I understand, but i don't believe they are 'invisible spirits'. You can keep it then a general translation to still keep the wideness of interpretation. Maybe something as concealed/hidden ones/beings. So your and mine and other views are still uphold, with this wide description. The best word must be found...