How Did it Come to This? (Part 1)
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Peace
I quote here from Layth?s article ?WHERE WAS MOHAMMED?? from the FM main page, which gives the definition of the word Kaaba from the use of the word in the Quraan. I hope this will be helpful.
(Brother Layth, Hope you will excuse me for quoting you without prior permission)? The Kaaba ? Jerusalem;
?God has made the Kaaba to be the Restricted Sanctuary, to enforce for the people, and for the restricted month, and for the donations, and for regulation; that is so you know that God knows what is in heavens and what is in Earth, and that God is aware of all things.? (The Message 597)
We are told that the word ?Kaaba? means a ?cube shape? and that the site in Mecca has been constructed in accordance with this design requirement.
However, the meaning of ?cube? associated to this word has no basis in the Scripture itself nor even to the Arabic language still in use today (the word for cube is mu?ka?ab, not kaaba or kaab).The word ?Kaab/Kaaba? are associated in Arabic to any feature that is protruding, such as the bones to the side of the ankles as can be seen below
?O you who believe, if you rise to attend the contact-method, then wash your faces and your hands up to the elbows, and wipe your heads and your feet to the ankles (Kaabain); and if you have had intercourse, then you shall bathe. And if you are ill, or traveling, or you have excreted feces, or you have had sexual contact with the women, and you could not find water, then you shall select from the clean soil; you shall wipe your faces and your hands with it. God does not want to make any hardship over you, but He wants to cleanse you and to complete His blessings upon you that you may be appreciative.?
(The Message 56)Thus, any construct, regardless of its shape can be called a ?Kaaba? as long as it stands out from the plain.What we need to ask to be more detailed is ?are there any special features that are protruding at the site of the temple of Mecca or Jerusalem that would give it the description of being a Kaaba?.
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/history/moh2.htm
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Peace Danish,
Certainly, as I mentioned earlier, all you sectarians of Islam come from the same boat, each using these same tactics upon the other. And btw, there is no such thing as ?meaningless proper names?. All proper names carry their meanings.
Again, it is not my problem that you are not intellectual enough to know that proper names are meaningless labels that don't convey the truth. For example, I think that Danish in Hindi means "day god" and in English means "someone from Denmark". Maybe your name came from some third language. In all three cases, you are probably not this name so this proper name is just a meaningless label that doesn't convey the truth about you. This is basic linguistics. So please get over your arrogance and learn the basics before parading your ignorance on this forum and stop using the sectarian Kaaba proper name argument.
Actually, everyone can see that you as a 21st century Islamic sectarian is trying hard to defy the historical Sunni (Arab) facts
The above statement clearly and concisely shows your beliefs. So there is no need for me to waste everyone's time addressing what I had already addressed and straying off topic as you and other dogmatic missionaries like to do. Again, you clearly demonstrate that the root cause of your beliefs is your blind faith in the Sunni mythology. Like Sunnis, you blindly take such myths as facts and base your beliefs on them.
At any rate, we will all die sooner or later and then you will know if you were right to have faith in Sunni mythology or not. Meanwhile, what are you hoping to gain by wasting whatever time you have left on spewing your bitterness around? What are you bitter at? Why such missionary zeal? You have become nothing more than a dogmatic atheist Sunni missionary. Is this how you want to spend the rest of your life or do you want to spend it in peace?
I hope you find peacefulness.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace Warner,
I quote here from Layth?s article ?WHERE WAS MOHAMMED?? from the FM main page, which gives the definition of the word Kaaba from the use of the word in the Quraan. I hope this will be helpful.
(Brother Layth, Hope you will excuse me for quoting you without prior permission)
http//www.free-minds.org/articles/history/moh2.htmThe article is mistaken. The word "ka3b" doesn't mean ankle it means heel. Hence, in Classical Arabic the term "ak3ab alrajul" means "the man walked faster on his heels" NOT "the man walked faster on his ankles". So according to 56, we should wash our feet to the heels (the base of the entire leg).
Peace,
Ayman
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..proper names are meaningless labels that don't convey the truth. For example, I think that Danish in Hindi means "day god" and in English means "someone from Denmark". Maybe your name came from some third language. In all three cases, you are probably not this name so this proper name is just a meaningless label that doesn't convey the truth about you. This is basic linguistics.
Quite creative, Ayman. Give three examples and think that they are probably not the same and conclude your reason for being meaningless labels. Please stop wanking stuff like that. The English meaning you gave is not a meaning. For example, Ayman is from Middle-East and therefore Ayman means middle-east.
Ayman is a proper name unique to you as a HUMAN and is your identity that explains yourself for whatever YOU are. Its common form means 'lucky' or 'right' and does not explain you because its a generalized term. In the same manner, Kaba is an identity given to a cuboid structure representing godly idols. Its common form means base along with other connotations and is a generalized term.
Should I start calling you lucky and insist that Ayman is not a proper identity and is meaningless.
So please get over your arrogance and learn the basics before parading your ignorance on this forum and stop using the sectarian Kaaba proper name argument.
The above statement clearly and concisely shows your beliefs. So there is no need for me to waste everyone's time addressing what I had already addressed and straying off topic as you and other dogmatic missionaries like to do. Again, you clearly demonstrate that the root cause of your beliefs is your blind faith in the Sunni mythology. Like Sunnis, you blindly take such myths as facts and base your beliefs on them.
At any rate, we will all die sooner or later and then you will know if you were right to have faith in Sunni mythology or not. Meanwhile, what are you hoping to gain by wasting whatever time you have left on spewing your bitterness around? What are you bitter at? Why such missionary zeal? You have become nothing more than a dogmatic atheist Sunni missionary. Is this how you want to spend the rest of your life or do you want to spend it in peace?
All the above is mystical filth. You sound frustrated and miserable, and fail to support any of your claims logically.
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Hi bro Danish,
According to your theory, assuming I understood it correctly, If my name explained what I am, I should be charged for DUI whenever I start driving, even though I certainly don't feel drunk.
Additionally, my grand-grand-father named me after his favourite actor, and not because I was screaming of pain from a hang-over when I was born.
*My name comes from the root of "To Drink", according to behindthename.com
Nadeem
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Tbh Danish, I don't understand why you're sticking to the Kaba as how it's portrayed in 'historical sunni facts' when a month back or so you said you think Aidid Safar has the best interpretation here. Why then does he have the best interpretation since he is off course from 'historical sunni facts' as well? Peace
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Peace Nadeem,
According to your theory, assuming I understood it correctly, If my name explained what I am, I should be charged for DUI whenever I start driving, even though I certainly don't feel drunk.
Additionally, my grand-grand-father named me after his favourite actor, and not because I was screaming of pain from a hang-over when I was born.
*My name comes from the root of "To Drink", according to behindthename.com
Thank you for the excellent example that illustrates how proper names are meaningless labels that don't convey the truth.
In the same way that your great-grand-father named you, sectarians named their idol after the common noun "kaaba"/base in the great reading. They then hid the true meaning of 595 and 597 behind the meaningless proper name. This is why all sectarian translators don't translate it. They know that the common meaning when translated doesn't fit the object that they idolize. If they translate it then people will see this truth.
Peace,
Ayman
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Hi bro Danish,
According to your theory, assuming I understood it correctly, If my name explained what I am, I should be charged for DUI whenever I start driving, even though I certainly don't feel drunk.
Additionally, my grand-grand-father named me after his favourite actor, and not because I was screaming of pain from a hang-over when I was born.
*My name comes from the root of "To Drink", according to behindthename.com
Nadeem
I am afraid you entirely misunderstood, please re-read my post.
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Tbh Danish, I don't understand why you're sticking to the Kaba as how it's portrayed in 'historical sunni facts' when a month back or so you said you think Aidid Safar has the best interpretation here. Why then does he have the best interpretation since he is off course from 'historical sunni facts' as well? Peace
Aidid's interpretation in comparison to other translations, then yes. Just becuase I liked his translation better than others doesn't overide the rule of agreement in its entirety. Did you read the first line, btw?
Edit missed the word 'read'.
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In the same way that your great-grand-father named you, sectarians named their idol after the common noun "kaaba"/base in the great reading. They then hid the true meaning of 595 and 597 behind the meaningless proper name. This is why all sectarian translators don't translate it. They know that the common meaning when translated doesn't fit the object that they idolize. If they translate it then people will see this truth.
Okay, fair enough then, present your proof so that we can all verify and I shall agree, period?
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Aidid interpretation in comparison to other translations, then yes. Just becuase I liked his translation better than others doesn't overide the rule of agreement in its entirety. Did you the first line, btw?
Just trying to understand what was the basis of liking his translations as his translation is poles apart from a traditional translation. If you think the 'traditional sunni historical facts' understanding about the Kaaba et al is correct, then his translation would be one of the worst translations around, I would think or in other words...If the traditional sunni historical sunni facts are thought to be correct, one would think that they would like a traditional translation that keeps that integrity instead of eschewing it. Carry on the discussion please )
Peace
Edit, after user edited their post
Which first line are you referring to?
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Nadeem,
Is it Nadeem or Nadim, as pronounced? Because for what I found that Nadeem means "friend" and Nadim means "drinking companion" coming from the root nadama to mean "to drink".
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Just trying to understand what was the basis of liking his translations as his translation is poles apart from a traditional translation. If you think the 'traditional sunni historical facts' understanding about the Kaaba et al is correct, then his translation would be one of the worst translations around, I would think or in other words...If the traditional sunni historical sunni facts are thought to be correct, one would think that they would like a traditional translation that keeps that integrity instead of eschewing it. Carry on the discussion please )
Peace
Edit, after user edited their post
Which first line are you referring to?
I liked Aidid's translation only because it sounded very natural yet unusual, such as sallaa meaning commitments, zakah meaning pure or purified, kaba meaning ankles pertaining to the paragraph on animal hunting, and the way he explains it away and so forth.
The first line in the link you embedded above, where I'd mentioned his translation to be THE BEST.
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Peace Brother Ayman,
Your're very welcome, and thank you for your efforts and hard work.
Peace brother Danish,
Then I apoligize, it was not my intention.
I'm a bit confused, you wrote Ayman is a proper name unique to you as a HUMAN and is your identity that explains yourself for whatever YOU are.
The name 'Ayman' doesn't explain to me anything about Brother Ayman.
But then you write"Its common form means 'lucky' or 'right' and does not explain you because its a generalized term"
What does a name explain, brother?
For me it's simple a means to single out the person I'm talking to, because I that the person will react to this name. That's a name does for me. Of course, if it's funny, that person might react to some other sounds as well.
Is it Nadeem or Nadim, as pronounced?
As an arabic word, it should be Naadim, but I've been using Nadeem, with a long 'e', I don't know how my great-grand-father pronounced it though. Looking at how it's written, I'd say the long 'e' is correct.
Because for what I found that Nadeem means "friend" and Nadim means "drinking companion" coming from the root nadama to mean "to drink".
Hmm, I never noticed that difference, thanks. I guess 'drinking companion' is an idiom for someone trustworthy, someone you can be with when your drunk with your guard down. That's what I'd like to believe, anyway.
But, Abdul Mannan gives nun-dal-miim the meaning of repentance.
So to not discriminate any of the sources, I'm a drunk repenting friend. -)
All these meanings just goes to show that proper names rather explain more about the person naming you, than yourself.
Nadeem - Perhaps I should use my second name 'Nomi'. (read noo me)
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Nadeem,
Lets look at it from another angle. If there were several persons with the same proper name Nadeem, what would be common among all and what would be different, besides the proper name of course?
edit sorry for this as I'm writing too fast and missing on words, and at the same time reviewing other online stuff.
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Hi Danish,
They'd be drunk. -)
I don't know brother, I don't think one can categorize our differences and similiarities based on our names.
edit sorry for this as I'm writing too fast and missing on words, and at the same time reviewing other online stuff.
That's totally ok. I see you're discussing with multiple people simultaneously, so it's ok if you wait and catch a breath before you respond to me. I ain't going nowhere any time soon -)
Nadeem
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They'd be drunk. -)
You got that right.
I don't know brother, I don't think one can categorize our differences and similiarities based on our names.
Sure we can and we shall get to that. The only thing common among all proper named Nadeems is that they are all humans. Likewise, all different proper names such as Nadeem, Danish, Ayman, Nadia are humans in common as well. Any questions so far?
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Sure we can and we shall get to that. The only thing common among all proper named Nadeems is that they are all humans. Likewise, all different proper names such as Nadeem, Danish, Ayman, Nadia are humans in common as well. Any questions so far?
Each Nadeem is identified or recognized by his own body features, behaviour, habits, intellect, needs, his middle name, surname, and so forth. Hence all Nadeems cannot be exactly alike in that respect. Likewise, the same recognition is applied towards Danish, Ayman, Nadia and Nadeem, hence they cannot be exactly alike either, yet every one of them is a human. Therefore each human is given its own name for recognition. Any questions so far?
Note each time I click quote for reply, only my own previous message displays and not my opponents, as seen above. On pervious posts, I had been copy pasting opponents replies one by one inserting a quote. Can the mod/admin help?