Alif; Laam and Meem with ancillary glyph/prolongation sign
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ayman, where do I do hajj? Can it be any place where there's no filth and idolatry?
Idolatory in pure physical terms is sculpting statues and declaring them as various iela'aha after giving them imaginative names. Idolators do not worship or call upon all sorts of stutues. Honouring and veneration does not constitue idolatory.
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Peace Mazhar,
My sinere and heartfelt advice to you is to start learning Arabic from Sisiter Samia; She is never hesitant and irritant to teach. I never feel shy in asking her to guide and make me understand even elementary things about Arabic.
Indeed, sister Samia has helped me on many things. Why don't you ask her what the word "mecca" means?
This is a statement made by a human being
and he is referring to the specific city and the Sustainer Lord of that city. If you cannot find and name that city then who is that lord whom you worship because the man who made this statement says he is to remain loyal and sincere to the Sustainer Lord of "this city"? If you do not recognize then you also do not recognize the man who said it. Sustainer Lord is recognized and then understood only by physical realities not by abstract hypothetical assertions. Allah is recognized only by "Aa'ya'aat" and these are physical realities all around us.
The present day town named Mecca is that town only in your imagination.
Besides the fact that the town presently called Mecca didn't exit prior to the 8th century CE, the physical reality is that the same city is referred to in the great reading with figs and olives and a mountain
This certainly doesn't sound like Mecca which has no figs and no olives. These are found in northern Arabia.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace Mazhar,
Indeed, sister Samia has helped me on many things. Why don't you ask her what the word "mecca" means?
The present day town named Mecca is that town only in your imagination.
Besides the fact that the town presently called Mecca didn't exit prior to the 8th century CE, the physical reality is that the same city is referred to in the great reading with figs and olives and a mountain
This certainly doesn't sound like Mecca which has no figs and no olives. These are found in northern Arabia.
Peace,
Ayman
Peace Ayman;
Througout the thread you are in "abstract" frame of mind. I talk about ground facts but you do not mention the name of "this city" where a particular "bait" exists upon whom the claimant is Allah since He calls it "My house".
If that is not Mecca as you emphatically claim that it came into existence in 8th century then please name it.Terms like northern Arabia, southern Arabia is not the translation of such specific words
By the way who told you/from where you got this "Mecca didn't exit prior to the 8th century CE".
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Peace Mazhar,
Througout the thread you are in "abstract" frame of mind. I talk about ground facts but you do not mention the name of "this city" where a particular "bait" exists upon whom the claimant is Allah since He calls it "My house".
If that is not Mecca as you emphatically claim that it came into existence in 8th century then please name it.You are the one who is stuck in an abstract frame of mind. Names are 100% abstract and have no relation to reality. Your name Mazhar means "appearance" in Arabic. Are you an "appearance"? Is this who you really are according to physical reality?
Similarly, there are many people named Mohamed, does this mean that they are the prophet? Anyone can name something this or that. This doesn't reflect the reality or truth.
You have to get beyond the superficial name and look at the reality of things. The location given in 2226 is the REALITY irrespective of what superficial untrue names people give to locations and things.
If someone in the 8th century CE named a town Al-Balad Al-Amin then does this make it the location? Is "al-balad al-amin" a name or a description?
Terms like northern Arabia, southern Arabia is not the translation of such specific words
Northern Arabia is where figs and olives grow. This is REALITY.
By the way who told you/from where you got this "Mecca didn't exit prior to the 8th century CE".
This is a fact based on great reading constantly talking about this town as a town with a multi-faith population of the people of the book. Yet no one from the people of the book ever heard about a town called Mecca prior to the 8th century CE. You can easily prove me wrong by bringing any evidence for the existence of Mecca prior to the 8th century CE.
More importantly, here is the Classical Arabic meaning of the common noun "mecca"
( ط
From the Mohit Classical Arabic dictionary, one can see that "mecca" can have the following meanings
- Sucking everything out
- Destruction and wearing down
Here is the Yusufali translation
- And it is He Who has restrained their hands from you and your hands from them in the midst of Mecca after that He gave you the victory over them. And Allah sees well all that ye do.
Here is the translation of 4824 using Classical Arabic dictionaries and the context of war from the passage to translate the common description "mecca"
- And it is He Who has restrained their hands from you and your hands from them in the midst of destruction after that He gave you the victory over them. And Allah sees well all that ye do.
The common meaning fits perfectly with the context of a war and standoff in 4824. This is an amazing observation. Besides discrediting the paganism going on in present day Mecca, it means that we can be 100% sure that the great reading is the preserved word of the god. The pagans couldn't even insert one word or change it to name the location of the pagan shrine they established. They were forced to hijack a clear common noun. When we see the truth, we achieve certainty. This is something a stone cube can never do for you no matter how long you stare at it.
Peace,
Ayman
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Quote from Mazhar on Today at 074430 AM
Througout the thread you are in "abstract" frame of mind. I talk about ground facts but you do not mention the name of "this city" where a particular "bait" exists upon whom the claimant is Allah since He calls it "My house".
If that is not Mecca as you emphatically claim that it came into existence in 8th century then please name it.You are the one who is stuck in an abstract frame of mind. Names are 100% abstract and have no relation to reality. Your name Mazhar means "appearance" in Arabic. Are you an "appearance"? Is this who you really are according to physical reality?
Similarly, there are many people named Mohamed, does this mean that they are the prophet? Anyone can name something this or that. This doesn't reflect the reality or truth.
You have to get beyond the superficial name and look at the reality of things. The location given in 2226 is the REALITY irrespective of what superficial untrue names people give to locations and things.
If someone in the 8th century CE named a town Al-Balad Al-Amin then does this make it the location? Is "al-balad al-amin" a name or a description?
My dear Ayman;
Watch your words; they show and expose the inner frame of mind and heart of a person.
See the first word of Grand Qur'aan, "great reading" as you call it. You call it "great" but do not accept it. The first information it gives is this "Beginning is with Name/Code"; and you think name is something abstract. Yes it is abstract when you innovate an imaginative/hypothetical name when the thing or person being referred through this innovate name is non existing. -
Peace Mazhar,
Watch your words; they show and expose the inner frame of mind and heart of a person.
See the first word of Grand Qur'aan, "great reading" as you call it. You call it "great" but do not accept it. The first information it gives is this "Beginning is with Name/Code"; and you think name is something abstract. Yes it is abstract when you innovate an imaginative/hypothetical name when the thing or person being referred through this innovate name is non existing.Tell me which hypothetical name I "innovated". It is you who is worshipping innovated hypothetical names. Just because some guy named a pagan stone cube Kaaba, it doesn't mean that it is the real base/"kaaba" talked about in the great reading. The great reading is only for those who use their god-given common sense. As for those who disregard their common sense because of some man-given names, nothing matters for them anyway. You see them here on this thread unable to understand the great reading or its clear words such as "kaaba" and "mecca" and are thus unable to translate them and instead provide lame excuses.
Peace,
Ayman
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Quote from Mazhar on Today at 085723 AM
Watch your words; they show and expose the inner frame of mind and heart of a person.
See the first word of Grand Qur'aan, "great reading" as you call it. You call it "great" but do not accept it. The first information it gives is this "Beginning is with Name/Code"; and you think name is something abstract. Yes it is abstract when you innovate an imaginative/hypothetical name when the thing or person being referred through this innovate name is non existing.Tell me which hypothetical name I "innovated". It is you who is worshipping innovated hypothetical names. Just because some guy named a pagan stone cube Kaaba, it doesn't mean that it is the real base/"kaaba" talked about in the great reading. The great reading is only for those who use their god-given common sense. As for those who disregard their common sense because of some man-given names, nothing matters for them anyway. You see them here on this thread unable to understand the great reading or its clear words such as "kaaba" and "mecca" and are thus unable to translate them and instead provide lame excuses.
Peace,
Ayman
The great reading gives physical facts and realities which do not come into the focus of those who live in hypothetical world. See the ground realities
Please answer in physical terms where it exists?
And when you do not know " My House" obviously you cannot be amongst its those who sit around it. When you do not know the House and its location/city how can you claim that you worship the Lord of that house?
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The great reading gives physical facts and realities which do not come into the focus of those who live in hypothetical world. See the ground realities
Please answer in physical terms where it exists?
And when you do not know " My House" obviously you cannot be amongst its those who sit around it. When you do not know the House and its location/city how can you claim that you worship the Lord of that house?
They ayat you quoted fails the test. Tell me, does the kaaba allow AN-NAS/mankind to go there?
Al bayt is for mankind. They will come in flocks. The 'kaaba' in existence fails the test in every way.
Where is al hajj? Since, all of mankind will flock to it, we will just 'know' it. Note it can be taken metaphorically, 'mankind', i.e. people of all races are allowed, etc..
Are you telling me that when Al quran uses 'al kaaba' it means any place that calls itself 'al kaaba' on earth?
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They ayat you quoted fails the test. Tell me, does the kaaba allow AN-NAS/mankind to go there?
Al bayt is for mankind. They will come in flocks. The 'kaaba' in existence fails the test in every way.
Where is al hajj? Since, all of mankind will flock to it, we will just 'know' it. Note it can be taken metaphorically, 'mankind', i.e. people of all races are allowed, etc..
Are you telling me that when Al quran uses 'al kaaba' it means any place that calls itself 'al kaaba' on earth?
Pl put some sense in the post to take it out of the category of joke.
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Are you telling me that when Al quran uses 'al kaaba' it means any place that calls itself 'al kaaba' on earth?
you are kidding for sure, countless times we've been told the location of kaaba and bayt-allah in countless ahadith! ever heard of Bukhari PBUH? You know nothing about history of Islam and claim to understand quran? are you for real?
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Peace Mazhar,
The great reading gives physical facts and realities which do not come into the focus of those who live in hypothetical world. See the ground realities
Please answer in physical terms where it exists?
And when you do not know " My House" obviously you cannot be amongst its those who sit around it. When you do not know the House and its location/city how can you claim that you worship the Lord of that house?
Why don't you translate the passages that you provided so that we can see if you understand them or not.
Peace,
Ayman
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The great reading gives physical facts and realities which do not come into the focus of those who live in hypothetical world. See the ground realities
Please answer in physical terms where it exists?
And when you do not know " My House" obviously you cannot be amongst its those who sit around it. When you do not know the House and its location/city how can you claim that you worship the Lord of that house?
Peace Mazhar,
Why don't you translate the passages that you provided so that we can see if you understand them or not.
Peace,
Ayman
To take people from hypothetical world to the world of realities see this also and name the locality.
And when Iebra'heim said "My Sustainer Lord, make this valley/locality a place of Peace , and feed its inhabitants with rich sustenance,
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Peace Mazhar,
The great reading gives physical facts and realities which do not come into the focus of those who live in hypothetical world. See the ground realities
Please answer in physical terms where it exists?
You don't even understand a single word from the above. Any idiot can mindlessly copy and paste verses. If you undertand anything them please translate the above passages and I will show you where the location is. There is no point in giving the location if you don't even understand the basics.
And when you do not know " My House" obviously you cannot be amongst its those who sit around it. When you do not know the House and its location/city how can you claim that you worship the Lord of that house?
To take people from hypothetical world to the world of realities see this also and name the locality.And when Iebra'heim said "My Sustainer Lord, make this valley/locality a place of Peace , and feed its inhabitants with rich sustenance,
Good so like you translated this passage, translate the above. In your translation you say "make this valley/locality a place of peace". Is Mecca a place of peace? How many people get trampled to death every year while they get pushed and shoved by people trying to kiss a Black Stone or stone three oblisks? Hundreds of people died in an armed rebellion in Mecca back in the seventies. In the eightees thousands of Iranian pilgrims were trapped and killed by security forces. Etc. Etc. Doesn't sound like a safe place.
Also, you say whoever enters it is safe. Did you or anyone you know ever entered it? Please don't lie.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace Mazhar,
You don't even understand a single word from the above. Any idiot can mindlessly copy and paste verses. If you undertand anything them please translate the above passages and I will show you where the location is. There is no point in giving the location if you don't even understand the basics.
Good so like you translated this passage, translate the above. In your translation you say "make this valley/locality a place of peace". Is Mecca a place of peace? How many people get trampled to death every year while they get pushed and shoved by people trying to kiss a Black Stone or stone three oblisks? Hundreds of people died in an armed rebellion in Mecca back in the seventies. In the eightees thousands of Iranian pilgrims were trapped and killed by security forces. Etc. Etc. Doesn't sound like a safe place.
Also, you say whoever enters it is safe. Did you or anyone you know ever entered it? Please don't lie.
Peace,
Ayman
I thought I was in duscussion with a literary person.
And when We appointed/declared/made "The House" the place of pilgrimage/return/assembly for people
and a place of safety/shelter/amnesty;
and for them to adopt the standing place of Iebra'heim as a standing/assembly place of sa'laat;
and We enjoined/imposed a pledge/duty upon Iebra'heim and Iesma'eile
that they should maintain/manage the cleanliness/sanctity of My House for those people who circle around it, and stay around it, and for the purpose of bowing and prostration of people.
Allah has appointed/declared the Sanctified House Al-Ka'abata enduringly a place of assembly/stay/congregation for the people.
If you find time you may find that it is not mindlessly copy and paste by an idiot, please see the translation by me here
http//www.haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/002.01.A.htmI would be happy if you point out mistakes or anyhypothetical assertions therein. Now can you tell me which one is "My House" and in which city it is located?
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here is the most simple translation
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And (remember) when We made the House (the Ka'bah at Makkah Saudi Arabia only, you can also google it to see the exact location) a place of resort for mankind and a place of safety.....
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All?h has made the Ka'bah (the one in Makka Saudi Arabia only), the Sacred House, an asylum of security and Hajj and 'Umrah (pilgrimage) for mankind, ....
2226 And (remember) when We showed Ibr?him (Abraham) the site of the (Sacred) House (the Ka'bah at Makkah in Saudi Arabia only) (saying) "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me, , and sanctify My House (the Ka'bah at Makkah in Saudi Arabia only) for those who circumambulate it, and those who stand up for prayer, and those who bow (submit themselves with humility and obedience to All?h), and make prostration (in prayer, etc etc);"
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2226 And (remember) when We showed Ibr?him (Abraham) the site of the (Sacred) House (the Ka'bah at Makkah in Saudi Arabia only) (saying) "Associate not anything (in worship) with Me, , and sanctify My House (the Ka'bah at Makkah in Saudi Arabia only) for those who circumambulate it, and those who stand up for prayer, and those who bow (submit themselves with humility and obedience to All?h), and make prostration (in prayer, etc etc);"
Brother perhaps you meant to say "circum gyration". My friend aymen is enough for circumambulating.
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Is Mecca a place of peace? How many people get trampled to death every year while they get pushed and shoved by people trying to kiss a Black Stone or stone three oblisks? Hundreds of people died in an armed rebellion in Mecca back in the seventies. In the eightees thousands of Iranian pilgrims were trapped and killed by security forces. Etc. Etc. Doesn't sound like a safe place.
I freakin' lol'd!!!!!!!!!!!