Why do you reject hadiths
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salaam Shirin and maha
I am not "making fun".
Rejecting books of hadiths is only a first step.
The second step is to reject hadiths hidden between the lines of the quran under the form of tafassirs.There is two quran. The first one is the one that believers read over the lines.
The second one is the one that idolaters reads betwwean the lines inpired by god, where there is tafassirs.The two qurans are differents, with differentt meanings and leads to two totally differents religions.
For many years, i had a veil on my eyes. I never thought that there were two qurans.
Wasting time in false rites let muslims away from the first quran
Please, tell me who gain from your prostrating and your bowing ? Don't you see that you are making the same rituals as salafist and wahabites and other islamic sects gone astray ?
Have I to demonstrate the gain you obtain from reading and studying words of your GOD three times a day ?God ask believers to read the first quran. It is the process of total mind purification from all the humans inventions.
It is the "zakat process" reserved to people coming humbly to GOD, putting their faith in him.
And GOD will then explain you Quran. I don't know how he does that but, for sure, he will do it if the reader is sincere (however i can't imagine how he can do such a thing for people not knowing arabic, since i was not in this difficult case)Notice that Many times, zakat is traduced by purification even by scholars because it was impossible to put "charity"
Zakat process by first quran is totally rejected by idolaters of Hadiths. They never do it and never do the salat asked by god.I don't ask you to believe me. I just ask you to connect to God with the first quran and ask him purification.
Do you see a trap ?i have to absent for some days.
However, i recommand you three articles in this site ordered in pedagogic orderhttp//free-minds.org/how-study-quran
http//free-minds.org/true-testimony
http//free-minds.org/whats-nameThey helped me in my second step of hadith rejection
Peace
Can I ask why you call yourself noshirk?
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Good point. What people do not understand YET, is that there will be those who will only take from the Quran and they will be those who don't mind taking anything that doe snot necessarily contradict the Quran. There still seems to be the attitude that one is right and the other is wrong. In time people more people will enter the Quranic Islam and these differences will be seen as various schools among the Quranist path. A person of a christian background might find it more comfortrable to go to Church and praise Jesus since the Quran praises Jesus also. But he won't believe in Jesus's divinity or the trinity, at least not in the way many Christians understand it. A person can be going to haj and praying with Muslims but won't believe its binding on everyone but that is teh way he favors worshiping God. A person of a Jewish background might still perform the rituals of Judaism but like a Muslim with hadith, he won't believe all aspects of the Talmud, only the ones that do not contradict the Quran. This will be a truly universalist faith.
The problem now is that some are not able to understand this and try to convinvce others that they are right and others are wrong. Its not whether Mecca is what the Quran is talking about or not but whether its binding. Many prophets did not perform haj there and some may have done it there. Prophets had many pilgrimages and places of worship. Rituals are a means to an end and not an end by themselves. The Quran tells us that every nation have been given rites and rituals, the important thing is why you do it and to whom.
Salaams,
As I mentioned above, I got used to "holier than thou" attitude form people. I'm not angry because of it, it just makes me sad. People who claim to be submitters to God's will should know that God is the only Judge and it is He who give guidance and above all it is He who is The Most Merciful.
I once heard a wise man said "people act like Jannah is narrow and small". People don't seem to understand that God created us different. If He willed, He would make us all the same and if the form of the prayer is more important than praying to God, He would have explain in detail how to do it. After I rejected hadith, I wasn't sure how to pray, I even started the thread here asking people how they do it. I received different replies form different people, so they didn't answer my question as I wish, e.i. they weren't united in their answers even though they all were Qur'an aloners. I realised what you said above, that among the Qur'an followers were different groups of understanding It. Which is OK if you ask me, but God knows who is "the most right" in their interpretation.
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With praying God to exalt the prophets, I'm still praying to God, not to the prophets.
Of course, prophets are exalted already, but what I'm praying for is that God save their, let's say, reputation in people's eyes and hearts. For example, many hadtih followers believe Muhammad said pretty silly things such as "woman are deficient in intelligence" or they believe he married a nine year old girl when he was 50+ etc. On the other hand, in Qur'an, we have that The Almighty said that in Muhammad we have excellent pattern, and I don't see the hadith mentioned above give an excellent example. Now, I am praying to Allah swt to "take off" those inappropriate epithets from Muhammad, in the eyes of people who believe in God and his messengers. You can also apply this silliness attributed to any other prophet described in hadith, Bible, Torah...
Hope you understand what I'm saying.
Peace.
Peace sister.
you have a point, but prayer is ment to glorify God, not to praise prophets you never met IMO.
You still didnt replied to why you, going by that logic, cannot pray the jewish way if you just include quranic verses as well.
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Peace sister.
you have a point, but prayer is ment to glorify God, not to praise prophets you never met IMO.
You still didnt replied to why you, going by that logic, cannot pray the jewish way if you just include quranic verses as well.
Peace
I am prying for all the believers as well.
Sorry about that, I had that answer in my mind, but I forgot to write it in my reply.
When I pray, I pray in Arabic, because it is the language of Qur'an. I don't know many Torah passages, but even if I did, I would look for Qur'anic equivalent and pray with it. I do like hearing Christians saying Halleluyah, but I'd go with Alhamdulillah since the both have the same/similar meaning, it's only I prefer Arabic.
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Peace
I am prying for all the believers as well.
Sorry about that, I had that answer in my mind, but I forgot to write it in my reply.
When I pray, I pray in Arabic, because it is the language of Qur'an. I don't know many Torah passages, but even if I did, I would look for Qur'anic equivalent and pray with it. I do like hearing Christians saying Halleluyah, but I'd go with Alhamdulillah since the both have the same/similar meaning, it's only I prefer Arabic.
I pray in Arabic also since this is what I am used to.
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Peace
I am prying for all the believers as well.
Sorry about that, I had that answer in my mind, but I forgot to write it in my reply. )
When I pray, I pray in Arabic, because it is the language of Qur'an. I don't know many Torah passages, but even if I did, I would look for Qur'anic equivalent and pray with it. I do like hearing Christians saying Halleluyah, but I'd go with Alhamdulillah since the both have the same/similar meaning, it's only I prefer Arabic.
One thing is to prefer arabic like you, which is a personal choice and perfectly fine, another thing is that God understands all languages and arabic isnt necessary in order to pray. One can pray in any language he wants.
i dont see any requirement or necessity of praying in arabic. You are reciting non-quranic passages as well, so why would it be a problem to recite non-arabic passages as the torah? If one wants to include torah in his prayer I dont see any problem in it as well
Peace
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Why do you guys reject hadiths and why do you think that Hadiths are false and fabrications but still followed by more than 90% of muslims for more than 1000 years ?
Why Allah allowed such a massive corruption in his last and final religion ?
Salaam,
This is because http//www.islamrevolution.org/hadithstheshameofislam.htm -
One thing is to prefer arabic like you, which is a personal choice and perfectly fine, another thing is that God understands all languages and arabic isnt necessary in order to pray. One can pray in any language he wants.
i dont see any requirement or necessity of praying in arabic. You are reciting non-quranic passages as well, so why would it be a problem to recite non-arabic passages as the torah? If one wants to include torah in his prayer I dont see any problem in it as well
Peace
Do what you think it's right, I already stated my opinion.
Salaams.
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And GOD will then explain you Quran. I don't know how he does that but, for sure, he will do it if the reader is sincere (however i can't imagine how he can do such a thing for people not knowing arabic, since i was not in this difficult case)
Well praise to God that he can do ALL things, because I have no understanding of Arabic. Just the 3 surah's I have taught myself. I do everything else in english. At the rate of my ability to learn Arabic I should be about 100 yrs old before I can read Quran. Spent 2 years on the Alphabet and still have issues recognizing letters.
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Why do you guys reject hadiths and why do you think that Hadiths are false and fabrications but still followed by more than 90% of muslims for more than 1000 years ?
Salaam, brother rameez.
Do you believe that most people who claim to be Muslims are really Muslims?
Everyone can say that "I am a Muslim".
I personally think that definitive answer to find out whether we are Muslims (who submit to Allah), or whether we are the believers, the right answer for it will only known for sure when we receive it from God (on the Day of Judgment).
Are you willing to really listen to the Qur'an carefully?
If you believe it is from God, then listen to its messages in earnest.
The more you compare Qur'an with hadith, I hope you will be able to feel that there are so many conflicting messages between them.
The hadiths mix between the looking good messages and the bad messages. And sometimes, the bad messages also hidden/cryptic. Saying that the words of hadith are Muhammad's words => seems to be a powerful weapon to invite other people easily believe it.
Have you ever read hadiths Qudsi? The hadith in the name of God, one type of hadith in which the prophet Muhammad's sayings leaning to God, or in other words, the prophet narrated the words of God.
But they are still said to be hadiths, and they are not part of the Qur'an. Isn't that very suspicious?
Indirectly, it is such a claim that there are still another words of God scattered outside the Qur'an.
Hadith Qudsi is the blasphemy against the Qur'an. Only evil people can made such a fraud using the prophet's name to write the 'words of God' created by their own.
In my opinion, to be safe from this kind of crime, Muslims have to start their own effort to get to know their own holy book (the Qur'an).
Do you believe the Qur'an because the scholars say that it is genuine, or do you believe the Qur'an because you are told that it was brought by Muhammad and collected by his companions?
It's a belief that could be going unsteady.
I strongly suggest that you believe in the Qur'an because you study/analyze the Qur'an itself. Study the Quran, and then decide by yourself whether you will believe in it or not. Your trust in the Qur'an should be something you decide for yourself and not because of the scholars say it came from Muhammad.
The scholars and preachers say this and that about Muhammad (the information they get from the hadiths).
But I feel the character of the last prophet mentioned in the Qur'an is very different from the character of the prophet that I read from the hadith.
Why Allah allowed such a massive corruption in his last and final religion ?
Doomsday has not arrived. The devil and his followers still have time.
God is testing us. God allowed satan to disrupt human until doomsday arrives. They will perform variety of ways to deceive us.
Be careful. I trust only God to lead and put me in a straight path.
May God help us to find the best way of life.
Peace.
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I just wanted to add this The more I think about hadith, the more I feel as if they limit God. Seriously. To say that one can only recite the Qu'ran in Arabic, and that if they don't have the Arabic Qu'ran then they don't have the real one. To say that womens prayers will not be accepted while they are menstruating, to say that if a person does not pray a certain way or if they leave out a certain area of a prayer their prayer is not accepted. All of these things are in hadith, not the Qu'ran, and they limit God.
God is the Creator, the Judge, the All-Knowing...is He not limited by our shortcomings.
This is another reason I began to reject hadiths. The thought that God was keeping tabs on whether I said "Bismillah" as I walked into my home with my right foot first...didn't make sense.
Peace,
Amina
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I just wanted to add this The more I think about hadith, the more I feel as if they limit God. Seriously. To say that one can only recite the Qu'ran in Arabic, and that if they don't have the Arabic Qu'ran then they don't have the real one. To say that womens prayers will not be accepted while they are menstruating, to say that if a person does not pray a certain way or if they leave out a certain area of a prayer their prayer is not accepted. All of these things are in hadith, not the Qu'ran, and they limit God.
God is the Creator, the Judge, the All-Knowing...is He not limited by our shortcomings.
This is another reason I began to reject hadiths. The thought that God was keeping tabs on whether I said "Bismillah" as I walked into my home with my right foot first...didn't make sense.
Peace,
Amina
and they also say that non-muslims (which includes quranists and other muslims they disagree with) prayers would not be accepted as well. Only their particular prayer according to their particular sectarian rules will be accepted. When I was sunni, the local mullah told me to cover my head carefully since if even one hair was visible my prayer wont be accepted.. that i have to make proper wudu otherwise my prayer wont be accepted... and so on.. so all my energy was exhausted on focusing on whether my whole head was covered or not, i repeated wudu several times in order to ensure that i had made the wudu proper and so on.. so the focus was more on the ritual then on the spiritual aspect of prayer...
the problems with sectarians are that rituals are seen as a goal in itself.
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the problems with sectarians are that rituals are seen as a goal in itself.
best statement that sums up pretty much everything about sectarians bravo
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Peace Maha and scaredmuslimah,
Your experiences cause me to think back to my sunni days.
The comraderie was good, but the craziness.........One time I missed dhuhr and asr prayer because of an appointment.
I was informed by a knowledgable brother that I had to make up the prayers.
4 sunnas before and 4 after the obligatory 4 ra'kats for aduhr and 4
before asr prayer for a total of 20 ra'kats. After about eight ra'kats I was getting tired.
After about 15 I wondered if I was gonna make it. I completed the twenty!
I remember laying on the floor afterwards thinking "this is crazy"
I better not ever miss three in a row.Peace O0
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Peace hawkninetynine, all.
I have missed 30 years of prayers in my life.I got to know and be drawn to my creator later on in my life.
So according to your sunni friends , I have missed 365 x 5 x 30 prayers, which is 54750 prayers.
Now if every two prayers missed, I will have to make up 20 rakkats. I am 27375 x 20 rakkats behind.
That makes 547500 rakkats! I wonder how many credits missed?
Well if you do not hear from me, I will be very busy?
Peace.
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Maha, Hawketynine, and good logic
I thank God that we were brought out of that mess. It is so freeing to let go of all of the technicalities. yay
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Salam RameezYou are not my first Hadeether. You will not do that
There is no such verse. What is the problem ?
I had never seen or met God. I believe he exists. I can't witness of that. I can't even witness that there is only one GOD.
I find a book called Quran. I have read it. I recognized words of my God. I believe in it all. I can't witness that it is book of GOD
I Had never seen Muhammad. I can't witness he even existed. In the book i believed was from my GOD, it is told to me that he is the rassool to whom was given the book. So i blieved in That.You can consider All Quran as a Gossip. But it is only one Gossip of 600 pages and i believed in it. Show me one human able to produce a Gossip like that. I put my faith in only one source. Whats the problem ?
Your books of Hadiths are compilation of millions of gossips. Bukhari's book alone came from 600 000 gossips (as he said). You and your scholars admitted that that gossips can be lies produced by humans. You are spending time in a huge garbage of lies hoping to find another Quran there. Books of yours gossips can't even agree for what gossips are true gossips.Now that i explained what believer mean, i hope that you can also recognize words of your God without "certification" of people of "knowledge and authority".
If you can't do so, then you believe in GOD through other divinities. You would not be a believer of GOD but a believer in "people of knowledge and authority" you have choosen.I will count now lies in the sentence below
Lie 1 Hadiths are not Gossips and conjecture. What are they then ? How you get them if not by a gossip process of "authentification of Gossips" by people you heard "by Gossip" that they were truthfull .
Lie 2 People of knowledge. What is their knowledge ?. What did they discovered other than doctrines for dividing muslims? How do you measure their knowledge ?
Lie 3 and authority. Who gave them authority ?. They are not even agree between them. Please give us the names of the people you think are of authority end tell us why you think that they have more authority than the others. How can you choose the good ones if you admit that they have more authority than yourself and have spent more time than you in studying?
Lie 4have studied them extensively and have separated/pointed out fabrications. Well, i can deduce from that that we can find now an update for books of Bukhari and other Hadiths compilors where fabrications have been separated. Where can i find these authentificated books and who are the authentificators ?. You know than such books don't exists but you are believing that the work has been done.
Lie 5People have spent their lives in studying this thing. Please give me names. How can you know that they spent their live in such a study ? Please, give me one Hadith and one example of "scientist" who managed to proove that that a hadith was not fabrication. Show me one demonstration. Only one. The best one.
I sincerely hope that you will discover one day that you were lying to yourself and that yours partners will not be with you in the day of judgment.
I sincerely hope that one day, you will read words of God through words of God and not throught tafassirs and hearsays.
I sincerely hope that one day, you will discover that science and Hikma of your GOD is in his words and in his universe and not in other books.
I sincerely hope that you will not return on your heels after you have met, in this forum, believers in GOD and words of GOD who are humbly triyng to understand what GOD said and asking GOD for his purification. Hope you will not return on your heels as you came, with false books of God between your hands.Peace
I am still waiting for a proof that Quran was revealed to Messenger by Jibrael and it was given to Jibrael by Allah.
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Salaams,
I consider myself Qur'an-aloner, but I still pray the "oldfashion" way. While I don't consider hadith as a religious authority, I think salat is something that we didn't learn from hadith it's rather tradition which is passed down on us from Muhammad and the Muslims around him. If Bukhari collected hadith two centuries after death of the Prophet, does that mean that Muslims didn't know how to pray in that period?
I learned salat from my mom, my mom learned it form her mom, my grandma learned it from her mom and I'm sure that mother of my grandmother didn't have Sahih Bukhari collection available but still she managed to pray five times a day.
Of course, Qur'an tells us we should stand in prayer, bow and fall prostrate and recite Qur'an and glorify Allah s.w.t., that's exactly what I do praying the "oldfashion" way.Really, do you even know what hadiths are ? they are the same traditions that you are claiming to be passed down on us from Muhammad and Muslims around Him . First learn what hadiths are. Bukhari and others simply collected the same narrations or passed down chains that you are talking about.
Lol. First you said that Hadiths are conjecture and Satan has misguided more than 90% Muslims, but now you are following same Muslims , how you are sure that Satan has not poisoned the way of Salat ?
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For those who say "Obey Allah and Obey the Messenger" means to Follow the message so you are obeying Messenger and in turn Obeying Allah
461 And when it is said to them, "Come to what Allah has revealed and to the Messenger," you see the hypocrites turning away from you in aversion.
Now explain why "Messenger" is separated from "what Allah has revealed".
All those who say that Satan has misguided more than 90% of Muslims and they are following conjecture, please prove that Satan HAS NOT distorted the original Quran and you are following the same verses that were revealed to the Messenger in its correct form.
And I can see how all the questions I asked with the Quranic verse are still unanswered ).
Someone said that they got "I am holiest than thou attitude" . I am not at all trying to give this attitude if someone gets this impression that I am implying that I AM more holy than you guys, its wrong , I am here just to learn and to understand your arguments and arguments can only be understood if we keep "arguing". After few days I will give you guys a surprise )
I have some more food of thought for you.
It says in the Quran to shorten the prayer when you travel. How long do you have to travel in order to be eligible to have this privilege? How short do you have to cut the prayer?
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Really, do you even know what hadiths are ? they are the same traditions that you are claiming to be passed down on us from Muhammad and Muslims around Him . First learn what hadiths are. Bukhari and others simply collected the same narrations or passed down chains that you are talking about.
Lol. First you said that Hadiths are conjecture and Satan has misguided more than 90% Muslims, but now you are following same Muslims , how you are sure that Satan has not poisoned the way of Salat ?
That might be correct in some part of the universe, but I will never, ever, ver, er, rrrr accept that the Prophet, mercy to mankind, the excellent pattern said that woman who wears perfume equals adulteress and many other nonsense. It just doesn't look like an excellent pattern. So, I dismiss it.
As for salat, well I thought about that too, but I realised that it couldn't be since all I do while praying, call it "sunni way", is glorifying God, which is exactly what God wants me to do.
See, your problem and problem of many other people here is arrogance, which leads all of you to conclusion "My way is the right way" and makes you blinded by your own faith. I don't really care if you're a hadith lover, as long as you believe that there is ONLY ONE GOD, and accept His messengers as a group of people with the same, universal message I will respect you. And I wish God would guide us all.
Salaams.