New article: What is the meaning of "al masjid al haram"?
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First of all God tells us the Quran is clear and easy to understand.
?A.L.R. these are the signs of the clear book? 121
?We have made it (the Quran) easy to understand and in your own tongue (language) may you take heed.? 4458Throughout the Quran, it tells us repeatedly that it is Clear, without contradiction. That it is written in Clear arabic language.
God would not give us this wonderfull book, full of clear words, with clear meanings and then expect us to somehow devise the 'hidden meaning' and alternative definitions of words to decipher the true meaning of his verses.
In fact God says
He sent down to you this scripture, containing straightforward verseswhich constitute the essence of the scriptureas well as multiple-meaning or allegorical verses. Those who harbor doubts in their hearts will pursue the multiple-meaning verses to create confusion, and to extricate a certain meaning. None knows the true meaning thereof except GOD and those well founded in knowledge. They say, "We believe in thisall of it comes from our Lord." Only those who possess intelligence will take heed.Note the word straightfoward. its pretty straightfoward.
In ragards to Qiblah
1087 'make your houses Qiblah'
-what does this mean? the next sentance mentions The Salat. The straightfoward meaning would make make your houses facing a direction.
2142 the foolish people say 'what turned them away from thier qiblah which they used to face?'
We learn from this verse that the Muslims used to face (from memory the verse litteraly says the Qiblah they were upon) a Qiblah and it changed. The people could see this as it was evident to them by them mocking the Muslims about it. So it must be something that can be physicaly observed. Next sentance mentions the east and the west. It seems this is associating the Qiblah with Physical directions.
2143 here we see that the Qiblah change Distinguished/marked/made known those who follow the Messenger. So this seems to make it an evident/observable thing.
2144 The subject of this verse was turning his face (face/course/direction/self/attention) towards the sky. the sky is a physical thing.. Then it says to 'turn in the direction of Al-Masjid Al-Haram'. turn your faces in 'That direction'So i can see from theese verses that the Qiblah is
-a direction/course one may face/turn towards/turn attention towards. Directly associated with Al-Masjid Al-Haram
-something that people can observe others doing.
-something that changed, and it was noticable.
-mentioned alongside the East and the West, PrayerNow what is Al-Masjid Al-Haram?
we learn from 97 people made a treaty near it.
we learn from 834, 2225, 2217 that certain people obstruct others from it.
we leran from 2225, 919, 834 that Certain people dwell/abide in it. that certain people maintain it, and give drink to pilgrims. That certain people Gaurd it, but they are not supposed to be its gaurdians because they are wicked.
we learn from 2191 that it is a place that people can fight atAll this seems to point to the fact that Al-Masjid Al-Haram is a physical place. It seems to me clear that The Qiblah is a Direction that one faces towards Al-Masjid Al-Haram.
Look at the previous scriptures, we find examples of people praying towards a certain direction during prayer, look at the previous religions, christianity and judaism, they both face a prayer direction towards what they consider their Sacred Temple.
Now if i am wrong about something i would like to be corrected, I am by no means an expert on Arabic language, but the Quran seems very clear to me. -
peace all,
I have updated the article http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-masjid-al-haram-Quran.html
change of qiblah - an understanding based on Quran
The information we can extract about the meaning of "qiblah", and the change, from these verses is as follows
this new change is in some way related to guiding to a straight/establishing path, and making the believers a balanced/moderate community
the qiblah which they were on was a great test (i.e. difficult), except those God guided, and their belief in such was not going to be for nothing, hence this new qiblah pleased the messenger (i.e. less hardship/difficulty)
in this case the qiblah happens to be AMAH, but there are potentially many other qiblah, as individuals could have their own qiblah
in 2148 the usage of "wherever" is the ONLY time it appears without a close link to "turn+wajh+AMAH" therefore likens "wijhatun (direction/course/goal/motive)" with "qiblah" and consequently likens AMAH to "race to the good" or at least we can say AMAH involves this. Furthermore, AQ implies each person may have their own "qiblah" in 2145 then later in 2148 says "for each is a wijhatun he turns towards it", strongly suggesting "qiblah" and "wijhatun" are being related as similar terms/concepts. Please re-read these verses as this is a key finding.
those who have been given the kitab/book/decree who that it is the truth, and recognise it like they recognise their sons but hide the truth. Their qiblah is likely based on desires
the effects of this change will be less debate from the people (implying the former qiblah produced more debate), lead to God completing His favour, aid guiding, and bringing you all together wherever you are.
wherever one is they should turn their wajh/purpose/consideration in the direction of AMAH, and from wherever they depart, from the contexts that likley involves being oriented towards the truth of your Lord, the good, and uniting of believersand
2150 "wherever thou start/come forth" implies the messenger would have to depart from somewhere, whilst others may not necessarily have to do so. Bringing you all together could be a reference to an ushering towards one place/event at one time. Interestingly, the root of the term "shatra (in the direction of)" has some links to things distant/remote and journeying to a distant/remote country/land. This may be a coincidence but it may explain a connotation this term has and the reason for its unique usage in these verses, especially so considering the use of "wherever you depart" and "God will bring you all together"
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peace all,
Almost 6 years after writing the article I am not aware of anyone who attempted to answer the 20 problems raised for the so-called "change of qiblah" verses, and in addition, I'm not aware of anyone who addressed the summarised list of problems I cite for the various understandings at the end of the article. Whatever your understanding is, run it through the checklist and see what happens.
It's a long and detailed article so perhaps I will cite just one problem that I have never heard anyone respond to (specifically from those who believe in the physical change in prayer direction view)
2145 clearly implies that if the messenger were to follow their qiblah after these revelations then he would be a wrongdoer and following their desires, yet he was apparently following it previously. Is there a precedent for this in Quran, i.e. doing X is allowed then a future revelation clearly changes doing X to desires/wrongdoing?
The question is simple.
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Peace Wakas.
Re Is there a precedent for this in Quran, i.e. doing X is allowed then a future revelation clearly changes doing X to desires/wrongdoing?I do not see it as changes doing X being is the desires/wrongdoing, rather not following an instruction is the desire/wrongdoing.
This is like saying if Qoran supersedes /replaces older scriptures, then following Qoran renders older scriptures wrong/false!
My opinion.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
Peace Wakas.
When Jesus came after Moses ,some "not doing X" became "doing X" example
"Li Uhilla Lakum Baada Alladi Hurrima Alaikum
When Mohammed came ,,similarly, some things changed as well like
1-Qiblah
2- Sawm.
The reason given is "Linaalama man yattabii Al Rassool ...(To dinstinguish true/false believers) and "Yuridu allah bikum Al yuas..( To help you stay the journey/ease it.I do not see it as a problem with X itself ,rather as a new trial for obedience. To each GOD has made a new trial/rules...
GOD bless you.
Peace -
Peace Wakas.
When Jesus came after Moses ,some "not doing X" became "doing X" example
"Li Uhilla Lakum Baada Alladi Hurrima Alaikum
When Mohammed came ,,similarly, some things changed as well like
1-Qiblah
2- Sawm.
The reason given is "Linaalama man yattabii Al Rassool ...(To dinstinguish true/false believers) and "Yuridu allah bikum Al yuas..( To help you stay the journey/ease it.I do not see it as a problem with X itself ,rather as a new trial for obedience. To each GOD has made a new trial/rules...
GOD bless you.
PeaceSalaam GL
Please see the red word in the verse above. It is "hurrima" a passive verb which means made haram for you. In a passive verb doer of action is not identified. So who made some things haram for them- God or their clergy or they themselves.
Brother I do not think this verse says that God made something forbidden and later sent Issa to make it permissible. His law does not change with the passage of time.
Regards
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peace all,
Almost 6 years after writing the article I am not aware of anyone who attempted to answer the 20 problems raised for the so-called "change of qiblah" verses, and in addition, I'm not aware of anyone who addressed the summarised list of problems I cite for the various understandings at the end of the article. Whatever your understanding is, run it through the checklist and see what happens.
It's a long and detailed article so perhaps I will cite just one problem that I have never heard anyone respond to (specifically from those who believe in the physical change in prayer direction view)
2145 clearly implies that if the messenger were to follow their qiblah after these revelations then he would be a wrongdoer and following their desires, yet he was apparently following it previously. Is there a precedent for this in Quran, i.e. doing X is allowed then a future revelation clearly changes doing X to desires/wrongdoing?
The question is simple.
There is no concept of "change" of Qibla in Qur'aan. There are only three nations in the world who have the concept of "Qibla", the Muslims since the days of Ibrahim alahissalam; the Jews and the Nisara (Christians). In the later period of Ibrahim alahissalam the Jews and Christians switched over to their independent Qibla concept.
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There is no concept of "change" of Qibla in Qur'aan.
The traditional story is the prophet and his followers prayed towards Jerusalem, then changed towards Kabbah, and thats what these verses discuss. Please be clear and concise as to what your view is, so we can actually test it with Quran.
2142 The foolish from the people will say "What has turned them from the qiblah/focal-point which they were on* it?" Say "To God is the east and the west, He guides whomever He wishes to a straight/establishing path."
2143 And as such We have made you a balanced community so that you will be witnesses over the people, and the messenger will be a witness over you. And not We made the qiblah/focal-point which thou were on it except that We make evident he who follows the messenger from he who will turn back on his heels. And indeed it was certainly a great (thing/test) except for those whom God guided; And not was God to let go waste your belief. Indeed, God is over the people Fully-Kind and Merciful.
2144 Indeed, We see thy face/consideration/purpose shifting/moving fee/in the sky/heaven; so We will surely turn thee (onto/to) a qiblah/focal-point that will please thee so turn thy face/purpose/consideration in the direction (of) al maSJD al haram and wherever that you are so turn your faces/purposes/considerations in its direction and indeed those who have been given the writ/decree know that it is the truth from their Lord. And God is not unaware of what they do.
2145 And even if thou come to those who have been given the writ/decree with all signs/evidences they would not follow thy qiblah/focal-point, and nor will thou be a follower of their qiblah/focal-point, and nor some of them are followers of each others qiblah/focal-point. And surely if thou were to follow their desires from after what came to thou of the knowledge, indeed thou would then surely be among the wrongdoers. -
Yes brother Novice. I can see that "Hurrima" was not necessarily done by GOD, i.e could have been done by others.
The correction was done by GOD.
Thank you for the clarification.Brother Wakas, why do you need to know another example ? What is the problem with 2145?
In the context of all the verses about qiblah, I do not see a problem.
GOD bless you both.
Peace. -
The traditional story is the prophet and his followers prayed towards Jerusalem, then changed towards Kabbah, and thats what these verses discuss. Please be clear and concise as to what your view is, so we can actually test it with Quran.
I don't talk about gossips. I was referring Qur'aan.
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Brother Wakas, why do you need to know another example ? What is the problem with 2145?
Brother GL, dont betray your name. Using the example under debate would be the logical fallacy known as circular reasoning.
By the way, it's ok to admit you dont have any other example.
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The traditional story is the prophet and his followers prayed towards Jerusalem, then changed towards Kabbah, and thats what these verses discuss. Please be clear and concise as to what your view is, so we can actually test it with Quran.
2142 The foolish from the people will say "What has turned them from the qiblah/focal-point which they were on* it?" Say "To God is the east and the west, He guides whomever He wishes to a straight/establishing path."
2143 And as such We have made you a balanced community so that you will be witnesses over the people, and the messenger will be a witness over you. And not We made the qiblah/focal-point which thou were on it except that We make evident he who follows the messenger from he who will turn back on his heels. And indeed it was certainly a great (thing/test) except for those whom God guided; And not was God to let go waste your belief. Indeed, God is over the people Fully-Kind and Merciful.
2144 Indeed, We see thy face/consideration/purpose shifting/moving fee/in the sky/heaven; so We will surely turn thee (onto/to) a qiblah/focal-point that will please thee so turn thy face/purpose/consideration in the direction (of) al maSJD al haram and wherever that you are so turn your faces/purposes/considerations in its direction and indeed those who have been given the writ/decree know that it is the truth from their Lord. And God is not unaware of what they do.
2145 And even if thou come to those who have been given the writ/decree with all signs/evidences they would not follow thy qiblah/focal-point, and nor will thou be a follower of their qiblah/focal-point, and nor some of them are followers of each others qiblah/focal-point. And surely if thou were to follow their desires from after what came to thou of the knowledge, indeed thou would then surely be among the wrongdoers."The foolish". http//haqeeqat.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.%20Tabweeb/00055.%20As%20sufha%20Seen%20Fa%20haa%20stupid/1.gif Who are the referent by this definite Adjective resembling participle?
Let us proceed step by step since the translation (bold) is ambiguous.
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2142 The foolish from the people will say "What has turned them from the qiblah/focal-point which they were on* it?" Say "To God is the east and the west, He guides whomever He wishes to a straight/establishing path."
I hope you know the importance of anaphora resolution. Who are referred by pronoun "them"?
Without doing it, the message in the text can never be correctly understood.
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Peace Wakas.
I do not follow your reasoning behind wanting an example.
Why would you need another example?
That is what I am wanting you to explain ,if you want to.
GOD bless you.
Peace. -
peace,
GL, the reason I want another example is to see if this is the exception in Quran (i.e. the only one of its kind). If so, this would indicate an unusual or suspect occurrence, especially if there is an alternative explanation which does not require this to be "the odd one out". My analysis/article is looking at the options, weighing up the evidence for/against each option, then selecting which is the strongest. This can only be done once the evidence is on the table, so to speak.
Mazhar, chapter 73 does no such thing, although I can see why you'd cite that. Please try again.
