To all of you Hijab supporters out there
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See, Is that picture Islamic even they're wearing jilbab?
Well that is not "Jilbab". Real Sunni Muslim women cannot wear jeans or pants or t-shirt. Our women must wear burqa like in Saudi Arabia.
Indonesia is not an Islamic coutry. They mostly still have Hindu and Buddhist culture.
Real Islamic country and society is Saudi Arabia and some other Arab countries in the Gulf.
I have seen many Indonesians here in Canada. They came from an International Islamic school as foreign exchange students. None of them pray Salat or go to the mosque. Islam is very weak in Indonesia I'm afraid.
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Indonesia is not an Islamic coutry. They mostly still have Hindu and Buddhist culture.
Yes Indonesia is not Islamic country and our ideology is Pancasila/five pillar (but don't mistaken it with Sunni's rukun Islam).
But my country is not secular country because Ministry of Religion is existed in the goverment.
The proof is the first sila of Pancasila, is read"Ketuhanan Yang Maha Esa" (google translate it)
Indonesia is not an Islamic coutry. They mostly still have Hindu and Buddhist culture.
Yes, Indonesia is former Hindhu majority not Buddha.But became Muslim majority started in early 1500s when Islamic local feudal kingdoms were risen.
I was from ethnic Javanese and some my cultures was influenced from Hinduism.Buddha is religion of Tionghoas (Chinese Indonesian).
I have seen many Indonesians here in Canada. They came from an International Islamic school as foreign exchange students. None of them pray Salat or go to the mosque. Islam is very weak in Indonesia I'm afraid.
I don't know what happened of Indonesian students in Canada.But I still not believe in you.
Because if that Indonesian is student exchange, that means that they're smart student in domestic universities.So If you found Indonesia who didn't salat maybe they aren't student for Islamic universities and maybe they're a secularist.
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I don't know what happened of Indonesian students in Canada.But I still not believe in you.
Because if that Indonesian is student exchange, that means that they're smart student in domestic universities.So If you found Indonesia who didn't salat maybe they aren't student for Islamic universities and maybe they're a secularist.
Read this article from my town newspaper
http//www.kamloopsnews.ca/article/20120621/KAMLOOPS0101/120629954/-1/KAMLOOPS/kamloops-a-hit-with-visiting-indonesian-studentsYou will that this year 180 Indonesian students came to my town for exchange program. They are all gone now. But they all came. They were wearing uniform which had on it written "International Islamic School Indonesia"
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Read this article from my town newspaper
http//www.kamloopsnews.ca/article/20120621/KAMLOOPS0101/120629954/-1/KAMLOOPS/kamloops-a-hit-with-visiting-indonesian-studentsYou will that this year 180 Indonesian students came to my town for exchange program. They are all gone now. But they all came. They were wearing uniform which had on it written "International Islamic School Indonesia"
Well I didn't see students wearing such kind of unifrom from the sites you pointing out
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Peace,
No religious people are fascinated by Madonna or Britney Spears or worse vulgar people.
You have preconceived ideas, brother Israfeel.
Modesty is the ideal way for a believer and the Quran tells a woman to cover as much as possible. It does not specifically or exactly to the letter say how the clothing should be worn. The veil on a woman's head may be the best scenario of a woman's dress, but it is not exclusive told in Quran.
Even men were expected to have head wear in earlier eras. It is an act of modesty.
And please do not mention your hadith books because their have no authority here.
God bless you
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Re your signature now
Quran-Only People say the Darnest ThingsSure would like to see what you have to say in front of God when you have to answer to Him. So continue on. You might want to read what God has to say about people who insist in their ways despite being repeatedly warned.
Again, you don't answer simple straight forward questions. What is wrong or sinful about husband and wife enjoying each other?
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Re your signature now
Quran-Only People say the Darnest ThingsSure would like to see what you have to say in front of God when you have to answer to Him. So continue on. You might want to read what God has to say about people who insist in their ways despite being repeatedly warned.
Again, you don't answer simple straight forward questions. What is wrong or sinful about husband and wife enjoying each other?
Madame I think it is you who should be concerned what you have to say in front of God. You saying its okay to do anal sex and swallow sperm!!!
You think God is happy with you saying this stuff. You should be scared for writing such things.
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Peace,
Praise God for guiding as He pleases.
God bless you
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I am a Muslim who follows Hadith. But the point is I have quoted the Holy Quran which is commanding women to cover their whole body.
It's just I find a lot of people who follow hadith will give themselves an additional 'label' such as Sunni, Shia, Hanafi, Salafi etc. Do you fit in any of these categories? It would be interesting to know because a lot of 'every day' Sunni Muslims, who make up the majority of Islam as we know it today, would not agree with your interpretation either. Do you disagree as much with them as you do with us?
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It's just I find a lot of people who follow hadith will give themselves an additional 'label' such as Sunni, Shia, Hanafi, Salafi etc. Do you fit in any of these categories? It would be interesting to know because a lot of 'every day' Sunni Muslims, who make up the majority of Islam as we know it today, would not agree with your interpretation either. Do you disagree as much with them as you do with us?
I belong to the Ahlul Hadith sect of Islam. Our sect very must stresses importance of following Hadith. According to Holy Quran, Hadith of the Prophet Muhammad (sallallahu alaihi wasallam) is revelation and guidance for us (See Surah 534-5 Bismillah included)
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I belong to the Ahlul Hadith sect of Islam. Our sect very must stresses importance of following Hadith. According to Holy Quran, Hadith of the Prophet Muhammad (sallallahu alaihi wasallam) is revelation and guidance for us (See Surah 534-5 Bismillah included)
They're also in Pakistan but I don't think they wear burqas there. Those verses don't refer to hadith brother. They refer to the Quran.
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It's just I find a lot of people who follow hadith will give themselves an additional 'label' such as Sunni, Shia, Hanafi, Salafi etc. Do you fit in any of these categories? It would be interesting to know because a lot of 'every day' Sunni Muslims, who make up the majority of Islam as we know it today, would not agree with your interpretation either. Do you disagree as much with them as you do with us?
Why did you stop there?
among sunnis there are ahlel we al jama3a , wahabis, ahle hadith, salafies, suffies and so on.
And even among these there are hanbali, maliki, shafi, and so on.
And even among these there are people following different local imams rotfl rotfl
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They're also in Pakistan but I don't think they wear burqas there. Those verses don't refer to hadith brother. They refer to the Quran.
Burqa is taught by Quran which tells believing women to cover themselves. "Themselves" is not restricted to just head or hair or chest. "Themselves" means their whole body. Ask anyone who knows Arabic he will say this is right.
This why in Saudi Arabia women are wearing burqa and niqab.
Also the verses I quoted cannot refer to the Quran, because Quran is the words of Allah, not Prophet Muhammad (Sallallahu alaihi wasallam). But the verses I quoted say that the words of Prophet Muhammad (Sallallahu alaihi wasallam) are also divinely inspired.
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Why did you stop there?
among sunnis there are ahlel we al jama3a , wahabis, ahle hadith, salafies, suffies and so on.
And even among these there are hanbali, maliki, shafi, and so on.
And even among these there are people following different local imams rotfl rotfl
Far too many to list sister. just like Christianity in that way that there are many denominations.
Burqa is taught by Quran which tells believing women to cover themselves. "Themselves" is not restricted to just head or hair or chest. "Themselves" means their whole body. Ask anyone who knows Arabic he will say this is right.
This why in Saudi Arabia women are wearing burqa and niqab.
Also the verses I quoted cannot refer to the Quran, because Quran is the words of Allah, not Prophet Muhammad (Sallallahu alaihi wasallam). But the verses I quoted say that the words of Prophet Muhammad (Sallallahu alaihi wasallam) are also divinely inspired.
Brother, think about it. If everything Prophet Muhammad said and did was divinely inspired that you can write it all down and follow all of it, then why would the Quran correct him? Those verses are referring to what has been revealed, to everyone - the Quran. Not Prophet Muhammad's words, choices etc. The hadith are recorded and collected ask it is - without any idea as to what was the best behaviour of his so called actions. Prophet Muhammad also repented, if he repented he made mistakes, how many of the so called hadith would then include mistakes? Do you believe in the Quran it says it will preserve the 'hadiths' recorded and written by scholars as well so that these will not have any type of corruption?
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Far too many to list sister. just like Christianity in that way that there are many denominations.
Brother, think about it. If everything Prophet Muhammad said and did was divinely inspired that you can write it all down and follow all of it, then why would the Quran correct him? Those verses are referring to what has been revealed, to everyone - the Quran. Not Prophet Muhammad's words, choices etc. The hadith are recorded and collected ask it is - without any idea as to what was the best behaviour of his so called actions. Prophet Muhammad also repented, if he repented he made mistakes, how many of the so called hadith would then include mistakes? Do you believe in the Quran it says it will preserve the 'hadiths' recorded and written by scholars as well so that these will not have any type of corruption?
You don't seem to understand that Quran was preserved and recorded in exact same way as Hadith. If you reject Hadith - fine that's your decision. But don't pretend the Quran is totally different from how Hadith was preserved.
The Quran did not drop from the sky as a complete Book printed in Golden letters. You say that Hadith was written 200 years after the Prophet peace be upon him died.
Guess what? The earliest existing complete manuscript of the Quran was written 200 years after the Prophet peace be upon him died!
So if Hadith is unreliable, how is Quran so special and any different. We have been asking this question to Quranists for years and they can never answer.
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Peace Israfeel,
You didn't answer my main point about Prophet Muhammad and the fact he was human, made mistakes and these can be recorded and followed in the hadith. The Quran is preserved by Allah, in a way that perhaps we don't completely comprehend. If the Quran was preserved because of the 'pious' at the time reciting and memorising and just that, and that the hadith can be remembered in the exact same way - well then there is nothing unique or special about the Quran. Anyone could remember a text an Arabic text in such a way from that time period if they really wanted to. Because the hadith are a set of so called historical collections. So, any historical collection could have been gathered and preserved... what is it about the hadith that made then help preservation? Some would say it is the poetry, rhythm and another aspect of the Quran that makes it well remembered. That is part of its uniqueness - its poetry etc. So it seems like you are saying the hadith is the same as the Quran stylistically etc. If not, then how can it be remembered and preserved inthe same way. It is Allah that will preserve it, as it says in the Quran, no matter how many corrupt people may come and try to change the Quran. Like I said, how exactly it is preserved, maybe we aren't supposed to know entirely because if we'd try and corrupt it, or because it simply is part of Allah's will. Just like we don't say so how exactly did Allah give you that blessing, what exactly was Allah's process? That just seems like a very odd question to ask, because we talking about God, and we are not supposed to be all knowing. Also the Quran is a recitation... it is a kitab as well but it is a recitation. There are two things to take into account the oral recitation and then the written book.
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Guess what? The earliest existing complete manuscript of the Quran was written 200 years after the Prophet peace be upon him died!
You're wrong.The oldest surviving Quran manuscript is Sana'a manuscript.
As Hadith follower, you may also know if the Quran already written by Nabi's secretary especially Zaid Ibn Tsabat and memorized by some hafidz Quran during Muhammd time.
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Peace Israfeel,
You didn't answer my main point about Prophet Muhammad and the fact he was human, made mistakes and these can be recorded and followed in the hadith. The Quran is preserved by Allah, in a way that perhaps we don't completely comprehend.
Prophet Muhammad sallallahu alaihi wasallam was definitely human and all humans make mistakes, but because he was a Prophet, Allah protected him from mistakes and always corrected him. Therefore the Prophet cannot remain in error for even the blinking of an eye, because Allah will always correct Him.
You say that Allah has preserved the Quran. I believe Allah has also preserved the Sunnah.
@Earthdom
The San'a manuscripts are not the complete Quran, it is fragments. There is also variations within the fragments discovered by archeologists.
The fact of the matter is that the earliest COMPLETE manuscript of the Quran which corresponds to the Quran you have in your home is some 200 years AFTER Prophet Muhammad Sallallahu alaihi wasallam died
So if you reject Hadith, you should also reject Quran.