Can Adam/Even be a metaphor?
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I read the article on Free-Minds regarding Adam/Eve as a metaphor, however I have heard that apparently the only verses we can take as metaphor in the Quran are those that are explicitly stated as such. I always think that metaphors can also be implicit through reasoning, but hadith-followers state that those who follow the Quran alone begin to just twist and make things mean whatever they want, and there can be some truth in that (there is a way to go far too extreme in either case).
Anyway, can anyone please enlighten me on the Adam/Eve tale?
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I read the article on Free-Minds regarding Adam/Eve as a metaphor, however I have heard that apparently the only verses we can take as metaphor in the Quran are those that are explicitly stated as such. I always think that metaphors can also be implicit through reasoning, but hadith-followers state that those who follow the Quran alone begin to just twist and make things mean whatever they want, and there can be some truth in that (there is a way to go far too extreme in either case).
Anyway, can anyone please enlighten me on the Adam/Eve tale?
Firstly we should know what metaphor means and how is it used.
Linley Murray on figures of speech
Metaphors
A Metaphor is a figure founded entirely on the resemblance which one object bears to another. Hence, it is much-allied to simile or comparison, and is indeed no other than a comparison, expressed in an abridged form. When I say of some great minister, "that he upholds the state, like a pillar which supports the weight of a whole edifice," I fairly make a comparison but when I say of such a minister, "That he is the pillar of the state," it now becomes a metaphor. In the latter case, the comparison between the minister and a pillar is made in the mind; but it is expressed without any of the words that denote comparison.The following are examples of metaphor taken from Scripture "I will be unto her a wall of fire round about, and will be the glory in the midst of her." "Thou art my rock and my fortress." "Thy word is a lamp to my feet, and a light to my path."
Rules to be observed in the use of metaphors.
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Metaphors, as well as other figures, should, on no occasion, be stuck on profusely; and should always be such as accord with the strain of our sentiment.
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Care should be taken that the resemblance, which is the foundation of the metaphor, be clear and perspicuous, not farfetched, nor difficult to discover. The transgression of this rule makes what are called harsh or forced metaphors; which are displeasing, because they puzzle the reader, and instead of illustrating the thought, render it perplexed and intricate.
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In the third place, we should be careful, in the conduct of metaphors, never to jumble metaphorical and plain language together. An author, addressing himself to the king, says
To thee the world its present homage pays;
The harvest early, but mature the praise.
It is plain, that, had not the rhyme misled him to the choice of an improper phrase, he would have said,
The harvest early, but mature the crop;
and so would have continued the figure which he had begun. Whereas, by dropping it unfinished, and by employing the literal word "praise," when we were expecting something that related to the harvest, the figure is broken, and the two members of the sentence have no suitable correspondence to each other.Mixed Metaphors and Extended Metaphors
4. We should avoid making two inconsistent metaphors meet on one object. This is what is called mixed metaphor, and is indeed one of the greatest misapplications of this figure. One may be "sheltered under the patronage of a great man" but it would be wrong to say, "sheltered under the mask of dissimulation" as a mask conceals, but does not shelter. Addison, in his letter from Italy, saysI bridle in my struggling muse with pain,
That longs to launch into a bolder strain.
The muse, figured as a horse, may be bridled; but when we speak of launching, we make it a ship; and by no force of imagination, can it be supposed both a horse and a ship at one moment; bridled, to hinder it from launching.The same author, elsewhere, says, "There is not a single view of human nature, which is not sufficient to extinguish the seeds of pride." Observe the incoherence of the things here joined together; making a view extinguish, and extinguish seeds.
As metaphors ought never to be mixed, so they should not be crowded together on the same object; for the mind has difficulty in passing readily through many different views of the same object, presented in quick succession.
The last rule concerning metaphors, is, that they be not too far pursued. If the resemblance, on which the figure is founded, be long dwelt upon, and carried into all its minute circumstances, we tire the reader, who soon grows weary of this stretch of fancy; and we render our discourse obscure. This is called straining a metaphor. Authors of a lively and strong imagination are apt to run into this exuberance of metaphor. When they hit upon a figure that pleases them, they are loth to part with it, and frequently continue it so long, as to become tedious and intricate. We may observe, for instance, how the following metaphor is spun out.
Now just go through all 25 occurrences using the name Adam and judge yourself if it were used as metaphor.
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Firstly we should know what metaphor means and how is it used.
Linley Murray on figures of speech
Metaphors
A Metaphor is a figure founded entirely on the resemblance which one object bears to another. Hence, it is much-allied to simile or comparison, and is indeed no other than a comparison, expressed in an abridged form. When I say of some great minister, "that he upholds the state, like a pillar which supports the weight of a whole edifice," I fairly make a comparison but when I say of such a minister, "That he is the pillar of the state," it now becomes a metaphor. In the latter case, the comparison between the minister and a pillar is made in the mind; but it is expressed without any of the words that denote comparison.The following are examples of metaphor taken from Scripture "I will be unto her a wall of fire round about, and will be the glory in the midst of her." "Thou art my rock and my fortress." "Thy word is a lamp to my feet, and a light to my path."
Rules to be observed in the use of metaphors.
-
Metaphors, as well as other figures, should, on no occasion, be stuck on profusely; and should always be such as accord with the strain of our sentiment.
-
Care should be taken that the resemblance, which is the foundation of the metaphor, be clear and perspicuous, not farfetched, nor difficult to discover. The transgression of this rule makes what are called harsh or forced metaphors; which are displeasing, because they puzzle the reader, and instead of illustrating the thought, render it perplexed and intricate.
-
In the third place, we should be careful, in the conduct of metaphors, never to jumble metaphorical and plain language together. An author, addressing himself to the king, says
To thee the world its present homage pays;
The harvest early, but mature the praise.
It is plain, that, had not the rhyme misled him to the choice of an improper phrase, he would have said,
The harvest early, but mature the crop;
and so would have continued the figure which he had begun. Whereas, by dropping it unfinished, and by employing the literal word "praise," when we were expecting something that related to the harvest, the figure is broken, and the two members of the sentence have no suitable correspondence to each other.Mixed Metaphors and Extended Metaphors
4. We should avoid making two inconsistent metaphors meet on one object. This is what is called mixed metaphor, and is indeed one of the greatest misapplications of this figure. One may be "sheltered under the patronage of a great man" but it would be wrong to say, "sheltered under the mask of dissimulation" as a mask conceals, but does not shelter. Addison, in his letter from Italy, saysI bridle in my struggling muse with pain,
That longs to launch into a bolder strain.
The muse, figured as a horse, may be bridled; but when we speak of launching, we make it a ship; and by no force of imagination, can it be supposed both a horse and a ship at one moment; bridled, to hinder it from launching.The same author, elsewhere, says, "There is not a single view of human nature, which is not sufficient to extinguish the seeds of pride." Observe the incoherence of the things here joined together; making a view extinguish, and extinguish seeds.
As metaphors ought never to be mixed, so they should not be crowded together on the same object; for the mind has difficulty in passing readily through many different views of the same object, presented in quick succession.
The last rule concerning metaphors, is, that they be not too far pursued. If the resemblance, on which the figure is founded, be long dwelt upon, and carried into all its minute circumstances, we tire the reader, who soon grows weary of this stretch of fancy; and we render our discourse obscure. This is called straining a metaphor. Authors of a lively and strong imagination are apt to run into this exuberance of metaphor. When they hit upon a figure that pleases them, they are loth to part with it, and frequently continue it so long, as to become tedious and intricate. We may observe, for instance, how the following metaphor is spun out.
Now just go through all 25 occurrences using the name Adam and judge yourself if it were used as metaphor.
Very thorough analysis, well-taken! Perhaps I am using the term metaphor too flexibly. What about symbol?
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...Anyway, can anyone please enlighten me on the Adam/Eve tale?
The Qur?aan informs us that, Adam is a masculine proper name, i.e. the name of a REAL person. He was picked by ALLAAH, swt, from among the human population of his time. See 333 below.
Verily GOD picked Adam and Noah and the family of Abraham and the family of ?Imraan over all the people.
Peace,
Khalil -
The Qur?aan informs us that, Adam is a masculine proper name, i.e. the name of a REAL person. He was picked by ALLAAH, swt, from among the human population of his time. See 333 below.
Verily GOD picked Adam and Noah and the family of Abraham and the family of ?Imraan over all the people.
Peace,
KhalilThank you. So how do we reconcile this with evolution? Man is a product of evolution, and yet Adam/Eve resided in heaven. Interestingly, I noticed that the Qur'an does not say Adam was the first man. However, notice in verses such as 735, when all people are regarded as "children of Adam" - this doesn't necessarily have to mean biological, but spiritual; or, in a way to regard us all as brothers and sisters of one family (biologically in terms of taxonomy confirms this, but beyond this, to connect all people together and to discourage discrimination and separation).
Perhaps Adam was the first conscious human being, or the first to be tested with free will (as opposed to our ancestors)?
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Thank you. So how do we reconcile this with evolution? Man is a product of evolution, and yet Adam/Eve resided in heaven. Interestingly, I noticed that the Qur'an does not say Adam was the first man. However, notice in verses such as 735, when all people are regarded as "children of Adam" - this doesn't necessarily have to mean biological, but spiritual; or, in a way to regard us all as brothers and sisters of one family (biologically in terms of taxonomy confirms this, but beyond this, to connect all people together and to discourage discrimination and separation).
Perhaps Adam was the first conscious human being, or the first to be tested with free will (as opposed to our ancestors)?
The highlights above are from me.
The idea that says, Adam used to live in heaven and after disobeying GOD and eating from the forbidden tree was exiled to Earth; is not from The Qur?aan. It is only a man-made superstitious belief. According to many detailed verses of The Qur?aan mankind/INSAAN, was created right here on Earth from the beginning and just like all other creatures has gone through numerous evolutionary phases.
735,
O children of Adam, when there come to you messengers from among yourselves, narrating our verses to you, then whosoever refrains from evil and reforms, there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve.
There is nothing spiritual about us being the children of Adam. It is the truth, we are all the PROGENY of Adam and he is our real COMMON ANCESTOR.
And, I do not believe that Adam was the FIRST conscious human. He might have been among a more evolved generation. He was just the replacement/KHALIFAH for a less evolved previous generation of humans. See 230.
Peace,
Khalil -
The highlights above are from me.
The idea that says, Adam used to live in heaven and after disobeying GOD and eating from the forbidden tree was exiled to Earth; is not from The Qur?aan. It is only a man-made superstitious belief. According to many detailed verses of The Qur?aan mankind/INSAAN, was created right here on Earth from the beginning and just like all other creatures has gone through numerous evolutionary phases.
735,
O children of Adam, when there come to you messengers from among yourselves, narrating our verses to you, then whosoever refrains from evil and reforms, there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve.
There is nothing spiritual about us being the children of Adam. It is the truth, we are all the PROGENY of Adam and he is our real COMMON ANCESTOR.
And, I do not believe that Adam was the FIRST conscious human. He might have been among a more evolved generation. He was just the replacement/KHALIFAH for a less evolved previous generation of humans. See 230.
Peace,
KhalilSalaam,
Then where are Adam and Eve in the following verses?
235
We said "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."236
Then did Satan make them slip from the Garden, and get them out of the state of felicity in which they had been. We said "Get ye down, all (ye people), with enmity between yourselves. On earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood - for a time."From 236, it's quite clear they were not originally on earth.
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The highlights above are from me.
It is the truth, we are all the PROGENY of Adam and he is our real COMMON ANCESTOR.
Peace,
KhalilThis insinuates that we were born from incest if Adam and Eve are our common ancestors, then their children must have engaged in sexual intercourse among one another. Genetic variation would be far too low for the species to last past a few generations. If you study evolutionary history, you will see that there is no such thing as a "first human.
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This insinuates that we were born from incest if Adam and Eve are our common ancestors, then their children must have engaged in sexual intercourse among one another. Genetic variation would be far too low for the species to last past a few generations. If you study evolutionary history, you will see that there is no such thing as a "first human.
Highlight is from me.
Adam and his wife were not the only humans. They lived among other humans in their community. Their children married the children of others within their community or other communities near them, thus no incest.
Besides, I never said there has been "such thing as a "first human"". verse 41 informs us that we were created from single cells.
O mankind, fear your Lord who created you from a single soul, and from it created its match, and spread many men and women from the two. Fear Allah in whose name you ask each other, and fear the womb-relations. Surely, Allah is watchful over you.
Peace,
KhalilPeace,
Khalil -
Adam and his wife were not the only humans. They lived among other humans in their community. Their children married the children of others within their community or other communities near them, thus no incest.
Peace,
KhalilDoes the Qur'an tell us this? Also, one other portion of my reply has not been addressed. You stated that Adam/Eve were not in heaven and that is an additional tale from hadith, but refer to the following verses
where are Adam and Eve in the following verses?
235
We said "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."236
Then did Satan make them slip from the Garden, and get them out of the state of felicity in which they had been. We said "Get ye down, all (ye people), with enmity between yourselves. On earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood - for a time."From 236, it's quite clear they were not originally on earth.
So where were they (#1) and what evidence do we have from the scripture that they were present among a civilization of other people (#2)?
Peace
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Does the Qur'an tell us this? Also, one other portion of my reply has not been addressed. You stated that Adam/Eve were not in heaven and that is an additional tale from hadith, but refer to the following verses
where are Adam and Eve in the following verses?
235
We said "O Adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the Garden; and eat of the bountiful things therein as (where and when) ye will; but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."236
Then did Satan make them slip from the Garden, and get them out of the state of felicity in which they had been. We said "Get ye down, all (ye people), with enmity between yourselves. On earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood - for a time."From 236, it's quite clear they were not originally on earth.
So where were they (#1) and what evidence do we have from the scripture that they were present among a civilization of other people (#2)?
Peace
Highlights above are from me.
1st Your own translation above which I highlighted red, talks about to get down YOU ALL, which is a plural YOU. The verse talks about a group of people to go down, i.e. Adam, his wife, and more people with them to go down. This means that there is a community of people.
2nd verses 235,36 talk about the garden and that THEY ALL to get DOWN from it. The Arabic
word used for GET DOWN YOU ALL, i.e. means to going down from a higher elevation to a lower one here on
Earth. It doesn't have anything to do with HEAVENLY, INNER PLANETARY, and or INNER GALACTIC travel. Besides, traveling in outer space, going up or down does not make sense, up or down compare to what?What I understand not just from this verse, but from a collective verses relating to this issue in the Qur'aan, is that Adam and his wife and his community used to live in high elevation forests/garden right here on Earth and after their disobedience and eating from the forbidden tree and losing their outer garments/fur as the consequence, they ALL had to migrate to lower lands.
3rd where do you get the NAME "Eve" from. It is not in The Qur'aan. ;D
Peace,
Khalil -
Highlights above are from me.
1st Your own translation above which I highlighted red, talks about to get down YOU ALL, which is a plural YOU. The verse talks about a group of people to go down, i.e. Adam, his wife, and more people with them to go down. This means that there is a community of people.
2nd verses 235,36 talk about the garden and that THEY ALL to get DOWN from it. The Arabic
word used for GET DOWN YOU ALL, i.e. means to going down from a higher elevation to a lower one here on
Earth. It doesn't have anything to do with HEAVENLY, INNER PLANETARY, and or INNER GALACTIC travel. Besides, traveling in outer space, going up or down does not make sense, up or down compare to what?What I understand not just from this verse, but from a collective verses relating to this issue in the Qur'aan, is that Adam and his wife and his community used to live in high elevation forests/garden right here on Earth and after their disobedience and eating from the forbidden tree and losing their outer garments/fur as the consequence, they ALL had to migrate to lower lands.
3rd where do you get the NAME "Eve" from. It is not in The Qur'aan. ;D
Peace,
KhalilI'm glad you noted the "all" portion - that is precisely why I considered Adam to be a symbol for mankind. Why would the entire community be punished for the disobedience of a single entity?
Regarding your second comment, whether or not the garden was at a high elevation or low elevation does not matter - whether high or low, the garden, according to you, is on earth. When you read "On earth will be your dwelling-place," it's only logical that they were not on earth. Even if I am on Mount Everest, I am still on earth.
My apology on the Eve reference - I am aware it is not the Quran, she is only referred as Adam's wife.
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Regarding your second comment, whether or not the garden was at a high elevation or low elevation does not matter - whether high or low, the garden, according to you, is on earth. When you read "On earth will be your dwelling-place," it's only logical that they were not on earth. Even if I am on Mount Everest, I am still on earth.
The Qur'aan, through numerous verses describes the start of the creation of human/INSAAN to be from Earthly materials. See 1526, 2312, 327, 5514, 41, 698, 7189, 396.
Peace,
Khalil -
The Qur'aan, through numerous verses describes the start of the creation of human/INSAAN to be from Earthly materials. See 1526, 2312, 327, 5514, 41, 698, 7189, 396.
Peace,
KhalilYes, exactly brother - so then, why is Adam not originally on earth? It doesn't fit the paradigm. This is what has led me to believe that Adam is a symbol for mankind, and Adam being a proper name doesn't necessarily equate him to a real person. He could be a character to represent human nature and man's relationship with God. By Surah 2's account, Adam and his spouse / "all" of what Adam represents were banished from a garden that was not on earth.
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Why do you say that that garden was not on earth?
Salaam
236
Then did Satan make them slip from the Garden, and get them out of the state of felicity in which they had been. We said "Get ye down, all (ye people), with enmity between yourselves. On earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood - for a time."Surah 2, Verse 36 infers that Adam was given earth as a new place to dwell. For coherency, it's only logical that he was not on earth prior to the order from God.
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I'm glad you noted the "all" portion - that is precisely why I considered Adam to be a symbol for mankind. Why would the entire community be punished for the disobedience of a single entity?
He the Exalted said "You both go down to Earth jointly departing from this place-Paradise.
Some of you people will be acting as enemy for some others. -
Peace,
God does not say the story about Adam is an allegorical one. As far as I have understood God is quite clear about what is an allegory and what is not in His Book.
Adam is an individual highlighted in this narrative, but as kgwithnob tells; they must have been quite a community exiled from this garden including Shaytaan.
Talking about how these events occurred is as discussing how the Paradise will be. It is difficult to fathom the experience after we have died. The afterlife is probably a bit different to what we are accustomed to here with a closer proximity to God and the world may be a bit fantasy-like, maybe with elements of "magic".
I am sure God did not use too complicated language when he revealed the Quran or people would scratch their heads and wonder what God is talking about. The events which are narrated in Quran about Adam and his exile is probably more complicated which is stated in Quran. God most likely used simplified language.
I can understand if the story about the tree might not carry a literal meaning but as a metaphor for something else. Yet it may be true and so on in a "fantasy world". Remember the tree was like a tree of knowledge, so they understood more when they had eaten from it.
Of course I am sure God already knew about the fact the humans would eat from the tree since He is all-knowing. It seems to have been a test all along. Why he created humans at all is something with Him.
Peace kgwithnob,
Your explanation about Adam seems plausible, but could you refrain from having a too confrontational or aggressive undertone in your posts. Or is it only me who get this feeling?
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Peace all.Sorry for interupting
Using Non-Muslim's evidence to proofing Quranic fallacies is something we must avoided.
3118 O you who believe do not take as an inner-circle any from besides yourselves; they will only disrupt you greatly. They wish that you
deviate; the hatred is apparent out of their mouths and what their chests conceal is even greater! We have made clear for you the
signs if you comprehend.I'm not study in athroplogy, but I believe of Adam and Hawa's existence because Quran was explaining if they're exist both literally or dictionaries.
Example
233 He said ?O Adam, inform them of their names,? so when he informed them of their names, He said ?Did I not tell you that I know the unseen of the heavens and the earth, and that I know what you reveal and what you are hiding??
This verse is very clear if Adam is exist
Plus this verse is don't need anykind of tafseer, becuase it's already clear understanding by just only by translation.There is Quranic verse which is "true" allegorical and still cannot easy to understand even with translation (mutasyabihat), the example is this
(QS 2431)
"And what posseses their right hand/maintain the oath"
This sentence cannot simply understand just by translation instead we must use tafsir.
Secondly, Yes I know if term "first human" forbidden in evolution science.Yeah maybe Adam is not first human but the first "homo sapiens" , the first human species who have more intellegence rather than it's predecessor.
I suggest that we must hold this motto
"Quran first then another science"
I mean before we study anykind of science, we must study the Quran first.It's because the Quran is can filtering the science what we must study.
The example is "Darwin Evolution".If we an atheist, maybe we believe that theory thus studying it, but if we have knowledge of the Quran before, then we can filtering that theory.
Salaam
