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  4. Non performers of As-Salaat are not true believers

Non performers of As-Salaat are not true believers

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  • M Offline
    M Offline
    Mazhar
    wrote on last edited by
    #21

    Chattering takes people neither here nor there.

    Ayahs of Qur'aan are explicitely explicative on all aspects of As-Salaat. Ayahs about each aspect are included in the Article. They need to be either accepted or refuted instead of chattering.

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      U Offline
      unknownuser
      wrote on last edited by
      #22

      262 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Nazarenes, and the Sabians, whoever of them believes in God and the Last Day and does good works; they will have their recompense with their Lord, and there is no fear upon them, nor will they grieve.

      Salat is extremely important, no doubt, but I believe its purpose is remembrance of Allah which leads one to the path of good works in a most righteous manner. However, if we take 262, is there any inclusion of Salat or even Zakat for ultimate salvation? Ultimately, it seems to come down to belief in one God, the Last Day, and good works. Salat, in my eyes, is not a good "deed," in that it is not directly benefiting others; it is crucial for the self. However, indirectly, it leads to benefit to others.

      I don't believe in a categorical approach to believers, but a dimensional one the lack of Salat doesn't render an individual to be a nonbeliever, but on a dimensional scale, perhaps they will place on a lesser degree than a believer who prays Salat.

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      • M Offline
        M Offline
        Man_of_Faith
        wrote on last edited by
        #23

        Salaam,

        It was not pointless "chatter" as I suggested the meaning of 'salat' and certain traditional details which seemingly does not exist other than tradition. Can you verify rakah system or these details using Quran? Or even the common belief in five daily compulsory prayers.

        I do not refute nor approve of any claims but merely raise more points to discuss. As far as I know you can only verify max three prayers and barely even that according to Wakas.

        God bless you

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        • M Offline
          M Offline
          Mazhar
          wrote on last edited by
          #24

          As far as I know you can only verify max three prayers and barely even that according to Wakas.

          The fact about Ass-sa'laat It has remained prescribed and mandatory for the true believers, characteristically time-bound; at scheduled timings-timetabled.

          Thereby timings are to be indicated to know as to how many times it is performed. Please refute the five timings mentioned in the Qur'aan to stand by the erroneous perceptions of two or three.

          It is a time bound protocol. Number and the appointed timings for its performance during a day

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          • M Offline
            M Offline
            Mazhar
            wrote on last edited by
            #25

            262 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Nazarenes, and the Sabians, whoever of them believes in God and the Last Day and does good works; they will have their recompense with their Lord, and there is no fear upon them, nor will they grieve.

            Salat is extremely important, no doubt, but I believe its purpose is remembrance of Allah which leads one to the path of good works in a most righteous manner. However, if we take 262, is there any inclusion of Salat or even Zakat for ultimate salvation? Ultimately, it seems to come down to belief in one God, the Last Day, and good works. Salat, in my eyes, is not a good "deed," in that it is not directly benefiting others; it is crucial for the self. However, indirectly, it leads to benefit to others.

            I don't believe in a categorical approach to believers, but a dimensional one the lack of Salat doesn't render an individual to be a nonbeliever, but on a dimensional scale, perhaps they will place on a lesser degree than a believer who prays Salat.

            http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/019.%20Maryam%20Siddiqa/19.59.gif
            http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/019.%20Maryam%20Siddiqa/19.59a.gif
            Thereafter, the later generations who succeeded them in timeline discarded the As-sa'laat Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and allegiance. And they pursued selfish desires, lusts and conjectural fascinations.

            Thereby, soon they will confront devastating result.

            And they the People of the Book were commanded not but that they should be subservient and allegiant subjects for Allah the Exalted by remaining exclusively and continuously loyal to the Operative Code of life prescribed by Him the Exalted.

            And that they should steadfastly maintain the Institution of As-sa'laat; and should pay the Az-zakat economic up lifter of society.

            Remain mindful; this is the straightly settled permanent Constitution-Perpetuated Code-Operative System of Life.

            On revelation of Grand Qur'aan they are reminded to recall their Covenant and fulfill the Promise to accept this Revelation and the elevated Messenger; and conduct their selves in the following manner which was also an Article of the Covenant

            Moreover, you people remain steadfast in maintaining Institution of As-sa'laat-Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and allegiance;

            And remain willingly determined to pay the Az-zakat economic up-lifter of society;

            And you people kneel together in company of those who bow.

            Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and Allegiance The Key of the door of success

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            • A Offline
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              ansmeh1998
              wrote on last edited by
              #26

              The most vexed term / issue I have confronted with in Al-Quran is the Salat. I find the entire world order is just guessing without a conclusive understanding to be followed securely and so am I. Below are the verses indicating as to whom the Salat is enjoined on.

              95, 11 Salat is enjoined on Non-believers as a pre-condition to remain with safety in the State.

              1431 Salat is enjoined on Believers.

              971 Salat is enjoined on Momins.

              1319-22 Salat is enjoined on Ulul-Albab.

              2241 Salat is enjoined on the one vested with the authority to govern the state.

              2278 Salat is enjoined on Muslims.

              2945 Salat is enjoined on the Prophet.

              2441 Salat is enjoined on all the creatures in the heavens and the earth.

              3031 Non adherence of Salat renders you among the Mushrikeen.

              3529 Adherence to Salat is a no loss business/venture.

              The above verses of Quran tempt me to have an understanding of Salat as Duty(ies) / obligation(s) to be carried out dutifully within the framework of the divine law in our day to day life while being loyal to the established system of Governance in the State. Corrections are invited.

              Salam!

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              • M Offline
                M Offline
                Mazhar
                wrote on last edited by
                #27

                95, 11 Salat is enjoined on Non-believers as a pre-condition to remain with safety in the State.

                This perception is by cutting away a subordinate clause from the main sentence. It is not enjoined upon Non-believers. First is if they revert and become believer; then following is this condition to become the brother of Muslim fraternity.

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                • M Offline
                  M Offline
                  Mazhar
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #28

                  ansmeh1998

                  Salam,

                  Did you not peep into Hell-Prison? Therein people are also saying something about Salaat.

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                  • A Offline
                    A Offline
                    ansmeh1998
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #29

                    This perception is by cutting away a subordinate clause from the main sentence. It is not enjoined upon Non-believers. First is if they revert and become believer; then following is this condition to become the brother of Muslim fraternity.

                    Here is the verse 95

                    I do not find a word in this ayat which may be construed as ?if they revert and become believer?. Given the information given in the previous ayat and in this ayat the term ?fa-in taboo? may at best be understood that ?if one refrains from mischief?. Have a re-look and share your considered views.

                    Salaam!

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                    • A Offline
                      A Offline
                      ansmeh1998
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #30

                      ansmeh1998

                      Did you not peep into Hell-Prison? Therein people are also saying something about Salaat.

                      Which of the verses of Al-Quran, you are referring to?

                      Salaam!

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                      • H Offline
                        H Offline
                        hawk99
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #31

                        Peace Family,

                        When I was Christian, I wondered why the muslims prayed like the jews but we Christians
                        did not, and now it appears that some muslims want to go back to praying like Christians by
                        just making up their own prayers, what a crazy world!

                        Matt. 26/39
                        And he went a little further, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be
                        possible, let this cup pass from me nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt.

                        Genesis 173 And Abram fell on his face and God talked with him, saying,

                        Numbers 145 Then Moses and Aaron fell on their faces before all the assembly ?

                        Numbers 1622 And they fell on their faces, and said, O God, the God of the spirits ?

                        The old Qiblah

                        Daniel 6/10
                        "When Daniel knew that the document had been signed, he went to his house where
                        he had windows in his upper chamber open toward Jerusalem; and he got down
                        upon his knees three times a day and prayed and gave thanks before his God, as he
                        had done previously"

                        peace

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                        • U Offline
                          U Offline
                          unknownuser
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #32

                          http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/019.%20Maryam%20Siddiqa/19.59.gif
                          http//haqeeqat.org.pk/English%20Tafsir%20e%20Haqeeqat/00.Arabic%20Text/019.%20Maryam%20Siddiqa/19.59a.gif
                          Thereafter, the later generations who succeeded them in timeline discarded the As-sa'laat Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and allegiance. And they pursued selfish desires, lusts and conjectural fascinations.

                          Thereby, soon they will confront devastating result.

                          And they the People of the Book were commanded not but that they should be subservient and allegiant subjects for Allah the Exalted by remaining exclusively and continuously loyal to the Operative Code of life prescribed by Him the Exalted.

                          And that they should steadfastly maintain the Institution of As-sa'laat; and should pay the Az-zakat economic up lifter of society.

                          Remain mindful; this is the straightly settled permanent Constitution-Perpetuated Code-Operative System of Life.

                          On revelation of Grand Qur'aan they are reminded to recall their Covenant and fulfill the Promise to accept this Revelation and the elevated Messenger; and conduct their selves in the following manner which was also an Article of the Covenant

                          Moreover, you people remain steadfast in maintaining Institution of As-sa'laat-Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and allegiance;

                          And remain willingly determined to pay the Az-zakat economic up-lifter of society;

                          And you people kneel together in company of those who bow.

                          Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and Allegiance The Key of the door of success

                          1959 Then, generations came after them who lost the contact prayer, and followed desires. They will find their consequences.
                          1960 Except for whoever repents and believes and does good works; they will be admitted to the Paradise, and they will not be wronged in the least.

                          1959 is referring to the group who both "lost the contact prayer" "and followed desires." It shows the directional path of deviance after losing the contact prayer. The prayer is useless if not taken with respect to its consequences, both in adherence and in disobedience.

                          So, what I see is that Verse 59 is referring to those who manipulated the prescribed law with their own desires.

                          A similar pattern is seen in Surah 98

                          985 And they were not commanded except to serve God and be loyal to His system, monotheists, and hold the contact prayer and contribute towards purification. Such is the valuable system.
                          986 Those who rejected from the people of the Book and the polytheists are in the fires of Hell abiding therein, those are the worst of creation.
                          987 As for those who believe and do good works, they are the best of creation.

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                          • K Offline
                            K Offline
                            kgwithnob
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #33

                            262 Surely those who believe; and those who are Jewish, and the Nazarenes, and the Sabians, whoever of them believes in God and the Last Day and does good works; they will have their recompense with their Lord, and there is no fear upon them, nor will they grieve.

                            Salat is extremely important, no doubt, but I believe its purpose is remembrance of Allah which leads one to the path of good works in a most righteous manner. However, if we take 262, is there any inclusion of Salat or even Zakat for ultimate salvation? Ultimately, it seems to come down to belief in one God, the Last Day, and good works. Salat, in my eyes, is not a good "deed," in that it is not directly benefiting others; it is crucial for the self. However, indirectly, it leads to benefit to others.

                            I don't believe in a categorical approach to believers, but a dimensional one the lack of Salat doesn't render an individual to be a nonbeliever, but on a dimensional scale, perhaps they will place on a lesser degree than a believer who prays Salat.

                            Highlight above is from me.

                            You may find the full explanation of the third part of 262, i.e. the "good works", in 2177 below.

                            Righteousness is not (merely) that you turn your faces to the East and the West; but righteousness is that one believes in Allah and the Last Day and the angels and the Book and the Prophets, and gives wealth, despite (his) love for it, to relatives, and to orphans, the helpless, the wayfarer, and to those who ask, and (spends) in (freeing) slaves and observes the Salah (prayers) and pays Zakah___and (the act of) those who fulfill their covenant when they enter into a covenant, and, those who are patient in hardship and suffering and when in battle! Those are the ones who are truthful, and those are the God-fearing.

                            Peace,
                            Khalil

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                            • M Offline
                              M Offline
                              Mazhar
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #34

                              Except Christians and Jews nobody cares for East and West. The pronoun in the second person verb is definite referring to them. Also not taking care about the connotations added by the mood of verbs and by translating a verb as active participle can distort the perception conveyed in Ayah.

                              That you the Christians and Jews might turnabout your faces-selves confronting the East and the West is not the Virtue-Magnanimous Conduct.
                              On the contrary; the Virtue-Magnanimous Conduct is of that person Who consciously and heartily believed in Allah the Exalted and the Last Day; and the Angels; and the Book one peculiar Book, Qur'aan; and the Chosen and Elevated Allegiants of Allah the Exalted;

                              And he spent-donated wealth for the sake of attaining approval and appreciation of Allah the Exalted to the near relatives, and the orphans, and the destitute, and the wayfarer, and those who seek help, and to get freedom-remission for the slaves-prisoners.
                              And he steadfastly maintained the Institution of As-sa'laat Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and allegiance; and he paid Az-Zakaa't; financial contribution for economic uplift of society.

                              Note it; Such are the people who honour their pledge-commitment when they have entered into a pledge;
                              And they remain coolly perseverant in financial crisis and adversity; and in times of poverty/war.
                              They are the people who have proved their word-declaration of belief with their acts as true;
                              And they are the people who are truly cautious, heedful and mindful avoiding unrestrained conduct.

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                                ansmeh1998
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #35

                                Brother Mazhar Salaam,

                                I am sorry I don't intend to sound harsh but frankly speaking due to my own ignorance or so I find your repeated exhortation - "time bound Protocol of Servitude and Allegiance" very irritating as I do not understand what you actually mean to say?

                                1. You have referred to a link of an article titled 'Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat'

                                Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat

                                wherein it is mentioned "We have listened to the people who were destined to scorching Hell-Prison that they were not seen in the company of performers of Time Bound Protocol of Servitude." My point is from where you have extracted this statement in red - I mean what is the source and who the 'We' is referred to?

                                1. May I request your good self to kindly clarify the above points for the sake of clarity of the issue in question?

                                May Allah(swt) bless you, me and all to keep on increasing our knowledge.

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                                • U Offline
                                  U Offline
                                  unknownuser
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #36

                                  Highlight above is from me.

                                  You may find the full explanation of the third part of 262, i.e. the "good works", in 2177 below.

                                  Righteousness is not (merely) that you turn your faces to the East and the West; but righteousness is that one believes in Allah and the Last Day and the angels and the Book and the Prophets, and gives wealth, despite (his) love for it, to relatives, and to orphans, the helpless, the wayfarer, and to those who ask, and (spends) in (freeing) slaves and observes the Salah (prayers) and pays Zakah___and (the act of) those who fulfill their covenant when they enter into a covenant, and, those who are patient in hardship and suffering and when in battle! Those are the ones who are truthful, and those are the God-fearing.

                                  Peace,
                                  Khalil

                                  Yes, but this is where I believe in a dimensional approach to righteousness, not a categorical approach. I don't believe it is such that, in order to fulfill the requirements of "believer," you must do each and every single thing on a checklist in order to be considered a believer and, thus, granted a place in Heaven. This would go contrary to Allah's mercy and kindness, because where do we draw the line? Righteousness is colors, not black and white. There is a degree of righteousness, and those who do all these good works mark high on righteousness. It does not mean that if someone does not do one of those elements that he/she is not righteous, but perhaps he/she is less righteous, not necessarily not righteous.

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                                    M Offline
                                    Mazhar
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #37
                                    1. You have referred to a link of an article titled 'Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat'
                                      Quote from Mazhar on August 13, 2013, 025837 PM
                                      Be always mindful for performing As-Salaat
                                      wherein it is mentioned "We have listened to the people who were destined to scorching Hell-Prison that they were not seen in the company of performers of Time Bound Protocol of Servitude." My point is from where you have extracted this statement in red - I mean what is the source and who the 'We' is referred to?

                                    Please see in the link the Ayahs 7442-48 wherein people residing in the Hell-Prison are explaining what caused them to be put therein.

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                                    • A Offline
                                      A Offline
                                      ansmeh1998
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #38

                                      Please see in the link the Ayahs 7442-48 wherein people residing in the Hell-Prison are explaining what caused them to be put therein.

                                      Thanks a lot Brother Mazhar for the information.

                                      Salaam!

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                                      • A Offline
                                        A Offline
                                        ansmeh1998
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #39

                                        Salaam,

                                        Institution of As-sa'laat Time Bound Protocol of Servitude and allegiance

                                        What is this all about? Whether it is about physical standing, bowing and prostration five time a day?

                                        OR

                                        (i) Whether it is about (a) having unflinching allegiance in the Highest Authority (b) refraining from
                                        committing Shirk?
                                        (ii) Whether it is about fulfillment of commitments as per divine laws - (a) Duties (b) Responsibilities /
                                        obligations?
                                        (iii) Whether it is about observing just balance between give and take - (a) Perseverance (b) Honesty?
                                        (iv) Whether it is about institutionalizing just system of governance in the land of Allah -
                                        (a) Supermacy of Rule of Law (b) Equality of opportunity to one and all?
                                        (v) Whether it is about commemorating Allah(swt) all the time by practicing the golden rules of -
                                        (a) Sabr (b) Shukr (c) Tawakkal (d) Attributing all the Praises and Glorification to Allah alone.
                                        (vi) Whether is it is about observing Asceticism ? (a) Abstain from vice and sin (b) Readiness to
                                        sacrifice the most loved things in the way of Allah.
                                        (vii) Whether it is about (a) Self Assessment / Review (b) Purification (c) Jahad (d) Enforcement of Law
                                        / Following the Rasool / Being Law abiding / Adherence to State Law.
                                        (viii) Whether it is about (a) Avoiding conflict and confrontation (b) Restoration of Peace.

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                                        • M Offline
                                          M Offline
                                          Mazhar
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #40

                                          Salam,

                                          It is sublime demonstration of absolute surrender to the Lord of Universes. It is surrender of granted free will-the forehead placed on ground; allegiance and absolute subjection to the Supreme Sovereign. Thereby, you promise to act according to the Constitution-Ordinance promulgated by the Supreme Soverein the Grand Qur'aan.

                                          Know the As-Salaat, one will get nearer to his Sustainer Lord.

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