Wahi Ghair Matloo ?
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Peace all,
"Al-kitab" in Arabic can be translated as "the book" in English.
Now depending on the context of each verse in "al-qura'n", this word "al-kitab" can be referring to many different things.
We need to understand that a book is composed by words that are making sentences and paragraphs, that are assembled in an intelligible form.
We know from "al-qura'n" that the god the creator only says "be" and then "it is" to create "things", so every thing in this universe is "a word" from the god.
All these creatures (things) are words of the god, which are combined to make this book we call "the universe" which is in front of all of us, equally accessible to all of us, and which is independent from the observer. That is the book where there is no doubt, a guidance for those who are aware enough to be able to "read it" and to learn from it. That is the book that the many messengers and "prophets" have studied for their own benefit and for their people.
"Al-qura'n" is giving some details of this book "universe", and is highlighting the principal laws governing it; "al-qura'n" is also giving recommendations on the best way to go through that book, and avoid misunderstandings that can be detrimental to our well-being.
The One crucial recommendation from "al-qura'n" to deal correctly with this book "universe", is "to not associate or confuse the god with any thing" in this book. Not following this simple and basic rule will provoke a big confusion in the mind of the reader of this book "universe", and may bring him many troubles that nobody else can help him to overcome, unless the reader chooses consciously to consider that the god the creator is not similar to any thing in this universe, because the god is the creator of all. (in the same way a car-maker is not to be confused with the car or any specific part of it - also, the nature of the car-maker is way beyond the nature of the car).
"Al-kitab" in "al-qura'n" can also refer simply to a specific book mentioned in the context of the verse. This book can be in the form of modern books, on papyrus, on rolls, or even written on a rock or a monument.
I hope this helps.
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Let's deal with one thing at a time. So, let's revisit the verse. We can talk about 22 after we resolve this issue
1037 This Qur?an could not have been produced without God; it is to authenticate what is between his hands, and to give details of the
Book in which there is no doubt, from the Lord of the worlds. (FM translation)The issue is the same with both translations. If "the Quran" gives details of "the book," then they can't be the exact same thing. There is overlap of the two, but there is a clear distinction and I want to figure out what this distinction is, exactly and completely.
+salaam brother
You are following the right methodology of seeking knowledge. This way you and anyone else will never go astray. When people start warning you not to do this or not to do that or not to read that translation but rather this translation then that reeks of sectarianism. My encouragement for you brother is for you to continue on your path of seeking truth form falsehood inshaa ALLAAH.
The Qur'aan makes it perfectly clear that there is the existence of the Book (al-kitaab) which ALLAAH has revealed through the ages and that this book will never cease from being in the world even if one person is in possession of it. It is a book that has passed on through one family like as ALLAAH have stated clearly in the Qur'aan. Here are additional proofs from the Qur'aan. I can go into all the details and show you everything you need to know inshaa ALLAAH.
The sending of the Book (al_kitaab) to Humanity.
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Humanity was one people
and ALLAAH sent Messengers giving good news and warning and with them He sent
the Book (al_kitaab) in the Truth
to judge between the people in matters wherein they differed.It was to Aadam that ALLAAH taught the Book (al-kitaab) that enabled him to surpass all the creation, including all the Angels, in knowledge and wisdom. Aadam was also the one that ALLAAH created to be His representative (al-khaliyfaH) on the Earth - the possessor of the command (al-'amr). This was the Trust (al-'amaanaH) from ALLAAH to Aadam that he must pass on to the specific line of his descendants -the possessors of the command ('uwlu-l-'amr) - generation after generation without intermission until the end at the arrival of the son of man (ibn Aadam) and his universal sacrifice.
Aadam also had a vicious enemy ('ibliys and his descendants) who was bent on destroying him and his entire line of descendants who would possess the Book (al-kitaab). To ibliys ALLAAH gave the freedom, under conditions, not only to mislead most of humanity but also inspired them to rise up against and ridicule the possessors of the command ('uwlu-l-'amr) - the inheritors of the Book (al-kitaab).
Aadam had many sons and daughters and their descendants and he lived among them for over nine-hundred years before he died. At that time they (al-naas) formed one humanity or one people or a single nation ('ummaH waahidaH).
About one thousand and fifty years after Aadam, Nuwh was born. He was the ninth descendant of Aadam and he lived among his people for another one thousand years minus fifty until the birth of his ninth descendant 'ibraaHiym almost exactly two thousand years after the creation of Aadam.
aadam (Adam)
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nuwh (Noah)The Book (al-kitaab) passing down generation after generation through the rightly guided descendants of the chosen family line
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And We have already sent
nuwh (Noah)
and
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'ibraaHiym (Abraham)
and placed in their
descendants prophethood
and
the Book (al-kitaab);
and
among them is he who is guided,
but many of them are defiantly disobedient.004054
But We had already given the Family of Abraham ("ibraaHiym)
the Book (al_kitaab)
and
the Wisdom
and conferred upon them a Great Kingdom.006084
We gave him
Isaac ('is-haaq) and Jacob (ya"quwb)
all We guided
--- and Noah (nuwh) We guided before ---
and among his progeny
David (daawud) and Soloman (sulaymaan) and Job ('ayyuwb) and Moses (muwsaa) and Aaron (Haaruwn)
Thus do We reward those who do good.006085
And Zachariah (zakariyyah) and John (yahyaa) and Jesus ("iysaa) and Elijah ('ilyaas)
All in the ranks of The Good006086
And
'ismaa"iyl (Ishmael)
and Elisha('ilyasa) and Jonas (yuwnus) and Lot (luwT)
And to all We gave favour above The Worlds.006087
And from
their fathers
and
their progeny
(Here we are following the descendants of 'ismaa"iyl (Ishmael) )
and
their brothers
We chose them and We guided them to a Straight Road.006088
That is
the Guidance of ALLAAH.
He guides by it whom He wills from among His servants.
And if they had associated partners with Him
lo! Useless is that which they have worked.006089
Those
were they
(aadam-> descendants--->nuwh-> descendants---> ibraaHim-> ismaa"iyl---> descendants---------->(among the others mentioned)
unto whom we gave
the Book (al_kitaab)
and
the Judgeship (al_hukm)
and
the Prophethood (an_nubuwwah)...
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Remember Abraham said
"O my Lord! make this city one of peace and security and preserve me and my sons from worshiping idols.1436
"O my Lord!
they have indeed led astray many among mankind;
He then who follows my (ways) is of me, and he that disobeys me,- but Thou art indeed Oft- forgiving, Most Merciful.1437
"O our Lord!
I have made some of my
offspring/progeny/descendants
(These became the tribe of Quraysh or the al-Qurashiy family from among whom Muhammad (S+) was born to deliver the Qur'aan to the world and the Book (al-kitaab) to his family and descendants)
to dwell in a valley without cultivation,
by Thy Sacred House;
in order, O our Lord, that they may establish regular Prayer
so fill the hearts of some among humanity with love towards them,
and feed them with fruits
so that they may give thanks.2124 (Y.A. Tr.)
And remember that Abraham was tried by his Lord with certain commands, which he fulfilled
He said "I will make thee an Imam to the Nations."
He pleaded "And also from my offspring/progeny/descendants!"
He answered "But My Promise is not within the reach of evil-doers."2125
Remember We made the House a place of assembly for men and a place of safety;
and take ye the station of Abraham as a place of prayer;
and We covenanted with Abraham and Isma'il,
that they should sanctify My House for those who compass it round,
or use it as a retreat, or bow, or prostrate themselves.2126
And remember Abraham said
"My Lord, make this a City of Peace, and feed its people with fruits,-such of them as believe in Allah and the Last Day."
He said "(Yea), and such as reject Faith,-for a while will I grant them their pleasure,
but will soon drive them to the torment of Fire,- an evil destination (indeed)!"2127
And remember Abraham and Isma'il raised the foundations of the House (With this prayer)
"Our Lord! Accept (this service) from us
For Thou art the All-Hearing, the All-knowing.2128
"Our Lord! make of us Muslims, bowing to Thy (Will), and of our
offspring/ progeny/descendants
a people Muslim, bowing to Thy (will);
and show us our place for the celebration of (due) rites;
and turn unto us (in Mercy);
for Thou art the Oft-Returning, Most Merciful.2129
"Our Lord!
send amongst them (offspring/ progeny/descendants of 'ibraaHiym and 'ismaa"iyl )
a Messenger of their own,
who shall read/rehearse to them
Thy Signs (al-aayaat)
and
teach them
the book (al-kitaab)
and
the Wisdom (al-hikmaH),
and
sanctify them
For Thou art the Exalted in Might, the Wise."2130
And who turns away from the religion of Abraham but such as debase their souls with folly?
Him We chose and rendered pure in this world
And he will be in the Hereafter in the ranks of the Righteous.2131
Behold! his Lord said to him
"Bow (thy will to Me)
" He said "I bow (my will) to the Lord and Cherisher of the Universe."2132
And this was the legacy that Abraham left to his sons,
and so did Jacob; "Oh my sons! Allah hath chosen the Faith for you; then die not except in the Faith of Islam."There are some of the evidence from the Recitation/Reading (al-Qur'aan) of how the book (al-kitaab) had passed through a chosen family - generation after generation without intermission - over a period of 4500 years - from Aadam---> Nuwh---> 'IbraaHiym->'Ismaa"iyl------------Muhammad- the peace and blessings of ALLAAH upon all of them.
This is only a basic explanation.
+salaam
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I don't know if Al Quran is Al Kitab itself due to the following verse
1037
Wama kana hatha alqur-anuan yuftara min dooni Allahi walakin tasdeeqaallathee bayna yadayhi watafseela alkitabi larayba feehi min rabbi alAAalameen
Sahih InternationalAnd it was not possible for this QUR'AN to be produced by other than Allah , but it is a confirmation of what was before it and a DETAILED EXPLANATION of THE BOOK, about which there is no doubt, from the Lord of the worlds.
+salaam
If one follows the Qur'aan without making the Qur'aan say what it does not say then it says that the Book (al-kitaab) is different from all other books.
Read the story in the Qur'aan how ALLAAH makes a distinction between His books. Read what ALLAAH was going to teach Jesus (D+). Look how ALLAAH makes a clear distinction between the Book (al-kitaab) and the TawraH and the Injiyl. The Qur'aan is yet to be revealed centuries later.
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And behold! The Angels said,
"O Mary! ALLAAH gives thee good news of a Word from Him.
His name is The Christ Jesus , The Son of Mary, distinguished in this world and the hereafter.003045
"He shall speak to the people in the cradle and middle age"003047
She said "O my Lord! How shall I have a son when no man has touched me?"
He said "Like that it is to thee; ALLAAH creates what He wills.
When He has executed a command and then He just says to it BE! And then it becomes.003048
And ALLAAH will teach him
The Book (al_kitaab)
and
The Wisdom (al_hikmah)
and
The Torah (al_tawrah)
and
The Gospel (al_'injiyl)After the above books were revealed ALLAAH revealed the Recitation/Reading (al-Qur'aan) to be a detailed explanation of the Book (al-kitaab). It is from the Book (al-kitaab) that all the other knowledge is extracted.
Only those to whom ALLAAH has given the Book (al-kitaab) knows of its existence and believes in it. The others have no idea and there they are denial
029047.
And like that We have sent down to thee The Book (al_kitaab).
And so those to whom we have given The Book (al_kitaab) believe therein
as also do some of these
and none rejects Our Signs (al-aayaat) except the Ungrateful Unbelievers.All who wants to know about the Book (al-kitaab) must pray to ALLAAH and then begin the search with a sincere intention to listen to anyone who says that he or she can teach it.
+salaam
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The answer is simple, read the second verse of Al-Baqarah.
"This book no doubt"
Of course the word "this" refer to the Quran.
Kitab literally means "book" in english and Al-Kitab (Kitab with Al) indicate if that book is something special a.k.a "Scripture".
Al-Quran is a Scripture, so Al-Quran is the Al-Kitab itself.
Torah and Gospel (Injeel) is also Al-Kitab/Scrpture.Peace.
+salaam
I shall make a diagrammatic representation of this and then we can all see what it is inshaa ALLAAH.
+salaam
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Salam mmkhan
So this means Muhammad is not a messenger,
Peace
Salaam brother Earthdom,
Who is Muhammad?
There are many many so called Arabic grammar experts on this forum.
Please check with them if there is any person's name Muhammad is mentioned in alQuraan/alKitaab, and let me know.
Thanks!BTW, I see that you do whatever you like. I saw in your reply # 12 that you translated "zalika" as "this"? hmm
Peace and may Allah bless you pr
mmKhan -
All the above replies have been greatly enlightening. Thank you all. I especially like the notion that "Al Kitab" refers to the universe, and "Al Quran" gives us the details necessary to navigate the Book wherein there is no doubt. Surely this has been a great modification in my understanding of Al Quran. Beautiful.
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+salaam
I shall make a diagrammatic representation of this and then we can all see what it is inshaa ALLAAH.
+salaam
+Salaam
You can further this in your current Al-Kitab thread.I still following your thread
+Salaam
Who is Muhammad?
There are many many so called Arabic grammar experts on this forum.
Please check with them if there is any person's name Muhammad is mentioned in alQuraan/alKitaab, and let me know.Salaam mmkhan
I think you're the one who should ask them, my brother .So this will be clear who is the real victim of the harakat system.
BTW, I see that you do whatever you like. I saw in your reply # 12 that you translated "zalika" as "this"? hmm
Yeah I should wrote "that" rather than "this".Thanks brother, I'm very tired at that time.
Peace
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I see that you do whatever you like. I saw in your reply # 12 that you translated "zalika" as "this"? hmm
In every translation I have read including "Quran Monotheist Translation" and "Quran Reformist Translation," "this" is present. Is "this" an incorrect translation?
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Salaam brother Earthdom,
Who is Muhammad?
There are many many so called Arabic grammar experts on this forum.
Please check with them if there is any person's name Muhammad is mentioned in alQuraan/alKitaab, and let me know.
Thanks!BTW, I see that you do whatever you like. I saw in your reply # 12 that you translated "zalika" as "this"? hmm
Peace and may Allah bless you pr
mmKhan -
All the above replies have been greatly enlightening. Thank you all. I especially like the notion that "Al Kitab" refers to the universe, and "Al Quran" gives us the details necessary to navigate the Book wherein there is no doubt. Surely this has been a great modification in my understanding of Al Quran. Beautiful.
Salaam brother,
As per my understanding, it is very simple and easy to understand, inshaAllah.
alQuraan is derived from root Qaaf Raa Noon
alKitaab is derived from root Kaaf Taa BaaalKitaab is nothing but the TEXT of alQuraan. This thread may help you inshaAllah.
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan -
In every translation I have read including "Quran Monotheist Translation" and "Quran Reformist Translation," "this" is present. Is "this" an incorrect translation?
Salaam,
Yes, "this" is a wrong translation. Translators translated the Arabic word "zaalika" to "this" just to prove that it is referring to alQuraan and they never fear changing the word of Allah &
Zaalika = that
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan -
Salaam brother,
As per my understanding, it is very simple and easy to understand, inshaAllah.
alQuraan is derived from root Qaaf Raa Noon
alKitaab is derived from root Kaaf Taa BaaalKitaab is nothing but the TEXT of alQuraan. This thread may help you inshaAllah.
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhanSalaam,
Thanks for the thread brother. Anyway I have already read it. Great.
But it is saddening me that there is a person on here who makes distinction between al-Qur'an and al-Kitaab by making them look like TWO DIFFERENT BOOKS
Anyway may GOD bless you for your contributions on this forum.
Regards,
Yuliana -
Salaam,
What did Moses receive, it was no kitab?
God bless you
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Salaam brother,
As per my understanding, it is very simple and easy to understand, inshaAllah.
alQuraan is derived from root Qaaf Raa Noon
alKitaab is derived from root Kaaf Taa BaaalKitaab is nothing but the TEXT of alQuraan. This thread may help you inshaAllah.
May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us on His path pr
mmKhan+salaam
I am amazed that a purported Qur'aanist who likes to point out the mistakes of others cannot point out his own.
Do you not know that the Recitation/Reading (al-qur'aan) does not originate from the verbal root
Qaaf Raa' Nuwn (Qarana).The Qur'aan derives from the verbal root
qaaf raa' 'amzaH (qara'a).
The n at the end of the word qur'aan is an extention to the root and represents completeness, fullness, etc.qarana means among other meanings
- he connected, linked, joined
From this verbal root is derived the word qarn which among other meanings mean a horn. dhuw al-qarn-ayn- of suwraH al- kaHf.
qara'a means
- he read; he recited
from this verbal root is derived the word qur'aan.
I hope pointing out this will not increase the animosity.
+salaam
- he connected, linked, joined
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Indeed, "Muhammad(un)" and "rosulu" in that verse is a nominative.
Nominative is the word who use verb and noun as predicate.The word Rasullulah is a subject-predicate and a noun.The subject is Rasul and Allah is the predicate.
The word Muhammad also in nominitive case
P S
This is the rule nominative case or isim marfu, the subject must end with dhammah.Btw why the word "Muhammad" have tanwin, there are two possibilities
- The word "Muhammad" is in nominate case like in that verse above.
- The word "Muhammad" is a common noun-irregular ( /isim nakirat).
As we know the isim nakirat, the word must end with three kind of tanwins, and it depend on the surrounding sentence.
Example of isim nakirat a house =
Salaam,
Thanks for the thread brother. Anyway I have already read it. Great.
But it is saddening me that there is a person on here who makes distinction between al-Qur'an and al-Kitaab by making them look like TWO DIFFERENT BOOKS ) ) )
Anyway may GOD bless you for your contributions on this forum.
If you really read brother mmkhan's thread, then maybe you didn't wrote a post like this )
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Salaam al-amiyr,
If you only would use your skill in Arabic to decipher the twisted meaning of words. You could be a valuable help to the problem with Quraan that we have. Please concentrate on Quraan and talk less about the overlaying Message for a while please, ie less of your al-kitab which may include illegitimate sources.
This nor the previous message I wrote that I did not understand your posts were not of bad intention. If you want to continue with your threads on al-kitaab feel free and I am okay with it. I just wish you could get involved in threads that discuss important aspects such as qiblah and get into critical thinking about the meaning using logic and reason.
I am your brother and please forgive me for not understanding your posts which I tried to tell in my previous post. Please do not be upset by my post as I have no ill-meant intentions.
Sure I would like to understand your threads on cosmology in the light of God and so on. And I have tried before too, even reading from post 1, but still lost in comprehension.
God bless you
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+salaam
I am amazed that a purported Qur'aanist who likes to point out the mistakes of others cannot point out his own.
Do you not know that the Recitation/Reading (al-qur'aan) does not originate from the verbal root
Qaaf Raa' Nuwn (Qarana).The Qur'aan derives from the verbal root
qaaf raa' 'amzaH (qara'a).
The n at the end of the word qur'aan is an extention to the root and represents completeness, fullness, etc.qarana means among other meanings
- he connected, linked, joined
From this verbal root is derived the word qarn which among other meanings mean a horn. dhuw al-qarn-ayn- of suwraH al- kaHf.
qara'a means
- he read; he recited
from this verbal root is derived the word qur'aan.
I hope pointing out this will not increase the animosity.
+salaam
Salaam,
Oh wow, sorry, that was a mistake .
Thanks for correcting me handshake
May Allah reward you the best.May Allah bless you pr
mmKhan - he connected, linked, joined
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Earthdom,
Can you tell me, what did you understand by my post? The word "someone" that I mentioned did not refer to brother mmkhan but to someone else.