Your stand on alcohol consumption based on Quran
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The query is very simple, I just want to ask from the forum contributors about their stand on the consumption of alcohol. Do you think (based on your study) is it Haram or not?
As far as I have read in the Quran, we have been guided to abstain from it in situations where it clouds the mind during prayer (i.e excessive consumption), other than that Allah (SWT) in the Quran does not seem to declare it Haram for us. Maybe I'm wrong so need other peoples input.
Salaam
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The query is very simple, I just want to ask from the forum contributors about their stand on the consumption of alcohol. Do you think (based on your study) is it Haram or not?
As far as I have read in the Quran, we have been guided to abstain from it in situations where it clouds the mind during prayer (i.e excessive consumption), other than that Allah (SWT) in the Quran does not seem to declare it Haram for us. Maybe I'm wrong so need other peoples input.
Salaam
Not haram. Though,it could lead to doing haram things.
I recommend you read The Natural Republic, it goes into detail and explains well. Start from PDF page 130, under the subject title Drug/Alcohol.https//free-minds.org/sites/default/files/TNR.pdf
Salam
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No, the Qur'an does nto say it is haram, but it says other things like that it is an evil (rijs) work of shaytan...
And in another aya it says that it has some good sides but that the bad sides ar greater than the good.
So, it does not say that it is haram, so what? Does that mean that if it was said haram it would be worse?
Eating pig is haram, so what is worse pig of wine? Of the pig the Qur'an does nto say the bad things it says of spirits, so why not say haram to spirits and say it about pig.
Which is a greater evil?
Alcohol is the hardest drug known. It destroys societies, families, persons.
No haram? How good! go and drink even, if you are told that it is the evil work of the shaytan.
By the way does it say anywhere inthe Qur'an that zina is haram literally? I cna't remember that it says so. Just to check as to when Does God say haram and when not.
Salaam
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peace,
http//misconceptions-about-islam.com/alcohol-is-forbidden.htm
Some people think "haram" is the strongest word Quran can use to forbid something, but what is actually the evidence for this? For example pig meat is "haram" but Quran says in times of hunger/desperation one can eat it .
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quran does not say
lie is haram
dishonesty is haram
cheating is haram
robbery is harambut quran say us to stay away from it .. for our own Good
same thing "ijtanabu" quran used it for alcohol and gambling
we should stay away from it too.. for our own goodalthough the verse indicate stay away from devil(shaitan)/evil
the word quran use in 2219 is is translated as sin not as "HARM"
in all other occassions this word is understood as "SIN"so we should avoid sin at any cost..
the catagory is although not like a "PIG" meat thats why people do it in general bothering not much about it same as they lie ,cheat and do other small sins without bothering much..
but in some cases alcohal related accidents cost the lives of people and society so its better if we stay away from this thing..
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peace,
http//misconceptions-about-islam.com/alcohol-is-forbidden.htm
Some people think "haram" is the strongest word Quran can use to forbid something, but what is actually the evidence for this? For example pig meat is "haram" but Quran says in times of hunger/desperation one can eat it .
That is right, that is what I am getting at. Pig meat does not do to a society the harm alcohol does.
The distinction I think is that obeying things like haram is automatic. It does not take much strength of will. There are so many thing to eat and so many ways to prepare them without haing to resort to pig...
But, on the other hand to keep away from alcohol is nto automatic. Many people have not been alcoholics in their life and then comes a time of hardship and spirists are such an easy comfort and refuge... It takes will, strength of will, a lot of conviction.
That, I think, may be why the Qur'an does not say haram, but tells us what it does to us. It divests us of our humanity and turns as into the work of the shaytan. It says so in the Qur'an. Don't we see? Do we need to be told it is haram in order to realise that we become shaytans. What do we want to be machines where we are pushed the button haram and we do it but refuse to reason? That is precisely what the Qur'an tells us not to do.
Alcohol is nto haram, it is much worse than haram, it is hell, for the drinker and the victims of the drinker. But we do not fight that with the haram automatic button, but with conviction and strength of will and repsect for our own God given humanity. With compassion for ourseles and for those to whom we can bring no end of worries and suffering through our falling into the clutches of that devil.
Of course there are plenty of people who drink moderately spparently and do not fall into alcohlism or drunkardness. The thing is whether all those who drink moderately at a gien time will remain so throughout their lives. The thing is also whether it pays for a society to hava a certain amount of people who drink moderately while having a certain amount of people becoming the abject victims of the "shaytan" tht is alcohol. As the poet says "so many have been destroyed by the happiness of the happy".
Salaam
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PIG meat is a "filthy thing" thats why its haram.. same like urine is not suppose to drink ...
alcohol is not filthy but its chemistry drive some of them crazy , some of them relax after drinking, some of them make accidents while drinking, some of them encounter illegal sex due to the heat of alcohol in body, some of them eat red wine for making themselves hungry so that they consume food properly, some of them use alcohol as a substance for mouthwash and perfumes that helps us getting rid from nasty smell, some of them start making trouble in land while they drunk,
although less benefits but more harms.. (drinking itself) is not accoutable but it makes chances of wrong doing at a risky level..
PIG and alcohal are both different things we cannot compare them..
if you drink alcohol and did not do anything wrong (you will not accountable)
if you eat PIG when u have other things to eat(you will held accountable) for disobeying the command of God. -
I don't drink alcohol because I don't like the smell of it, and I don't see why I should. But I have not read any verse in the Quran which directly makes it haram, rather the Quran seems to warn us against alcohol consumption because it can be detrimental to us.
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Alcohol is a collectie evil, it does not matter that we do nothing wrong even though we drink it. If we drink we contribute to others drinking, to the normalisation of alcohol. So indeed we are responsible as members of society.
Again, it is not a question of the button haram or no button at all. Every one knows, every one, every adult, that alcohol is a hard drug that it causes enormous suffering and human and economic losses, so one is not responsible if one does nothing? And how do we know that we will always be like that.
Pig is not near as dangerous as alochol, and one of the reasons is precisely because people do not have to make a will effort not to eat pork but they do have to do it not to drink. Ask any Alcoholic anonymous about it. It is pitiless on the part of those who do not have trouble not drinking to deliberately indicate that it is ok and they will not be judged for it and ignore that for many people that is not so straightforward or easy. It would be of the greatest help to them that alcohol was not so common, so readily available, even so pushed down our throats, so popular and so "inocuous".
Inocuous if you do not get drunk... tell that to those who cannot quit it even though they would like very much to...
Again it is the hardest drug known, may be because of being the most attractive and pleasurable.
The Qur'an seems to waste words at times, because. if it misses the convenient "haram" button, is as it if had said nothing at all.
Pig does not destroy societies, alcohol does, whole societies. So we are comfortable with the work of shaytan, fantastic.
Salaam
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doing "shirk" also does not harm any society same like pig meat but it is a gross SIN.. isnt it?
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Greetings and Peace, all group
@OnlyOneGod Have you looked at this topic on previous threads?
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9602930
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606121
Based on my study and individual understanding, alcohol is not haram (follow your ~own~ understanding, not mine).
Is there really anything new to be said about this topic? According to the Bible (John 21-11), Jesus (Peace upon all Prophets) turned water to wine. Wine in paradise (4715), wine from grapes (1667), prohibition from praying while "befogged" (443), avoiding Satan (590), endogenous fermentation, natural occurrence of alcohol, water as an intoxicant...all this and more has already been discussed. It's enough to drive a person to drink!
732 Say "Who has made forbidden the nice things that God has brought forth for His servants and the good provisions?" Say "They are meant for those who believe during this worldly life, and they will be exclusive for them on the Day of Resurrection." It is such that We explain the revelations for those who know.
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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quran does not say
lie is haram
dishonesty is haram
cheating is haram
robbery is harambut quran say us to stay away from it .. for our own Good
same thing "ijtanabu" quran used it for alcohol and gambling
we should stay away from it too.. for our own goodalthough the verse indicate stay away from devil(shaitan)/evil
the word quran use in 2219 is is translated as sin not as "HARM"
in all other occassions this word is understood as "SIN"so we should avoid sin at any cost..
the catagory is although not like a "PIG" meat thats why people do it in general bothering not much about it same as they lie ,cheat and do other small sins without bothering much..
but in some cases alcohal related accidents cost the lives of people and society so its better if we stay away from this thing..
I agree that Alcohol related issues can be very devastating not only to the individual but also (in some instances) to the people around them. So why then is pig haram or eating dead meat and blood haram and yet alcohol that can potentially have society wide implications come in the category of "ijtanabu"? Obviously its Gods wisdom but then does it mean that we can consume alcohol as long as we don't go overboard? Because I find Haram to mean something that is a not allowed at all, while alcohol does not seem to fall within that category.
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The question put up in this thread is not whether alcohol is haram or not but the stand on alcohol concumption based on Qur'an.
If alcohol is the work of shaytan and corrupting but it is not haram, that is great. We can have a great time with shaytan's corrupting work any time we feel like it. It is not haram.
Who fears shaytan and his works if it is not haram? Why should we be held up from the corrupt worok of Shaytan if it is not haram. What can be wrong with it. We are so good so moderate why should we fear it and keep away from it as fromthe devil? Those whowant to spoil the fun cannot prohibit us what God does not prohibit. Is not that great. nd sometimes if you are moderte Shytan is so friendly...
Salaam
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The question put up in this thread is not whether alcohol is haram or not but the stand on alcohol concumption based on Qur'an.
If alcohol is the work of shaytan and corrupting but it is not haram, that is great. We can have a great time with shaytan's corrupting work any time we feel like it. It is not haram.
Who fears shaytan and his works if it is not haram? Why should we be held up from the corrupt worok of Shaytan if it is not haram. What can be wrong with it. We are so good so moderate why should we fear it and keep away from it as fromthe devil? Those whowant to spoil the fun cannot prohibit us what God does not prohibit. Is not that great. nd sometimes if you are moderte Shytan is so friendly...
Salaam
Actually the question is very clear on whether alcohol is "haram" based on the Quran. I think my first sentence in the OP clarifies that.
If you are going to deflect and talk about things that shaytan entices people towards then (just like the hadith lovers) you will declare a lot of things "haram" which God did not declare "haram".
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You are worng I do not cling to declaring haram anything at all, but you cling to something not being haram you make it problemless that is nto what the qur'an says. As to the categories haram nd halal as right or wrong equivalents and nothing asiade of that, that is hadithism in deed, and not Qur'an. Qur'an is far more intelligent and refined than that.
You seem to think that if it is not haram, called haram in Qur'an, you can go ahead and no problem, well it is not like that, you may do whatever you like but ypu will have to answer for what you do. Not labelling something haram does not turn people into irresponsible robots.
Salaam
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You are worng I do not cling to declaring haram anything at all, but you cling to something not being haram you make it problemless that is nto what the qur'an says. As to the categories haram nd halal as right or wrong equivalents and nothing asiade of that, that is hadithism in deed, and not Qur'an. Qur'an is far more intelligent and refined than that.
You seem to think that if it is not haram, called haram in Qur'an, you can go ahead and no problem, well it is not like that, you may do whatever you like but ypu will have to answer for what you do. Not labelling something haram does not turn people into irresponsible robots.
Salaam
I do not say that non-Haram things are acceptable. This is your own interpretation on my wordings. What I simply ask is whether alcohol is "haram" as per the Quran. If you bother to view my previous postings in this thread I clearly mention the devastating effect alcohol can have on the person and their family.
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So it is not declared haram, so what. What do you get out of that? Yu can go ahead and drink and no qualms?
The question is not whether it is haram or halal but whether youa re well advised to do it or not.God does nto say that if you do not do anything haram you are a good person or that you are muslim.
On the other hand it is not me who puts shaytan on the scene but the Qur'an. You may want to make light of it or ridicule it, but it is there, and it does nto say that shaytan "entices", as you put it, but says that spirits (amongst other things) are "rijsun min 3amal ash-shaytan", are a corruption work of shaytan, so really the fact that it is not called haram, really what does tell you, that you may go and drink? It is like saying to somebody "yes your are freeto go inside that building that is crumbling under the fire". It is not forbidden to go into it, but why would you want to do such a thing? For the kicks?
If it is to guarantee a right that you are harping on the not haram, do nto worry we do all of us have that right, but that makes the question more difficult and not easier and if God did not call it haram it is because He knows it is more difficult than that. Not any prohibition but only the very strong conviction can keep anybody from drinking and encouraging thereby others to drink.
Salaam
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So it is not declared haram, so what. What do you get out of that? Yu can go ahead and drink and no qualms?
The question is not whether it is haram or halal but whether youa re well advised to do it or not.God does nto say that if you do not do anything haram you are a good person or that you are muslim.
On the other hand it is not me who puts shaytan on the scene but the Qur'an. You may want to make light of it or ridicule it, but it is there, and it does nto say that shaytan "entices", as you put it, but says that spirits (amongst other things) are "rijsun min 3amal ash-shaytan", are a corruption work of shaytan, so really the fact that it is not called haram, really what does tell you, that you may go and drink? It is like saying to somebody "yes your are freeto go inside that building that is crumbling under the fire". It is not forbidden to go into it, but why would you want to do such a thing? For the kicks?
If it is to guarantee a right that you are harping on the not haram, do nto worry we do all of us have that right, but that makes the question more difficult and not easier and if God did not call it haram it is because He knows it is more difficult than that. Not any prohibition but only the very strong conviction can keep anybody from drinking and encouraging thereby others to drink.
Salaam
Ok then why did God create a "Haram" category of things? Why did God say not to put things into this category unless God himself did not do so? Is that not stated in the Quran?
What is the value of this so called "haram" category if you feel that you can insert other things to fall within it which God did not within the Quran? What is the difference between the Quranic Haram and the things you want to insert into it?
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Peace, it?s straight forward advice especially detrimental if done together/combination like gambling and drunk.
2219 asked they you about l-khamri/the inebriant and the wager say in them dual ith'mun/detriment great and gains (i.e. medicinal when taken in moderation e.g. glass of wine perhaps, analytics study, etc. hence still useful) to the humankind ith'muhum/and detriment them dual greater from benefit them dual...
590 O you the ones believes ye of only the inebriant and the wager and the monuments/altars for sacrifice and the arrows filthiness from work the devil so avoid ye him that may you succeeding 591 only intends the devil that cause between you the hostility and the hatred in the inebriant and the wager and hinder you about remembrance the god and from the connection so can be you ceasing?
443 O you the ones believes ye of not approach ye of the connection and are you sukr/intoxicated until thou know ye of what thou saying?
1667 and from fruits the date palms and the grapes thou taking from it sakaran/intoxicant of and provision of good of indeed in such surely sign for folk reasoning
It?s also important to note that years ago water especially not running or in containers could have harmful microorganisms and make people sick same as today when visiting some third world countries e.g. Mexico hence people drank beer/wine especially when on long voyages.
This reminds me of the book "The Turkish Letters of Ogier Ghiselin de Busbecq" him traveling to Istanbul at time of Suleiman the Magnificent via Balkans when he encounters Janissaries (one of my great grandfathers was their imam/spiritual leader lol) which their function when not at war was to "police and protect? Christians under Ottoman rule. He says they were respectful, often silent, and one would think they were monks without knowing them. They also liked wine and when offered drank all they could since they considered it a sin to have even a small sip so either way the punishment was equal.
https//books.google.com/books/about/The_Turkish_Letters_of_Ogier_Ghiselin_de.html?id=AnynLQ_cgjYC
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I agree that Alcohol related issues can be very devastating not only to the individual but also (in some instances) to the people around them. So why then is pig haram or eating dead meat and blood haram and yet alcohol that can potentially have society wide implications come in the category of "ijtanabu"? Obviously its Gods wisdom but then does it mean that we can consume alcohol as long as we don't go overboard? Because I find Haram to mean something that is a not allowed at all, while alcohol does not seem to fall within that category.
actually there is a difference in between PIG and alcohol
PIG is filth
alcohol is danger(highly inflammeable)i usually prefer not to talk about this issue as i witness one of my frd family effected by this thing its kinda senstive topic for me.. i will not advise anybody to go near it..
but the fact and the wording of God is far above emotions
so lets summarise it for last time..
"ijtanab" from devil
"ithm" are in themlet say forget about alcohol , if you consider a Gun there are both good and harm in it too
apply everything in general you can have benefits and harms both.. so God did not prohibited it as we know alcohol as a chemical is something important to b used for killing bacteria and infections , medical use.. mouthwash use.. perfume useso according to Quran yeh its not in the list of "haram" but while addressing alcohol God already told us the dangerous properties of this substance.. and these dangerous properties are exist in evething literal
like this laptop and internet.. either read a quran thorough it, give a charity through it.. but you can also watch porn and disturb/abuse people by same medium. do cyber crime and fraud by same medium
so i dnt think so its hard to understand what author want us to tell..
nobody have a right to declare something "haram" which is not haram by God..
the problemtic thing for making it haram is the verse in which you are advice to stay away from sala if you are intoxicated by default what does it mean.. are we allowed to take it on other hours?
and the event of jospeh and the example of wine rivers, there is not any pig rivers/roast in heavens why?
thats my last post on this thread becoz trully i dnt not want anybody to consume alcohol but it will not change the fact when we collect all the verses of alcohol its totally different than pig..
God bless you
