salat = meeting to administrate the islamic state
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(by sohail Qureshi)
Salam to allwhile discussing salath subject brother Mubashir asked
what about call to prayer,day of assembly,spread out after and seeks Allah's bounties,wash your hands,shorten your salath,those who lost their salath,masajids,those who bow.I will just add one more question here,timing of salath.I will answer them in the light of Quran. One should remember humanity is the lesson of Quran.It in the form of DEEN ask us to achieve a goal of just society having no sorrow and internal sadness.
Quran says it explain itself by itself. We have to take this statement very seriously. We have discussed earlier the word salath in its root form means to follow very closely(example of two horses in horse race in which front feet of second horse falling exactly on the foot prints of hind legs of first horse).Like this example a muslim should keep in front of him God's given commitments/responsibilities mentioned in Quran.
Commitments of a muslim as a son/daughter, as a brother/sister, as father/mother, as a husband/wife and as a member of society to implements them in the society is his salath. Complete submission to this guidance is called sajda and efforts to fulfil these commitments is called tasbih..
We have to keep in our mind this definition as answers of the above question will be easy to grasp.I will keep the word salath instead of pray as it is given in the Quran.
Call to Salath , day of assembly, spread out and seeks Allah's bounties
In an Islamic state, affairs of daily life and long planning in each and every department like social, economical and political are to be solved by meetings and consensus. These meetings and consensus can be at local level or at head office level." O,who agree with the God's guidance, rush for fulfilling your commitments on invitation of God, do consensus and keep open means of production for the welfare of the society/humanity ".(42/38 ) . Here invitation of God means call of the head of the state or heads of each departments as these are the representatives of the God because the formation of this state is based on the guidance of Quran. The objective of this consensus is benefit of the humanity.In other verse (62/9-10) " O,who agree with God's guidance, when you are called for an assembly, you should leave all your jobs and rush to it as it is for your benefit.(one may miss part of discussion if he will reach late).After assembly spread out on the lands for your practical job and keep guidance of God (ZIKR) more intensely in front in your dealings. (one should not think that after attending assembly he can do what ever he wants according to his own wishes in his outside job).
People should take these commitments very seriously and should do it at their prescribed time and on the other hand while attending the meetings they should reach at prescribed time.( Inalsalatha kanath alal momenena kitabun moquta 4/103)
Washing hands and other parts of body
Brother mubashir Quran teaches us the basic values of humanity like speak gently (31/19 ) , don't show arrogance(31/18 ) , walk nicely(31/18 ),don't make joke of others(49/11),control your emotions(15/42 , 7/102) etc. Cleanliness is also a basic value, God says in 4/43 and 5/6 to the people they should be clean all the time but particularly at times when they are going to attend the meetings for fulfilling their obligations or starting the day to fulfil their obligations. The method of cleaning is mentioned and in shortage of water or where water is not available then cleaning of the dust over the body is advised. The purpose is that the person should look decent, serious and fresh towards his obligations.Those who lost their salath (19/59)
This is a clear cut verse, the main reason because of which people don't fulfil their responsibilities given by the God is, they give priorities to their self interests and neglect the welfare of the humanity.Masajids
Masjid is the place where muslims meet to do consensus. In a system masajids are like parliamentarian houses where rules and laws are made, discussion, meetings and consensus are done in the light of guidance of Quran.In 72/18 Quran says" Masajids are for the God,don't include name of any one else in His authority ". Masjid for God means we should make laws and by laws in the light of God's guidance in these places and implement them for the welfare of society. In this way Government of God will reflects its promised results in the society. Any place prior to the formation of state or after the formation of state where this job will be done will be called masjid in real sense.
Those who bows
It is also understandable, as one should bow in front of guidance of God, accept it whole heartily and apply it in his character and society.Shorten Salath
In situation where difficulties are more and direct confrontation with the evil forces is not the objective then the pace of commitments is slow down to achieve this strategy. This is usually done when the number of people who want to implement this guidance are less and power to fight back is not significant. These people can emigrate from this place and slowly and gradually can acquire the strength.Timing of Salath
Aquemosalatha ledalook al shams ala gaskulal wa quranalfajar (17/78 ).
In this Dalook is timing between sunrise and sunset. Fajar is time before sunrise and gasqullal is time after sunset. It means salath is for 24 hours so person has to keep God's guidance for 24 hours in front of him.Tarafannar wa zulfanminallal (11/114) Tarafannar means time between both corners/sides/ends of the day and zulfanmiallal is initial or beginning part of the night. It means all time is for keeping the guidance in front except sleeping time. In 24/58 salath fajor is the starting time of the day where one can take guidance from Quran for the work to be done by him that day and Isha is the time where he can review what has been done, whats remaining and what to be done next day. At administrative levels meetings at morning time will be salath fajor and at the end of day review of the work done and to be done next day or next meeting is salath isha.In this way society will progress day by day and can achieve the goal of " Wala Kufun alaehim wala hum yazanoon ",no sorrow no internal sadness.
Regards.
http//64.227.163.32/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?read=30027
http//64.227.163.32/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl?read=30051 -
Peace be upon you,
Where is this "islamic state"?
Salaat is not talking about any Government except the Governing of the faculties within you, which is done by the process of meditation whereby you program your SPirit/Mind(nafs) and purify it of the incorrect programming one recieves from this earthborn guessing of the rejectors of the God's system.
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Greetings,
(by sohail Qureshi)
Timing of Salath
Aquemosalatha ledalook al shams ala gaskulal wa quranalfajar (17/78 ).
In this Dalook is timing between sunrise and sunset. Fajar is time before sunrise and gasqullal is time after sunset. It means salath is for 24 hours so person has to keep God's guidance for 24 hours in front of him.If the timing is between sunrise and sunset for "Aquemosalatha", then how can it be extended to mean 24 hours? How can one keep God's guidance while one is asleep? While asleep, one is not even aware of it. At least I have NEVER been aware that I'm sleeping while asleep.
Tarafannar wa zulfanminallal (11/114) Tarafannar means time between both corners/sides/ends of the day and zulfanmiallal is initial or beginning part of the night. It means all time is for keeping the guidance in front except sleeping time.
So this is conflicting with the previous explanation namely keeping God's guidance for 24 hours in front of him.
Anwar Azim
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Peace to all,
Any people who would not agree with the above article can answer directly to his author here
http//groups.yahoo.com/group/WideMinds/message/42203
http//groups.yahoo.com/group/WideMinds/message/42273Idolfree, how do you think the state where you live should be administered ?
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Peace be upon you JM,
Idolfree, how do you think the state where you live should be administered ?
In a righteous manner. The basic statement of do unto others as you would have themn do unto you is sufficient enough. I do not agree that there should be some place with the TITLE "ISLAMIC" state. I do not take that word in the sense of a title but of ACTION. So it would have to be a "state" where everyone freely accepted righteousness, and that is not what my neighborhood is doing.
So for "salaat" to be bear a lesson for guidance....for "salaat" to be the HELP that the God promises it to be, do I have to wait for everyone in my neighborhood to turn to righteousness? Or can I go to my private room like Zachariah and maintain the process of meditation at dawn and dusk, and with PATIENCE, change my behavior so that I can remain in a peaceful state(garden) as much as possible. I am talking about a peace that nothing can disturb. Like a mummy, nothing can effect me from outside, I take my direction from the God within.
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The term used in previous posts, "islamic state" is my focus. I have seen this phrase used many times in many places, but I am unaware if it is mentioned in the quran.
By definition, would any sort of state be a place that is govened by a ruling class that inforces the rules upon its inhabitants? Such an existence defies the "no compulsion" guideline of the quran.Explaining my understanding may mean this post will belong under another topic, but i felt this much at least applied.
May God guide us to the truth.
Peace,
Brian -
For interested people, here are some more informations on SQ's understanding of salat, masjid, sujud.
Do not hesitate to read the debates in the linked pages.
Sister if we presume the masjid is a place of physical worship then we have to find the masjid of all the objects of universes.
In fact masjid is the appropriate place to solve the affairs of the society as Prophet and his companion did. Instead keeping the name parliamentary house, governor house etc masjid is better name but as later(after Prophet and companions time) all decisions of politicosocio-economic system carried to the palaces so the gap in masjid was filled with physical worship only and the results that human eyes saw at that time due to complete submission to God's guidance are not seen now in the muslim society.
Masjids were the places to liberate the humanity from injustice, slavery, feudalism, tribilism and other evil forces and the two times( Fajor and Isha) were fixed and the momneen were obliged to attend that meetings or consensus at fixed times("Inulsalatha kanath alalmomeneena kitabun muquta" 4/103). In our time if it happened then the places where the people will getjustice in the guidance of God will be called masjids or any other name but in fact these will be masjids.
Regarding sajda during battle field see the following understanding keeping in our mind the message of Quran was for the past, is for the present and will be for the future.
Salath in battle field is a meeting of supreme commander (controlling authority) with his subordinates for discussing the strategy of war according to its changing circumstances. As message of Quran is for eternity so the place of prophet will be taken by his representative in our time who is the leader of the Islamic state or head of the army forces .
http//groups.yahoo.com/group/WideMinds/message/41746
http//groups.yahoo.com/group/WideMinds/message/41616salath qasar or short salath or salath in fear are the commitments which are to be fulfil when muslims are in the phase of emigration and evil forces are opposing these obligations and establishment of just society.
Meetings, discussions,strategy to achieve this goal can be minimise according to the situation as it is mentioned in the story of Prophet Moses who was advised by the God to make their home as their qibla while struggling the freedom of his nation from Pharaoh. Their qibla(goal) was freedom from slavery. This mission they start from their home where Moses and his companions use to do consensus and meetings to achieve this goal.Considering the context the understanding of verse 101 of chapter 4 mentioned in Quran will be
"When you(musleen) are in a phase of emigration or travelling through the earth to fulfil your commitments and you have fear that your enemy may harm you then to achieve your goal you may plan your strategy(discussion,meetings,consensus)according to the need of time(consciously and not very openly),as who reject God's guidance are your open enemies".Salath in battle field or war is a meeting of supreme commander(controlling authority) with his subordinates for discussing the strategy of war according to its changing circumstances. As message of Quran is for eternity so the place of prophet will be represented in our time by the leader of the Islamic state or head of the army forces .
Considering the context the understanding of 102 of chapter 4 mentioned in Quran will be
"When you are with them during battle, let one group come to you for discussing the strategy and let others to be attentive to face the enemy, when discussion is over and final message after consensus passed to them then let the other group come(replacing the previous one) to you to get the message but they should also be attentive as those who reject God's guidance may take the opportunity of your negligence. And there is no blame on you if you lay aside your weapons if you are hampered by rain,sickness or injury. But in spite of that take your precautions and don't loose the concentration. Once you will adopt this strategy, you will be victorious."http//groups.yahoo.com/group/WideMinds/message/41807
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Peace, all.
Since the beginning of my journey, the topic of salat has remained a mystery, and in the context of the freeminds websites, it seems to be no exception. This is not to criticize, mind you...i just cannot fathom how such a significant word cannot be nailed down. At times, it is the very definition of this word that seems to draw lines between so many of us...sunni, shiite, submitters, quran only-ers, whoever. such a topic of debate.
I have read
assembly, linking, learning link, reaching out, follow closely,commitment, strategy, prayer, contact prayer, ritual prayer...and many of these are followed by multiple understandings of what these english definitions imply.This has remained a mystery for me for several years now. My heart tells me that "reaching out", as in taking time away from everything to talk to GOD & read the quran & meditate & discuss with others...is close, especially because when i don't get up in the morning to do it, or when i'm lying in bed and begin a "bedtime prayer" from the pillow, i feel I've not done as i should...but again this could be dogma of some sort...convincing myself i'm doing something wrong.
I believe the clues, in addition to finding what the word meant BEFORE the quran was revealed, are contained in the context of such verses as...the birds know their salat...the dawn salat is ever witnessed (by whom?)...guard your salat, especially the balanced/middle/best/wusta salat... and probably some others.
Would love to get more feedback...PLEASE!!!
Patiently searching, waiting & praying...
Peace,
brian -
Hello Brian,
I believe the clues, in addition to finding what the word meant BEFORE the quran was revealed, are contained in the context of such verses as...the birds know their salat...the dawn salat is ever witnessed (by whom?)...guard your salat, especially the balanced/middle/best/wusta salat... and probably some others.
Would love to get more feedback...PLEASE!!!
Patiently searching, waiting & praying...When I first came across thoroughly understanding the word "salat" and have since firmly believed in it, was the meaning given to it by Aidid Safar as commitment/obligation/duties/routines. No other meaning as far as I am concerned comes close. This has been well and self explained within the context of ALL verses containing its proper usage. You can study it (besides other relevant topics) by downloading the pdf file at www.aididsafar.com.
Remember every individual living creature, be they animals, birds, insects, fish or humans, have their very own ways by which they live and govern their lives, hence their commitments/obligations/duties (salat) to fulfill their given paths. The verse in reference to birds is one such example.
Hope this helps.
God bless.
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Peace be upon you,
Salaat is singular, therefore it cannot be a plural word such as commitments.
I hope to have an article completed in a few weeks to explain my understanding of al-salaat (the process) as being the process of meditation. It is the process of changing whats in our spirit/mind(nafs), because until we change what is within, the God will not change our conditions. This message, as with all religions, are behavior shaping systems. The process is to CHANGE so you can reap PEACE.
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Peace be upon you JM,
Idolfree, how do you think the state where you live should be administered ?
In a righteous manner. The basic statement of do unto others as you would have themn do unto you is sufficient enough. I do not agree that there should be some place with the TITLE "ISLAMIC" state. I do not take that word in the sense of a title but of ACTION. So it would have to be a "state" where everyone freely accepted righteousness, and that is not what my neighborhood is doing.
Is there, in your words, a difference between righteousness and Islam ?
What do you think of
an islamic state = a state where everyone has freely accepted Islam, and which tries to implement the Quran.How should we deal with the people who have not accepted Islam ?
So for "salaat" to be bear a lesson for guidance....for "salaat" to be the HELP that the God promises it to be, do I have to wait for everyone in my neighborhood to turn to righteousness? Or can I go to my private room like Zachariah and maintain the process of meditation at dawn and dusk, and with PATIENCE, change my behavior so that I can remain in a peaceful state(garden) as much as possible. I am talking about a peace that nothing can disturb. Like a mummy, nothing can effect me from outside, I take my direction from the God within.
How do you understand ? Is it not about salat in assembly ?
And what is a masjid, and what is it for ?
Peace
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Peace be upon you JM,
Is there, in your words, a difference between righteousness and Islam ?
Righteousness is doing good things, submission is to surrender.
What do you think of
an islamic state = a state where everyone has freely accepted Islam, and which tries to implement the Quran.I dont know of such a place, but it is my desire to see and be part of a community that lives by the God's universal Laws, as oppossed to a physical book. No need to accept any "religion" or "book" except THE BOOK(Universal Law).
How should we deal with the people who have not accepted Islam ?
Continue to invite them with wise debate.
How do you understand ? Is it not about salat in assembly ?
It is saying that no matter what you are doing, when it comes time for the process(salaat) of meditation, stop whatever you are doing, even if you are assembled with others (job, home, with friends, etc). Its a lot more difficult to pull yourself away from a group , then to stop something you were doing by yourself to maintain "salaat".
And what is a masjid, and what is it for ?
Masjid is "place of hearing and obeying". It is a metaphysical place within where all is ONE. This is our focus. The God says the rejectors cannot enter the "masjid", how does one keep others out of a "physical masjid"? It is a metaphysical place, and the laws of the spirit/mind prevent the rejectors from getting to that level(maqam).
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Peace Kyle,
Salaat is singular, therefore it cannot be a plural word such as commitments.
Well then, Kyle, take the 's' out of commitments and there you have it. Meditation at dusk and/or dawn just doesn't click as an orderly way of living a life and neither does it apply to several verses. One can meditate at anytime, anywhere, like I do most of the time.
I hope to have an article completed in a few weeks to explain my understanding of al-salaat (the process) as being the process of meditation.
Although I've stood firm on salaat's meaning as mentioned earlier, I shall nevertheless be looking forward to your article. Please do note that your basis is justified by ALL verses containing the word "Salat" as per their context/usage in the Quran and applied naturally.
Take care and God bless.
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Peace be upon you Danish,
Well then, Kyle, take the 's' out of commitments and there you have it.
What is the commitment we must maintain?
Meditation at dusk and/or dawn just doesn't click as an orderly way of living a life and neither does it apply to several verses.
WHich ones?
One can meditate at anytime, anywhere, like I do most of the time.
Certainly you can, but there are times when your spirit(nafs) is most receptive. Just like a man can give his seed at any time, but there are certain times when the woman is receptive to the seed and can become impregnated.
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Peace Kyle,
Well then, Kyle, take the 's' out of commitments and there you have it.
What is the commitment we must maintain?
EVERYTHING that you do on a daily basis throughtout your lifetime as per the commands, guidelines and fundamental principles of living a righteous life outlined by contextual understanding of the veses that contain the word "salat". Hope you got my drift.
Meditation at dusk and/or dawn just doesn't click as an orderly way of living a life and neither does it apply to several verses.
WHich ones?
I shall get to that, God Willing, when you present your analysis/article coherrent/relevant to such verses. For a starter, lets take the very first verse 23 that contain the word salat. From 21 to 24, these verses simply talk about believing in the unseen, believing in the guidance contained, upholding your obligations (commitments) and providing for the needy. The commitments/obligations/duties that this verse talks about are laiden throughout the Quran which are provided as guidance/beacon to live a righteous life. Nothing to do with meditating at dusk and dawn.
One can meditate at anytime, anywhere, like I do most of the time.
Certainly you can, but there are times when your spirit(nafs) is most receptive. Just like a man can give his seed at any time, but there are certain times when the woman is receptive to the seed and can become impregnated.
True, but such receptiveness are not specifically applicable to the times at dusk and/or dawn only. And certainly nothing to do with meditation.
I'll check back on this thread tomorrow, insha-Allah. Gotta go. )
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Peace be upon you Danish,
idolfree1 wrote
What is the commitment we must maintain?EVERYTHING that you do on a daily basis throughtout your lifetime as per the commands, guidelines and fundamental principles of living a righteous life outlined by contextual understanding of the veses that contain the word "salat". Hope you got my drift.
"EVERYTHING" would be plural, not singular.
Danish
Meditation at dusk and/or dawn just doesn't click as an orderly way of living a life and neither does it apply to several verses.Idolfree1
WHich ones?I shall get to that, God Willing, when you present your analysis/article coherrent/relevant to such verses. For a starter, lets take the very first verse 23 that contain the word salat. From 21 to 24, these verses simply talk about believing in the unseen, believing in the guidance contained, upholding your obligations (commitments) and providing for the needy. The commitments/obligations/duties that this verse talks about are laiden throughout the Quran which are provided as guidance/beacon to live a righteous life. Nothing to do with meditating at dusk and dawn.
You are taking that verse out of context of the whole. If "salaat" it that verse dealt with "commitments", rather lets change that to the singular "commitment", then why is the next statement "providing for the needy"? Isn't that redundant? Or is providing for the needy the one singular commitment that you are refering to?
Instead, meditation is the way to get in touch with the UNSEEN that we are to trust in, so we can get the help from the God, with patience, to help reprogram our behavior. Just like TV and Radio programs us all day, we must purify ourselves from this worldy programming and maintain our process(salaat) of meditation to cleanse ourselves.
Danish
One can meditate at anytime, anywhere, like I do most of the time.Idolfree1
Certainly you can, but there are times when your spirit(nafs) is most receptive. Just like a man can give his seed at any time, but there are certain times when the woman is receptive to the seed and can become impregnated.True, but such receptiveness are not specifically applicable to the times at dusk and/or dawn only. And certainly nothing to do with meditation.
It is scientifically(objectively) proven that the times before going to bed and after waking up are the best times of receptivity, because you are at that in-between(medi) state. Now if we keep in mind that he nightime if for sleep, the day is for other duties, and the timing for salaat is dawn and dusk, what does this suggest to you?
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Peace be upon you Danish,
Receptivity
Scientist have discovered that the brain is more receptive at certain times of the day. The least receptive time for the human is the waking state which is called the Beta wave state. The brain wave in this state is 13 to 28 Hz. This wave state is not go for receptivity because it is this wakened state that is favors the Will (Consciusness). The Will is not your vehicle of receptivity, it is the Spirit/nafs (Subconscius) that is your receptor. The ideal states of receptivity occur just above and just below the Beta wave state. Lets first talk about the state above the Beta Wave state. That is the Gamma wave state at 29 to 35 Hz. The brain enters this state in response to strong a strong emotion (anger, fear, ?love?, etc). This is the state that movie and television producers aim at when trying to program you. But this is not the state we want to plant our seeds by because we want to avoid emotional programming, we want to transcend emotions and be the commanders of emotions, not followers of emotions. So lets talk about the brain state that is just below the waking state of Beta, that is the Alpha state 8 to 12 Hz. The brain enters this level in response to daydreaming or at the brief moment of passing from waking to sleep. This is the perfect time for what is called meditation, which means to reflect on or contemplate in the mind. The word Meditation comes from the root ?Medi? which means middle. We are balanced(wusta) between the wake state and dream state, or in other words, we are balance between the Consciousness(Will) and the subconscious(Soul).
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idolfree1 wrote
What is the commitment we must maintain?EVERYTHING that you do on a daily basis throughtout your lifetime as per the commands, guidelines and fundamental principles of living a righteous life outlined by contextual understanding of the veses that contain the word "salat". Hope you got my drift.
"EVERYTHING" would be plural, not singular.
EVERYTHING as a "Whole" is singlar, not plural. Hence, whatever you do as a WHOLE falls under the category of "salaat".
Danish
Meditation at dusk and/or dawn just doesn't click as an orderly way of living a life and neither does it apply to several verses.Idolfree1
WHich ones?I shall get to that, God Willing, when you present your analysis/article coherrent/relevant to such verses. For a starter, lets take the very first verse 23 that contain the word salat. From 21 to 24, these verses simply talk about believing in the unseen, believing in the guidance contained, upholding your obligations (commitments) and providing for the needy. The commitments/obligations/duties that this verse talks about are laiden throughout the Quran which are provided as guidance/beacon to live a righteous life. Nothing to do with meditating at dusk and dawn.
You are taking that verse out of context of the whole. If "salaat" it that verse dealt with "commitments", rather lets change that to the singular "commitment", then why is the next statement "providing for the needy"? Isn't that redundant? Or is providing for the needy the one singular commitment that you are refering to?
"providing for the needy" is generalized to mean EVERYONE as a WHOLE whoever is in need and not just one person, hence your obligation/commitment to provide for the needy, such as financial aide, clothing, shelter, a helping hand, etc. and not via meditaion. That's sounds like a bizzare approach when trying to meditate in order to help someone at dawn and dusk only, don't you think? Besides, the first verse I provided has nothing to do with such traumatic approaches. It is NOT natural.
Instead, meditation is the way to get in touch with the UNSEEN that we are to trust in, so we can get the help from the God, with patience, to help reprogram our behavior. Just like TV and Radio programs us all day, we must purify ourselves from this worldy programming and maintain our process(salaat) of meditation to cleanse ourselves.
Getting in touch with the UNSEEN via meditation is NOT required of any specific times. Besides, meditation can be done for just about anything. Anyone can pray to GOD and ask for HIS guidance, help and mercy at anytime, anyday, anywhere. GOD Almighty is Omnipresent and Omniscient. Programming our behavior is through proper channelling and practising our commitments/obligations/duties (salaat) as it surrounds us is every moment/aspects of our lives per the commands of the Quran and adhering to it. The "process" of meditation is simply an instruction/illustration.
Wordly programming is not done at dawn and dusk only and one can mediatate anytime to "cleanse themsleves". Meditation itself is not specific to certain mandatory times, such as dawn and dusk. Kyle, you seem to be stuck with just one verse that talks about timings and forcing your views/issues on all verses of the Quran that has no basis. That's what I call redundant and biased.
Danish
One can meditate at anytime, anywhere, like I do most of the time.Idolfree1
Certainly you can, but there are times when your spirit(nafs) is most receptive. Just like a man can give his seed at any time, but there are certain times when the woman is receptive to the seed and can become impregnated.True, but such receptiveness are not specifically applicable to the times at dusk and/or dawn only. And certainly nothing to do with meditation.
It is scientifically(objectively) proven that the times before going to bed and after waking up are the best times of receptivity, because you are at that in-between(medi) state. Now if we keep in mind that he nightime if for sleep, the day is for other duties, and the timing for salaat is dawn and dusk, what does this suggest to you?
Meditation is more receptive during relaxed mood at any given time. Dawn and dusk are NOT specific to bed or waking-up times. Millions work during graveyard and other odd shifts, hence their relaxed/receptive levels varies, and not to mention individual lifestyles. Perhaps only a small percentage out of 6+ billion people know how to meditate, but all 6+ billion people know their commitments/obligations/duties (salaat) as a WHOLE on a day to day basis. The Quran emphasis on such commitments/obligations/duties to take heed and to become righteous individuals. Even those who know how to mediate are not restricted to dawn and dusk, like myself and several others whom I know. You are using science to elaborate what meditation is all about as per their theories and/or facts, not Quran to prove what salaat is all about as per contexts, naturally occurring.
Take heed and GOD bless.
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Peace be upon you Danish,
idolfree1 wrote
What is the commitment we must maintain?EVERYTHING that you do on a daily basis throughtout your lifetime as per the commands, guidelines and fundamental principles of living a righteous life outlined by contextual understanding of the veses that contain the word "salat". Hope you got my drift.
"EVERYTHING" would be plural, not singular.
EVERYTHING as a "Whole" is singlar, not plural. Hence, whatever you do as a WHOLE falls under the category of "salaat".
That explanation does not fit the verses, for example, we are to get two witnesses for a will after they "salaat", how does your idea of "everything" and "whole" fit that verse? Also, the verses for times of privacy which indicate befroe dawn salaat and after dusk salaat, how does that fit?
Idolfree1
You are taking that verse out of context of the whole. If "salaat" it that verse dealt with "commitments", rather lets change that to the singular "commitment", then why is the next statement "providing for the needy"? Isn't that redundant? Or is providing for the needy the one singular commitment that you are refering to?"providing for the needy" is generalized to mean EVERYONE as a WHOLE whoever is in need and not just one person, hence your obligation/commitment to provide for the needy, such as financial aide, clothing, shelter, a helping hand, etc. and not via meditaion. That's sounds like a bizzare approach when trying to meditate in order to help someone at dawn and dusk only, don't you think? Besides, the first verse I provided has nothing to do with such traumatic approaches. It is NOT natural.
The only way you can help, that is , CHANGE A CONDITION, is to change what is WITHIN YOU first. Yu cant help another until you first help yourself. The God says He doesnt change the condition of a people until they change what is in thier SPIRIT/Mind(nafs), and we do that by meditation.
The "commitments", rather, "commitment" you are trying to debate deals with outward externals, but that must be preceeded by change WITHIN. The Externals are part of the purification(zakaat) portion, thats where you will find your "commitments".
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Instead, meditation is the way to get in touch with the UNSEEN that we are to trust in, so we can get the help from the God, with patience, to help reprogram our behavior. Just like TV and Radio programs us all day, we must purify ourselves from this worldy programming and maintain our process(salaat) of meditation to cleanse ourselves.Getting in touch with the UNSEEN via meditation is NOT required of any specific times.
Dawn and dusk are the times mentioned clearly for salaat.
Besides, meditation can be done for just about anything. Anyone can pray to GOD and ask for HIS guidance, help and mercy at anytime, anyday, anywhere.
Why are you comparing meditation to prayer? I agree BOTH can be done at anytime, but this does not mean that it is the BEST TIME to be doing those PROCESSES. Just like one can eat food at anytime, but its best to eat your biggest meal between 1-3pm, not late at night before going to bed. It has to do with the proper timing, this is a timed book(universe), thats why we have timing devices in the skies.
GOD Almighty is Omnipresent and Omniscient. Programming our behavior is through proper channelling and practising our commitments/obligations/duties (salaat) as it surrounds us is every moment/aspects of our lives per the commands of the Quran and adhering to it. The "process" of meditation is simply an instruction/illustration.
You see how you made "commitments" as PLURAL again? Thats because it does not fit as singular and subconsciously, you cant help but keep using the plural.
Wordly programming is not done at dawn and dusk only and one can mediatate anytime to "cleanse themsleves".
What do you mean by worldy programming?
You are saying what is NOT DONE, rather than talking about what SHOULD BE done.
Again, YES, we can do ANYTHING at ANYTIME, but we have to find out when are the BEST TIMES to do these things, and the God answers clearly as to the best times to maintain the process(salaat).
Meditation itself is not specific to certain mandatory times, such as dawn and dusk. Kyle, you seem to be stuck with just one verse that talks about timings and forcing your views/issues on all verses of the Quran that has no basis. That's what I call redundant and biased.
Stuck on one verse? Is that how you defend your position? By not addressing the timing issue and talking past it, but only saying I am stuck? D Why not confront it?
Idolfree1
Certainly you can, but there are times when your spirit(nafs) is most receptive. Just like a man can give his seed at any time, but there are certain times when the woman is receptive to the seed and can become impregnated.True, but such receptiveness are not specifically applicable to the times at dusk and/or dawn only. And certainly nothing to do with meditation.
You have only made a statement and have offered no proof. I have given OBJECTIVE SCIENTIFIC PROOF regarding brain wave states, you have given a subjective response with no evidence.
Idolfree1
It is scientifically(objectively) proven that the times before going to bed and after waking up are the best times of receptivity, because you are at that in-between(medi) state. Now if we keep in mind that he nightime if for sleep, the day is for other duties, and the timing for salaat is dawn and dusk, what does this suggest to you?Meditation is more receptive during relaxed mood at any given time. Dawn and dusk are NOT specific to bed or waking-up times. Millions work during graveyard and other odd shifts, hence their relaxed/receptive levels varies, and not to mention individual lifestyles
.Yes, some people work OUT OF THIER NORMAL LIFE CYCLES because there is no compulsion in the system. But certainly you agree that the God has described the night as a time for sleeping, and the day for other duties, do you agree? So if we are dealing with the God's message, then you cannot enter into the argument the lifestyle of some human beings as evidence that dawn and dusk are not the proper times.
Perhaps only a small percentage out of 6+ billion people know how to meditate
Then came a generation who LOST thier salaat and followed thier desires. Remember?
Also, while a LARGE percentage of the 6+ Billion people may not be ATTENTIVE of thier meditation, they still meditate unknowingly when they daydream, and when they get punped up by high emotions, etc.
Therefore , when we read the verses that say "WOE/REGRET to thosse who "salaat" but are unattantive to thier salaat.
, but all 6+ billion people know their commitments/obligations/duties (salaat) as a WHOLE on a day to day basis.
Again, you have used the PLURAL form, you see that?
And I CERTAINBLY doubt that the majority know what they should be doing, in fact the od says REPEATEDLY "most of them do not KNOW"
So how can you come and say they DO know? D Please consider what I am saying.
The Quran emphasis on such commitments/obligations/duties to take heed and to become righteous individuals. Even those who know how to mediate are not restricted to dawn and dusk, like myself and several others whom I know. You are using science to elaborate what meditation is all about as per their theories and/or facts, not Quran to prove what salaat is all about as per contexts, naturally occurring.
Again you used the plural. You keep using the same argument that it can be done at anytime, I agree, but when is it most beneficial? If you were trying to lose weight, you can eat at anytime, but isnt there a time you can eat that would be most beneficial to weight loss?
If you were trying to impregnate your wife, shouuldn't you ask her if the TIMING IS RIGHT? Or do you just release seed haphazardly?
Please think about the TIMING and do not downplay TIMING.