Is Quran anti- secular?
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Hi All,
Sadly, people have began to use the banner of 'quran alone' to legitimise thier opinion. While it's true that al-quraan has quantitatively less rules than sunnism, its rebellion against these liberal notions is pretty clear. Therefore the 'quran alone' preached by some is nothing more than secularism in disguise. Interesting malaise, I never saw this in the early days but these days, its common. The good thing is, we can always refer to the book itself. That never fails and people who project false opinions will be exposed. The lack of verse-quoting in this thread is a clear proof of this irreverence.
Is Quran anti- secular?
Should muslims not be a part of a secular society?
Are muslims meant to be anti-secular?Today, most of the countries practice a secular governance and not a religious governance, Becoz of which muslims are able to live peacefully even in a non muslim country. Every human being has equal rights and is treated equal irrespective of religion. Would this be wrong???
Anybody with answers/views/opinions?
And Mquran, No offence meant on having quoted what u said on an other thread.
Its more like a food for thought really.Peace!
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Hi all
I meant secular, as in a secular government where all people are equally important irrespective of their religious beliefs, such as most of the countries today. Like say, in countries where muslins are a minority, they are not differentiated on the basis of their religion and are considered equal to just any other person in the country.
And yeah, I have no clue what Mquran meant by secular beliefs in the quote. Propably, he can tell us, his definition as well.
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Here is the dictionary meaning
Secular
Worldly rather than spiritual.
Not specifically relating to religion or to a religious body secular music.
Relating to or advocating secularism.
Not bound by monastic restrictions, especially not belonging to a religious order. Used of the clergy.
Occurring or observed once in an age or century.
Lasting from century to century.Lets move on from these definitions, shall we?
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I meant secular, as in a secular government where all people are equally important irrespective of their religious beliefs, such as most of the countries today. Like say, in countries where muslins are a minority, they are not differentiated on the basis of their religion and are considered equal to just any other person in the country.
A government based on al-quraan would have the same principle of equality.
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A government is essentially legislation, set of laws with an executive. The difference, in my view between a secular govt and a Quranic govt is that a Quranic has a permanent set of laws set by Allah. Its not concerned with winning the vote of the majority because there's no election. It's concerned with the establishment of ad-deen as opposed to maximise the pleasure in the short-term (which is what 'ad-dunya' refers to)
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Hi Mquran,
Say there are 10% of christians in the country. Would the Quranic laws apply to them as well or would they have different rules? -
As far as my reading goes, in an Islamic domain, all laws apply to everyone equally.
'Christianity' applies to thier belief system. Once they enter the islamic domain, they have to iqamus-salaat and itaauz-zakaat ( what i interpret as being committed to producing growth in the quranic sense). This pledge makes them 'muslimeen' in the quranic sense. Religious freedom is a private matter. Hope im clear there.
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So, would the christians be forced to live by Quranic laws even when they dont believe in it?
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Hi Mquran,
I didnt obviously mean 'dont kill' , 'dont cheat' laws. These are values, that any human, irrespective of any religion can realise and understand.How about lashing for adultery? What if the christians in the country do not relate to it?Would the law apply to them as well?
What about marriage and divorce laws? What rules will be followed for the christians? the ones mentioned in Quran(which they dont believe and accept) or seperate rules for them, according to their beliefs?
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I didnt obviously mean 'dont kill' , 'dont cheat' laws. These are values, that any human, irrespective of any religion can realise and understand.
These are laws in the Quran though. If you don't take them as 'religious', thats fine.
How about lashing for adultery? What if the christians in the country do not relate to it?Would the law apply to them as well?
If they dont relate to it, they shouldnt have sex in the public space like animals. If they do, its not a personal thing anymore , is it ? Obviously, adultery and fornication in thier own space is thier (as with anyone else's) own affair.
What about marriage and divorce laws? What rules will be followed for the christians? the ones mentioned in Quran(which they dont believe and accept) or seperate rules for them, according to their beliefs?
There's no 'qisas' for marriage and divorce laws, i.e. whether you follow or not, there's no punishement stipulated unless of course, you cheat someone using marriage as a scam. If a marriage and divorce is straightfoward, there's no qisas or equal retribution.
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Hi Jaxal,
SALaM PM
Excellent question. Only proves that Quran was never meant to run a country.
I honestly wanted to know what everyone out here thinks on this subject.
I lived all my life in India. And I am sooo glad its a secular government and not a religious government (would be hindu government since they are the majority). If it was a religious government and muslims had to follow their religious laws, even if we dont believe it, it would be unfair, wouldnt it? Say, they followed crude laws like burning widows(sati) etc and if all people living in the country were forced to follow it?
I am glad the people and the country chose a secular government where everyone is equal and we follow laws that are just to humanity in general, not taking into consideration any specific religion and religious beliefs.
The same can be said for UK, America etc, isnt it? -
I honestly wanted to know what everyone out here thinks on this subject
.I didnt bother answering because this person generally doesn't know what he's saying and can't answer a question to save his life but if you want, I can deconstruct the sentence for you.
I lived all my life in India. And I am sooo glad its a secular government and not a religious government (would be hindu government since they are the majority). If it was a religious government and muslims had to follow their religious laws, even if we dont believe it, it would be unfair, wouldnt it?
The Quran isnt a comparison for this. In an islamic domain, anyone can perform any religious rituals as they so choose. However, ppl are bound by Quranic laws which one might call 'civil' instead of 'religious'. I caution against the use of both terms. Al-quraan gives laws, period. They dont have anything to do with your rituals.
I am glad the people and the country chose a secular government where everyone is equal and we follow laws that are just to humanity in general, not taking into consideration any specific religion.
The same can be said for UK, America etc, isnt it?Does al-quraan propagate a religion to you ? If so, I'd urge you to read al-quraan thoroughly and see where it preaches a 'religious' government.
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The only thing i need to know regarding you is that ur the kind of man who cant keep his marriage together. The rest, as 7 of 9 says, is irrelevant.
SaLaM PM
What you say is right. Even the indians have enough sense not to run their country using religion. IT has already excelled pakistan in nearly all ways.
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Obviously, adultery and fornication in thier own space is thier (as with anyone else's) own affair.
So, according to u, there would be no punishment of lashing for adultery among the christians living under muslim law?
There's no 'qisas' for marriage and divorce laws, i.e. whether you follow or not, there's no punishement stipulated unless of course, you cheat someone using marriage as a scam. If a marriage and divorce is straightfoward, there's no qisas or equal retribution.
Would the widows be required to wait for a period of 3 months to marry again?
Would they be required to follow divorce procedures like Quran says?
Would all other punishments(from Quran) apply to them? -
So, according to u, there would be no punishment of lashing for adultery among the christians living under muslim law?
No. If they had sex publicly (in front of 4 ppl as the Quran stipulates) then there's punishment for them as with everyone else.
Would the widows be required to wait for a period of 3 months to marry again?
Would they be required to follow divorce procedures like Quran says?As far as my reading goes, there's no punishable requirement for divorce laws. If you follow them, you gain Allah's rewards. If you don't, you won't.
Would all other punishments(from Quran) apply to them?
Such as what ?