Is "al-masjid al-haram" a physical building ?
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Peace brother Wakas,
Thank you for your thought provoking comments.
literal translation
al masjid al haram ~ the implementation of acknowledging/recognising the restrictionWouldn't "institution/organization/establishment" be a better term here than "implementation" as they have a wider range of meaning ? For example one can say "government institution/organization" but not "government implementation".
"Institution" can mean An established or organized society or corporation; an establishment, especially of a public character, or affecting a community; a foundation; as, a literary institution; a charitable institution; but "implementation" does not have those meanings.
The above trans does leave it open in terms of what mode/form/vehicle is used to acheive the goal.
597 clearly points to a decision making vehicle. the current "Kabba" and "al masjid al haram" simply does not fit this criteria.
I agree that a communication vehicle is necessary for an institution of authority for implementing hearing and obeying the restriction and that vehicle would be the restricted house/sanctuary. It can be anywhere where people can gather safely to hear and obey the forbidden.
2226 And We have appointed to Abraham the location of the Sanctuary "Do not set up anyone with Me, and purify My Sanctuary for the passers by, and those who remain, and the humbly hearing and obeying."
As per 2226, the house could be any place where the restriction "do not set up anyone with me" (6151) is heard and obeyed, and as such it could be a physical building or a non-physical virtual website where no partners are set up with The God and where people can come to safely hear and obey the system/obligation/deen.
The house which is used as the communication vehicle for "al-masjid al-haram" will be "al-bayt al-haram". According to verse 2791-92, it can even be a whole town where people can safely hear and obey the forbidden.
deen/obligation/system most definitely has a real-world presence, see the following point.
Makes sense. Similar usage of "fi al-din" is in 609 which is wrongly translated as "because of your system", rather than "in the system" in the PM translation. Also "fi din" in 1102.
The deen/obligation/system is made equivalent with "al-masjid al-haram" when we compare 2190-191 with 609 and 2217, and also by comparing 4827 with 1101-2.
If one takes it as an institute then this could further imply that there would be more than one al masjid al haram, with 'al bayt al haram' being the primary/head establisher/enforcer, i.e the one overseeing things as suggested in 52 & 597.
As I was thinking about your post, It occurred to me that the "first bayt" and "al-bayt al-haram" as used in the qur'aan may not be referring to the same "bayt" !!
The "kaaba"/base would be "al-bayt al-haram" as per 597. Potentially there could be multiple "al-bayt al-haram" for the multiple "al-masjid al-haram" suggested by 2196, and each "al-bayt al-haram" would be the "kaaba"/base for that particular province or geographical area. The hajj/debate however would always be at the FIRST BAYT at Bakkah.
Alternatively, the word "first" in 396-97 implies that there could be other "bayt". There could, therefore, be multiple "bayt" in multiple geographical areas, and each "bayt" could be "al-bayt al-haram" and the "kaaba"/base for that area. There would, therefore, be multiple hajj/debate in multiple "al-bayt al-haram" all over the world.
What do you think ? I have to research this concept by studying the occurrence of "bayt" and "al-bayt al-haram" in all verses of the qur'aan.
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Peace brother Wakas,
literal translation
al masjid al haram ~ the implementation of acknowledging/recognising the restrictionAnother point that I missed mentioning in my last post is that the terms "acknowledging/recognizing" may not represent the wider meaning of "sujud" including the actual obedience or submission.
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Peace brother Wakas,
if one goes through the occurrences of the phrase ~"al haqq min rabb" in 'the reading' it usually (always?) refers to the scripturere/writ. taking this into account, a stronger link is formed by the use of 'al kitab' in 2144.
In addition to "al-masjid al-haram" being the main subject in 2144, the same phrase ~"al haqq min rabb..." is repeated and stressed in 2149 where only "al-masjid al-7aram" is mentioned and there is no mention of the book. This makes it almost certain to be referring to "al-masjid al-haram".
Peace and all best wishes,
Ayman
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Al-masjid al-haram is off limits to the idolaters per 928 but al-bayt al-haram is for the entire mankind (2226-27), so they cannot be the same thing.
tanveermd wrote
928 O you who believe, those who have set up partners are impure, so let them not approach al-masjid al-haram after this year of theirs; and if you fear poverty, then God will enrich you from His blessings if He wills. God is Knowledgeable, Wise.2226 And We have appointed to Abraham the location of the Sanctuary "Do not set up anyone with Me, and purify My Sanctuary for those who will partake, and those who will enforce, and those who kneel and prostrate."
2227 And call out to mankind with the hajj/debate, they will come to you walking and on every transport, they will come from every deep enclosure.ur conclusion that al-masjid al-haram and al-bayt-al-haram cannot be the same thing, as far as those 2 verses are concerned, seems to be a bit shaky! 928 puts the masjidalharam off-limits for those who associate with god! 2226 clearly sets the rules for the sanctuary do not set up anyone with god and so on! 2227 tells adam to call from humankind those who meet the criteria of not associating with god!
furthermore, 2225 also says the same thing about masjidalharam which u have claimed as being exclusive to baytulharam being for 'entire' annas!
925 Surely (as for) those who disbelieve, and hinder (men) from Allah's way and from the Sacred Mosque which We have made equally for all men, (for) the dweller therein and (for) the visitor, and whoever shall incline therein to wrong unjustly, We will make him taste of a painful chastisement.
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ur conclusion that al-masjid al-haram and al-bayt-al-haram cannot be the same thing, as far as those 2 verses are concerned, seems to be a bit shaky! 928 puts the masjidalharam off-limits for those who associate with god! 2226 clearly sets the rules for the sanctuary do not set up anyone with god and so on! 2227 tells adam to call from humankind those who meet the criteria of not associating with god!
2226 says that the location of the house is "do not setup any partner" (2nd person singular). So this is addressed to Abraham (who is establishing the house) NOT to the people who will visit. On the other hand, in 2227 the call is made to the entire humankind (plural).
The passage makes it clear that the only requirement for the location of the house is that it is established by someone who doesn't setup partners. Clearly, this is not a particular location but any location where this criterion is met.
furthermore, 2225 also says the same thing about masjidalharam which u have claimed as being exclusive to baytulharam being for 'entire' annas!
925 Surely (as for) those who disbelieve, and hinder (men) from Allah's way and from the Sacred Mosque which We have made equally for all men, (for) the dweller therein and (for) the visitor, and whoever shall incline therein to wrong unjustly, We will make him taste of a painful chastisement.
There is never any command telling certain people not to come near the restriction house. On the other hand, in 928, you will see the following related to "al-masjid al-haram"
- O you who had faith, those who set up partners are pollution so they do not come near the institution of hearing and obeying the forbidden after this year of theirs. And if you fear neediness, The God will enrich you from His favor if He willed, indeed The God is knowledgeable, wise.
One possible understanding is that "after this year of theirs" in 928 indicates that those who setup partners were previously allowed to come near the institute of hearing and obeying the restriction ("al-masjid al-7aram" as per 2225.
Also, another consideration is the verb "yaqrabu". I think that its meaning needs to be more carefully studied. 7114 makes it clear that the word "muqaraboon" can be used to signify not merely "come near" but "being one of those with influence or one of the political decision makers". So a better understanding is that "al-masjid al-7aram" is made for all people but those who setup partners cannot have influence on it or be the decision makers about it. This would be consistent with the function of al-masjid al-7aram".
Peace,
Ayman
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Salaams All,Aymaan,
believe it or not masjid isn't a physical place.
2225
As to those who have rejected (Allah), and would keep back (men) from the Way of Allah, and from the Sacred Mosque, which We have made (open) to (all) men - equal is the dweller there and the visitor from the country - and any whose purpose therein is profanity or wrong-doing - them will We cause to taste of a most Grievous Penalty.A Better Trans
2225
As for those who have rejected (Allah), and would KEEP BACK (men) From the way of Allah, And from avoiding of the forbidden Which we have classed as evil - those set in their ways and those who are occasional and whoever inclines respecting it with opposition or to do wrong will we cause to taste from a torment painful.The way of Allah ?all the good things is in the quran and the forbidden things are listed throughout the quran as well.
God Bless.
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- O you who had faith, those who set up partners are pollution so they do not come near the institution of hearing and obeying the forbidden after this year of theirs. And if you fear neediness, The God will enrich you from His favor if He willed, indeed The God is knowledgeable, wise.
One possible understanding is that "after this year of theirs" in 928 indicates that those who setup partners were previously allowed to come near the institute of hearing and obeying the restriction ("al-masjid al-7aram" as per 2225.
Also, another consideration is the verb "yaqrabu". I think that its meaning needs to be more carefully studied. 7114 makes it clear that the word "muqaraboon" can be used to signify not merely "come near" but "being one of those with influence or one of the political decision makers". So a better understanding is that "al-masjid al-7aram" is made for all people but those who setup partners cannot have influence on it or be the decision makers about it. This would be consistent with the function of al-masjid al-7aram".
I agree.
You might also consider the following verses
It is not for such as join gods with Allah, to maintain AAmuroo the mosques of Allah while they witness against their own souls to infidelity. The works of such bear no fruit In Fire shall they dwell. The mosques of Allah shall be maintained yaAAmuru by such as believe in Allah and the Last Day, establish regular prayers, and practise regular charity, and fear none (at all) except Allah. It is they who are expected to be on true guidance. Do ye make the giving of drink to pilgrims, or the maintenance AAimarata of the Sacred Mosque, equal to (the pious service of) those who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and strive with might and main in the cause of Allah? They are not comparable in the sight of Allah and Allah guides not those who do wrong.
Maybe al masjid al haram was a place where people met to make business, to pray and do rituals, and where political decisions (like hunting restrictions) were taken between all tribes. Theses decisions were consecrated by being done in the names of Allah and the idols people associated to it.
Then God told the muslim that they should administer al masjid al haram, in order that the decisions should be taken in the name of Allah only (and by the light of its message).
That's why al masjid al haram became a symbol of true monotheism put into action.Peace
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ayman wrote
2226 says that the location of the house is "do not setup any partner" (2nd person singular). So this is addressed to Abraham (who is establishing the house) NOT to the people who will visit. On the other hand, in 2227 the call is made to the entire humankind (plural).even though the call is made to the entire humankind the target audience is quite evident in the next verse itself...those who are called to the house are done so to remember the name of god...so quite evidently those who asscoiate with god are excluded!
what do u mean by 'location' of the house is "do not setup any partner"?
ayman wrote
There is never any command telling certain people not to come near the restriction house. On the other hand, in 928, you will see the following related to "al-masjid al-haram"that is because u are viewing masjidalharam and baytalharam as distinct! still...let's look at the 2226 to get a clearer picture...
And (remember) when We prepared for Abraham the place of the (holy) House, saying Ascribe thou no thing as partner unto Me, and purify My House for those who make the round (thereof) and those who stand and those who bow and make prostration.
circumambulate this house....why?...because it is a sign from god...see 396-97...so that makes believing in god a condition!
again....so that they stand bow and prostrate....to whom?...god!
and yeah...clear verses as to who are to be called to baytalharam
22 30 Such (is the Pilgrimage) whoever honours the sacred rites of Allah, for him it is good in the Sight of his Lord. Lawful to you (for food in Pilgrimage) are cattle, except those mentioned to you (as exception) but shun the abomination of idols, and shun the word that is false,-
2231 Being upright for Allah, not associating aught with Him and whoever associates (others) with Allah, it is as though he had fallen from on high, then the birds snatch him away or the wind carries him off to a far-distant place.
the verses keep speaking of god...quite evidently those who believe in god are to be called to the house of god...so v have the same restriction which we have for masjidalharam being enforced for baytalharam...no reason to believe they are distinct!
ayman wrote
One possible understanding is that "after this year of theirs" in 928 indicates that those who setup partners were previously allowed to come near the institute of hearing and obeying the restriction ("al-masjid al-7aram" as per 2225.not necessarily...as faith was 'lost' they simply changed their practise even as they frequented the house....it does not mean they were previously allowed even as they associated (with god)...but now that a messenger has come and faith was 'renewed' and the believers have taken custody of the kabah...those who associate with god are not to be allowed therein!
- But what plea have they that Allah should not punish them, when they keep out (men) from the sacred Mosque - and they are not its guardians? No men can be its guardians except the righteous; but most of them do not understand.
so in either case we get the same rules for masjidalharam and baytalharam and lack of reason to believe they are distinct!
####### peace
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simple wrote
believe it or not masjid isn't a physical place.a masjid would be a place for sujood....physical...but does not have to be a building constructed according to a certain construction!
simple wrote
As for those who have rejected (Allah), and would KEEP BACK (men) From the way of Allah, And from avoiding of the forbidden Which we have classed as evil - those set in their ways and those who are occasional and whoever inclines respecting it with opposition or to do wrong will we cause to taste from a torment painful.where did u get the 'avoiding' from in 'avoiding of the forbidden'?
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They hinder people from Allah?s way.
99
The Signs of Allah have they sold for a miserable price, and (many) have they hindered from His way evil indeed are the deeds they have done.They avoid not the breaking of agreements.
98
How (can there be such a league), seeing that if they get an advantage over you, they respect not in you the ties either of kinship or of covenant? With (fair words from) their mouths they entice you, but their hearts are averse from you; and most of them are rebellious and wicked.They are doing things that where forbidden
913
Will ye not fight people who violated their oaths, plotted to expel the Messenger, and took the aggressive by being the first (to assault) you? Do ye fear them? Nay, it is Allah Whom ye should more justly fear, if ye believe!Najisa = impure/that perceived by intelligence./the associaters of others with God.
Br. Ayman said
928. O you who had faith, those who set up partners are pollution so they do not come near the institution of hearing and obeying the forbidden after this year of theirs. And if you fear neediness, The God will enrich you from His favor if He willed, indeed The God is knowledgeable, wise.My trans
928
O you who believe verily the associators cannot be trusted let them not approach/undertake the forbidden killings/slaughter/expulsions after the yearly contract ????
929
Fight against those who not believe in Allah nor in the Day Last nor forbid that which has forbidden Allah ???Its too simple?
Salaams. -
Salaams Br,
i was merely making it easier to comprehend.
but here you are i have made it even more easier to understand.
2225
As for those who have rejected (Allah), and would KEEP BACK (men) From the way of Allah And from ,avoiding of the forbidden/ the forbidden submissions/the killing of innocents/the raping of women/the expulsion of people Which we have classed as evil - those set in their ways and those who are occasional and whoever inclines respecting it with opposition or to do wrong will we cause to taste from a torment painful.Peace to you.
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simple wrote
i was merely making it easier to comprehend.but here you are i have made it even more easier to understand.
thanks -)
simple wrote
2225
As for those who have rejected (Allah), and would KEEP BACK (men) From the way of Allah And from ,avoiding of the forbidden/ the forbidden submissions/the killing of innocents/the raping of women/the expulsion of people Which we have classed as evil - those set in their ways and those who are occasional and whoever inclines respecting it with opposition or to do wrong will we cause to taste from a torment painful.i get that..but what i am asking is...last time around u translated masjidalharam as "affairs of restriction" and masjidalaqsa as "affairs of retaliation'! using this translation we have
171
Glorified who set forth His slave (to upland) by loss of power and prosperity (or by night) from avoiding of the forbidden/ the forbidden submissions/the killing of innocents/the raping/the expulsion of people Which we have classed as evil to avoiding of retaliation, whereof we blessed his escape/strength/around to show him of Our Signs He He the All-Hearer the All-Seer.salaams. peace to you -)
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Salaams Br,
I forgot we had a discussion already once!
You cannot avoid penalty after, doing what is forbidden, killing ? in the case of Moses, but you can be forgiven.
You know the context of languages matters Br.
like you can't avoid bandaging your hand after you have cut it,can you.
Thanks.
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Peace brother,
2225
As to those who have rejected (Allah), and would keep back (men) from the Way of Allah, and from the Sacred Mosque, which We have made (open) to (all) men - equal is the dweller there and the visitor from the country - and any whose purpose therein is profanity or wrong-doing - them will We cause to taste of a most Grievous Penalty.A Better Trans
2225
As for those who have rejected (Allah), and would KEEP BACK (men) From the way of Allah, And from avoiding of the forbidden Which we have classed as evil - those set in their ways and those who are occasional and whoever inclines respecting it with opposition or to do wrong will we cause to taste from a torment painful.The way of Allah ?all the good things is in the quran and the forbidden things are listed throughout the quran as well.
Yes. The insitute of hearing and obeying the restriction ("al-masjid al-7aram" is no more a physical building than "the way of The God" is a physical highway to Mecca.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace JM,
I agree.
You might also consider the following verses
It is not for such as join gods with Allah, to maintain AAmuroo the mosques of Allah while they witness against their own souls to infidelity. The works of such bear no fruit In Fire shall they dwell. The mosques of Allah shall be maintained yaAAmuru by such as believe in Allah and the Last Day, establish regular prayers, and practise regular charity, and fear none (at all) except Allah. It is they who are expected to be on true guidance. Do ye make the giving of drink to pilgrims, or the maintenance AAimarata of the Sacred Mosque, equal to (the pious service of) those who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and strive with might and main in the cause of Allah? They are not comparable in the sight of Allah and Allah guides not those who do wrong.
Maybe al masjid al haram was a place where people met to make business, to pray and do rituals, and where political decisions (like hunting restrictions) were taken between all tribes. Theses decisions were consecrated by being done in the names of Allah and the idols people associated to it.
Then God told the muslim that they should administer al masjid al haram, in order that the decisions should be taken in the name of Allah only (and by the light of its message).
That's why al masjid al haram became a symbol of true monotheism put into action.I totally agree that what defines "al-masjid al-7aram" is that the decisions made by its administrators should be taken by the light of The God's message. This correct definition that you provided has nothing to do with a physical place. Any building no matter how impressive cannot result in decisions being made in the light of The God's message.
Hence, even if you build a nice building with a minaret and a golden dome and put a big sign on the front door saying "Masjid", it wouldn't be a "masjid" if the people don't make decisions in light of The God's message. So how do people make decisions in light of The God's message? Of course, they hear and obey what The God restricted on them. They implement this in their family and community and ultimately in their country. So from your excellent observation, one can see that "masjid" is not primarily a physical building but it is primarily an institution that makes decisions in light of The God's message. The physical building is irrelevant.
Peace,
Ayman
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Peace,
even though the call is made to the entire humankind the target audience is quite evident in the next verse itself...those who are called to the house are done so to remember the name of god...so quite evidently those who asscoiate with god are excluded!
How can you remind people of the name of The God? Is it by mindlessly repeating "labayk allahu ama labayk" thousands of times while spinning around an idol (and sometimes stampeding over people)? I think that you need to look at the action of "thikr" in the great reading and see how it is supposed to be accomplished.
Notice that "witness benefits" is mentioned before "remembering The God".
what do u mean by 'location' of the house is "do not setup any partner"?
This is what the passage clearly says in 2226. The word "makan" in Arabic means "location". The location is given by the passage as "do not setup any partner"
that is because u are viewing masjidalharam and baytalharam as distinct! still...let's look at the 2226 to get a clearer picture...
And (remember) when We prepared for Abraham the place of the (holy) House, saying Ascribe thou no thing as partner unto Me, and purify My House for those who make the round (thereof) and those who stand and those who bow and make prostration.
circumambulate this house....why?...because it is a sign from god...see 396-97...so that makes believing in god a condition!There is no "circumbulate" anywhere in this passage or the entire great reading. This of course, unless you want to make the suggestion that those who go in heaven have drinks or servants spinning seven times around them (5224, 5617, 7619, 3745, 4371, 7615) and your family and you spin seven times around each other (245. So clearly, "circumbulate" has nothing to do with what The God's message is actually saying.
again....so that they stand bow and prostrate....to whom?...god!
Yes it is to The God but there is nothing in there that says that everyone who goes there will bow (be humble) and prostrate (obey).
and yeah...clear verses as to who are to be called to baytalharam
22 30 Such (is the Pilgrimage) whoever honours the sacred rites of Allah, for him it is good in the Sight of his Lord. Lawful to you (for food in Pilgrimage) are cattle, except those mentioned to you (as exception) but shun the abomination of idols, and shun the word that is false,-2231 Being upright for Allah, not associating aught with Him and whoever associates (others) with Allah, it is as though he had fallen from on high, then the birds snatch him away or the wind carries him off to a far-distant place.
the verses keep speaking of god...quite evidently those who believe in god are to be called to the house of god...so v have the same restriction which we have for masjidalharam being enforced for baytalharam...no reason to believe they are distinct!
Again, these passages are not just for those who go to the restriction house. One should obey 2230-31 all the time. Or is it OK to not "shun the abomination of idols" when one is not in the restriction house?
not necessarily...as faith was 'lost' they simply changed their practise even as they frequented the house....it does not mean they were previously allowed even as they associated (with god)...but now that a messenger has come and faith was 'renewed' and the believers have taken custody of the kabah...those who associate with god are not to be allowed therein!
- But what plea have they that Allah should not punish them, when they keep out (men) from the sacred Mosque - and they are not its guardians? No men can be its guardians except the righteous; but most of them do not understand.
so in either case we get the same rules for masjidalharam and baytalharam and lack of reason to believe they are distinct!
The God doesn't use words haphazardly. He made a distinction and didn't use the same words for them. I think that "al-bayt al-7aram" (the restriction house) is a component of "al-masjid al-7aram" (the institute of hearing and obeying the restriction). They are related but they are not synonymous. My understanding is that "al-bayt al-7aram" is the communication medium for "al-masjid al-7aram". Thus, "al-bayt al-7aram" can be any place where people can assemble in safety (2125) to hear The God's message. The "hajj" is an annual market (where people primarily witness benefits) that takes place, as we saw above in 2226, anwhere partners are not setup with The God. So having people from different creeds coming from all over the world is an excellent opportunity to remind them of The God by showing them the real "islam" (lower case action not the proper name) through ACTIONS of a role-model community of people who don't setup partners with The God and make decisions according to the light of His message, not through ARGUMENTS ("jidal".
Peace,
Ayman
- But what plea have they that Allah should not punish them, when they keep out (men) from the sacred Mosque - and they are not its guardians? No men can be its guardians except the righteous; but most of them do not understand.
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ayman wrote
How can you remind people of the name of The God? Is it by mindlessly repeating "labayk allahu ama labayk" thousands of times while spinning around an idol (and sometimes stampeding over people)? I think that you need to look at the action of "thikr" in the great reading and see how it is supposed to be accomplished.Notice that "witness benefits" is mentioned before "remembering The God".
why do u try to limit everything to ur understanding? -/ does remembering the name of god mean mindlessly repeating it? are u trying to say whoever takes the name of god verbally is doing it mindlessly?
that said i said remembering the name of god and did not say 'how'...that was just ur limited understanding at work...the point still remains the same...those who are called to the house are called so as to remember the name of god...being mindful about it! -)
ayman wrote
This is what the passage clearly says in 2226. The word "makan" in Arabic means "location". The location is given by the passage
as "do not setup any partner"the word denotes more than just location...it denotes something like foundation...established....rootedness...firm placing....i suggest u read the quran to understand this for urself! -)
ayman wrote
There is no "circumbulate" anywhere in this passage or the entire great reading. This of course, unless you want to make the suggestion that those who go in heaven have drinks or servants spinning seven times around them (5224, 5617, 7619, 3745, 4371, 7615) and your family and you spin seven times around each other (245. So clearly, "circumbulate" has nothing to do with what The God's message is actually saying.i guess 'going about' would be better...fair enough...choose going about the house of god...doesnt make a difference...it still remains the house of god...one god....not nafs of an individual! -)
ayman wrote
Yes it is to The God but there is nothing in there that says that everyone who goes there will bow (be humble) and prostrate (obey).huh?? clearly states for the standing the bowing and the prostrating! and god does not need others to put in brackets to show what it intends to mean....while u were at it why did u leave out standing?
ayman wrote
Again, these passages are not just for those who go to the restriction house. One should obey 2230-31 all the time. Or is it OK to not "shun the abomination of idols" when one is not in the restriction house?yeah...would apply anywhere...and also to the house....have u forgotten that? who obey 2230-31 are them for whom the hajj has been ordained..so whoso desires to associate with god are not called to do the hajj...its a package...u cannot come to party at the house of god....u come there when u have belief in god....lets not miss the forest for the trees!
ayman wrote
The God doesn't use words haphazardly. He made a distinction and didn't use the same words for them.calling the choice of words of god as haphazard is not a solution....using different titles does not make 2 things different...read the quran to know what i mean! -)
ayman wrote
I think that "al-bayt al-7aram" (the restriction house) is a component of "al-masjid al-7aram" (the institute of hearing and obeying the restriction). They are related but they are not synonymous. My understanding is that "al-bayt al-7aram" is the communication medium for "al-masjid al-7aram". Thus, "al-bayt al-7aram" can be any place where people can assemble in safety (2125) to hear The God's message.####### it is not what v think but that which is confirmed by quran which counts...2125 is speaking of the house the alqawaida of which was raised by ibrahim and ismail.....so while u are entitled to ur understanding as much as anyone else..as long as it remains deprived of support from quran it will remain just that...a personal understanding without significance! -)
ayman wrote
The "hajj" is an annual market (where people primarily witness benefits) that takes place, as we saw above in 2226, anwhere partners are not setup with The God. So having people from different creeds coming from all over the world is an excellent opportunity to remind them of The God by showing them the real "islam" (lower case action not the proper name) through ACTIONS of a role-model community of people who don't setup partners with The God and make decisions according to the light of His message, not through ARGUMENTS ("jidal".####### god does not set up markets to sell or showcase its religion...it sends its messengers to make truth distinct from falsehood...nowhere does it say that the hajj is to be a fair or a market where 'ideal muslims' will be on display for the rest of the humanity....rather it is the bayt itself to which believers are called...again u need to back up ur claims from the quran rather
than ur understanding as all are entitled to their own understandings but to reach an 'understanding' it has to be based on quran rather than hypothesis!######## and yes i agree....our understanding should be guided according to god and its message rather than us trying to guide the understanding of god and its message! cool! -)
######### peace -)