Surah 111:1-5
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OPF,
I think now you are making more sense .i.e. you do not believe in the whole Quran because you are rejecting Dr Rashad Khalifa for being a messenger (381) and you are prefering Muhammad over Rashad i.e. making distingtion between messengers, and that you are still refering to Hadith regarding 9128-129..
Sorry you are not God Alone and Quran Alone person as you potray you are you are just another stubborn sunni, who would not lose out on traditional so called Islam..
Based on above I would like to denounce what you are saying and agree to disagree!!
You Shall Not Make Any Distinction
Among God's MessengersThe messenger has believed in what was sent down to him from his Lord, and so did the believers. They believe in GOD, His angels, His scripture, and His messengers "We make no distinction among any of His messengers." They say, "We hear, and we obey.* Forgive us, our Lord. To You is the ultimate destiny."
Where am I referring to hadeeth, regarding 9128-129? Are you talking about when I put forth the example of alcohol? If so, that was not a reference to hadeeth, it was a purely hypothetical example. On the other hand, your reference to Abu Lahab as a vengeful uncle of a prophet is derived purely from ahadith. Show me an outside source that mentions Abu Lahab, naming him as you say, completely independant of ahadith & their compilers. Inconsistency is a notorious problem with this 19 deal; stating "The Quran, the whole Quran and nothing but the Quran" then referencing outside sources is a shining example of such a thing.
381 does not mention anyone being named as the messenger. All the relevant messengers have been named in the text. Your usage of "distinction between the messengers", or rather, the abuse thereof does not stand to 2253 -
002.253
YUSUFALI Those messengers We endowed with gifts, some above others To one of them Allah spoke; others He raised to degrees (of honour); to Jesus the son of Mary We gave clear (Signs), and strengthened him with the holy spirit. If Allah had so willed, succeeding generations would not have fought among each other, after clear (Signs) had come to them, but they (chose) to wrangle, some believing and others rejecting. If Allah had so willed, they would not have fought each other; but Allah Fulfilleth His plan.
PICKTHAL Of those messengers, some of whom We have caused to excel others, and of whom there are some unto whom Allah spake, while some of them He exalted (above others) in degree; and We gave Jesus, son of Mary, clear proofs (of Allah's Sovereignty) and We supported him with the holy Spirit. And if Allah had so wiled it, those who followed after them would not have fought one with another after the clear proofs had come unto them. But they differed, some of them believing and some disbelieving. And if Allah had so willed it, they would not have fought one with another; but Allah doeth what He will.
SHAKIR We have made some of these messengers to excel the others among them are they to whom Allah spoke, and some of them He exalted by (many degrees of) rank; and We gave clear miracles to Isa son of Marium, and strengthened him with the holy spirit. And if Allah had pleased, those after them would not have fought one with another after clear arguments had come to them, but they disagreed; so there were some of them who believed and others who denied; and if Allah had pleased they would not have fought one with another, but Allah brings about what He intends.There is a difference between making a distinction between messengers and rooting out those who falsely claim to be a messenger. Whether or not RK is a messenger is a whole other ballgame.
"Sorry you are not God Alone and Quran Alone person as you potray you are you are just another stubborn sunni, who would not lose out on traditional so called Islam.."
Last time I checked, I was not the one attempting to plug Abu Lahab the evil uncle into the Quran. You also quoted 7431 to support YOUR point of view. As the verse says, this is laughable.
We appointed angels to be guardians of Hell, and we assigned their number (19) (1) to disturb the disbelievers, (2) to convince the Christians and Jews (that this is a divine scripture), (3) to strengthen the faith of the faithful, (4) to remove all traces of doubt from the hearts of Christians, Jews, as well as the believers, and (5) to expose those who harbor doubt in their hearts, and the disbelievers; they will say, "What did GOD mean by this allegory?" GOD thus sends astray whomever He wills, and guides whomever He wills. None knows the soldiers of your Lord except He. This is a reminder for the people.
Also, there is no room to "agree to disagree" on a clear revelation. Possibly temporarily, but we will fool nobody but ourselves by "agreeing to disagree".
Peace...
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No, as pointed out earlier, without hadith there would be no uncle to doubt and any name with GV = 150 would suffice as a code candidate.
No, there is no where in the Quran where it says that one cannot refer to Hadith for historic reference like I did. As for believing you are not allowed to believe Hadith, but you are allowed to believe Quran, therefore from the above code specific to Quran we should believe that Abu Laheb was Muhammad's Uncle..
Lastly, the verses are ?allegoric? thus should be read ?in context? with caution?
The verses are allogoric to the extent that 19 based codes are not clearly defined in 7430-31, these were clarified by Rashad..
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No, there is no where in the Quran where it says that one cannot refer to Hadith for historic reference like I did. As for believing you are not allowed to believe Hadith, but you are allowed to believe Quran, therefore from the above code specific to Quran we should believe that Abu Laheb was Muhammad's Uncle..
The verses are allogoric to the extent that 19 based codes are not clearly defined in 7430-31, these were clarified by Rashad..
Fabiayyi hadeethin baAAdahu yuminoona
7750 Then what Hadith, after that, will they believe in?No, what you are doing is working the problem backwards; example
You have your 19 tables which are searched for numbers containing 111 and 92.
Then fill in the missing 150 as in this case GV for the word ?uncle? meaning relation without regard to numbering order or which uncle? What about cousins or the rest of the extended family?Here?s a favorite Hadith which goes something like this?
The Prophet (pbuh) asks one of his wives (Aisha I believe) if there?s anything (meaning to eat)?
She answers no, and he replies guess we?ll fast today.Reason I remember that particular one is because it reminds me of something that I?d say. lol
I?d like to believe that it?s true although as with most hadith even if slightly true we have no way of knowing the context or if people were propagating and injecting their personal tastes and opinions.Likewise, with the uncle we can never be sure if someone had a rift with this fellow and wanted to make him look bad by associating him to be the father of the flame ? what if he was actually a nice man?
Now as to ?Father of Flame? and his wife are representative of those constantly opposed to Islam and do everything and anything against it; these are easy to spot and internet/media is full of them.
Peace
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Nun de Plume,
I don't know this area, but am I right to assume that for 1400 years Quran was in domain of Hadithists. If this is true then it has'nt done badly it still has its originality, besides 9128-129 etc.
I believe no matter how much corruption God still holds the truth..
Regards
Ijaz
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Peace be upon you,
Abu Lahab means Father of the Flame, it represents ANYONE who likes to fuel the emotions of mankind in opposition to the Peaceful Truth of God. The "his wife" is just like Adam and "his wife"...."his wife" just represents the female aspect of these concepts...the male side provides the seed, the female side becmes inpregnated and noursishes the ideas...its ike your thoughts(male) and the images(female) that nourish and strengthen the thoughts that moves your energies to act. It is the Yin and Yang of life. I have not understood the symbolism of the thorns yet.Salam.
Is this your personal opinion?
I mean, where do you have the proof?
Are you sure, they are not real people?It does not matter who they were, they were humans, they did something bad and this is what they will get - punishment.
The God Most Merfciful, Most Wise, knows best.
Glory be to The God The Most High.Peace.