Why does God punish unbelievers?
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Peace,
Yes and no. Reincarnation is rebirth in this stage of the universe, on this earth. Nirvana is going into the state of nothingness when the cycle of rebirth is broken. In Hinduism and Buddhism the goal is to break the cycle of reincarnation, they do not call it rebirth, but redeath, since they see reincarnation as negative, not as positive since every rebirth means the goal is not achieved and man must remain to suffer. In the West people made it into "rebirth" as they approached it as positive coming from the materialistic point of view. A Hindu/Buddhist wants to stop existing, while Westerners wants to keep on living.
The Quran defines a completely different concept that is line with the universal evolution. This universe will end in a Big Freeze or Crunch, but it will end. When it is ended, through Inflation a new universe will emerge that has this universe as its Blue Print. No information can be lost since all are stored on Quantum level. Mankind, the ones who benefitted the species atleast, will be created again, meaning their conciousness and a physical body will be merged again into a union. They will have attained a higher form of life as they evolved together with the universe. This state of evolution is described as Jannah in the Quran. Jahannam is a state of non-evolution, meaning these humans who harmed Mankind will not evolve further, and this will be experienced by them as agony.
But the concept of Karma, which was developed much earlier and seperate from the concept of Reincarnation (these 2 would only be linked much later on around 250BCE), is something uphold in the Quran. The concept of Cause and Effect, whereby any action is liking throwing a pebble in a pond whereby the ripples created will eventually hit the borders of the pond and then return to the source of the pebble, meaning every action will create an effect sooner or later (in this life or the next or both) and will be equavalant (or stronger in the case of good deeds 6160) to the action.
The Qurnaic descriptions of the cosmic evolution we as humans are part of is very scientific and logical. The concepts of Nirvana and Reincarnation are vague and many times contradict one another in the Veda's and Buddhistic scriptures. In the oldest parts of the Veda's there is no mention of reincarnation or a state of Nirvana, this is a later development that emerged around 300BCE. -
Hell can last for ever as can the Garden, there is no contradiction in that. In essence we are all eternal because we are God's WILL manifest, which is eternal.
Sorry Soof, for the delay. My mind works on what it wills, when it wills, and how it wills. I have very little say, now she feels like taking up this interesting sentence.
I can't say but that I agree completely with this. In fact I have thought on it many times that way, in the sense that every thing is eternal, every second exists always. We cannot grasp it because we are limited, in the same way that if you only have a square metre and have four boxes one m3 side, you have to pile them on the same sq metre. If you see them form the top you will not see all of them, but the boxes are there alright.Youhave to see them one after the other or from the side. If it is many piles, you will need many times to see them. But if we leave three dimensions to go onto four and not to go back to two, then we will be a little more eternal, that is "the moment" will be all there is and will comprise all imaginable moments. Mind boggling. After a a few moments of those one must go back to the shitty moments of the three dimensions to hold in place.
So, my conception, the best one I am capable of is that indeed paradise is not forever either, because our return is to God, not to Paradise. Paradise is the marvelous way to god, when you have finished the heavy part of preparations for the travel, I suppose something like getting the vaccinations and the visas. But the fact of leacing paradise will not be a loss any more in the same sense that it will be comprised in the return to God in the same way that our life on earth will be comprised in paradise, in the same way that the two dimensions are comprised in the thre dimensions. No loss nowhere.
Thanks for bringing this up.
Salaam
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Salaam abrar,
huruf said it very well...
"The reality is whether the disbelievers are in Hell for 10 days, 100 years, 10 billion years, God tells us that it is a thoroughly bad place to be, and that no one should wish to be there. Whether people suffer in Hell and are destroyed is no consolation or invitation to do wrongdoing. No sane person would wish to go in hell for any period of time, this is what God is showing us. Instead of focusing on the time period people should focus on how to avoid going to Hell. Eternity or one day is irrelevant, we do not want to be there."
peace
Peace, respectfully
That was me that said that not Huruf )
Peace
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Sorry Soof, for the delay. My mind works on what it wills, when it wills, and how it wills. I have very little say, now she feels like taking up this interesting sentence.
I can't say but that I agree completely with this. In fact I have thought on it many times that way, in the sense that every thing is eternal, every second exists always. We cannot grasp it because we are limited, in the same way that if you only have a square metre and have four boxes one m3 side, you have to pile them on the same sq metre. If you see them form the top you will not see all of them, but the boxes are there alright.Youhave to see them one after the other or from the side. If it is many piles, you will need many times to see them. But if we leave three dimensions to go onto four and not to go back to two, then we will be a little more eternal, that is "the moment" will be all there is and will comprise all imaginable moments. Mind boggling. After a a few moments of those one must go back to the shitty moments of the three dimensions to hold in place.
So, my conception, the best one I am capable of is that indeed paradise is not forever either, because our return is to God, not to Paradise. Paradise is the marvelous way to god, when you have finished the heavy part of preparations for the travel, I suppose something like getting the vaccinations and the visas. But the fact of leacing paradise will not be a loss any more in the same sense that it will be comprised in the return to God in the same way that our life on earth will be comprised in paradise, in the same way that the two dimensions are comprised in the thre dimensions. No loss nowhere.
Thanks for bringing this up.
Salaam
Exactly my understanding. What I learn from studying Life after Death is that it is entirely conceivable as is the current creation but the true purpose of the second life is beyond us right now. I think we could get some understanding of the Garden and what will be in store for the believers. I do not think the believers will just be sitting around or swimming in streams, I believe there will be more to it. I get it from this ayat
Those who did well will have the best reward and more besides
1026Maybe believers will be perfected beings like the Holy Spirit when he appeared before Mary. Believers are described on the day of resurrection as having their light perfected. Maybe that means their soul, their understanding, their senses but it shows that everything is a journey even the 2nd creation.
O ye who believe! turn Unto Allah with a sincere repentance. Belike your Lord will expiate from you your misdeeds and cause you to enter Gardens whereunder rivers flow, on the Day whereon Allah will not humiliate the prophet and those who believe with him. Their light will be running before them and on their right hands, and they will say our Lord! perfect for us our light, and forgive us; verily Thou art over everything Potent.
668Unfortunately the disbelievers will have no light, for God gives them no light (2439). I believe that will be the true source of despair on the Day. The rejection from the Source, who gave you Life, I think that will result in Hell itself. Maybe the disbelievers own self-disgust and despair will create Hell for them within their own souls or minds, which they cannot escape. That would be more terrifying and harder to conceive than being consigned to a great Fire.
and no worries Dotty D
Peace
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and no worries Dotty
Lemme get this right now.
Soof said it very well...
"The reality is whether the disbelievers are in Hell for 10 days, 100 years, 10 billion years, God tells us that it is a thoroughly bad place to be, and that no one should wish to be there. Whether people suffer in Hell and are destroyed is no consolation or invitation to do wrongdoing. No sane person would wish to go in hell for any period of time, this is what God is showing us. Instead of focusing on the time period people should focus on how to avoid going to Hell. Eternity or one day is irrelevant, we do not want to be there."
peace
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Lemme get this right now.
Soof said it very well...
"The reality is whether the disbelievers are in Hell for 10 days, 100 years, 10 billion years, God tells us that it is a thoroughly bad place to be, and that no one should wish to be there. Whether people suffer in Hell and are destroyed is no consolation or invitation to do wrongdoing. No sane person would wish to go in hell for any period of time, this is what God is showing us. Instead of focusing on the time period people should focus on how to avoid going to Hell. Eternity or one day is irrelevant, we do not want to be there."
peace
Absolutely!
peace