a HOT Question, Please I need every body help in a SOUL Question?

huruf

I think the talk was about male and female. Whatever anybody's feelings about the delights or advantages of sex, which I am not discussing nor going to discuss, because it goes off a tangent, the point remains that it is the reproductive function that defines the male and the female. If you are going to have "sex" for anything else, we are no longer talking about males and females, but about other things.

Salaam

jonny_k

Peace "soof",

Peace

My opinion of you has gone down Jonny_K, I'm actually astounded at your prejudice. (your final comment). If I present my opinion or a dispute on something, I'm called part of a cult, I'm talking BS? What kind of a muslim forum is this? Oh.... right It is a forum first...therefore people can be completely insulting and insensitve because they are behind a keyboard. I hope for your sake you are not like this in real life.

JK- Thats right freedom pf speech includes insulting at times but youll always find me backing up my statements with reason so it's not empty slander. Im a very harsh critic of people who say "sex is superficial, sex is not love, sex is not spiritual etc" because it triggers a known pattern in my brain of pure religious fundamentalism associated with the suppression of sexual activities MOSTLY INVOLVING WOMEN.

Ok calm down.

I did not say that when we lose our balls or our ovaries in entirety we lose our manhood and womanhood. I said we lose our sexual desire. Which is a fact.

JK- A man does NOT lose his sexual desire either when his sperm line is removed. Even if one of his testicles is he maintains sexual desire. It maybe less in case of one testicle but tht could be adjusted by him taking extra testosterone or anabolic. Same goes for removing part of the reproductive system of a women which is not responsible for producing the sexual hormones as ive explained before.

My point was in society, all over the world, sex is seeked for non-spiritual means, that it becomes entirely superficial. Sex is not the basis of any relationship. It is the two people and the bond they have. Sex comes after, and it is purely superficial, BUT because of the bonds developed during the relationship, the emotions tied to that person, the love for that person, it becomes much more than physical. BUT it is only because of the person, that is the "spiritual" link.

JK- Why does sex come after and is not part of the initial attraction/bond already? Without the sexual hormones a man would not love a woman in the bonding sense at all. Hed might get to love her as one loves a person one gets close to but this is a different type of love altogether and it can be made with anyone. The love between men and women is unique and it is only possible due to sexual hormones interacting along with other hormones which are responsible for general human love sensation. Sex hormones control trigger those certain emotions in the first place.
As far as sex being used by men to show off their arrogance and pride and to put the women down infront of others, YES, this is very wrong IMO and never did i say that i support such.

However in my generation, what I have previously engaged in, what my friends people all around me do, is seek SEX before the PERSON. One night stands, F-buddies et cetera. Such that it becomes a shallow activity, it merely becomes masturbating with a vagina. There's no person attached to that vagina or penis. It is then pure pleasure seeking, there is no sharing or caring, just "get in, get off, get out". But that is not how God intended it to be, he intended this physical act to be shared with someone whom you have a emotional and spiritual link with (your spouse) as a celebration of love, because it is sharing pleasure with your spouse, and there is nothing wrong with that at all.

JK- I agree with you here that this is extremely bad. The whole body and the thoughts processed inside a woman's brain make up her beauty IMHO and the sexual hormones stimulate all that wonderful desire and a man who makes use of all of it.

I did not say sex is bad, inferior and only reduced to child birth. I said First and foremost sex is procreation. Because we are sentient beings with something more inside us, Sex therefore means more to us. BUT it is still first and foremost for preservation of the species. It is not ridiculous it is nature.

JK- As i said why not "pathenogensis" then if sex was primarily for child birth and not bonding and more intense communication?

I was speculating on the Garden and means that we would have to link with each other that may be beyond Sex. It is not an atrocious thought. Calm Down. You could not be further from the truth. I am quite in tune with my sexual desire, I don not shut it out. But I do not have to explain my self to you, nor fit a description you have set up for me because I typed a paragraph on an insignifcant, almost slanderous forum.

Hope you understand more of where I am coming from. Next time have more respect (calling my opinion BS, being prejudice), alleged Wise One.

Peace

JK- There could be more feelings besides sex in the garden but i personally cannot think of anything more wonderful than sexual bonding EXCEPT the direct relationship/connection with GOD as is mentioned in the Quran. GOD Bless!

jonny_k

Peace "huruf",

I think the talk was about male and female. Whatever anybody's feelings about the delights or advantages of sex, which I am not discussing not going to discuss, because it goes off a tangent, the point remains that it is the reproductive function that defines the male and the female. If you are going to have "sex" for anything else, we are no longer talking about males and females, but about other things.

Salaam

JK- But if sex is primarily for child birth and not an efficient mode of processing information or social bonding then 1) why didnt GOD just introduce parthenogenesis in humans and 2) why do we observe homoSEXUAL behaviour in animals which obviously does NOT result in procreation? GOD Bless!

Soof

Peace

Like Huruf said, its going off topic. We could start a new post with the post you just used and discuss it further.

Free speech is one thing. What the Qur'an says about respect is another.

Peace

huruf

Peace "huruf",

JK- But if sex is primarily for child birth and not an efficient mode of processing information or social bonding then 1) why didnt GOD just introduce parthenogenesis in humans and 2) why do we observe homoSEXUAL behaviour in animals which obviously does NOT result in procreation? GOD Bless!

It is efficient or not, it is of no consequence in the present debate which is about whether there is breeding or notin Paradise and therefore whether there should be males and females in that station. And females or males are defined as such by virtue of their function in reproduction. If we are talking about males and females, then males and females are defined according to their function in reproduction, if we are not talking about the functions of reproduction then we are not talking about males and females, so the subject of the debate and is being changed, and it is useless to refute things that have not been said or meant, forcing people to defend positions they have never expressed or do not care to express.

Salaam

belH

Peace "huruf",

JK- But if sex is primarily for child birth and not an efficient mode of processing information or social bonding then 1) why didnt GOD just introduce parthenogenesis in humans and 2) why do we observe homoSEXUAL behaviour in animals which obviously does NOT result in procreation? GOD Bless!

Peace "soof",

JK- Thats right freedom pf speech includes insulting at times but youll always find me backing up my statements with reason so it's not empty slander. Im a very harsh critic of people who say "sex is superficial, sex is not love, sex is not spiritual etc" because it triggers a known pattern in my brain of pure religious fundamentalism associated with the suppression of sexual activities MOSTLY INVOLVING WOMEN.

JK- A man does NOT lose his sexual desire either when his sperm line is removed. Even if one of his testicles is he maintains sexual desire. It maybe less in case of one testicle but tht could be adjusted by him taking extra testosterone or anabolic. Same goes for removing part of the reproductive system of a women which is not responsible for producing the sexual hormones as ive explained before.

JK- Why does sex come after and is not part of the initial attraction/bond already? Without the sexual hormones a man would not love a woman in the bonding sense at all. Hed might get to love her as one loves a person one gets close to but this is a different type of love altogether and it can be made with anyone. The love between men and women is unique and it is only possible due to sexual hormones interacting along with other hormones which are responsible for general human love sensation. Sex hormones control trigger those certain emotions in the first place.
As far as sex being used by men to show off their arrogance and pride and to put the women down infront of others, YES, this is very wrong IMO and never did i say that i support such.

JK- I agree with you here that this is extremely bad. The whole body and the thoughts processed inside a woman's brain make up her beauty IMHO and the sexual hormones stimulate all that wonderful desire and a man who makes use of all of it.

JK- As i said why not "pathenogensis" then if sex was primarily for child birth and not bonding and more intense communication?

JK- There could be more feelings besides sex in the garden but i personally cannot think of anything more wonderful than sexual bonding EXCEPT the direct relationship/connection with GOD as is mentioned in the Quran. GOD Bless!

JK-
Please you are defering from the main topic; Please can you focus in the following

Peace every one,

I found a Straightfrward verse that says that we will be resurrected as we were created, SINGLE SOUL

(

And your creation or your resurrection is in no wise but as an Single soul for Allah is He Who hears and sees (all things). (31-2
!
Here are more verses

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"And behold! ye come to Us Singls as We created you for the first time Ye have left behind you all (the favours) which We bestowed on you We see not with you your intercessors whom ye thought to be partners in your affairs so now all relations between you have been cut off, and your (pet) fancies have left you in the lurch!" (6-94)

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And they will be marshalled before thy Lord in ranks, "Now have ye come to Us as We created you first aye, ye thought We shall not fulfil the appointment made to you to meet (Us)!" (18-4

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The Day that we roll up the heavens like a scroll rolled up for books even as We produced the first Creation, so shall We return them (as they were before) a promise We have undertaken truly shall We fulfil it. (21-104)

(&#65279
!

What do you Think,
Peace

Peace all,

I want all of you to ask yourselves the following

Why God will reward the Believers with Wives and Kids, whom he made and not produced as in our life (male and female), in Heaven?

And if such a reward is for a male believer, what is the reward for a Female believer?

Why God never spoke about the reward of the Female believer?

And for some of you who think that the female believer would become one of the many wives of the male believer (as hadith says), why God did not say that in Quran? Why Females have to be always a reward for males?
peace

jonny_k

Peace "huroof",

It is efficient or not, it is of no consequence in the present debate which is about whether there is breeding or notin Paradise and therefore whether there should be males and females in that station. And females or males are defined as such by virtue of their function in reproduction. If we are talking about males and females, then males and females are defined according to their function in reproduction, if we are not talking about the functions of reproduction then we are not talking about males and females, so the subject of the debate and is being changed, and it is useless to refute things that have not been said or meant, forcing people to defend positions they have never expressed or do not care to express.

Salaam

JK- No male can also mean the person who gives or initiates the love while the female receives it. Women usually like it when the man initiates the sexual love process instead of waiting for her to start. So no i dont think one can argue that male and female refer to giving and receiving of sperm only and hence reproduction. GOD Bless!

belH

You are too focused on the superficial gender. I never mentioned gender. Please ignore the sex of the self.

Peace Ayman;

Would you agree that Male Soul and Female Soul are not different from each other?
Do you agree that, when time to enter Heaven or Hellfire, your Soul (if you are a Male) will be joined by another Soul that were in a Female body in this life?

Would you agree that if joining happened, the two Souls will have one Body that will fit to its new life (Heaven or Hellfire)?

In addition to the passages that I already showed you and which you could not reconcile with your understanding of 817, please see 21104, 694, 1848 and many others.

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And (remember) the Day when We shall roll up the heaven like a scroll rolled up for books, As We began the first creation, We shall bring them back; it is a promise binding upon Us. Truly, We shall do it. (21-104)

That will happend when JD starts; all of us will come out, and each human will be Judged for his own deeds.

(&#65279
And truly you have come unto Us singles as We created you the first time. You have left behind you all that which We had bestowed on you. We see not with you your intercessors whom you claimed to be partners with All?h. Now all relations between you and them have been cut off, and all that you used to claim has vanished from you. (6-94)

The same as above, as well 18-48.

The joining, if true, will happend after being judged for our deeds; when finish the following will happened

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But for him who fears the standing before his Lord, there will be two Gardens (i.e. in Paradise). (46) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (47) With spreading branches. (4 Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (49) In them (both) will be two springs flowing (free). (50) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (51) In them (both) will be every kind of fruit in pairs. (52) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (53) Reclining upon the couches lined with silk brocade, and the fruits of the two Gardens will be near at hand. (54) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (55-55)

Now why God will reward each TWO "2" Gardens?

Wherein both will be Qasirat-ut-Tarf , with whom no man or jinni has had Tamth] before them. (56) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (55-57)

WHY The reward is for Males?

(In beauty) they are like rubies and coral. (5 Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (59) Is there any reward for good other than good? (60) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (61) And besides these two, there are two other Gardens (i.e. in Paradise). (62) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (63) Dark green (in colour). (64) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (65) In them (both) will be two springs gushing forth. (66) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (67) In them (both) will be fruits, and date- palms and pomegranates. (6 Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (69) Therein (Gardens) will be Khair?tun-His?n . (70) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (71) H?r] (beautiful, fair females) guarded in pavilions; (72) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (73) With Whom no man or jinni has had Tamth] before them. (74) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (75) Reclining on green cushions and rich beautiful mattresses. (76) Then which of the Blessings of your Lord will you both (jinn and men) deny? (77) Blessed is the Name of your Lord (All?h), the Owner of Majesty and Honour. (55-7

Did you find any thing eccept Two Gardens and Wives?

Aymen, God's Signs are Very Clear, how can we deny it?
If we try to twist or add to it, we are committing the same mistake as Code 19 and SUni and Shia do.
Are we committed to accept God's Signs (verses) even if it do not make sense in our limited brain? or should we twist to fit our understanding?

If you do not accept that Souls will be joined, then do not twist the verses in order to find Equal Rewards for Females Believers.
Peace

Soof

Peace "soof",

JK- Thats right freedom pf speech includes insulting at times but youll always find me backing up my statements with reason so it's not empty slander. Im a very harsh critic of people who say "sex is superficial, sex is not love, sex is not spiritual etc" because it triggers a known pattern in my brain of pure religious fundamentalism associated with the suppression of sexual activities MOSTLY INVOLVING WOMEN.

No, sorry, you are a reactionary. Not a sign of wisdom. Your distorted view of freedom of speech directly contradicts this which you believe in

Call to the way of your Lord with wisdom and goodly exhortation, and have disputations with them in the best manner; surely your Lord best knows those who go astray from His path, and He knows best those who follow the right way.
16125

And do not abuse those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest exceeding the limits they should abuse Allah out of ignorance. Thus have We made fair seeming to every people their deeds; then to their Lord shall be their return, so He will inform them of what they did
6108

So by the Qur'an there is no justification for insults despite how you may view one's opinions i.e. making prejudice statements.

JK- A man does NOT lose his sexual desire either when his sperm line is removed. Even if one of his testicles is he maintains sexual desire. It maybe less in case of one testicle but tht could be adjusted by him taking extra testosterone or anabolic. Same goes for removing part of the reproductive system of a women which is not responsible for producing the sexual hormones as ive explained before.

Ok I misread your first post, you said part of the genitalia. Whereas I referred to the whole genitalia being removed. So we should stop disputing this point.

JK- Why does sex come after and is not part of the initial attraction/bond already? Without the sexual hormones a man would not love a woman in the bonding sense at all. Hed might get to love her as one loves a person one gets close to but this is a different type of love altogether and it can be made with anyone. The love between men and women is unique and it is only possible due to sexual hormones interacting along with other hormones which are responsible for general human love sensation. Sex hormones control trigger those certain emotions in the first place.
As far as sex being used by men to show off their arrogance and pride and to put the women down infront of others, YES, this is very wrong IMO and never did i say that i support such.

Well my understanding is sex CAN be temporary, whereas as love lasts. What happens when that person cannot deliver in the bed anymore, do you cease to love that person, or is the person you grew to love still there, but a mere physical component of him/her has withered. To me people always get confused with SEX and LOVE. People have great sex with people and think they are in love with them, when they are more likely to be in love with the feeling of sex and not the person itself, hence it becomes pleasure seeking and not true love. As soon as that pleasure dries up (if it does) what use is the relationship?
Women can be just as arrogant, manipulative and heartless in relationships its not just Men. Men are infamous for dehumanizing women. But women can do the exact same thing, they enjoy sex as much as us. I never said you supported that, I just stated a point. It's not an attack then defend debate.

JK- I agree with you here that this is extremely bad. The whole body and the thoughts processed inside a woman's brain make up her beauty IMHO and the sexual hormones stimulate all that wonderful desire and a man who makes use of all of it.

JK- As i said why not "pathenogensis" then if sex was primarily for child birth and not bonding and more intense communication?

JK- There could be more feelings besides sex in the garden but i personally cannot think of anything more wonderful than sexual bonding EXCEPT the direct relationship/connection with GOD as is mentioned in the Quran. GOD Bless!

Well you can say WHY anything? God created us as He intended. Once again I said sex is first and foremost for PROCREATION. But God in his bounty has made it extremely enjoyable for us, He didn't need to. It could have been incredibly painful. Therefore there are other intentions behind sex i.e. sharing this pleasuresome experience with someone you love example being your spouse.

You say I cannot think of anything more wonderful because that is your world. You are limited by your understanding, but that does not mean that is all. Can you imagine something not being created, Just being? No because we cannot see anything like that in our world. We are limited by what we understand. But God tells us as such, He was not Created i.e. Eternal. Therefore if God was to tell us there is something greater and more wonderful than sex you would deny this because you cannot understand it or think of anything like it? Or would you reason that God knows what He is talking about? My point in saying this is maybe there IS something more to it than is described in the Qur'an remember it is only a similitude. There may be so much more.

Peace

huruf

Peace "huroof",

JK- No male can also mean the person who gives or initiates the love while the female receives it. Women usually like it when the man initiates the sexual love process instead of waiting for her to start. So no i dont think one can argue that male and female refer to giving and receiving of sperm only and hence reproduction. GOD Bless!

This as subjective as it can get.

Female and male are categories adscribed to the individuals that reproduce sexually and have nothing to do with any personal ideas or feelings about how females or males should feel. Anything you attach to that is subjective.

Salaam

huruf

Women can be just as arrogant, manipulative and heartless in relationships its not just Men. Men are infamous for dehumanizing women. But women can do the exact same thing, they enjoy sex as much as us. I never said you supported that, I just stated a point. It's not an attack then defend debate.

It is not because the Quran doesn't make abundantly clear, but still we seem to get this nonsense about presumed emotional, moral and sentimental differences between men and women, which ar enot there in the Quran nor in real life. The conditions inlife are different for men and females. How different again depends on each society on each seting and on each circumstance. HOWEVER, you are absolutely right, Soof, moral behaviour comes form each person, an each person of any sex can behave in any way. Society may push more persons of one sex than the other to certain behaviour or habits, but virtue or vice is always a personal and circumstancial product not a sexual determined thing.

Soof

It is not because the Quran doesn't make abundantly clear, but still we seem to get this nonsense about presumed emotional, moral and sentimental differences between men and women, which ar enot there in the Quran nor in real life. The conditions inlife are different for men and females. How different again depends on each society on each seting and on each circumstance. HOWEVER, you are absolutely right, Soof, moral behaviour comes form each person, an each person of any sex can behave in any way. Society may push more persons of one sex than the other to certain behaviour or habits, but virtue or vice is always a personal and circumstancial product not a sexual determined thing.

I absolutely agree. I wasn't trying to say women as a gender as bad as men. My point was saying there are just as bad women as there are men, which has nothing to do with gender. Especially where I live. Gender does not give us emotional predisposition, it is more of a nurture thing than nature. Man/Woman, Male/Female is exclusively referring to sexual gender. XX and XY. Anything else is added meaning/subjective.

Peace

belH

I absolutely agree. I wasn't trying to say women as a gender as bad as men. My point was saying there are just as bad women as there are men, which has nothing to do with gender. Especially where I live. Gender does not give us emotional predisposition, it is more of a nurture thing than nature. Man/Woman, Male/Female is exclusively referring to sexual gender. XX and XY. Anything else is added meaning/subjective.

Peace

Peace,
You are right, but remember that due to Male body streanth that is more than female, Male can endore more negative emotion than female before breaking down.

It is not because the Quran doesn't make abundantly clear, but still we seem to get this nonsense about presumed emotional, moral and sentimental differences between men and women, which ar enot there in the Quran nor in real life.

Peace,
the differences only in the ability to tolerate negative emotions. As far as our body needs of water, food, air, and sex and the way we fulfill, and the way we feel when fullfilled or not are the same. But our psychological part are different due to the envirnoment effect, and the self free well, and not due to differences in the way we were created.
Here a Quote of the research that discribe the psychological part

People describe their own psychological needs and harms in different ways; each way depends on their beliefs in what it should be, based on their culture, religion, and other moral beliefs. Such needs and harms are different from one culture to another, one person to another, and from time to time through out the same person life cycle. Examples of such needs and harms are love of God, success, respect, body look, relationships, religion beliefs, wealth, career, disrespect, family values, political beliefs, economic beliefs, and many other words that describe benefits and harms that are not related to the body?s basic needs and harms.
What I want to emphasize is (a) our souls are relaxed when we fulfill such needs and prevent such harms, and (b) we are the ones (our souls) who define such needs and harms.
On the basis of such findings, I can conclude, in regard to our psychological part that people learn, change, and adopt certain sets of events, and then use their brains to label them (using chemical coding) as either psychological needs or harms (negative or positive emotions). Such needs and harms then work as triggers for the production of our good liquid and bad liquid (e.g., serotonin and dopamine), which make us, feel good or bad every time the needs are fulfilled or the harms have occurred (in medical terms, it causes the release of the related monoamines with its receptors). The psychological part?s needs and harms are different from one person to another and from culture to culture, as well as, from time to time within the same human.

As an example, a father and mother from the Europe or an american culture might feel happy (good liquid release) when their daughter grows up and meets a man (sensed event to the father or mother) with whom she has a love relationship (dating period before marriage that is stored as a value in the father or the mother?s brain memory); in contrast, a father and mother from Saudi Arabia will be sad (bad liquid) if such an event happened to their daughter (they might even kill her). What makes the two families different from each other is the way they label a specific event (their daughter in love with a man to whom she is not married) in their brain?s memory?one family labels it as a happy event, and the other family labels it a sad event.

Peace

belH

Peace Belal,

I didn?t drop anything. Can?t someone be a witness and a driver at the same time?

When you say in Arabic ?Ana nagih wa sa3eed? (I am successful and happy), does this mean you are two people?

Peace,

Ayman

Peace Ayman,
Did God said Driver witness or Driver and Witness? In your above example you said "Ana" (I'm), but in the verse God did not mention any body, thus, A driver is one, and Witness is another one.

And there will come forth every soul with each will be a drive and a witness. (50-21)

That is the witness

Thus have We made of you an Ummah justly balanced That ye might be witnesses over the nations and the Messenger a witness over yourselves; and We appointed the Qiblah to which thou wast used, only to test those who followed the Messenger from those who would turn on their heels (from the faith). Indeed it was (a change) momentous except to those guided by Allah. And never would Allah make your faith of no effect. For Allah is to all people most surely full of kindness, Most Merciful. (2-143)

And that is the Driver

The Unbelievers will be driven to Hell in crowds; until, when they arrive there, its gates will be opened and its Keepers will say "Did not messengers come to you from among yourselves rehearsing to you the Signs of your Lord, and warning you of the meeting of this Day of yours?" The answer will be "True but the Decree of Punishment has been proved true against the Unbelievers!" (39-71)

Peace

huruf

Peace,
You are right, but remember that due to Male body streanth that is more than female, Male can endore more negative emotion than female before breaking down.

Says who?
Is it a fact that every man men with lesser body strength than other men can endure less?? negative emotion than those other more strongbodied men before breaking down?

Salaam

jonny_k

Peace "soof",

No, sorry, you are a reactionary. Not a sign of wisdom. Your distorted view of freedom of speech directly contradicts this which you believe in

Call to the way of your Lord with wisdom and goodly exhortation, and have disputations with them in the best manner; surely your Lord best knows those who go astray from His path, and He knows best those who follow the right way.
16125

And do not abuse those whom they call upon besides Allah, lest exceeding the limits they should abuse Allah out of ignorance. Thus have We made fair seeming to every people their deeds; then to their Lord shall be their return, so He will inform them of what they did
6108

So by the Qur'an there is no justification for insults despite how you may view one's opinions i.e. making prejudice statements.

JK- As humans it is natural that we get harsh or offensive in speech. This is why one needs to learn to tolerate and not become violent because any statement you may find not the least bit offensive, a sunni/shia will. Like saying "i dont believe Muhammad was the last prophet or messenger" can be more offensive to a sunni/shia than saying "your a f***ing idiot". It is very important to realize this relativity.

Ok I misread your first post, you said part of the genitalia. Whereas I referred to the whole genitalia being removed. So we should stop disputing this point.

JK- Ok good that this has been cleared now.

Well my understanding is sex CAN be temporary, whereas as love lasts. What happens when that person cannot deliver in the bed anymore, do you cease to love that person, or is the person you grew to love still there, but a mere physical component of him/her has withered. To me people always get confused with SEX and LOVE. People have great sex with people and think they are in love with them, when they are more likely to be in love with the feeling of sex and not the person itself, hence it becomes pleasure seeking and not true love. As soon as that pleasure dries up (if it does) what use is the relationship?

JK- When a person cannot deliver in bed anymore they may still love each other as humans, YES, but it wont be beneficial for them to act as a couple anymore IMO. BUT you forget if a person has a brain damage he can even stop feeling love or be without certain emotions so the bond with other humans will break unless that person finds someone like him/herself or gets medically cured. The point is SEXual LOVE is a type of LOVE and theres no way around this. There are many types of love and each is controlled by different hormones together with other complex processes in the brain.

Women can be just as arrogant, manipulative and heartless in relationships its not just Men. Men are infamous for dehumanizing women. But women can do the exact same thing, they enjoy sex as much as us. I never said you supported that, I just stated a point. It's not an attack then defend debate.

JK- Whether woman can be just as heartless as men im not too sure about but arrogant and manipulative i can agree. Regarding men they are FAMOUS for dehumanizing women. Look at the patriarchal mindset all over especially in the form of religion.

Well you can say WHY anything? God created us as He intended. Once again I said sex is first and foremost for PROCREATION. But God in his bounty has made it extremely enjoyable for us, He didn't need to. It could have been incredibly painful. Therefore there are other intentions behind sex i.e. sharing this pleasuresome experience with someone you love example being your spouse.

JK- Why do you insist it's first and foremost for procreation? As i said there couldve been asexual reproduction or parthogenesis. There was no need for GOD to introduce male and female if it were just for procreation.

You say I cannot think of anything more wonderful because that is your world. You are limited by your understanding, but that does not mean that is all. Can you imagine something not being created, Just being? No because we cannot see anything like that in our world. We are limited by what we understand. But God tells us as such, He was not Created i.e. Eternal. Therefore if God was to tell us there is something greater and more wonderful than sex you would deny this because you cannot understand it or think of anything like it? Or would you reason that God knows what He is talking about? My point in saying this is maybe there IS something more to it than is described in the Qur'an remember it is only a similitude. There may be so much more.

Peace

JK- I said there is something more wonderful than sex i.e. the direct connection with GOD. Did you miss that part? GOD Bless!

jonny_k

Peace "huruf",

This as subjective as it can get.

Female and male are categories adscribed to the individuals that reproduce sexually and have nothing to do with any personal ideas or feelings about how females or males should feel. Anything you attach to that is subjective.

Salaam

JK- No this is very much statistically verifiable and fit perfectly the attributed of "zakr wal untha". If you say male and female is ascribed to the individuals that reproduce then your just limiting your definition of the terms. After all the definitions are also made by humans and dont come from aliens. GOD Bless!

jonny_k

Peace "huruf",
There are significant biological induced gender differences between male and female too. It is NOT ALWAYS due to society shaping the individuals. http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_Differences
GOD Bless!

farida

Peace Ayman,
Did God said Driver witness or Driver and Witness? In your above example you said "Ana" (I'm), but in the verse God did not mention any body, thus, A driver is one, and Witness is another one.

And there will come forth every soul with each will be a drive and a witness. (50-21)

That is the witness

Thus have We made of you an Ummah justly balanced That ye might be witnesses over the nations and the Messenger a witness over yourselves; and We appointed the Qiblah to which thou wast used, only to test those who followed the Messenger from those who would turn on their heels (from the faith). Indeed it was (a change) momentous except to those guided by Allah. And never would Allah make your faith of no effect. For Allah is to all people most surely full of kindness, Most Merciful. (2-143)

And that is the Driver

The Unbelievers will be driven to Hell in crowds; until, when they arrive there, its gates will be opened and its Keepers will say "Did not messengers come to you from among yourselves rehearsing to you the Signs of your Lord, and warning you of the meeting of this Day of yours?" The answer will be "True but the Decree of Punishment has been proved true against the Unbelievers!" (39-71)

Peace

Salaam
I have no idea how come this thread has been diverted towards equality between the sexes and the role of sex particular to humans . Not only humans have sex and reproduce; animals too enjoy sex and plants too reproduce in a similar manner so, to take this thread in a different direction suggests that some 're trying to show off their modern approch to sexuality.

I understand your point brother Belal and see not a hint of discrimination towards women. In fact you have, in my opinion, been trying to emphasise how the survival of man and of woman is interdependen of each other in the final world and this is my understanding too. Men trying to demean women would ultimately lose out and vice versa.

So, as i understand, if you want ot be joined by your mate in the next world, be good to each other that you would happily mingle as one etrnal soul. ;D

peace

Wakas

Salaam Wakas

You are right. The root is Daal Seen Seen, and it means (to hide/burry, usually an unpleasant thing). This verb is also used in verse 1659.

peace Samia,

Thanks. The entry has been updated to

Dal-Siin-Siin = To hide, bury, conceal, insinuate, thrust, corrupt.

dassa vb. (1) impf. act. 1659

dassa vb. (2) perf. act. 9110

Lane's Lexicon, Volume 3, page 44