doubting Quran
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Peace
Jibreel is the one I know of, and no other. Not sure what you mean about disguising.
Regarding the human messenger his role is manifold and therefore you will have other factors to look at to be clear about the messenger's constitution. This one should explain, teach, and practice what he preaches.
Joe
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brothers and sisters ~
these past few days i have had a lot of doubt. as to faith, God, the Quran, religious truth...
Me too - and the conclusion I came to?
ALL religions are man made - NOT from God.
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ALL religions are man made - NOT from God.
I agree... yes
If we see this universe we see great wisdom of the creator but do we find the same great wisdom in any religion? nope
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The God promotes way of life rather than religion in the Quran so yes religion in the loose sense of the word is man made.
The quran describes a way of life rather than a religion from my reading of it.
PEACE
actually, this is what i am coming to understand, too. masha'allah. peace the Quran says so many wonderfully true things about God, and the attributes it lists are beautiful, diverse, and comprehensive. the Quran is a guide, a beautiful guide to be read, studied, considered, and learned from. yet it is not God, nor is it God embodied. Isalm (surrender to God) is a way of life, sirat al-mustaqim.
we can't simply internalize an abstract formula or mantra, we have to live in order to learn, and in order to walk the paths of peace He shows us to. alhamdulillah.
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Peace CD,
ALL religions are man made - NOT from God.
Exactly. All religions (millat) are manmade and without humans there would be no such thing as a religion. This is why there is no such thing as the religion of God and even monotheism is described in the great reading as the religion of Abaraham (millat Ibrahim). On the other hand, peacemaking (islam) is a universal obligation. It is our only true obligation to the god.
Peace,
Ayman
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Are you an athiest or a deist, cosmic?
I do believe in God - but not any religion.
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Do you believe the Quran came from God CD?
I used to.
I don't anymore.
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You don't think God has provided any guidance to his creatures?
I don't know - is the most honest answer I can give you.
I certainly don't believe he provided guidance in the form of books or prophets.
But I am open to the idea that he provided guidance in our inner being/conscience.
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cosmic ~ salam. in your youtube clip, you introduce the text description of the clip by giving praise and recognition to God, and call Him by Quranic attributes.
i did try doing as you do not, believing in God yet not the Quran. but i found myself calling Him by the Quranic asma al-husna in prayer, and agreeing with them, that yes, they did describe the Being we call God or Allah. actually, the asma al-husna were what first convinced me to look into Islam and the Quran.
it's good to have a relationship with God- i believe He has created us to worship Him, to be thankful, and to invite Him, the Living, into the details of our lives. that is how i understand deen.
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I don't know - is the most honest answer I can give you.
I certainly don't believe he provided guidance in the form of books or prophets.
But I am open to the idea that he provided guidance in our inner being/conscience.
That's what I think the prophet's are, people who's inner being and conscience/consciousness is guided by God, by the spirit, the Ruh Allah. I think a lot of religious believers make the mistake of seeing them as machines, with one purpose only, as if God was only using human beings as prophets because he couldn't find a tape recorder. Whereas in reality they're as fallible as the rest of us. But still with an important role to play. After all, without the prophet's, hardly anyone would have heard of God, as a singular entity, so it can hardly all have been an accident that now half the world is Christian or Muslim.
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cosmic ~ salam. in your youtube clip, you introduce the text description of the clip by giving praise and recognition to God, and call Him by Quranic attributes.
i did try doing as you do not, believing in God yet not the Quran. but i found myself calling Him by the Quranic asma al-husna in prayer, and agreeing with them, that yes, they did describe the Being we call God or Allah. actually, the asma al-husna were what first convinced me to look into Islam and the Quran.
it's good to have a relationship with God- i believe He has created us to worship Him, to be thankful, and to invite Him, the Living, into the details of our lives. that is how i understand deen.
Good for you - I'm sure your faith is very sincere.
My faith is also very sincere and I have tried for a long time to believe the Qur'an is the word of God.
But I simply can't.
For example Hell in the Qur'an is described in such a way that I find it impossible to see as some sort of allegory or metaphor. Did you see this video I made here
http//uk.youtube.com/watch?v=Zd1P8SPcXPY
)
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That's what I think the prophet's are, people who's inner being and conscience/consciousness is guided by God, by the spirit, the Ruh Allah. I think a lot of religious believers make the mistake of seeing them as machines, with one purpose only, as if God was only using human beings as prophets because he couldn't find a tape recorder. Whereas in reality they're as fallible as the rest of us. But still with an important role to play. After all, without the prophet's, hardly anyone would have heard of God, as a singular entity, so it can hardly all have been an accident that now half the world is Christian or Muslim.
I don't think he sent prophets to guide us.
What I am saying I am open to (I mean it is something that could be true - but not sure about) is the possibility that God has given each and everyone of us an inner light, an inner nature or conscience (or Fitrah) that is inclined towards good/morality etc...
But I don't believe in Prophets or Holy books.
I believe we are all charged with working things out for ourselves.
Nor do I think there are moral absolutes of what is 'right' or 'wrong' to everything - it depends on one's circumstances and perception, ability, and many other things.
But I say AGAIN - I reject completely the idea that God sent prophets or holy books.
These are all man-made and stem from man's (misguided but well-meant) desire to "Share" the truth he has found with others.
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sorry - double post
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I don't think he sent prophets to guide us.
What I am saying I am open to (I mean it is something that could be true - but not sure about) is the possibility that God has given each and everyone of us an inner light, an inner nature or conscience (or Fitrah) that is inclined towards good/morality etc...
But I don't believe in Prophets or Holy books.
I believe we are all charged with working things out for ourselves.
Nor do I think there are moral absolutes of what is 'right' or 'wrong' to everything - it depends on one's circumstances and perception, ability, and many other things.
But I say AGAIN - I reject completely the idea that God sent prophets or holy books.
These are all man-made and stem from man's (misguided but well-meant) desire to "Share" the truth he has found with others.
Yet sharing the truth is very successful - after all, we're typing these messages on computers, not stone tablets.
Why not for religious guidance?
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I don't think he sent prophets to guide us.
What I am saying I am open to (I mean it is something that could be true - but not sure about) is the possibility that God has given each and everyone of us an inner light, an inner nature or conscience (or Fitrah) that is inclined towards good/morality etc...
But I don't believe in Prophets or Holy books.
I believe we are all charged with working things out for ourselves.
that actually sounds very Quaker. they also downplay the absolute importance of scripture, and talk about an "inner light" of God within all people, and focus on person truth-seeking.
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I don't think he sent prophets to guide us.
What I am saying I am open to (I mean it is something that could be true - but not sure about) is the possibility that God has given each and everyone of us an inner light, an inner nature or conscience (or Fitrah) that is inclined towards good/morality etc...
But I don't believe in Prophets or Holy books.
I believe we are all charged with working things out for ourselves.
Nor do I think there are moral absolutes of what is 'right' or 'wrong' to everything - it depends on one's circumstances and perception, ability, and many other things.
But I say AGAIN - I reject completely the idea that God sent prophets or holy books.
These are all man-made and stem from man's (misguided but well-meant) desire to "Share" the truth he has found with others.
The trouble with our inner light is that it only shines so long as we're spiritually clean. When a person keeps on committing sins, lying, cheating, hurting and harming other people, it gets covered up, to the point that we become convinced that our 'conscience' is telling us that the bad things we do are in fact good. So when a thief first steals, they might be going against their conscience, and they might feel bad about it. But the 20th time, or 100th time they steal, it will not be in spite of, but because of their instincts - it will really feel right to them. At no stage will they realise that their conscience has been entirely buried by their greed.
Our conscience only works when our Nafs, the desires that constitute our 'Self', are subordinated to our Ruh, the will of God inside us. But the fact is that we all sin, and we are all children of sinners, going back all the way to Adam. No human being is without sin, so it is impossible for us to really be certain of our consciences without some external guidance. So we have religion, which is like a light house, providing us with hope and direction amidst the stormy seas of life in this world.