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  4. "Quran Only" vs "Quran + Worship Practices"

"Quran Only" vs "Quran + Worship Practices"

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Questions/Comments on the Quran
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    TheSubmitter
    wrote on last edited by
    #41

    Peace.

    I agree. The label Quran only-muslim, Koranist, and other labels like these are created by people that don't get it. I guess it is in our human nature to want to label something without having verified our labels to see if they match with the facts. For example the word koranist that some people here use, does not even exist in the Quran = Invention. They have invented these labels = Man-made. Some people like to create labels because they want security. They want to have a different set of rules and rituals that they can follow every day. Instead of focusing on doing good deeds = External. They focus on themselves = Internal. And when people focus too much on themselves = Narcissism. You know, i think the reason why man-made religions and cults are so attractive to the masses is because the cults and the religions have lots of rituals and practices that can give their members a sense of control and security. They will be given rituals and practices that allow them to do the practices and rituals on autopilot = Not think. When people don't need to think, they can live their life in a fantasy island were everything is beautiful and romantic and they are pleasing and changing the world. But by doing lots of man-made and fake rituals and practices, they neither will change the world nor change themselves. The fact is that there is no magic pills or rituals that can lead people to the truth. There is no fantasy neither. I hate to say it, but reality is ugly and this life is only an illusion.

    Peace david_k and others

    I understand that you dont like the label Quran Only. I am wondering why is that? Aren't you finding everything in Quran alone? Even the practices, that I believe were issued to the public by our messengers and public transmitted them to us and are not contradicting Quran.

    As I understand for most people on this forum "God Only = Quran Only". Then why is Quran Only label is offensive and God only is more appropriate?

    (This is an honest question in order to learn your point of view.)

    TheSubmitter

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      unknownuser
      wrote on last edited by
      #42

      Peace jonny,

      JK- Why is that?

      Stupid numerology!

      7431 ....and the disbelievers to say "What God intended with that (as) an example?

      Now 803+1171 equals 1974.

      Countless combinations...

      802 + 1172
      801 + 1173
      800 + 1174
      799 + 1175
      798 + 1176
      797 + 1177
      796 + 1178
      795 + 1179
      794 + 1180
      793 + 1181
      792 + 1182
      791 + 1183
      790 + 1184
      789 + 1185
      788 + 1186
      787 + 1187
      786 + 1188
      785 + 1189
      784 + 1190

      Countless events...
      http//www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1C1CHMB_enUS310US310&q=1974+timeline&btnG=Search

      1. the oldest available manuscript via archaelogical findings and 2) the numerical structure since GOD also gives example that His books are numbered or numerically structured
        8319 Do you know what `Elleyyeen is?
        83 20 kitaabun marqoom i.e. A book/writing numbered.

      961

      Not about physical media nor did an old manuscript fall the sky -- the book is ingrained in people's minds.

      5417

      5422

      5432

      5440

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        unknownuser
        wrote on last edited by
        #43

        Peace david_k and others

        I understand that you dont like the label Quran Only. I am wondering why is that? Aren't you finding everything in Quran alone? Even the practices, that I believe were issued to the public by our messengers and public transmitted them to us and are not contradicting Quran.

        As I understand for most people on this forum "God Only = Quran Only". Then why is Quran Only label is offensive and God only is more appropriate?

        (This is an honest question in order to learn your point of view.)

        TheSubmitter

        That is because i believe that labelling ourselves with other than what God has told us in the Quran is wrong. In my opinion the only labels accepted are the labels we find in quran. And those labels are Mumin, Muslim, Monotheist, etc.

        In order to learn my point of view, you can read this article below. It explains the difference between Religion and system

        http//aboutquran.com/

        And read this thread below as well. It explains the difference between the Sunni Islam Salaat, and the Salaat of Quran. Very interesting read indeed

        http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=16137.msg159300#msg159300

        Have a nice day.

        David_k

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          jonny_k
          wrote on last edited by
          #44

          Peace "Eid",

          Peace jonny,

          Stupid numerology!

          7431 ....and the disbelievers to say "What God intended with that (as) an example?

          JK- This is a statement of mockery as if to say "what the heck is tht? it aint significant whtsoever". This actually applies more to the deliberate rejectors of the signs of GOD which im beginning to think you are because you are consitently avoiding my qs. You have not answered yet whether "rahman" is spelled "ra Ha meem alif noon" or "ra Ha meem noon" and also how "salat" and "'alaa" are spelled.

          Countless combinations...

          802 + 1172
          801 + 1173
          800 + 1174
          799 + 1175
          798 + 1176
          797 + 1177
          796 + 1178
          795 + 1179
          794 + 1180
          793 + 1181
          792 + 1182
          791 + 1183
          790 + 1184
          789 + 1185
          788 + 1186
          787 + 1187
          786 + 1188
          785 + 1189
          784 + 1190

          JK- Where did you get those GVs from? Are you inclduing shadda letters twice now? Are you omitting some alifs? What are you doing. SHOW what youve done.

          Countless events...
          http//www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1C1CHMB_enUS310US310&q=1974+timeline&btnG=Search

          961

          Not about physical media nor did an old manuscript fall the sky -- the book is ingrained in people's minds.

          5417

          5422

          5432

          5440

          JK- WRONG. The BOOK/WRITING(AL-KITAAB) is NOT in ingrained in peoples minds. Thats why it is called writing(from root KTB i.e. WRITTEN). Thats why the Quran is not just a recital but also a written scripture(al-kitaab). The RECITAL MAY be claimed to be so BUT does it make sense that GOD would ingrain even that in the minds of sunni/shia sectarians? I think not. AND i mentioned it before that the above verses dont necessarily impyl to commit the Arabic of the Quran into memory and reciting it like a parrot BUT that it is easy to remember ITS TOPICS BECAUSE THEY ARE OFT REPEATED THROUGHOUT. NOW please answer my questions above. GOD Bless!

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            unknownuser
            wrote on last edited by
            #45

            Peace jonny,

            JK- This is a statement of mockery as if to say "what the heck is tht? it aint significant whtsoever". This actually applies more to the deliberate rejectors of the signs of GOD which im beginning to think you are because you are consitently avoiding my qs. You have not answered yet whether "rahman" is spelled "ra Ha meem alif noon" or "ra Ha meem noon" and also how "salat" and "'alaa" are spelled.

            Yes I am 100% rejector of the stupid code for the naive cattle. If you want to learn to spell then open another thread.

            JK- Where did you get those GVs from? Are you inclduing shadda letters twice now? Are you omitting some alifs? What are you doing. SHOW what youve done.

            I'm showing basic math and the numerous (i.e. numerology) ways to get 1974...

            1973 + 1
            1972 + 2
            1971 + 3
            1970 + 4
            1969 + 5
            1968 + 6
            1967 + 7
            1966 + 8
            1965 + 9
            1964 + 10
            1963 + 11
            1962 + 12
            1961 + 13
            1960 + 14
            1959 + 15
            1958 + 16
            1957 + 17
            1956 + 18
            1955 + 19

            JK- WRONG. The BOOK/WRITING(AL-KITAAB) is NOT in ingrained in peoples minds.

            Then what was it that the prophet (God bless him) was told to read, a book from the sky?

            961

            Do you understand what is an allegory, ?

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              jonny_k
              wrote on last edited by
              #46

              Peace "Eid",

              Peace jonny,

              Yes I am 100% rejector of the stupid code for the naive cattle. If you want to learn to spell then open another thread.

              JK- So you still disagree with the initial count in sura 19? That all relies on YOU, NOT ME, knowing how to spell correctly. Im testing you here. So kindly spell those words for me.

              I'm showing basic math and the numerous (i.e. numerology) ways to get 1974...

              1973 + 1
              1972 + 2
              1971 + 3
              1970 + 4
              1969 + 5
              1968 + 6
              1967 + 7
              1966 + 8
              1965 + 9
              1964 + 10
              1963 + 11
              1962 + 12
              1961 + 13
              1960 + 14
              1959 + 15
              1958 + 16
              1957 + 17
              1956 + 18
              1955 + 19

              JK- WHERE are you getting those GVs from in sura 74? I didnt just add any no. I used the LETTERS in 741-2 which call upon the secret/hidden one to be revealed. Thats the signficance of it. I wonder what you re doing here?

              Then what was it that the prophet (God bless him) was told to read, a book from the sky?

              961

              Do you understand what is an allegory, ?

              JK- Who said from the sky? The kitaab was formed later as Muhammad or his companions wrote it down ALL by inspiration of GOD. Thats why I said that the Quran besides being a recital is also a WRITTEN document(al-kitaab) and that writing down mustve been isnpired by GOD too just like the initial recital was inspired OTHERWISE why would GOD call the very same recital "al-kitaab" too in other verses? It is through this written document that we can confirm the Quran, NOT the recital as made by Muhammad for do not have a tape recorder to listen what he said. As for you relying on sunni/shia memorization anyone can easily memorize the Quran as you know it and add a few verses. Then just to make a point he carries on the tradition to his/her children. So what then? Does it mean the Quran is no longer preserved? GET IT NOW?
              As for an allegory it is something symbolic like associating human moods to non living things/body parts for example
              3865 On that day we will seal their mouths; their hands and feet will bear witness to everything they had done.
              GOD Bless!

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                jonny_k
                wrote on last edited by
                #47

                Peace again "Eid",
                It appears to me that you believe the Quran is only an inspired recital by GOD. Your making a big mistake if you think that. GOD has on numerous occassions called the Quran AL-KITAAB that is THE BOOK i.e. SOMETHING WRITTEN DOWN WHICH INOLVES LETTERS. So that means the Quran mustve been protected down to the letter. GOD Bless!

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                  unknownuser
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #48

                  Peace jonny,

                  JK- So you still disagree with the initial count in sura 19?

                  Yes, I disagree with all those counts only one is #of Q (57) in chapter 50 is multiple as is #of Q (57) in chapter 14 is multiple -- nothing special and not multiple in over 100 chapters.

                  JK- WHERE are you getting those GVs from in sura 74? I didnt just add any no. I used the LETTERS in 741-2 which call upon the secret/hidden one to be revealed. Thats the signficance of it. I wonder what you re doing here?

                  http//www.openburhan.net/ob_w.php?w=74505

                  Click Browse Word

                  Read in context! Take the numbers/conjectures especially nineteen out of your head!

                  1974 / 19 = 103.894737 is not multiple! Meaningless conjecture same as this...

                  ABBA Dancing Queen 1976 / 19 = 104!
                  http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=REElUors1pQ

                  THERE IS NO SECRET and chapter 74 addresses a person...

                  You, you the wrapped/covered
                  Stand, so warn/give notice
                  And your Lord, so magnify/exalt
                  And your clothes, so purify/clean
                  And the idol worship, so abandon
                  And give your wealth and person selflessly
                  And to your Lord, so be patient

                  JK- Who said from the sky? The kitaab was formed later as Muhammad or his companions wrote it down ALL by inspiration of GOD. Thats why I said that the Quran besides being a recital is also a WRITTEN document(al-kitaab) and that writing down mustve been isnpired by GOD too just like the initial recital was inspired OTHERWISE why would GOD call the very same recital "al-kitaab" too in other verses? It is through this written document that we can confirm the Quran, NOT the recital as made by Muhammad for do not have a tape recorder to listen what he said. As for you relying on sunni/shia memorization anyone can easily memorize the Quran as you know it and add a few verses. Then just to make a point he carries on the tradition to his/her children. So what then? Does it mean the Quran is no longer preserved? GET IT NOW?

                  You are babbling again -- Quran was revealed/given/send down NOT a physical book or on CD as they have it now.

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                    jonny_k
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #49

                    Peace "Eid",

                    Peace jonny,

                    Yes, I disagree with all those counts only one is #of Q (57) in chapter 50 is multiple as is #of Q (57) in chapter 14 is multiple -- nothing special and not multiple in over 100 chapters.

                    JK- You still disagree depite me clearly poiting out how you counted wrongly USING A PERSIAN UNICODE DATABASE. Tell me something are you even an Arab because im beginning to doubt it. Every real Arab knows that the unicode is PERSIAN wth hell lot of fake alif additions. YET you rely more on that than on the image which shows the original script.

                    http//www.openburhan.net/ob_w.php?w=74505

                    Browse Word

                    Read in context and take the numbers/conjectures especially nineteen out of your head!

                    THERE IS NO SECRET and chapter 74 addresses a person...

                    You, you the wrapped/covered
                    Stand, so warn/give notice
                    And your Lord, so magnify/exalt
                    And your clothes, so purify/clean
                    And the idol worship, so abandon.
                    And give your wealth and person selflessly
                    And to your Lord, so be patient.

                    1974 / 19 = 103.894737 is not multiple!

                    ABBA Dancing Queen 1976 / 19 = 104!

                    http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=REElUors1pQ

                    JK- This can all well be allegorical. Youve been spoonfed by sunnis/shias. Thats why you think the verses are referring to a person namely Muhammad. What these verses actuall symbolize is that the code-19 will purify the garment i.e. Mushaf and extract from it the Quran freeing it from non Quranic statements.

                    You are babbling again -- Quran was revealed/given/send down NOT a physical book or on CD as they have it now.

                    JK- WHAT IS AL-KITAAB? You didnt address that. I KNOW QURAN WAS REVEALED AND I KNOW IT ALL HAPPENED NATURALLY VIA NATURAL PROCESSES IN MUHAMMAD'S BRAIN. IN THE SAME WAY MUHAMAD AND HIS COMPANIONS ALSO WROTE DOWN THE QURAN NATURALLY NO MAGIC BUT ALL HAPPENED WITH INSPIRATION FROM GOD i.e WITH HIS AUTHROTIY. DO U GET THIS? GOD Bless!

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                      unknownuser
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #50

                      Peace jonny,

                      http//www.openburhan.net/ob_w.php?w=74505

                      Click Browse Word

                      JK- This can all well be allegorical. Youve been spoonfed by sunnis/shias. Thats why you think the verses are referring to a person namely Muhammad. What these verses actuall symbolize is that the code-19 will purify the garment i.e. Mushaf and extract from it the Quran freeing it from non Quranic statements.

                      Read in context! Take the numbers/conjectures especially nineteen out of your head!

                      THERE IS NO SECRET and chapter 74 addresses a person...

                      You, you the wrapped/covered
                      Stand, so warn/give notice
                      And your Lord, so magnify/exalt
                      And your clothes, so purify/clean
                      And the idol worship, so abandon
                      And give your wealth and person selflessly
                      And to your Lord, so be patient

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                        jonny_k
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #51

                        Peace "Eid",

                        Peace jonny,

                        http//www.openburhan.net/ob_w.php?w=74505

                        Click Browse Word

                        JK- WER NOT TALKING ABOUT ALL "YA AYUHAL..." phrases. The no 19 is ONLY MENTIONED AND ADDRESSED IN SURA 74 THAT IS WHY WE TOOK 741-2 and coincidentally??? the two verses GV equals 1974.

                        Read in context! Take the numbers/conjectures especially nineteen out of your head!

                        THERE IS NO SECRET and chapter 74 addresses a person...

                        You, you the wrapped/covered
                        Stand, so warn/give notice
                        And your Lord, so magnify/exalt
                        And your clothes, so purify/clean
                        And the idol worship, so abandon
                        And give your wealth and person selflessly
                        And to your Lord, so be patient

                        JK- NO IT DOESNT. Not if you read the whole sura especially 7421-37. This is an allegorical sura taking about a sign of GOD i.e. significance of no 19. Here are those verses translated from the following article http//19.org/index.php?id=14,175,0,0,1,0 (READ the whole article first before throwing silly comments)
                        7421 He(the rejecting disbeliever) looked.
                        7422 He frowned and scowled.
                        7423 Then he turned away arrogantly.
                        7424 He said, "This is but an impressive illusion/magic!"
                        7425 "This is human made."
                        7426 I will cast him into SAQAR!
                        7427 And what will explain to you what the SAQAR is?
                        7428 It leaves nothing, it lets nothing (NOT MORE, NOT LESS; PRECISE; PERFECT);
                        7429 VISIBLE (LAWAHATUN) to PEOPLE (BASHAR) (universal)!
                        7430 On it is Nineteen.
                        7431 As guardians of fire we appointed none except angels, and we assigned their number (1) to torment the unappreciative disbelievers, (2) to convince People of the Book, (3) to strengthen the faith of the faithful, (4) to remove all traces of doubt from the hearts of People of the Book, as well as the believers, and (5) to expose those who have disease in their hearts, and the unappreciative disbelievers; they will say, "What did God mean by this allegory?" God thus sends astray whomever He wills (or, whoever wills), and guides whomever He wills (or, whoever wills). None knows the soldiers of your Lord except He. IT (HIYA) is a reminder for the people.
                        7432 Indeed, by the Moon.
                        7433 By the night as it passes.
                        7434 And the morning as it shines.
                        7435 This (NUMBER) is one of the GREATEST (KUBRA).
                        7436 A WARNING (NAZEER) for the PEOPLE (BASHAR).
                        7437 For those who want to progress or regress.

                        GOD Bless!

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                          unknownuser
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #52

                          Peace jonny,

                          JK- WER NOT TALKING ABOUT ALL "YA AYUHAL..." phrases. The no 19 is ONLY MENTIONED AND ADDRESSED IN SURA 74 THAT IS WHY WE TOOK 741-2 and coincidentally??? the two verses GV equals 1974.

                          Quran is, not sure what book you reading.

                          Ya ayyuha -- addresses a person!

                          Gv is nonsense!

                          Output desired (illa fitna) = selective input

                          JK- NO IT DOESNT. Not if you read the whole sura especially 7421-37. This is an allegorical sura taking about a sign of GOD i.e. significance of no 19. Here are those verses translated from the following article http//19.org/index.php?id=14,175,0,0,1,0 (READ the whole article first before throwing silly comments)

                          Why waste time reading that silly site, clueless people infected with fitna.

                          7435 This (NUMBER)

                          Where is this word (NUMBER?)

                          Manipulation, distortion, see only (illa fitna) NUMBER all things nineteen -- the disease.

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                            jonny_k
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #53

                            Peace "Eid",

                            Peace jonny,

                            Quran is, not sure what book you reading.

                            Ya ayyuha -- addresses a person!

                            Gv is nonsense!

                            Output desired (illa fitna) = selective input

                            JK- Sura 74 NOT about person but allegorically about secret of no. 19. "illa fitna" INCOMPLETE should be "illa(for the following five reasons)..." and only read that way does it make sense. It makes no sense to say that the fitnah of count 19 increases the faith of the faithful. This has been discussed in great detail here
                            http//19.org/forum/index.php/m/47670/7191/0///0/#msg_47670 onwards

                            Why waste time reading that silly site, clueless people infected with fitna.

                            Where is this word (NUMBER?)

                            JK- 7430 'alaiha TIS'ATAH ASHAR
                            7431 ...wama ja'alna 'IDDADAT(THEIR NUMBER, referring to the previous verses 30 logically)AHUM...

                            Manipulation, distortion, see only (illa fitna) NUMBER all things nineteen -- the disease.

                            JK- 1st it is not only a fitnah. It is a fitnah for the disbeleivers and it serves the purpose of strenghtening the faith of the beleivers. This is excatyly what happened to many of us as we witnessed this awesome numerical structure. Our confidence that the Quran is the Word of GOD has actually INCREASED. Your interopretation of 7431 is thus falsified and nonsensible. GOD Bless!

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                              truthseeker11
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #54

                              Salaam Q_student,

                              RK produced WRONG and UNAUTHENTICATED information.
                              Quran is Mufassal and detailed.

                              I agree.

                              Salaam

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                                truthseeker11
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #55

                                Peace thesubmitter,

                                I understand that you dont like the label Quran Only. I am wondering why is that? Aren't you finding everything in Quran alone? Even the practices, that I believe were issued to the public by our messengers and public transmitted them to us and are not contradicting Quran.

                                As I understand for most people on this forum "God Only = Quran Only". Then why is Quran Only label is offensive and God only is more appropriate?

                                (This is an honest question in order to learn your point of view.)

                                I have already answered this above in the following post

                                http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598166.msg198221#msg198221

                                Perhaps you missed it.

                                Quran only = limiting only to signs/ayaat in the qur'aan (contradicts 4153)

                                God alone = considering ALL the signs of The God (the qur'aan + the signs in the horizons and within ourselves) and following/obeying/submitting/making peace to God alone. This is endorsed by The God Himself (please see my referenced post above for qur'aanic evidences).

                                I have faith/trust that the qur'aan is fully detailed and enough for our guidance. Part of that guidance is to ponder on the extra-qur'aanic signs/ayaat to arrive at the truth. So even though the qur'aan is fully detailed and enough relevant to our guidance, we cannot limit ourselves only to the signs in the qur'aan and ignore the signs/ayaat in the horizons and within ourselves, hence the term God alone instead of qur'aan only. Hope that clarifies this issue.

                                Peace

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                                  Q_student
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #56

                                  Peace "Eid",

                                  JK- Sura 74 NOT about person but allegorically about secret of no. 19. "illa fitna" INCOMPLETE should be "illa(for the following five reasons)..." and only read that way does it make sense. It makes no sense to say that the fitnah of count 19 increases the faith of the faithful. This has been discussed in great detail here
                                  http//19.org/forum/index.php/m/47670/7191/0///0/#msg_47670 onwards

                                  JK- 7430 'alaiha TIS'ATAH ASHAR
                                  7431 ...wama ja'alna 'IDDADAT(THEIR NUMBER, referring to the previous verses 30 logically)AHUM...

                                  JK- 1st it is not only a fitnah. It is a fitnah for the disbeleivers and it serves the purpose of strenghtening the faith of the beleivers. This is excatyly what happened to many of us as we witnessed this awesome numerical structure. Our confidence that the Quran is the Word of GOD has actually INCREASED. Your interopretation of 7431 is thus falsified and nonsensible. GOD Bless!

                                  Salaam JK

                                  Peace "Eid",

                                  JK- Sura 74 NOT about person but allegorically about secret of no. 19. "illa fitna" INCOMPLETE should be "illa(for the following five reasons)..."

                                  There seems to be a lot of allegorical mania. Rk has translated this chapter's initial verses as follows.

                                  O you hidden secret.

                                  Come out and warn.

                                  Extol your Lord.

                                  In other words he has translated as a hidden secret.

                                  In one of your previous posts you said that ;

                                  JK- Simple. 1) Use of classcial arabic dictionaries 2) proper analysis of immediate conext and 3) cross referencing with other parts of the Quran that use the same or similar terms. This is how it's supposed to work mainly with the Quran. Other than that if archaelogical evidence pops up supporting an aforementioned Quranic statement, the better.

                                  Using these three methods ,prove that
                                  Al-mudaththir = hidden secret
                                  Regards

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                                    unknownuser
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #57

                                    Peace jonny,

                                    JK- Sura 74 NOT about person but allegorically about secret of no. 19. "illa fitna" INCOMPLETE should be "illa(for the following five reasons)..." and only read that way does it make sense. It makes no sense to say that the fitnah of count 19 increases the faith of the faithful. This has been discussed in great detail here
                                    http//19.org/forum/index.php/m/47670/7191/0///0/#msg_47670 onwards

                                    JK- 7430 'alaiha TIS'ATAH ASHAR
                                    7431 ...wama ja'alna 'IDDADAT(THEIR NUMBER, referring to the previous verses 30 logically)AHUM...

                                    JK- 1st it is not only a fitnah. It is a fitnah for the disbeleivers and it serves the purpose of strenghtening the faith of the beleivers. This is excatyly what happened to many of us as we witnessed this awesome numerical structure. Our confidence that the Quran is the Word of GOD has actually INCREASED. Your interopretation of 7431 is thus falsified and nonsensible. GOD Bless!

                                    37

                                    http//www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=3&vid=7

                                    You were never a believer fooled by a cheap trick false code; if you had a slight bit of intelligence and knew basic math you?d easily see that it?s all random meaningless conjectures...

                                    1. Start with preconception to meet desire (fitna)
                                    2. Try all sorts of combinations look for anything nineteen (a hit gives you a buzz)
                                    3. Show only multiples hide everything else that is not multiple

                                    One can find multiples every day; here is chapter 9 with the last two verses included?

                                    Fact sequence of chapter 9 is multiple!
                                    123456789101112131415161718192021222324252627282930313233343536373839404142434445464748495051525354555657
                                    585960616263646566676869707172737475767778798081828384858687888990919293949596979899100
                                    101102103104105106107108109110111112113114115116117118119120121122123124125126127128129

                                    Copy/paste into miracle calculator and see?
                                    http//www.apostatesofislam.com/quran/analyzer.htm

                                    Chapter........verses.........Sum
                                    1.......+.......7...........=.......8.........even
                                    2.......+.......286.......=.......288.......even
                                    3.......+.......200.......=.......203.......odd
                                    ?..............?..............?.......?
                                    ?..............?..............?.......?
                                    113.....+.......5.........=.......118.......even
                                    114.....+.......6.........=.......120.......even

                                    6555...........6236............6555.......6236

                                    (6+5+5+5) + (6+2+3+6) = 19 ? 2 is multiple!

                                    9128

                                    9129

                                    Total letters 9128 = 60 (even verse total is same as #of even verses in Quran = 60)
                                    Total letters 9129 = 54 (odd verse total is same as #of odd verses in Quran = 54)

                                    60 + 54 = 114 is multiple!

                                    The 19th word is Allah!

                                    Total words 9128 = 14
                                    Total words 9129 = 15

                                    Words, verse are multiple!
                                    14 128 15 129 = 19 x 74358691

                                    (9 + 129 + 12 / 19 = 14 is multiple!

                                    Total gv of 9128 = 2896
                                    Total gv of 9129 = 3882

                                    Verses, words, values are multiple!
                                    128 129 60 54 2896 3882 = 19 x 6743663443629678

                                    Countless other things?

                                    I know it disturbs you that it works with 9128-129 ? repent before its too late!l

                                    7431 And We did not make the fire's company (guards) ONLY/illa angels, and We did not make their number/count ONLY/illa a test to those who disbelieve...

                                    The internet is littered with those infected (fitna) searching for all things nineteen.

                                    http//bruceadumas.com/db2/00111/bruceadumas.com/_uimages/Curious-Cows-13-x-19.jpg

                                    "Curious Cows"

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                                    • U Offline
                                      U Offline
                                      unknownuser
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #58

                                      Peace thesubmitter,

                                      I have already answered this above in the following post

                                      http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9598166.msg198221#msg198221

                                      Perhaps you missed it.

                                      Quran only = limiting only to signs/ayaat in the qur'aan (contradicts 4153)

                                      God alone = considering ALL the signs of The God (the qur'aan + the signs in the horizons and within ourselves) and following/obeying/submitting/making peace to God alone. This is endorsed by The God Himself (please see my referenced post above for qur'aanic evidences).

                                      I have faith/trust that the qur'aan is fully detailed and enough for our guidance. Part of that guidance is to ponder on the extra-qur'aanic signs/ayaat to arrive at the truth. So even though the qur'aan is fully detailed and enough relevant to our guidance, we cannot limit ourselves only to the signs in the qur'aan and ignore the signs/ayaat in the horizons and within ourselves, hence the term God alone instead of qur'aan only. Hope that clarifies this issue.

                                      Peace

                                      Peace truthseeker11

                                      Great answears. I totally agree. "The Quran only" is limiting the system to only the Quran. When for example muslims found in the Quran a verse which is about big bang, they had to compare it to the scientific findings = External. Off course information about the big bang was in the quran over 1000 years before modern science and the west found that big bang is a fact. However, to see that the scientific in quran was a fact they compared it to modern scientific findings. So Quran can't therefore be limited to itself only.

                                      One short period of my life, i almost only read the quran and stopped reading other books because i thought the Quran was sufficient for Development. But that was wrong because it was other sources that lead me to the Quran in the first place. yes, the Quran explains itself, and yes the Spiritual/religious laws we should follow are only the laws in the Quran. So the quran is the only book for spiritual/religious laws. BUT, we can gather knowledge from others sources like science, philosophy, psychology, nature etc. I actually think that if we know more about different subjects, we will understand more from the Quranic verses. For example someone that has knowledge about science will understand the scientific verses in the Quran. Or someone who has knowledge about philosophy will understand the philosophical verses in the Quran. And someone with lots of life experience and which has studied psychology will understand the verses in the Quran which talks about psychology and human nature. Someone who has knowledge when it comes to laws of nature will understand the natural/universal laws of the Quran. Someone who has knowledge about Politics or law will understand the verses in the Quran which deals about matters of law and human rights. And someone who is an archeologists will be able to compare his archeological findings with verses in the Quran that talks about his findings.

                                      Conclusion

                                      In my opinion, it is of total necessity to reflect upon nature, philosophy and science etc. and compare it to the Quranic verses, so that the verses that deals with these topics will become clear. Sitting and reading Quran alone 24/7 won't change the world. We have to read the Quran, put its principles and laws in practice, Compare it to the Universal laws and the laws in nature, and compare it to scientific and archeological findings.

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                                      0
                                      • Q Offline
                                        Q Offline
                                        Q_student
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #59

                                        Peace jonny,

                                        37

                                        http//www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=3&vid=7

                                        You were never a believer fooled by a cheap trick false code; if you had a slight bit of intelligence and knew basic math you?d easily see that it?s all random meaningless conjectures...

                                        1. Start with preconception to meet desire (fitna)
                                        2. Try all sorts of combinations look for anything nineteen (a hit gives you a buzz)
                                        3. Show only multiples hide everything else that is not multiple

                                        One can find multiples every day; here is chapter 9 with the last two verses included?

                                        Fact sequence of chapter 9 is multiple!
                                        123456789101112131415161718192021222324252627282930313233343536373839404142434445464748495051525354555657
                                        585960616263646566676869707172737475767778798081828384858687888990919293949596979899100
                                        101102103104105106107108109110111112113114115116117118119120121122123124125126127128129

                                        Copy/paste into miracle calculator and see?
                                        http//www.apostatesofislam.com/quran/analyzer.htm

                                        Chapter........verses.........Sum
                                        1.......+.......7...........=.......8.........even
                                        2.......+.......286.......=.......288.......even
                                        3.......+.......200.......=.......203.......odd
                                        ?..............?..............?.......?
                                        ?..............?..............?.......?
                                        113.....+.......5.........=.......118.......even
                                        114.....+.......6.........=.......120.......even

                                        6555...........6236............6555.......6236

                                        (6+5+5+5) + (6+2+3+6) = 19 ? 2 is multiple!

                                        9128

                                        9129

                                        Total letters 9128 = 60 (even verse total is same as #of even verses in Quran = 60)
                                        Total letters 9129 = 54 (odd verse total is same as #of odd verses in Quran = 54)

                                        60 + 54 = 114 is multiple!

                                        The 19th word is Allah!

                                        Total words 9128 = 14
                                        Total words 9129 = 15

                                        Words, verse are multiple!
                                        14 128 15 129 = 19 x 74358691

                                        (9 + 129 + 12 / 19 = 14 is multiple!

                                        Total gv of 9128 = 2896
                                        Total gv of 9129 = 3882

                                        Verses, words, values are multiple!
                                        128 129 60 54 2896 3882 = 19 x 6743663443629678

                                        Countless other things?
                                        7431 And We did not make the fire's company (guards) ONLY/illa angels, and We did not make their number/count ONLY/illa a test to those who disbelieve...

                                        The internet is littered with those infected (fitna) searching for all things nineteen.

                                        Salaam Eid

                                        rotfl rotfl rotfl

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                                        0
                                        • T Offline
                                          T Offline
                                          TheSubmitter
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #60

                                          God alone = considering ALL the signs of The God (the qur'aan + the signs in the horizons and within ourselves) and following/obeying/submitting/making peace to God alone. This is endorsed by The God Himself (please see my referenced post above for qur'aanic evidences).
                                          Peace

                                          Peace

                                          That makes sense. God Alone and Quran Alone are two different things.

                                          Thanks thruthseeker11 and david_k.

                                          TheSubmitter

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