The Search for Muhammad has Ended

Jafar

Be careful when you make such claims. I am Lebanese, and I will tell you now that there is no Baka Valley in Lebanon. There is an interior plateau whose average altitude is about 600 meters, located between two mountain ranges, called the Beqa'a Plain ( &#1593
It has NEVER been called a "valley". I can tell you that with 100% confidence.

There is a BIG difference between (which appears in the Quranic verse) and which is the name of that interior plateau.
Please stop trying to force Lebanon into the events that are described in the Quran, because Lebanon has nothing to do with it. In fact, the entire Levant region has nothing to do with it.

So a 'plain between two mountain range' is not a 'valley'???
What is a valley then?

Bakaa vs Beqa'a this is debatable depending on the lissaan/tongue and given the tongue itself has evolved much for many centuries..
But nevertheless let skip this for the moment...

The black line I've drawn for you shows the general direction of the main trade route which ran from Yemen, all the way to Mesopotamia. Note how it passes by the mountain range of South West Arabia. These mountains are at their highest near the city of Abha in Southern Saudi Arabia, near the Yemeni border, where they reach a height of over 3000 m.

Now, concerning Yemen, the land was very important and strategic for 2 reasons

1- It served as a transit stop for goods (spices) coming from India (as you pointed out)
2- It served as the origin of the famous - (LEGENDARY actually) - insence and mirrh route. The insense of Yemen is beyond legendary actually. Go look it up.

You're right about incense yet the incense itself was actually also originated from Somalia.. Both Somalia and "Yemen" is the producer of incense.

However, the goods from the Eastern regions (India,China etc..) with "Mesopotamian Cities" as their delivery or transition address. DID NOT FLOW THROUGH YEMEN. It goes through the persian gulf and landed in Ur..

Ancient city of Ur was situated along the coastline of the gulf and it was a hell of a busy trading port in ancient times, the singapore of ancient time, heavy erosion from Euphrat river for many centuries resulted in 'additional land' as we see today in Iraq. Archeological findings confirm this, the geological structure of today's Iraq coastline along the gulf also confirm this.

See your map there again.. IF.. you're an Indian or Mesopotamian trader.

Why would you spend additional days or even months (if the wind is not favorable) going to "Yemen" if you can use much shorter route to the Mespotamian plain through the persian gulf?? As a trader you knew very well that time = $$$
Going to Ur through persian gulf also bring additional benefits, as you can also sail along Euphrat / Tigris river to bring the goods directly to the upper mesopotamian cities (Niniveh etc..) and makes additional profit. And also buy additional items from there to be sold back in India during your return. That's what trading is all about.

From 'eastern asians' perspective there were 3 main trading destination to the west..

Mixed of overland and maritime routes through Mesopotamian plains down to the ancient Phoenician land in today's Lebanon. The Phoenicians shall thus transport the goods to their colonies spread in the Mediterranean sea (Today's Tunisia, Spain, Sicily, Italy) and also to the Greeks.
Maritime routes through Yemen, Ethiopia, Somalia and up to Egypt.
Maritime routes through Yemen, Somalia and down to eastern African coast.. (where they trade spices, silk, gold with ivory, diamond etc..)

As thus I see the your proposed hypothesis of 'Assyrian/Babylonians/Akkadians motives' of attacking Yemen due to the "Yemeni" sole control of trade route is a fallacy.

And IF.. big IF that is.. they were to invade "Yemen" they will do it through the sea routes.. as bringing thousands of troops through the arid and vast desert of Arabia is a very dangerous (if not foolish) idea. Talk to any army general and they will agree on this.

As thus compared to 'attacking Yemen', from the "War ROI" perspective it is much more cheaper, less risk and higher gain for them to attack India directly.. to the east... where all the riches originally coming from. Which they didn't do that either.

"Assyrian/Babylonians/Akkadians" attack to Yemen is a far-fetched idea.. to me..

And I definitely will not do that.. if I were "Assyrian/Babylonians/Akkadians" I have much better gain by invading either those pesky Phoenician port in the west (and give further grip of my control to the trade towards the Mediterranean sea) as the land route is also favorable for my troop logistics (basically raid and rape everyone along the way) OR invade India directly..

This land was called "Arabia Felix" by the ancient Romans and Greeks because of its riches. It was indeed blessed. ANd it saw the rise of many great kingdoms, like Himyar, Sheba, and ISRAEL, which prospered from control of the maritime trade routes (as you called it).

Sheba and Himyar was indeed there.. however Israel is debatable.. and IT WASN'T the sole control of trade routes.

There was no such thing as Saudi Arabia back then. The Saudis are nothing but agents of colonial Brittain who annexed this region and claimed it as their own. In factm they even annexed a good chunk of Yemen (this is historical fact). The original border of Yemen was farther north that it is today.

Fully agree on this..

Now...look closely at the topography of the entire region. Look at Jordan and Palestine. DO you see any mountains whose altitude is even remotely close to those mountains in Arabia? Where are the volcanoes you are talking about? The mountains of Arabia are called "Al - Surat", which means "The Heights" (high elevated place).

Yes, there ARE volcanoes in Ethiopia. No one is denying that. BUT THE QURAN WAS NOT REVEALED IN ETHIOPIA. I am not sure what you are trying to prove.

How can you be so sure? I mean.. by applying your own logic, I can make up some strong argument to say that Quran and everything else (Abraham etc..) was actually in Ethiophia.

Here's the deal ALL the events mentioned in the Quran took place there. ALL the prophets lived and preached there. Noah, Abraham, Lot, Jacob, the Israelites, Moses , Esau (not Jesus), David, Solomon, Muhamad....They were ALL there.

Solomon definitely done many venturing in Ethiopia.. The israelites and Moses also done many 'adventuring' within 'arabian desert'.

While Noah and Abraham I don't think so...
The worshiping of the star, the worshiping of the sun, human sacrifices, a deity called "Marduk" did exist in ancient Mesopotamian plain civilization. (Ur, Niniveh, Babylon etc..)
I strongly believe that Abraham is a Mesopotamian native.. an 'iraqi' if it's today's world...

Arabic, the ancient, perrenial and "fitri" tongue of mankind emerged from there.

There are no such thing as 'fitri' tongue.. human language development and evolution is a complex subject to discuss we better start another tread to discuss specifically on this if you want.

The 'Garden" of Adam was there, in the Heights. HUMAN LIFE AS WE KNOW IT BEGAN THERE. This is the truth that you people are refusing to accept.

I'm sorry my friend.. according to the DNA trace, the 'mitochondrial eve' is somewhere within Ethiophia, Somalia / East African region, and not Yemen... Adam and his partner (whatever her name) if it does exist.. then most probably he's a black African man... and most certainly not in Yemen..

Although Yemen / South Arabian Coastline might be the 'first stop' of his progeny long journey to populate the whole earth many hundred of thousands years ago.

Among the first batch of those coastal migration to the east can still be found today in Papua, Aboriginal Australians / New Zealand and Andaman islands.. and they possess many similarities to those 'black man of Africa'.

Palestine was NOTHING.

The whole point of the thread is to prove this. And I WILL prove it.

The Phoenicians did manage to get a strong grip around the Levant area (including Palestine) and also Mediterranean coasts.. And their trade network is the envy of Assyrians/Babylonians/Akkadian etc..

The Phoenicians gene has been absorbed and mingled with many 'natives' and continue to exist within today people of Lebanon, Greeks, Arabs, Israelite/Jews, Spaniard, Portuguese, Tunisians, Italians etc..

The Greek and Roman historians and geographers, like Strabo, Herodotus, and many others, when they visited the lands of Palestine and Syria in ancient times, and made a study of its people, stated very clearly that the origin of all these Semitic races can be traced back to South West Arabia. That region is the wource of all Semitic migrations.

Greek and Roman historians should not be trusted fully, their motives are usually 'political'..
By making an argument that those 'native people' are actually 'barbarians' and should be subjugated / enslaved through invasion.

By the way Phoenician civilizations long predate the "Roman era".. the "Romans" by itself is the result of 'cross breeding' between Greek colonist arriving in Italian peninsula and the local Phoenicians colonies who had already been there for many centuries before their arrival. This hypothesis has already been proven by DNA Trace and in accordance to the italian myth and legend of 'romulus and remus'.

The Torah is nothing but the account of Bani Israel, and their trials and ordeals in SOUTH WEST ARABIA.

The book of exodus, deutoronomy etc.. indeed tell stories of the Israelite adventure in arabian desert and not only in south west arabia.

Salam / Peace

almarh0m

Be careful when you make such claims. I am Lebanese, and I will tell you now that there is no Baka Valley in Lebanon. There is an interior plateau whose average altitude is about 600 meters, located between two mountain ranges, called the Beqa'a Plain ( &#1593
It has NEVER been called a "valley". I can tell you that with 100% confidence.

There is a BIG difference between (which appears in the Quranic verse) and which is the name of that interior plateau.

Please stop trying to force Lebanon into the events that are described in the Quran, because Lebanon has nothing to do with it. In fact, the entire Levant region has nothing to do with it.

I think maybe a visual aid should help you people understand what it is I'm trying to say

Take a look at the following topographic map of Arabia

http//i1203.photobucket.com/albums/bb386/Gorefiendel/Map2.jpg

The black line I've drawn for you shows the general direction of the main trade route which ran from Yemen, all the way to Mesopotamia. Note how it passes by the mountain range of South West Arabia. These mountains are at their highest near the city of Abha in Southern Saudi Arabia, near the Yemeni border, where they reach a height of over 3000 m.

Now, concerning Yemen, the land was very important and strategic for 2 reasons

1- It served as a transit stop for goods (spices) coming from India (as you pointed out)
2- It served as the origin of the famous - (LEGENDARY actually) - insence and mirrh route. The insense of Yemen is beyond legendary actually. Go look it up.

This land was called "Arabia Felix" by the ancient Romans and Greeks because of its riches. It was indeed blessed. ANd it saw the rise of many great kingdoms, like Himyar, Sheba, and ISRAEL, which prospered from control of the maritime trade routes (as you called it).

Now..look closely at the topography of the entire region. The stars I have placed on the map denote the location of VOLCANOES.

The overland route doesn't concern me, and has nothing to do with the events described in the Quran.

Now please note that when I say "Yemen", I don't necesarily mean the modern and (artifiical political entity) that we know. Yemen is ancient beyond what you perceive it to be. The word means joy and optimism. From this comes the word "tayammun", because the ancient Arabs always felt optimism when they traveled towards it. There was no such thing as Saudi Arabia back then. The Saudis are nothing but agents of colonial Brittain who annexed this region and claimed it as their own. In factm they even annexed a good chunk of Yemen (this is historical fact). The original border of Yemen was farther north that it is today.

Now...look closely at the topography of the entire region. Look at Jordan and Palestine. DO you see any mountains whose altitude is even remotely close to those mountains in Arabia? Where are the volcanoes you are talking about? The mountains of Arabia are called "Al - Surat", which means "The Heights" (high elevated place).

Yes, there ARE volcanoes in Ethiopia. No one is denying that. BUT THE QURAN WAS NOT REVEALED IN ETHIOPIA. I am not sure what you are trying to prove.

You see the blue circle I have placed on that map? Here's the deal ALL the events mentioned in the Quran took place there. ALL the prophets lived and preached there. Noah, Abraham, Lot, Jacob, the Israelites, Moses , Esau (not Jesus), David, Solomon, Muhamad....They were ALL there. So are the places mentioned in the Quran. Baka, Aad (the descendants of Noah's people), Sheba, Thamud, al- Tur (where God spoke to Moses), the Holy Sacntuary....They are ALL there. Arabic, the ancient, perrenial and "fitri" tongue of mankind emerged from there. The 'Garden" of Adam was there, in the Heights. HUMAN LIFE AS WE KNOW IT BEGAN THERE. This is the truth that you people are refusing to accept.

Palestine was NOTHING.

The whole point of the thread is to prove this. And I WILL prove it.

The Greek and Roman historians and geographers, like Strabo, Herodotus, and many others, when they visited the lands of Palestine and Syria in ancient times, and made a study of its people, stated very clearly that the origin of all these Semitic races can be traced back to South West Arabia. That region is the wource of all Semitic migrations.

Back to the subject of Lot

THe Quran tells us the following facts
1- They were obliterated by a Volcanic Eruption
2- The remains of their town are VERY CLOSE to the place where Muhammad was preaching the Quran. (They passed by it day and night in their travels)
3- It was along a well-established trade route.

Which region fits all these criteria? Definately nit Jordan or Palestine. Certainly not Ethiopia (despite the volcanoes) and it sure as Hell isn't India, China, or Malaysia (despite the riches).

These events took place inside that blue circle.

Now, take a look at theis next map

http//i1203.photobucket.com/albums/bb386/Gorefiendel/Map1.gif

The red arrow (from Iraq to Palestine) indicates the direction that the Jews and Zionist want is to believe was taken by the Assyrians and Babylonians when they marched on ancient Israel" (Which they insist was in Palestine).

But if you have carefully read my first two posts in this thread, you will come to the realization that ancient Israel was in Yemen, and bordered Sheba's kingdom. The Israelites were a thorn in the waist of the Mesopotamians. The black arrow shows the true direction of the Assyrian and Babylonian campaigns. They were directed to South West Arabia, in order to discipline the rebelious tribes who controlled the trade routes.

Thus, Bani Israel were from among the ancient and extinct Qahtani Arab tribes, who were originally in Yemen. The grandfather, Abram-Abrahm was born in YEMEN.

The stories of the Torah mention the following names Aden, Hazaramaveth, Uzal, and Ramah.

Do you know what those names are? They are places in YEMEN.

Aden is in Yemen
Hazaramaveth is Hadramoot in YEMEN
Uzal is the ancient and ancestral name of Sana'a in YEMEN. (go look up "Uzal" or "Ozal" in any encyclopaedia...ask any Yemeni, and he will confirm this)
Ramah is a river valley in YEMEN.

The Torah is nothing but the account of Bani Israel, and their trials and ordeals in SOUTH WEST ARABIA.

The events of the Torah did not take place in Egypt, nor in Palestine, nor in Ethipia, nor in India, nor in Lebanon, nor in China or Malaysia.

They took place in that blue circle.

Peace...

Peace

A very interesting piece indeed. My only reservation about the whole article is that the inclusion of Muhammad as one of the said messengers from that area contradicts 3444 as well as the lumping of Abraham and his progenies as the patriarchs of the jews seemed to be wandering away from the Qur'an 2140. That aside, the article was an excellent read.

Peace

almarh0m

unknownuser

According to Qur'an God sent prophets to all peoples. So no. No exclusive for the middle east. To each people sent prophets.

I never said that Allah sent messengers ONLY to Arabia. I think I was very clear and precise in this matter, so please don't put words into my mouth. What I said was that the messengers whom are mentioned in the Quran, were in Arabia. There are many messengers whom Allah did NOT tell Muhamad (P) about, and these were sent to lands outside Arabia.

{And messengers of whom We have told to you before, and messengers We have not told you about; and Allah spoke to Moses directly}....

So yes, there were messengers sent to other peoples on this planet (Mesopotamia, Persia, China, Egypt, Peru, Mezzo-America, you name it). But their stories do not concern us.

The idea you people fail to understand is so ridiculously simple, it just boggles the mind.

Muhamad was none other than a descendant of all the previous messengers who were all in Arabia, in that blue circle, precisely. The Quran is addressing the PEOPLE OF MUHAMMAD, and recounting to them the stories of their ancestors WHO WERE IN THE SAME AREA.

Now, it is our job, as believers, to porpagate this message to all of humanity.

Can I be any more clear than this?

@ Loxbox

I respect your opinion, but I do not agree with you. I'm sorry, it's just too far-fetched for me to think the Quran was revealed in Rome. (But nice pics anyway )

@ Jafar

Assyrian/Babylonians/Akkadians" attack to Yemen is a far-fetched idea.. to me..

And IF.. big IF that is.. they were to invade "Yemen" they will do it through the sea routes.. as bringing thousands of troops through the arid and vast desert of Arabia is a very dangerous (if not foolish) idea. Talk to any army general and they will agree on this.

Sheba and Himyar was indeed there.. however Israel is debatable.. and IT WASN'T the sole control of trade routes

So what will it take to convince you that Israel was in Yemen, and right next to Sheba? The Quran is very clear on this issue. It speaks of the "hudhud" (the hoopooe bird), traveling from Solomon's city to Sheba, which was not far off, and returning the same day. How many kilometers can the hoopooe fly in one day??

Mr. Jafar, you can't even begin to imagine the evidence I will soon start posting on this thread, which will prove, beyond any shadow of doubt, that the Isralelites were none other than ancient Arabian tribes of the Qahtany (Southern Branch), and that the ALL the place names and tribe names mentioned in the Torah are Yemeni names.
EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM.

When King Cyrus of Persia, after sacking Babylon, issued his famous decree allowing the exiled tribes to return to their homeland, the prophet Nehemia prepared a list of the names of these tribes. This list appears in the Torah, and contains something close to 100 names. Every single one of those names belongs to a YEMENI tribe. THey returned to their ancient homeland in YEMEN, not in Palestine.

I will stack up all the evidence you can imagine (and some you can't even imagine) that Judasim was BORN in Yemen, not Palestine. And the Yemeni Jews know this for a fact. It has been transmitted throughout their generation for ages untold. This is why the Yemeni Jews do not recognize Palestine as their ancestral homeland, and are the most passionate haters of the Zionists. And this why they stuck to their TRUE homeland (YEMEN), and theur roots.

And then we will see if that's enough to convince you or not.

And yes, I promise you the Assyrians and Babylonians DID in fact sack Arabia. The classical Arab historians, like Yaqoobi, and al-Tabari (whose books do contain shreds of some truth amid all the nonsense), INSIST that "Bakht-Nassar al- Babily" sacked the city of Tayma'a in North Arabia, and made it his military outpost from which he launched his raids to discipline the tribes who controlled the trade routes along the Read Sea coast. So who is "Bakht-Nassar the Babylonian?" Who are they referring to? Also, this is one of the very few allegations by Tabari and Co. that has been authenticated and verified. The city of Taima'a, in northern Saudi Arabia, does in fact contain archeological evidence which proves that the Assyrians were indeed posted there.
The Saudis know this for a FACT.

So, desipte all of the garbage in Tabari's books, he was right on that one.

Why the Hell would Nebuchadnezzar annex the city of Taima'a, if the destination of his campaign was Palestine?

I strongly believe that Abraham is a Mesopotamian native.. an 'iraqi' if it's today's world...

And I strongly believe he was NOT. And this also will be proven to you. I will put in front of your eyes, the original Aramaic text of the Torah, which clearly states he was born in "Ur-Kasdeem", and show you how the Septuagint criminals and corruptors (who "translated" the Torah from Aramaic to Greek) replaced the name "Ur-Kasdeem" with "Ur-Kaledon", thus creating the illusion that Abraham was born in Ur of Kaledonia. (despite the fact the Kaledonian state did not even EXIST at the time of Abraham - which exposes their corruption and forgery).

My question now is directed at Mr. Layth, but I think that Jafar and others will benefit from it.

Layth accepts the fact that ancient Israel was indeed in Yemen, and shared borders with Sheba. That's the one thing we agree upon.

However, Mr. Layth, who is obssessed with Palestine, insists that Abraham was born in Mesopotamia, then traveled to the "promised land flowing with milk and honey" (PALESTINE), where the Israelites were "spawned" there??? Or wait...Sorry, my mistake...they were spawned in Egypt, because Jacob was born there, then they escaped with Moses later on, back to Palestine? Why did they leave Plaestine in the first place to enter Egypt?

Also, what Mr, Layth fails to explain is the following IF the Israelites were "spawned" in Egypt, then invaded Palestine under Joshua bin Nun, they how the HELL did David and Solomon suddenly "pop up" in Yemen, more than 2000 Kilometers to the south from Palestine??? Did they migrate there, conquering all of Arabia on their way???

You people are confused to the point of INSANITY.

The Israelites ORIGINATED in Yemen, and nowhere else. They migrated from there, throughout the centuries, then settled in the Levant area.

So the Greek and Roman geograhers were right, and they were not making Political lies when they said that South West Arabia was the origin of Semitic migrations.

Someone has hijacked the history of Arabia and turned it upside down.

Peace....

Jafar

Dear Pazuzu..

Many of your arguments contains discrepancies which brings doubt to your conclusion.
And... I would suggest that you avoid the use of very unpleasant and subjective word such as 'insanity' or any 'ranting/derogatory type of words' for those parties who disagree with you... it is an advice for your own good... as using such word in an objective discussion shall correlate with your own level of intelligence.. as perceived by the readers..

First
You were saying that there were nothing in Palestine/Levant and as such makes the place as a 'non strategic' /'non prestigious' place for external parties to invade. (Akkadian/Babylonian invasion)

Which I have proved to you that the Phoenician civilization which originated in the Levant region is THE main civilization who traveled far and colonize nearly all of the shore line within Mediterranean sea.
And there is REAL artifact which I haven't mentioned in this thread , that will show
The tight collaboration between Israelite/Hebrew speaking people + Phoenicians civilizations has enabled them to traveled far and wide during 1000-500 BC up to a continent which is now being called as America.

This again proves the proximity of livelihood between Israelite/Hebrew speaking people and Phoenicians..

Second.
You maintain a double standard regarding your attitude to the "Torah", you regard some part of it as truth if it support your 'hypothesis' yet you cursed some other part if it doesn't ring well with your 'hypothesis'..

This shows your lack of objectivity regarding the matter.. which resulted in a 'faulty' conclusion...
If you're attacking description in the "Torah" because you disagree with it.. then it's much better not to use it all to support your argument... in that manner you shall maintained a consistent approach...

I do however.. see that there are lot of BS written in the 4 books which was considered as "Torah"..
And as you can see.. I NEVER use it to support my argument... or derive something from it to make my conclusion.

Third
You seem to be obsessed to show that YEMEN is the place for ALL things.. starting from Adam, to Eden, to Noah to Abraham, to Sheba, to Israelite, to Muhammad etc..
I wonder what's your true objective in this matter?

As you seem to hyperbole everything to support your own conclusion that it is in YEMEN... YEMEN has all the resources, the gold, the incense, the origin of the purest language.. etc..

Southern part of Arabian peninsula were once contained a great civilization and an important place.. but not ALL of the great civilizations and/or great things happened there...
Again please don't get too obsessed by trying to fill all of the water within one bucket.. it spill out...

I will answer to some of your argument in detailed later on..

Salam / Peace

Noon_dhe_plume

No, he sent prophets everywhere

Well, with all this, I can add someting else, that might sound weird ; MEKA is MACEDONIA, Called in local dialect MAKE DONIA , in the quran BATNI MAKKA , same meaning, it is the place where alroum were defeated by one of the prophets

1889 furthermore he followed a means
1890 until when he reached rising the sun he found it rising on a community not We made to them from against it Siin-Ta-Ra = to cover/veil/conceal, modesty, covered one, hide oneself

Dhul-Qarnayn and the "naked philosophers"

http//www.utexas.edu/courses/classicalarch/images3/alexhead.jpg

While in India, Alexander took prisoner ten of the Brahmins gymnosophists or ?naked philosphers? who had done most to get Sabbas to revolt, and had made the most trouble for the Macedonians. These men had a great reputation for intelligence, so Alexander decided to give them a test. He announced that the one who gave the worst answer would be the first to die, and he made the oldest Brahmin the judge of the competition.

Which are more numerous, Alexander asked the first one, the living or the dead? "The living," said the Brahmin, "because the dead no longer count."

Which produces more creatures, the sea or the land? Alexander asked the second. "The land? was his answer, "because the sea is only a part of it."

The third was asked which animal was the smartest of all, and the Brahmin replied "The one we have not found yet."

Alexander asked the fourth what argument he had used to stir up the Indians to fight, and he answered "Only that one should either live nobly or die nobly."

Which is older day or night? Was Alexander's question to the fifth, and the answer he got was "Day is older, by one day at least." When he saw that Alexander was not satisfied with this answer, the Brahmin added "Strange questions get strange answers."

What should a man do to make himself loved? Asked Alexander and the sixth Brahmin replied "Be powerful without being frightening."

What does a man have to do to become a god? He asked the seventh, who responded "Do what is impossible for a man."

The question to the eighth was whether death or life was stronger, and his answer "Life is stronger than death, because it bears so many miseries."

The ninth Brahmin was asked how long it was proper for a man to live, and he said "Until it seems better to die."

Then Alexander turned to the judge, who decided that each one had answered worse than another. "You will die first, then, for giving such a decision," said Alexander. "Not so, mighty king," said the Brahmin, "if you want to remain a man of your word. You said that you would kill first the one who made the worst answer."

Alexander gave all of the Brahmins gifts and set them free ?Plutarch, Life of Alexander

unknownuser

And... I would suggest that you avoid the use of very unpleasant and subjective word such as 'insanity' or any 'ranting/derogatory type of words'

I hardly think labeling someone as "confused" or "insane" to be derogatory.

You were saying that there were nothing in Palestine/Levant and as such makes the place as a 'non strategic' /'non prestigious' place for external parties to invade. (Akkadian/Babylonian invasion)

I am not inventing this. The archeological evidence uncovered from the Palestinian earth has shown that it was a peripheral region. The "Israeli" archeologists themselves have reached this conclusion. Their dismal failure to find a single shred of proof that the Kingdom of Solomon was in Palestine has made them reach a state of total dispair. Did you even bother reading the first two posts of this thread?

Which I have proved to you that the Phoenician civilization which originated in the Levant region is THE main civilization who traveled far and colonize nearly all of the shore line within Mediterranean sea.

I am not denying that the so-called "Phoenicians" were sea-faring people. (I'm Lebanese, and I know what you're talking about). All I'm saying is that these people ORIGINATED from the Red Sea coast in Arabia, and migrated north to the Levant.

You maintain a double standard regarding your attitude to the "Torah", you regard some part of it as truth if it support your 'hypothesis' yet you cursed some other part if it doesn't ring well with your 'hypothesis'..

Let me tell you something about the Torah....

I firmly believe that the original text of the Torah contained a very accurate account of the trials and orgdeals of Bani Israel, an ancient Yemeni tribe. However, the text was tampered with many times.

1- THe first tampering took place during the Babylonian Exile, when certain myths were added to the text, which were not originally there. SOmeday I will point these additions out to you.

2- The second and most scandalous tampering took place in Egypt, and was perpetrated by the Septuagint priests, who, under the mandate of Ptolemy (the Greek ruler of Egypt), translated the Torah from Aramaic to Greek. I will show you, in detail, how they corrupted the text through their translations. I will put forth examples of Aramaic text right next to the Greek text, and we will analyze them together, so that you will see the blatant corruption with your own eyes.

3- The third tampering was done by the Masorite priests, who, working from their mountain sanctuary in Turkey, decided to accentuate the originally silent Aramaic letters. And in doing so, they made some very serious mistakes, because they were not expertly fluent in the language. Most Jewish scholars today know very well that the Masoritic articulation contained many mistakes. Bernard Leeman pointed many of those out. So did Kamal Salibi in his book "The Torah Came from Arabia". For example, the original Aramaic text mentions that after the waters of the Deluge receded, Noah's Ark settled in a place called "rrt" (this is how it was spelled in the original, silent Aramaic text). So the Masorites articulated the word as "Ararat", because it was the name of a nearby mountain that they knew. In truth all experts in Aramaic will tell you that "rrt" is not a proper noun, and that it simply means "high place".

4- The fourth tampering was done in modern times, by the orientalist and imperialist Europeans (who established the Zionist movement). What these criminals did was that they projected the geography of the events described by the Torah, which took place in Yemen, onto the land of Palestine. THey hijacked the geography of the events and forged history as we know it.

However, despite all the tampering, many names of tribes and places remained as they are, and these alone are enough to expose the forgeries, as I will soon show you. We are not talking about 2,3, or 10 matching names...I will put , in front of your eyes, over 200 names of places and tribes mentioned in the Torah that match, TO THE LETTER, names of places and tribes in Yemen, and you will not believe your eyes when you see them.

Again I will repeat Bani Israel are ancient Yemeni tribes from the distant childhood of Arabia. The names of their prophets ( Abram - Samu'il - Nehmia - Yehoshua - etc...) are all mentioned in the old traditions and ballad songs of Yemen, as well as the old Arabian poetry, and their legends have been transmitted from generation to generation since forever.

By insisting that Ancient Israel was in Palestine, you are not only defying the archeological evidences that have been put forth by the "Israeli" scientists themselves, but you are also, unknowingly, supportung the Zionist version of history.

You seem to be obsessed to show that YEMEN is the place for ALL things.. starting from Adam, to Eden, to Noah to Abraham, to Sheba, to Israelite, to Muhammad etc..
I wonder what's your true objective in this matter?

I don't have an objective. I guess I am just INSANE and OBSSESSED with Yemen.
I guess I need psychiatric help.

Prepare yourself for the evidence that is coming....

Peace...

loxbox13

I respect your opinion, but I do not agree with you. I'm sorry, it's just too far-fetched for me to think the Quran was revealed in Rome. (But nice pics anyway )

No, the Quran wasn't hosted in Roma, But in North Africa, this is what I was saying, and , The whole mediteraneen used to speak the same language, or almost same, with diffferent accent, it is obbious when you find every single word in a language, the same in the other languages

You made your study based of facts made up to alter history in the first place, at least consider Rome, it is not innocent, and it wasn't KABALA or Christian , check out for yourself
than, I don't see the point on Allah telling us details, names and facts in the quran, while we go look for scholars who were enemies of humanity in the first place, I'm talking about those who manipulated books, by writting many versions

Magic, is like this, they leave something in front of your eyes, While you don't see it
I liked your research, but all these i read before

All messengers that existed are mentioned in the quran, some, Allah told their stories, some, not, we only know their names, Exemple, DHU NOON , DHU KIFL, IL YACINE
this is how i read it, I consider both ways, because, he said LAM NAKSSUS , and not LAM NATLOU or NAQULL

huruf

I never said that Allah sent messengers ONLY to Arabia. I think I was very clear and precise in this matter, so please don't put words into my mouth. What I said was that the messengers whom are mentioned in the Quran, were in Arabia. There are many messengers whom Allah did NOT tell Muhamad (P) about, and these were sent to lands outside Arabia.

I wrote that in answer to SiNoob's message

after reading this thread..i was wondering..why god only send down the book into middle east's populatuon..looks like god didn't care about other population?

Obviously not in answer to you or to any person who knows the Qur'an and therefore knows that God does not have an exclusive with anybody, but has attented to all peoles equally through the world nd through the ages. And that is a fact that indeed comes also very appropriately to destroy the enthronisation of Christian and Judeist sacred history, which seems to uphold some kind of monopoly concerning God's relationship with human kind.

Obviously the revelation of the Qur'an, bearing in mind that it was made to an Arab, must refer often to concepts that are current amongst the immediate population surrounding the messenger. And it also guarantees that that messenger will uphold that that history is just one of the many histories of revelation on earth, all of them the same, because God is God for everybody and therefore inconsistencies do not come from Him bur from the tampering of people.

On another aspect, I must say that I have always wondered how on earth did Bilqis and Suleyman get in touch if they were one in Palestine and the other one in Yemen, without also getting in touch with all the peopel in between.

So what you are narrating has plenty of interest.

Salaam

loxbox13