Inheritance according to Qur?an
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No;
In verse 11 there is no wife of the deceased. That is why there is a different division list and different shares.
In verse 12, the deceased has a living spouse. That is why there is a different list and different proportions.
Verses 11, 12 and 176 give different lists and shares for different situations.
And in verse 176, the deceased has no wife, children, parents. Therefore, this time only the brothers and sisters of the deceased are heirs.
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Nope..brother I think in my perception you have little complicated here.. I appreciate your understanding mostly Right..you can say same to me..
But.. No different formula in 412 and 411...one formula.. I reiterate one formula.. But depends on conditions.. And depends on gender and number of children.. No different formula in 411-12
4176 is totally different.. Unless you have different perspective to Kalala...
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Nope..brother I think in my perception you have little complicated here.. I appreciate your understanding mostly Right..you can say same to me..
But.. No different formula in 412 and 411...one formula.. I reiterate one formula.. But depends on conditions.. And depends on gender and number of children.. No different formula in 411-12
4176 is totally different.. Unless you have different perspective to Kalala...
No, you persist in your error.
In all 3 verses there are different formulae for different situations.
And that is why for example the proportions given to brothers in verse 12 and the proportions given to brothers in verse 176 are different . Because in verse 12 it is stated that if the deceased has a living spouse but no children, then the siblings will also receive a share.
In verse 176, on the other hand, only the brothers/sisters are alive. This time the share of the brothers/sisters is different from the one mentioned in verse 12.
By the way, you sometimes confuse the brothers and sisters of the deceased with the brothers and sisters of the children and similar expressions.
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No, you persist in your error.
In all 3 verses there are different formulae for different situations.
And that is why for example the proportions given to brothers in verse 12 and the proportions given to brothers in verse 176 are different . Because in verse 12 it is stated that if the deceased has a living spouse but no children, then the siblings will also receive a share.
In verse 176, on the other hand, only the brothers/sisters are alive. This time the share of the brothers/sisters is different from the one mentioned in verse 12.
By the way, you sometimes confuse the brothers and sisters of the deceased with the brothers and sisters of the children and similar expressions.
In case I have confused you with my English, I am sorry about that.. Not only to you but to everyone..
Well.. I hope you can maintain patience with me if your intention is to herald God's message to others with clarity within your knowledge ..Again I reiterate NO different formula In 411 and 412 ... but depends on gender and number of children and who is alive who is dead.. etc..
Whatever others understanding kalala is, let me tell you what kalala is in my understanding..
In simple unambiguous language "No direct decendants (child) and No direct ascendants (parent/s) but could have wife or husband to the living spouse.. Or both spouse living still kalala ..
But this state of Kalala can reach to its extreme end on top of its basic as I stated above save INDIRECT heirs (wife husband or siblings) .. ie the one who doesn't have decendants or ascendants could die.. Remember.. For example husband ..
Having said that... 4176 explains of extreme end of Kalala cuz the one who didn't have ascendants or decendants also passed away as verse clearly states... And accordingly heir is explained...But in 412 if one inherits(living) a state of Kalala no direct decendants or ascendants then, verse explains how to share.. Remember he still alive..
The word kalala itself indicates that children and parents are always DIRECT recipients regardless of any situation.. Indispensable share holders of wealth of their son's or daughter's or their father's or mother's respectively.. Not to confuse , let me elaborate like this.. David has son Adam and Sofia and David's parents Mary and Micheal.. These Adam, Sofia and Mary and Micheal always gets their due share cuz they are direct decendants and direct ascendants (devoid of any of them becomes a state of Kalala basically)
Now try to understand why proportion of kalala differs in 4176 compared to 412 ..No change in formula but living ones more in numbers in 412 though they are INDIRECT HEIRS .
How can decendants get portions always and ascendants won't and why then call Kalala?
Further simplify..
Direct recipients = children and patents of deceased ..
Indirect recipients = husband, wife and siblings of husband and wife or deceased.. conditional..
It's not a topic to debate or argue... Only misunderstanding can lead to difference in opinion... No harm.. Any of us could be in error.. But verses clear..
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411
" ... And for one's parents, to each one of them(dual) is a sixth of his if he left child (Walad) ...."Here walad everywhere on these two verses 411-12 is male child not merely a child..
2233 Awlādahunna/offspring theirs
411 Awlādikum/offspring yours6100 Lahu Banīna Wa Banātin (to Him sons and daughters)
6101 Anná Yakūnu Lahu Walad (offspring, male or female)
If walad is male child contradicts allows attributing daughters.And you'll run into all sorts of problems e.g.,
2/3 three+ daughters
1/2 sister
1/2 husband
1/3 mother -
in verse 12 it is stated that if the deceased has a living spouse but no children, then the siblings will also receive a share.
Where does it say but no children?
412
so if kāna (is) for you offspring, so to them the eight (1/ mimmā/from what left you
from after instruction (behest/will) thou instructing in it or dept.
and if is man inherited kalālatan (fatherless) or woman
and to him (i.e., person) brother or sister
so to each one of them dual the sixth (1/6)If spouse with/without children you rob the mother and/or father.
If spouse with/without children you rob the mother and/or siblings.It's thus, example $120k
$40k 1/3 to mother (411)
$40k 1/3 (1/2 * 2/3) to husband (412 1/2 mā/what left)
$40k 1/3 remainder to father$20k 1/6 to mother (411)
$30k 1/4 to wife (412 1/4 mimmā/from what left)
$70k 7/12 remainder to siblings (4176 if mixed)Likewise see prior post on meaning of Kalala.
Kalala can have mother, spouse, or children.Cannot enter 4176 l-kalālati means no child.
4176
Allah giveth ruling you in l-kalālati,
if individual died not is for him childTherefore, l-kalālati can have a child!
1031-3
وَالْعَصْرِ "and (by) the epoch (time)"إِنَّ الْإِنسَانَ لَفِي خُسْرٍ "indeed the humankind surely in loss"
إِلَّا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا وَعَمِلُوا الصَّالِحَاتِ وَتَوَاصَوْا بِالْحَقِّ وَتَوَاصَوْا بِالصَّبْرِ "except the ones believes they of and work they of the righteousness and exhort they of in the truth and exhort they of in the patience"
Salaam!
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In case I have confused you with my English, I am sorry about that.. Not only to you but to everyone..
Well.. I hope you can maintain patience with me if your intention is to herald God's message to others with clarity within your knoI think you sometimes mean something different when you say English parent. So read the verses again, revising the terms. When you say "parents", you can again use expressions like confusing the parents of the child with the parents of the deceased.
By the way, the parents of the deceased person are foreign to the spouse of the deceased person in terms of genes. So the protection of the spouse is also in question here.
Let me remind you again;
In verse 11 there is no spouse of the deceased,
In verse 12 there is the wife of the deceased
In verse 176, only the siblings of the deceased are alive (the parents, spouse and children of the deceased are not alive.
Since only the siblings of the deceased are alive in verse 176, the rate given to the siblings is different from the rate given to the siblings in verse 12 (because in verse 12 it is stated that the siblings can also receive a share if the deceased has a spouse but no children, and a different rate is given compared to verse 176).
412 (Additionally) - If a couple had no children, the husband gets half of what the wife leaves behind. - If they had children, the husband gets one-fourth. - If they had no children, then the wives get one-fourth of what the husband leaves behind. - If they had children then the wife gets one-eighth. - If a man or a woman, whose inheritance is in question, was a loner, in the sense of leaving behind no ascendants or descendants, but leaves behind a sister and a brother, each of them gets one-sixth of the inheritance. If there are more than two siblings, they equally share one-third of the inheritance. The above applies after fully satisfying the will, and after paying off all debts, so that no one's rights are infringed upon. This is the will decreed by God Who is Knower, Clement
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I think you sometimes mean something different when you say English parent. So read the verses again, revising the terms. When you say "parents", you can again use expressions like confusing the parents of the child with the parents of the deceased.
By the way, the parents of the deceased person are foreign to the spouse of the deceased person in terms of genes. So the protection of the spouse is also in question here.
Let me remind you again;
In verse 11 there is no spouse of the deceased,
In verse 12 there is the wife of the deceased
In verse 176, only the siblings of the deceased are alive (the parents, spouse and children of the deceased are not alive.
Since only the siblings of the deceased are alive in verse 176, the rate given to the siblings is different from the rate given to the siblings in verse 12 (because in verse 12 it is stated that the siblings can also receive a share if the deceased has a spouse but no children, and a different rate is given compared to verse 176).
412 (Additionally) - If a couple had no children, the husband gets half of what the wife leaves behind. - If they had children, the husband gets one-fourth. - If they had no children, then the wives get one-fourth of what the husband leaves behind. - If they had children then the wife gets one-eighth. - If a man or a woman, whose inheritance is in question, was a loner, in the sense of leaving behind no ascendants or descendants, but leaves behind a sister and a brother, each of them gets one-sixth of the inheritance. If there are more than two siblings, they equally share one-third of the inheritance. The above applies after fully satisfying the will, and after paying off all debts, so that no one's rights are infringed upon. This is the will decreed by God Who is Knower, Clement
And even in verse 11 it is stated that if the deceased has no wife and childs, but only parents, and if he has brothers and sisters, the brothers and sisters will also have a share, and the share here is also different.
In short, in verses 11, 12 and 176, separate/different shares are given for the siblings of deceased . Because the list is different in each verse.
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Dear Folks,
I hope it's okay for me to join this discussion with a question related to the topic of inheritance distribution according to Islamic law. My understanding is that the Quran encourages Muslims to prepare a will before passing away. This suggests that in the absence of a will, only then the prescribed shares for inheritance apply, is that right? I believe Jkhan has mentioned this point in the thread if not mistaken.
However, when a will is present, does it allow for how much flexibility in how one's assets are distributed among heirs?
Specifically, I'm curious if a person, for instance, a father, can allocate his assets—both liquid and non-liquid—among his children in a manner he deems just, based on his personal judgment and circumstances. For example, if one son has been particularly attentive to his parents, dedicating much of his time and effort to their care, while another has been distant or neglectful, can the father decide to leave a more significant portion of his estate to the more devoted son in his will?
I would appreciate it if someone could clarify whether such discretion is permitted within Islamic inheritance laws, keeping in mind the principles of fairness and justice that would presumably be considered on the Day of Judgment.
The reason for asking is that in certain arab countries the distribution of inheritance is primarily governed by Shariah law, which outlines specific shares for heirs. While the creation of a will is permissible, it's subject to certain Islamic legal restrictions, including that up to one-third of the estate can be allocated to non-heirs or causes not directly defined in Shariah. For the majority of the estate, the distribution among heirs follows predetermined shares as detailed in Islamic law. This ensures adherence to religious principles in the allocation of assets after death.
Hence my question because as my understanding considering that Surah An-Nisa, verses 11 and 12, mention "مِنۢ بَعْدِ وَصِيَّةٍۢ" "after the fulfillment of bequests," it's clear that Islamic law allows for consideration beyond the preset shares. Critics often overlook this when they argue that women receive less inheritance. It highlights the importance of preparing a will, with a thoughtful approach towards the needs of one's family after their passing, ensuring fairness and care for all, including wives and daughters. -
1657
And they attribute to Allah daughters (banati)1991
That they attribute to ArRahman a male child (Walad) .root wāw lām dāl (و ل د) is never directly means for a female child.. This is the same root by which it refers to Beget / give birth / parents or begetter / male child / Child (unknown gender) / Children and through same root it can give meaning of father / mother / offspring ( unknown gender) / decendant or offspring (mix gender) / boy ...
When you know the gender you can never use for female child but only for male child..
You can always write Walad with intent that you mean a male child...
You can always say also a Walad offspring (unknown gender) not for female only..
So.. Walad in the concerned topic verses are male child..
Read all Walad verses... -
2233 Awlādahunna/offspring theirs
411 Awlādikum/offspring yours6100 Lahu Banīna Wa Banātin (to Him sons and daughters)
6101 Anná Yakūnu Lahu Walad (offspring, male or female)
If walad is male child contradicts allows attributing daughters.And you'll run into all sorts of problems e.g.,
2/3 three+ daughters
1/2 sister
1/2 husband
1/3 motherNo all sorts of problem.. Just don't spoil the thread..
Okay... Let me ask below Question one by one.. If your intention here is clarity for believers then explain..
There is a family..
David and Linda husband and wife..
And David and Linda has three sons Adam, Peter and Ben and three daughters only Sofia , Emily and Alice..
And David has his parents Mary and Micheal...
Well David deceased...
Now David had 10000 USD after all debts etc..
Let us know how this 10000 USD is devided between Linda, Adam, Peter and Ben and Sofia, Emily and Alice and Mary and Micheal based on 411-12?Note No need any of your explanations.. Just write the figures.. Okay buddy.. It's not a challenge just for info..
Cuz lots of Arab christians enter and discord and forums like this and playing around make it look crooked..Thank you..
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One privately asks.. According to411 how much of deceased person's brother get?
Well.. In fact brother of deceased perspn mentioned, not for any heir or share.. But brother of deceased person is mentioned just to confirm the exact portion of deceased mother gets.. Cuz deceased brother's existence makes mother of deceased safe.. So She gets only 1/6 (reduced) and if no brother to deceased then 1/3 (increased) .. Male dominance is obvious not cuz of any reasons but male has little more authority over mother.. .... That's why male child too specifically mentioned..
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1657
And they attribute to Allah daughters (banati)1991
That they attribute to ArRahman a male child (Walad) .root wāw lām dāl (و ل د) is never directly means for a female child.. This is the same root by which it refers to Beget / give birth / parents or begetter / male child / Child (unknown gender) / Children and through same root it can give meaning of father / mother / offspring ( unknown gender) / decendant or offspring (mix gender) / boy ...
When you know the gender you can never use for female child but only for male child..
You can always write Walad with intent that you mean a male child...
You can always say also a Walad offspring (unknown gender) not for female only..
So.. Walad in the concerned topic verses are male child..
Read all Walad verses...Same the word Ikhwat
That is to say.
Brothers..never sisters only..
And it can give meaning of Sibling (mixed gender) but you can never decide by saying Ikhwat that means mixed gender siblings..
Note.. 4176 God clearly said Ikhwat then stated male and female.. If Ikhwat can be taken naturally as male and female then no need to say so..
Further in 411 Ikhwat means brothers only.. No brothers and sisters.. If not explained then first priority meaning is BROTHERS..Read all Ikhwat verses..
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No all sorts of problem..
Yes problems, replace walad to "son" ...
411 instructed you Allah in awlādikum/sons yours? …
and to parents two his, to each one of them dual the sixth from what left, if be for him walad/son?how much to parents if only daughters?
so if not beeth for him walad/son? and inherit him parents dual his, so to mother his the third
mother 1/3, how much to father and to daughters?
412 and for you half what left azwājukum yours if not beeth for them walad/son?
husband 1/2, how much to parents and to daughters?
There is a family..
David and Linda husband and wife..
And David and Linda has three sons Adam, Peter and Ben and three daughters only Sofia , Emily and Alice..
And David has his parents Mary and Micheal...
Well David deceased...
Now David had 10000 USD after all debts etc..
Let us know how this 10000 USD is devided between Linda, Adam, Peter and Ben and Sofia, Emily and Alice and Mary and Micheal based on 411-12?Thank you..
Already posted summary
https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9604035.msg443174#msg443174$3,333.33333 (1/3) parents (411) $1,666.66667 (1/6) each
$1,250.00000 (1/ wife (412)
$5,416.66667 (13/24) remainder to children (411 to distribute)
411 so if they are womenfolk above two, so for them third dual (2/3) what left
3+ daughters, 1+ sons
2/3 three females (2/9 each), 1/3 one male (1.5x to male/s)
1/2 three females (1/6 each), 1/2 two males (1/4 each)
2/5 three females (2/15 each), 3/5 three males (1/5 each)$2,166.66667 three daughters ($722.222667 each)
$3,250 to the three sons ($1,083.33333 each)2/3 four females (1/6 each), 1/3 one male (2.0x to male/s)
1/2 four females (1/8 each), 1/2 two males (1/4 each)
2/5 four females (1/10 each), 3/5 three males (1/5 each)2/3 five females (2/15 each), 1/3 one male (2.5x to male/s)
1/2 five females (1/10 each), 1/2 two males (1/4 each)
2/5 five females (2/25 each), 3/5 three males (1/5 each)2/3 six females (1/9 each), 1/3 one male (3.0x to male/s)
1/2 six females (1/12 each), 1/2 two males (1/4 each)
2/5 six females (1/15 each), 3/5 three males (1/5 each)now your turn, really simple
- how much to wife and sister?
- how much to wife and mother?
- how much to sister and mother?
- how much to wife, sister, and mother?
you can try 2 or 3+ sisters above if you like with walad = son?
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Are you insane or just passing time here..
WHO YOLD YOU THAT AWLAD is SONS in 411...
AWLAD is children (mixed OR unmixed)Just don't alter what I have written.. People can read what u have and come and say as if I said AWLAD means SONS..
either be direct in answering or don't reply to my points..
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1657
And they attribute to Allah daughters (banati)1991
That they attribute to ArRahman a male child (Walad) .root wāw lām dāl (و ل د) is never directly means for a female child.. This is the same root by which it refers to Beget / give birth / parents or begetter / male child / Child (unknown gender) / Children and through same root it can give meaning of father / mother / offspring ( unknown gender) / decendant or offspring (mix gender) / boy ...
When you know the gender you can never use for female child but only for male child..
You can always write Walad with intent that you mean a male child...
You can always say also a Walad offspring (unknown gender) not for female only..
So.. Walad in the concerned topic verses are male child..
Read all Walad verses...Read you twister... Did I say AWLAD means SONS... just don't spoil the thread.. What's your mission here...
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Are you insane or just passing time here..
WHO YOLD YOU THAT AWLAD is SONS in 411...
AWLAD is children (mixed OR unmixed)Just don't alter what I have written.. People can read what u have and come and say as if I said AWLAD means SONS..
either be direct in answering or don't reply to my points..
Did you not write this? laugh
Here walad everywhere on these two verses 411-12 is male child not merely a child.. And God has decided based on male child's presence the proportions.. Even in 412 it doesn't state NO CHILD but it literally states of NO MALE child …
Perhaps apologize and thank me for correcting your insane nonsense! police
Care to answer questions posted to you or run away?
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Salam everyone..
This Man is in his own confusion and trying to intentionally confuse others.. That's obvious..Look for examples as I said in my my previous threads.. Arabic Akh = brother..from this root only word sister get formed.. Without Akh no sister from the same root..
Similarly WA lam Dhal ie Walad.. From this root only sibling get forms.. But Walad is male child and from this male child only sibling form get formed.. Like AWLAD (mixed gender)
It's like in English MAN and from MAN only woman gets birth.. Without MAN no WO-MAN..
IKHWAT is indeed BROTHERS... but depend what person explains it can mean sibling of mixed gender..
Walad is male child for sure..from that only AWLAD gets formed..When people say to ArRahman you took a WALAD they know what gender they talk of and they not talking what is in their mind.. But if they want to say daughters directly they use female form..
Why to confuse a clear word..Note if what I learned in Arabic is right, it is always male form converted to female version.. And not female version into male form.. Allah created Adam first for a reason as male and created partner and called His partner and not Her partner .. That's how languages formed.. Arabic I am not good at but not fool either not to grasp with scrutiny..
Antha = you male
Aithi = you female..
There is no anthi without ANTHA (MALE) -
