How do YOU reconcile evolution with islam.
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Peace!
Ook, so some people here reject hadith completley and some reject some an some accept all here on this forum? Great. P
Well lets just take the quran then.
There are different interpretations of verses i get that, how would you interpret the verses saying adam was created from clay in the face of evolution, the only hadith i think of as a problem is this one Narrated Abu Huraira The Prophet said, "Allah created Adam, making him 60 cubits tall. When He created him, He said to him, "Go and greet that group of angels, and listen to their reply, for it will be your greeting (salutation) and the greeting (salutations of your offspring." So, Adam said (to the angels), As-Salamu Alaikum (i.e. Peace be upon you). The angels said, "As-salamu Alaika wa Rahmatu-l-lahi" (i.e. Peace and Allah's Mercy be upon you). Thus the angels added to Adam's salutation the expression, 'Wa Rahmatu-l-lahi,' Any person who will enter Paradise will resemble Adam (in appearance and figure). People have been decreasing in stature since Adam's creation.I also remember some hadith that said before adam there many other adams, cant find it though and im am srry for that.
Thank you! And peace! -
Also for your information 60 cubits is about 120 feet or around 40 meters tall. That is really really really tall. I haven't seen anyone that tall.
Just my crazy thoughts...
JewishDude
peace Salam, Shalom, Peace peaceSalaamun alayka,
D
Most of times I really enjoy reading your crazy thoughts.
Salaam,
Bender -
But then how do they learn to pray then? I understand the Quran is number one in taking guidance from but we cannot simply reject authentic hadith?
Thanks! And peace!Salam,
My understanding, based on what I've learned from the Qu'ran so far, is that Allah initially taught prophet Ibrahim the Islamic practices such as Salat (2127-128, 6040 ). These practices were handed down from generation to generation and reaffirmed or corrected when a new messenger or prophet came to the people (2124, 2729).
In other words, the practice of Salat was already implemented into society prior to the prophethood of prophet Muhammad. Muhammad was order to adopt these practices (16123) and to fix some aspects of Salat such as the tone, timings, etc... These fixes are documented in the Qu'ran.
The beauty of Islam is that it is the teachings and practices of Allah that have culminated over thousands of years through uncountable prophets and messengers. These practices were finally perfected under the final prophet in Arabia. That is why the Qu'ran order the believers to not make distinction among any prophets/messengers as they have all contributed to the perfection of this deen. We are not to assume that just because prophet Muhammad is the final prophet, that he brought everything, that is incorrect and against the Qu'ran in my opinion.
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I don't think he meant it like that at all.... as you imply, it would be madness.
Rather it would make more sense to understand his words as saying that things "began" with some organic cellular life form, which developed into some form that had two versions, i.e. male and female... and then things went on on that track. It doesn't necessarily mean ONE male and ONE female... rather it would mean ONE male FORM, and ONE female FORM... talking about the gender types and not individuals.I mean, wouldn't staunch evolutionists take it like this also?.. that things started of with some single cellular organism.... then things evolved and eventually there were life forms having genders.
I think it is wise to understand that words so that they make sense with scientific findings, unless we are out to disprove the quran not matter what the facts or truth. Like I say, one truth thing should not contradict another truth thing, how could they, unless one or both is/are false or misunderstood?
I agree. Your version makes more sense.
"your creation with a single life-cell which split into two parts" does however mention quite explicitly one cell. One cell splits = 1 man + 1 woman.
So instead of saying it should be understood differently I would tend to call it outright wrong. Otherwise I can write complete gibberish and the reader then has to substitute my nonsense with the correct knowledge the reader has. But then what is the value and purpose of what I wrote?
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Salam,
My understanding, based on what I've learned from the Qu'ran so far, is that Allah initially taught prophet Ibrahim the Islamic practices such as Salat (2127-128, 6040 ). These practices were handed down from generation to generation and reaffirmed or corrected when a new messenger or prophet came to the people (2124, 2729).
In other words, the practice of Salat was already implemented into society prior to the prophethood of prophet Muhammad. Muhammad was order to adopt these practices (16123) and to fix some aspects of Salat such as the tone, timings, etc... These fixes are documented in the Qu'ran.
The beauty of Islam is that it is the teachings and practices of Allah that have culminated over thousands of years through uncountable prophets and messengers. These practices were finally perfected under the final prophet in Arabia. That is why the Qu'ran order the believers to not make distinction among any prophets/messengers as they have all contributed to the perfection of this deen. We are not to assume that just because prophet Muhammad is the final prophet, that he brought everything, that is incorrect and against the Qu'ran in my opinion.
Thank you for your response!
Could you tell me some verses in The Quran where salat is "fixed"? Thank you!
Peace. -
Narrated Abu Huraira The Prophet said, "Allah created Adam, making him 60 cubits tall. When He created him, He said to him, "Go and greet that group of angels, and listen to their reply, for it will be your greeting (salutation) and the greeting (salutations of your offspring." So, Adam said (to the angels), As-Salamu Alaikum (i.e. Peace be upon you). The angels said, "As-salamu Alaika wa Rahmatu-l-lahi" (i.e. Peace and Allah's Mercy be upon you). Thus the angels added to Adam's salutation the expression, 'Wa Rahmatu-l-lahi,' Any person who will enter Paradise will resemble Adam (in appearance and figure). People have been decreasing in stature since Adam's creation.
So you reject this hadith then?
Do you seriously believe this? A human who is like 30 metres tall? How could the spine support the weight? It is physically impossible. And if this was in heaven, how could any living human have this knowledge?
Also, why does Abu Huraira also report in Bukhari 8.74.246 "Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, created Adam in His own image with His length of sixty cubits"? Do you have information regarding the shape and size of Allah so you can verify this?
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I don't think he meant it like that at all.... as you imply, it would be madness.
Rather it would make more sense to understand his words as saying that things "began" with some organic cellular life form, which developed into some form that had two versions, i.e. male and female... and then things went on on that track. It doesn't necessarily mean ONE male and ONE female... rather it would mean ONE male FORM, and ONE female FORM... talking about the gender types and not individuals.I mean, wouldn't staunch evolutionists take it like this also?.. that things started of with some single cellular organism.... then things evolved and eventually there were life forms having genders.
I think it is wise to understand that words so that they make sense with scientific findings, unless we are out to disprove the quran not matter what the facts or truth. Like I say, one truth thing should not contradict another truth thing, how could they, unless one or both is/are false or misunderstood?
Thank you for the comments!
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Peace!
Ook, so some people here reject hadith completley and some reject some an some accept all here on this forum? Great. P
Well lets just take the quran then.
There are different interpretations of verses i get that, how would you interpret the verses saying adam was created from clay in the face of evolution, the only hadith i think of as a problem is this one Narrated Abu Huraira The Prophet said, "Allah created Adam, making him 60 cubits tall. When He created him, He said to him, "Go and greet that group of angels, and listen to their reply, for it will be your greeting (salutation) and the greeting (salutations of your offspring." So, Adam said (to the angels), As-Salamu Alaikum (i.e. Peace be upon you). The angels said, "As-salamu Alaika wa Rahmatu-l-lahi" (i.e. Peace and Allah's Mercy be upon you). Thus the angels added to Adam's salutation the expression, 'Wa Rahmatu-l-lahi,' Any person who will enter Paradise will resemble Adam (in appearance and figure). People have been decreasing in stature since Adam's creation.I also remember some hadith that said before adam there many other adams, cant find it though and im am srry for that.
Thank you! And peace! )In my eyes you are making the catastrophic mistake of mixing science and religion. That never works.
Adam being created has nothing to do with the development of species as is described in the Theory of Evolution.
Similarly, a stick turning into a snake can't be verified by biology in any way. Or mountains sitting on top of earth as stabilisers does not gel with geology.
So you need to separate a religious book on spirituality from scientific text-books. Abiogenesis or evolution do not mention creation and the Koran does not refer to science. Let's leave it that way. -
Do you seriously believe this? A human who is like 30 metres tall? How could the spine support the weight? It is physically impossible. And if this was in heaven, how could any living human have this knowledge?
Also, why does Abu Huraira also report in Bukhari 8.74.246 "Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, created Adam in His own image with His length of sixty cubits"? Do you have information regarding the shape and size of Allah so you can verify this?
Peace and thank you for the comment!
I dont know if i believe this, it could be fabricated and im here to learn and no i dont got information regarding the size of Allah, and im PRETTY sure no one else does sooo, yeah P -
In my eyes you are making the catastrophic mistake of mixing science and religion. That never works.
Adam being created has nothing to do with the development of species as is described in the Theory of Evolution.
Similarly, a stick turning into a snake can't be verified by biology in any way. Or mountains sitting on top of earth as stabilisers does not gel with geology.
So you need to separate a religious book on spirituality from scientific text-books. Abiogenesis or evolution do not mention creation and the Koran does not refer to science. Let's leave it that way.Peace and thanks for commenting.
I do agree with most of what your saying. ) -
Hi Everyone,
As far as the evidence tells us... people have been getting taller in the last century. Archaeological records show people have been not getting shorter, but getting taller.
I think the problem as I mentioned before is that problems you are bringing up are fabricated. Why must we make a problem where one doesn't exist. I don't really see the problem with the Quran and Evolution. It is a matter of perspective on how you interpret a few items. It is only when you take things literally that the problem arises. Could clay = carbon + water + organic material? We are made of carbon water and other organic materials.
As for that Hadith... I don't know what to say. My intellect says "no". And that same intellect wonders at the amazing world Allah has created for us. Don't leave your intellect behind. Allah gives you your intellect and heart so you may know him better.
Just my crazy thoughts...
JewishDude
peace Salam, Shalom, Peace peace -
Hi Everyone,
As far as the evidence tells us... people have been getting taller in the last century. Archaeological records show people have been not getting shorter, but getting taller.
I think the problem as I mentioned before is that problems you are bringing up are fabricated. Why must we make a problem where one doesn't exist. I don't really see the problem with the Quran and Evolution. It is a matter of perspective on how you interpret a few items. It is only when you take things literally that the problem arises. Could clay = carbon + water + organic material? We are made of carbon water and other organic materials.
As for that Hadith... I don't know what to say. My intellect says "no". And that same intellect wonders at the amazing world Allah has created for us. Don't leave your intellect behind. Allah gives you your intellect and heart so you may know him better.
Just my crazy thoughts...
JewishDude
peace Salam, Shalom, Peace peacePeace!
Its some great crazy thoughts you have, great post! I got some other stuff yet but that i will write at another time, thanks to you all so far!
Peace! -
Salaam
before conciliate evolution with islam you have to demonstrate that evolution is true.
Hope that StopS will not read my post.
Peace
Ooops, sorry, I DID read it.
http//whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/
http//www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-fact.html
Just in case anyone is interested what reality is like to then compare it to the Koran.
But in general if anyone wants to know something scientific I suggest you go to a science forum to ask there and not a religious forum.