Quran is Clear Versus Allegorical in Verse 3:7
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The traditional understanding of verse 37 contradicts the understanding of "Quran is clear" verses.
Demonstration
He (is) the One Who revealed to you the Book, of it (are) Verses absolutely clear - they (are) the foundation (of) the Book, and others (are) allegorical. Then as for those in their hearts (is) perversity - they follow what (is) allegorical of it, seeking discord and seeking its interpretation. And not knows its interpretation except Allah. And those firm in knowledge, they say, "We believe in it. All (is) from our Lord." And not will take heed except men of understanding.37Versus
And the Day We will resurrect among every nation a witness over them from themselves. And We (will) bring you (as) a witness over these. And We sent down to you the Book (as) a clarification of every thing and a guidance and mercy and glad tidings for the Muslims.1689
Upon checking how mutashbihtun has been used in other verses I came to conclusion that it means "similar" instead of "allegorical". I checked other translations and some of them confirmed that I was seeing it right. But the third sentence "And not knows its interpretation except Allah" from 37 is hindering my understanding. Can anyone shed light on it? How to connect all the sentences of 37?
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The traditional understanding of verse 37 contradicts the understanding of "Quran is clear" verses.
Demonstration
He (is) the One Who revealed to you the Book, of it (are) Verses absolutely clear - they (are) the foundation (of) the Book, and others (are) allegorical. Then as for those in their hearts (is) perversity - they follow what (is) allegorical of it, seeking discord and seeking its interpretation. And not knows its interpretation except Allah. And those firm in knowledge, they say, "We believe in it. All (is) from our Lord." And not will take heed except men of understanding.37Versus
And the Day We will resurrect among every nation a witness over them from themselves. And We (will) bring you (as) a witness over these. And We sent down to you the Book (as) a clarification of every thing and a guidance and mercy and glad tidings for the Muslims.1689
Upon checking how mutashbihtun has been used in other verses I came to conclusion that it means "similar" instead of "allegorical". I checked other translations and some of them confirmed that I was seeing it right. But the third sentence "And not knows its interpretation except Allah" from 37 is hindering my understanding. Can anyone shed light on it? How to connect all the sentences of 37?
I concur with you 100%. There is no such things as allegorical in the Quran!
But the third sentence "And not knows its interpretation except Allah" from 37 is hindering my understanding. Can anyone shed light on it? How to connect all the sentences of 37?
If you notice the conjunction "waw" and if we apply it while reading, it will render as below
And not knows its interpretation except ALLAH and those firm in knowledge. They say, "We believe in it. All from our Lord and not will take heed except men of understanding"
the next verses, 9 & 10 is the continuation of the prayers of those who have knowledge...
This is my understanding.... peace
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Peace all,
The beginning of what you posted for 37 "He (is) the One Who revealed to you the Book, of it (are) Verses absolutely clear - they (are) the foundation (of) the Book"
This doesn't seem to contradict the other verse you posted.
The other verse with a clarification of every thing, I suppose that's the one I have some issue with, as clearly we don't have clarification on some issues.
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....................The traditional understanding of verse 37 contradicts the understanding of "Quran is clear" verses.
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Salaam/Peace be upon you, Reel,
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No, they are Clear/Clarifying Verses (=Ayatun Bayyinatun)
in the chests of those who are given Knowledge (=alladheena utoo al-Ilm) ...... 29/49So I believe that QURANIC Verses may not be necessarily Clear/Clarifying all the time, for all,
but they may absolutely be Clear/Clarifying all the time, only for those who are given Knowledge (=alladheena utoo al-Ilm)
as clearly emphasized in the above Verse, in the first place.Therefore, if we look into that Verse again, in this respect
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7- ............... But none know its interpretation except AL-LAH and those who are well founded in Knowledge (=rasikhoona fiy al-Ilm),
they say"We believe in it; (for) all --(of those Allegorical/Mutashabihat and Straightforward/Muhkamat Verses mentioned above)-- are from our LORD."
But none will take-heed except those who possess intelligence. (=3/7)Remain in peace/salaam.
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Salam,
I agree with your post Reel.
My understanding of the verse is to translate as follows
37 He is the One who sent down to you the Book, from which there are legislative verses?they are the Mother of the Book?and others which are comparable. As for those who have a disease in their hearts, they follow that of it which is comparable, seeking to confuse, and seeking to derive an interpretation. But none know its interpretation except God, and those who are well founded in knowledge; they say "We believe in it, all is from our Lord." And none will remember except those who possess intelligence.
The legislative verses "Hukum" are the essence of the Book and the prime reason it was sent down do not kill, do not lie, do not eat the meat of pig, etc..
As for the "comparable", they are comparable to the Hukum verses (they seem like laws) when in fact they are not "obey the messenger, preserve the salat, let women cover, etc..
The twisted people will flock to the "comparable" verses to enforce them as a law when they were never a law (e.g. Saudi Arabia, Iran) and thus distort God's system.
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t'awiil may be "purpose", or run of th thing, or unfolding. Forme there is something clear in the Qur'an as in life. Things we do not understand at one point, with time we understand and see clearly. So it may be things we will see or understand in due course, may be in the other life. On the other hand, there ar hing which are plai at any time.
Salaam
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Salaam/Peace Huruf,
but we should certainly note that,
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...... but those in whose hearts is a crookedness
will be seeking (to create) confusion and seeking its explanation/interpretation (=abtighaa-a taweelahu) .....and its rightful explanation/interpretation (=taweelahu) is absolutely known
only by AL-LAH and (HIS truthful Servants) =those who are well founded in Knowledge (=rasikhoona fiy al-Ilm),
(in this world and in the Hereafter) .........as clearly indicated in the above Verse, in its entirety (=3/7).
Remain in peace/salaam.
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Peace,
God knows best the interpretation of his book, many people, seek to find an interpretation suitable to their purposes, hence seeking disharmony.
God present examples (similarities) or parables, anyone who has read the previous scriptures will, inshaAllah be familiar with this concept.
God shows things by way of example. sometimes, theese examples are distorted by people who do not understand them.
People whose hearts are not open to God, and to his truth, will fail to see the truth, even if it is clear.
"Can anyone shed light on it? "
Only The One! seek his guidance, who else can guide but him..
Peace
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Peace all,
"Qur'an is clear" in various verses means in my opinion that it was revealed in an ordinary language of the people at that time, not a language of liturgy.
I find the demonstration of Brother Ayman convincing http//free-minds.org/how-did-it-come-part-1It doesn't mean that reading it quickly is sufficient for understanding.
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.......It doesn't mean that reading it quickly is sufficient for understanding.
Salaam/Peace Anoushirvan,
What you said above is absolutely True.
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114- Then High above all is AL-LAH, The (One and Only) True Sovereign.
Therefore, do not be hasty with the QURAN (=i.e. READING) before its inspiration is completed to you,
and say"My LORD, increase my Knowledge."
(=20/114)
Remain in peace/salaam.
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Peace reel,
The traditional understanding of verse 37 contradicts the understanding of "Quran is clear" verses.
Demonstration
He (is) the One Who revealed to you the Book, of it (are) Verses absolutely clear - they (are) the foundation (of) the Book, and others (are) allegorical. Then as for those in their hearts (is) perversity - they follow what (is) allegorical of it, seeking discord and seeking its interpretation. And not knows its interpretation except Allah. And those firm in knowledge, they say, "We believe in it. All (is) from our Lord." And not will take heed except men of understanding.37Versus
And the Day We will resurrect among every nation a witness over them from themselves. And We (will) bring you (as) a witness over these. And We sent down to you the Book (as) a clarification of every thing and a guidance and mercy and glad tidings for the Muslims.1689
Upon checking how mutashbihtun has been used in other verses I came to conclusion that it means "similar" instead of "allegorical". I checked other translations and some of them confirmed that I was seeing it right. But the third sentence "And not knows its interpretation except Allah" from 37 is hindering my understanding. Can anyone shed light on it? How to connect all the sentences of 37?
I posted this 37 contradiction a while ago in this forum and had a lengthy discussion on it but no one was able to resolve it. It is a blatant and "clear" contradiction. On one hand "clear revelations" (299, 1015, 1973, 2216, 2272, 241, 2949, 3443, 4525, 467, 579, 6511). On the other hand acknowledging presence of verses that "no one knows its interpretation except allah".
Say what? I am afraid there is no way around this one.
Additionally how can the signs in the horizons and within ourselves verify the truth of something that we don't even know the interpretation of? (4153).
How can we use our inner/conscience (3030), mind/reason (numerous verses), and knowledge (1736) to verify something we don't even know the interpretation of?
Then the issue is the deliberate mistranslation of 37.
You cannot remove the full stop between allah and those firm in knowledge because then "they" will refer to both allah and those firm in knowledge which will render a nonsensical interpretation. So they (allah and those firm in knowledge combined) believe in it (allah believes in verses? Nonsensical), and all is from their lord (allah's lord? Nonsensical).
This has been also explained on this forum in past by Ayman and others.
Then there is also the point raised about clarification of "all things" in 1689
Peace
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Peace reel,
I posted this 37 contradiction a while ago in this forum and had a lengthy discussion on it but no one was able to resolve it. It is a blatant and "clear" contradiction. On one hand "clear revelations" (299, 1015, 1973, 2216, 2272, 241, 2949, 3443, 4525, 467, 579, 6511). On the other hand acknowledging presence of verses that "no one knows its interpretation except allah".
Say what? I am afraid there is no way around this one.
Additionally how can the signs in the horizons and within ourselves verify the truth of something that we don't even know the interpretation of? (4153).
How can we use our inner/conscience (3030), mind/reason (numerous verses), and knowledge (1736) to verify something we don't even know the interpretation of?
Peace
Hi truthseeker,
I am very sure that if you are able to distinguish the arabic characters from each other that you can "solve" this "contradiction" very easily.
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Salaam/Peace to All,
due to the Fact that this is such a most Critical and important Verse in this respect here (=3/7)
in the whole QURAN TESTAMENT,
(which is also most distorted by various factions based on their own prejudiced/biased --intentional or unintentional-- misinterpretation/misunderstanding)
I want to present a new Perspective thereof supported with Perfect Example that we may understand it more/most correctly, inshaAL-LAH,
in this Final Age now.============
7- HE is the ONE Who sent down to you the Written-Document,
from which there are Firmly-Established Signs (=Ayatun Muhkamatun);
they are the Essence of the Written-Document (=Ummu al-Kitab);
and others which are Vaguely-Established (Signs) (=(Ayatun) Mutashabihatun);As for those who have a crookedness in their hearts, they will go after that which are of Vaguely-Established-Ones (=ma tashabaha minhu);
seeking (to create) confusion, and seeking (to ask for) its interpretation.But none know its interpretation except AL-LAH and those who are well founded in Knowledge;
they (=i.e. those who are well founded in Knowledge) say"We have believed in it;
(for) all --(of those Firmly-Established Signs and Vaguely-Established Signs mentioned above)-- are from our LORD."But none will take-heed except those who possess intelligence.
28- ...... It is not for a Messenger to come with any "Sign" --(whether a Firmly-Established Sign or a Vaguely-Established Sign
as clearly emphasized in the above Verse, in the first place)-- except with the Permission of AL-LAH;
(because) for each course there is a Written-Decree.29- (Because) AL-LAH neutralizes what HE wishes (as/of those Vaguely-Established Signs above)
and fixes (as/of those Firmly-Established Signs above),
because with HIM is the Essence of the Written-Document (=Ummu al-Kitab) --(as clearly emphasized
in the above Verse, in the first place, in this most specific respect therein again, in the very first paragraph of this Verse =3/7 above).(QURAN TESTAMENT 3/7 = 13/28-29)
So, I will give that Perfect Example
that will clearly and unmistakably show us what has been meant abovewith regard to this Most CURIOUS & MIRACULOUS Phenomenon above
in my next post, soon, inshaAL-LAH.Remain in peace/salaam.
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Peace Comrox,
The other verse with a clarification of every thing, I suppose that's the one I have some issue with, as clearly we don't have clarification on some issues.
Some say that since at the beginning of the book it says it is a guide for the forethoughtful (22), "all things" in 1689 refers to all things relevant to guidance. This is the best explanation you will get after thoroughly browsing this forum. But even if that is true, some basic and fundamental verses relevant to our guidance are not clear. For example how to perform salat and sawm above Arctic Circle or in some other part of Universe (21107), how many days exactly is sawm for (theories range from 3 to 10 days based on quranic evidence), when exactly are the 4 restricted "shahr" etc. These issues have already been discussed in countless threads on this forum by brilliant and extremely learned people in last 10+ years with no resolutions. Theories abound and someone might come along now and post his/her latest theory, which then will get challenged by someone else and so on, like it always does!
Please read the entire ongoing discussion at the following thread as proof of this
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9608586.0
If there was clarification for all things, the above thread would not have dragged on and on and on ...... and the size of this forum would probably have been 1/100th the size.
Peace
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Peace truthseeker11,
Peace Comrox,
Some say that since at the beginning of the book it says it is a guide for the forethoughtful (22), "all things" in 1689 refers to all things relevant to guidance. This is the best explanation you will get after thoroughly browsing this forum. But even if that is true, some basic and fundamental verses relevant to our guidance are not clear. For example how to perform salat and sawm above Arctic Circle or in some other part of Universe (21107), how many days exactly is sawm for (theories range from 3 to 10 days based on quranic evidence), when exactly are the 4 restricted "shahr" etc. These issues have already been discussed in countless threads on this forum by brilliant and extremely learned people in last 10+ years with no resolutions. Theories abound and someone might come along now and post his/her latest theory, which then will get challenged by someone else and so on, like it always does!
Please read the entire ongoing discussion at the following thread as proof of this
http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9608586.0
If there was clarification for all things, the above thread would not have dragged on and on and on ...... and the size of this forum would probably have been 1/100th the size.
Peace
I agree completely. Is any of us on the truthful path concerning these matters? Or is there not one truth for any of these topics?
The discussion will continue to go on.
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Peace truthseeker11,
I agree completely. Is any of us on the truthful path concerning these matters? Or is there not one truth for any of these topics?
The discussion will continue to go on.
The discussion baseless conjecture will continue to go on.
untill people decide to believe in all of Gods revelations, not pick and choose what parts suits them
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Peace truhseeker,
Have you considered a meaning of "bring about safety, security and tranquility with it" rather than "believe in it"?
Imraan
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Peace Imraan,
Still doesn't resolve the issue. You still cannot remove the full stop between allah and those well founded in knowledge because then in the phrase "kullun min 3indi rabbina", "rabbina"/our sustainer would mean the rabb of allah ("our" will include both allah and those well founded in knowledge).
Sorry bro, no way around it. You have to put full stop after allah, which will then lead to the contradiction mentioned. So either the contradiction or you will have to accept that allah has a rabb.
Peace
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Peace Imraan,
or you will have to accept that allah has a rabb.
Peace
What do you mean? I did not understand how you came to this conclusion.
Just a hint maybe it will help you to solve the "contradiction"
- I think ayaat means sign not verses
- I think kitaab means what is prescribed not book
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Peace truthseeker,
This is not really an issue. The plural simply refers to those being described. I'm not sure why you think the plural needs to include Allah.
As a side note, I don't think there is anything in the verse about allegorical, but using the plural as a justification for the point you're trying to make just doesn't jive.
Imraan
