Would you commit shirk if God told you so ?
-
Where is the competition with the angels? Angels knew before God that Adam genderation would be bloodshedders? They say this
They said, "Exalted are You; we have no knowledge except what You have taught us. Indeed, it is You who is the Knowing, the Wise."232
Or do we believe as Invalid once wondered, humans multiplied through incest?
Note
Who perfected everything which He created and began the creation of man from clay.327
And Allah has caused you to grow from the earth a growth7117And He taught Adam the names - all of them. Then He showed them to the angels and said, "Inform Me of the names of these, if you are truthful."231
Lets not call it competition because Allah "taught" Adam the names. And as you have seen we can't isolate verses because Quran explains itself. Hence, I provided the other verses previously. Of course, there are some more I didn't have the time to include. As I said, if you consider Adam to be first human which nowhere in the Quran seems to exist then you have to assume that humans multiplied through incest. Do you agree with that concept?
If you wanna know about blood shedders get some pets. This is gonna get many things cleared up about who we are. So far this is what I have learned from my own pets
They are inclined to rape (my new finding after I brought a female kitty home)
They are impatient
They do deceive
They are arrogant
They hate to share things
They are selfish
They do practice eugenic
They like to show off to make their peers feel bad
They are demanding
They can be fake
They fight for their own entertainment and to kill boredom
They are racist (that came as a surprise to me)
They copy each other blindly ( the latest in our community is folding of one front leg because there was a disabled kitty who was doing this)
When they want something they'll destroy things on the way to getting it.
They can be taught what is illegal, but if the owner is not near they'll do it anyways and they cover for each otherWhat makes "successor" relate to Adam and not to Iblis ? Or something else other than the two ?
If you read all the verses we are discussing here you will notice that brain/mind is one of the biggest things to make Adam different. Allah taught Adams the names and it really is what makes him different.
He said, "O Adam, inform them of their names." And when he had informed them of their names, He said, "Did I not tell you that I know the unseen of the heavens and the earth? And I know what you reveal and what you have concealed."231
Go to all the verses about Iblees. He is arrogant and he has plans to deceive humans. Look at the world think what deception does to it. One example is atom bomb. Majority of the scientists were deceived to work for it. They had no idea that they were making a bomb. If you explode a few on this planet we will be back in the forest. Successors are about progressing. The opposite is backward. Ponder upon the laws given in the Quran.
Jinns/Reptilians/Dinosaurs is still here ?
And on what is your claim based on?
Do you know that you have a Reptilian Brain core, just like every human being on Earth. And this brain core is responsible for things like wanting to eat, fornicate, and other lusts. Which God teaches us to not get attached to.
https//k12.thoughtfullearning.com/sites/k12/files/blogPost/images/brain_image.jpg
Dont you see that our bodies are our enemies ? The serpent is inside of our brains ?
http//mikelev.in/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/lizard-brain-300x285.gif
The Garden of Eden might be just an allegory to the constant fight between our higher self and serpent/reptilian core brain, which drives/deceives us to eat those "forbidden fruits".
Thank you so so much for this post Honslo. It sums up everything.
-
bravo
Reel really interesting post. It really opens one`s eyes, so to speak.And thanks for kind words. We all here because we are hungry for the truth. Doesn't matter how bitter it is.
Thanks ). I did a bit of of more research. It seems that thinking part of the brain indeed came later
https//www.sociedelic.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/New-Brain-Middle-Brain-and-the-Reptilian-Brain.jpg
http//image.slidesharecdn.com/mechanismofaddictionfinal-140422085734-phpapp01/95/mechanism-of-addiction-10-638.jpg?cb=1410690197
And I suppose this describes what MOF has been telling us
http//i4.ifrm.com/670/83/upload/p22032418.jpg -
And He taught Adam the names - all of them. Then He showed them to the angels and said, "Inform Me of the names of these, if you are truthful."231
Lets not call it competition because Allah "taught" Adam the names. And as you have seen we can't isolate verses because Quran explains itself. Hence, I provided the other verses previously. Of course, there are some more I didn't have the time to include. As I said, if you consider Adam to be first human which nowhere in the Quran seems to exist then you have to assume that humans multiplied through incest. Do you agree with that concept?
i think you are confused in evolution of human being and creation of human being...
and perfection of human being after they accept the test... !RED is there is any human being before adam in quran is mention?
the subject is not only 2 31 go through all the verses after that.. something what is apparent according to there , the event took place in which adam achieved what asked from him and angels could not make it , and then God commanded them to give an honour to adam..isnt it...
If you wanna know about blood shedders get some pets. This is gonna get many things cleared up about who we are. So far this is what I have learned from my own pets
They are inclined to rape (my new finding after I brought a female kitty home)
They are impatient
They do deceive
They are arrogant
They hate to share things
They are selfish
They do practice eugenic
They like to show off to make their peers feel bad
They are demanding
They can be fake
They fight for their own entertainment and to kill boredom
They are racist (that came as a surprise to me)
They copy each other blindly ( the latest in our community is folding of one front leg because there was a disabled kitty who was doing this)
When they want something they'll destroy things on the way to getting it.
They can be taught what is illegal, but if the owner is not near they'll do it anyways and they cover for each otheranimals and human being are not not same... they are programmed the way they are... like a computer is programmed the instruction we put in it...
human being is not an animal... he is responsible for his actions as he/she is well aware about right and wrong...
example is if a bull hit you,, no court will punish him..
if a wall fell on you , you will not hit the wall back...yeh but in human being the case is different...
If you read all the verses we are discussing here you will notice that brain/mind is one of the biggest things to make Adam different. Allah taught Adams the names and it really is what makes him different.
even animals have brain/mind
we have authority what make us different from other species ...
angels may have authority but they are well aware about it so they cannot go against it.. like sun must give you heat and light must , complete its orbital period... and so on...
the test is about authority not about brain.. what you gona do with the authority will decide what you get... on other words free will of chosing a path ...
although if you find the verses regarding the claim what u make it would be helpful ,, still waiting for it..
-
And lots of people have their daily drive from the reptile brain.
Aggression, dominance, fear, worship, greed, lust, seeking a mate, but do not forget hierarchical alignment, materialism, jealousy, "survival of the fittest (self-centered and on own kin)" and the "workaholic syndrome" which causes us to go with the flow of what we are doing and be preoccupied and enjoy the mere duty.
It is due to the reptile brain that humans enjoy watching movies portraying violence or matches of martial arts, particularly when they can identify themselves with someone in those, e.g. the hero of the movie.
Want, greed and jealousy will make the human indulge more in order to reach what they want in order to acquire social status for climbing upwards in the hierarchy is desired, every instinct goes hand in hand with each other. The more instincts one succumbs to the more potentially dangerous a being in conjunction with a lacking spirit. Malicious methods seem to be instinctively programmed and are used when the greed and other involved instincts are pushing too high. Malicious methods begin with seemingly innocent and non-violent lies, i.e. "false testimony", one turns their reality to the own advantage.
Dominance begins to show with the desire to win a game. It might seem innocent, but an "innocent' game in which one desire to win is an activation of the instinct. This is also why we should not gamble with someone else when it comes to money because then suddenly more instincts might came into play. When there is a material reward the driving will be extra hard.
Fear might express itself in many ways, but one that might happen on a daily basis is to lie (carry false testimony) because one wishes to avoid consequences. We could connect the "malicious methods" with carrying false testimony and fear because when one sees they are not going to win they might employ falsehood in order to win because they fear. Wars can become awfully cruel because people fear and they portray the threat of reality improperly.
The instinct of worship is elusive, it simply seems to drive one to superstition and it is creating the separate god phenomenon. I have noticed that the desire for religious worship seems almost like an obsession to many people without even ignoring to ponder what kind of use the deity has for it, but the deity is given humanly properties and requires flattering like a human king would, i.e. it becomes hierarchical alignment. With the reptile brain enabled the deity becomes no more than a man on the moon. The instincts of materialism and hierarchical alignment as well as fear are involved in the driving of projecting the material god because what their imagination projects causes fear to them because it is not understandable and the imagination portrays a deity with something they can compare with, i.e. a human king which they can worship, but this king gives them things out of nothing so they draw the conclusion they are of no use to it in return and hence because of its ability they worship it even more and sees it as a being that is great in dominating because of the natural phenomena they see. The worship of divinities has changed over time, but it fundamentally the same as in the past. People cannot explain why they should worship or the logic behind it but still do it and they get emotional if you ask them why. Many people might say they do not worship but they clearly worship anyhow.
The sex drive is not exactly necessary to explain about, it is self-explanatory. But it will cause the person to have fantasies and lusts when beholding a sexually attractive individual and might cause the person to need to discharge the generated lust somehow through various means. It seems like a kind of sexual frustration is generated when the mind is wandering towards the images built up. This instinct is really primitive because it is hard to resist and has to do with mating, and it was made to end in a feeling of pleasantry in order to increase the incitement. The best way to detach oneself from this instinct (if they have this intention) is to not behold features of the opposite sex that might make the mind to wander and to force the mind to render sex distasteful and crude, and to somehow eat foods that will not sponsor the sex drive and to not be too bodily in shape because that sensation might be a factor. The images in the instinct of domination in both directions (being dominated or dominating) will reinforce the sexuality e.g. fantasizing about the ability of another. And their material composition. For someone with the drive but not desiring it it can be enslaving.
Be well
Amenuel -
The spirit of man was likely inserted in an already established species on Earth so not created simultaneously. You do not believe in my argument that the Jinn is the bodily, but Quran says the Jinn was created before the Naas and that reveals that the bodily existed before the spirit (of Adam) was placed on its body. Adam is the race of man and not only an individual. Everyone is called children of Adam whereas they are never called children of anyone else except "children of Israel" which is a secret code name. Humans are still to this day referred to as Adam in languages such as Persian/Farsi. Adam might not even have been a particular human individual, but he mainly appears in the parable about the garden of Eden. Each unit of the story is metaphorical for what we should NOT do in this world, it teaches that the indulge in the world grows the sexual attraction of bodies and that we thus cover them starting with our organs of reproduction. We eat from the fruit of all the trees for the whole of our lives which means that we simply have to live off the world in order to make the body persist, but we should not eat of the fruit from the tree of sin and that is when we begin to see the instincts come forth resembled in the story of Adam in more than one way, e.g. being tempted to desire the sin, realizing the sin, preventing the further sinning (covering the body) and covering the sin. The two sons of Adam reveal what causes a person to desire to murder, e.g. jealousy, domination. The tree from which they should not eat is the fruit of desire.
When regarding the narratives it is always important to reflect upon their philosophical teachings more than the actual stories, i.e. "why is it so?"
Be well
Amenuel -
Salam Imran
Some us mankind use the word Animal in degrading way for Humans, but the Lord has put some of us even lower than Animals in following aya
Q546 There are many jinn and men who have hearts that fail to grasp the truth. We have destined for Hell, those whose eyes fail to see and whose ears fail to hear. They are like cattle. No, they are even less mindful of the right path. It is they who are oblivious.
Hence if a deer was to hear a little tiny crunch of grass crushed by the weight of the hunter, it makes full use of its sensors(hearing,sight,mind)Animals are not computerized they also have choice, and Intelect, but Mankind is superior
Q638 Every beast that crawls on the earth and every birds that flies with its two wings have formed communities like you. We have left nothing out of the Book. Later, they will be gathered to their Lord.
Ants having Intelect Q2718 Bird brain or Intelect Q2722
-
i think you are confused in evolution of human being and creation of human being...
and perfection of human being after they accept the test... !I am guessing you still believe in this kind of creation
https//encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbnANd9GcTrCoUYTexVAM9sdyzmXf-MaGoyETYIdctrTGcgUZc7xTzEfgkI
No worries, I have been there. But verses don't seem to agree with it.RED is there is any human being before adam in quran is mention?
Don't you ponder why? Hint The slides above. You answered it here though
example is if a bull hit you,, no court will punish him..
if a wall fell on you , you will not hit the wall back...
yeh but in human being the case is different...the subject is not only 2 31 go through all the verses after that.. something what is apparent according to there , the event took place in which adam achieved what asked from him and angels could not make it , and then God commanded them to give an honour to adam..isnt it...
I don't think we are denying the event of Adam telling the names. I said we can't see it as a competition.
animals and human being are not not same... they are programmed the way they are... like a computer is programmed the instruction we put in it...
Exactly, hence, it would be probably a waste of time for God to write about whether they are being nice or bad in Quran.
human being is not an animal... he is responsible for his actions as he/she is well aware about right and wrong...
But humans can behave like animals. He can deny that he is responsible for his actions and we see that everyday on this planet. One of the reasons why many reject evolution is because it tries to market the misconception that there is nothing wrong in being like an animal.
the test is about authority not about brain.. what you gona do with the authority will decide what you get... on other words free will of chosing a path ...
although if you find the verses regarding the claim what u make it would be helpful ,, still waiting for it..
The test is only for Adam. Angels have no free will. If you do not believe Adam basically is the evolved sane version of blood shedders then there is nothing we can do. Strangely, the perfect human being Adam did slip to "taste the tree". I don't remember seeing it in the reply. So you believe in the incest assumption?
You do not believe in my argument that the Jinn is the bodily
I am interested in seeing signs from different people/places to come to conclusion. I hope you do not mind. I do not reject your claim. I like to go the evaluation way.
And lots of people have their daily drive from the reptile brain.
Aggression, dominance, fear, worship, greed, lust, seeking a mate, but do not forget hierarchical alignment, materialism, jealousy, "survival of the fittest (self-centered and on own kin)" and the "workaholic syndrome" which causes us to go with the flow of what we are doing and be preoccupied and enjoy the mere duty.
It is due to the reptile brain that humans enjoy watching movies portraying violence or matches of martial arts, particularly when they can identify themselves with someone in those, e.g. the hero of the movie.
Want, greed and jealousy will make the human indulge more in order to reach what they want in order to acquire social status for climbing upwards in the hierarchy is desired, every instinct goes hand in hand with each other. The more instincts one succumbs to the more potentially dangerous a being in conjunction with a lacking spirit. Malicious methods seem to be instinctively programmed and are used when the greed and other involved instincts are pushing too high. Malicious methods begin with seemingly innocent and non-violent lies, i.e. "false testimony", one turns their reality to the own advantage.
Dominance begins to show with the desire to win a game. It might seem innocent, but an "innocent' game in which one desire to win is an activation of the instinct. This is also why we should not gamble with someone else when it comes to money because then suddenly more instincts might came into play. When there is a material reward the driving will be extra hard.
Fear might express itself in many ways, but one that might happen on a daily basis is to lie (carry false testimony) because one wishes to avoid consequences. We could connect the "malicious methods" with carrying false testimony and fear because when one sees they are not going to win they might employ falsehood in order to win because they fear. Wars can become awfully cruel because people fear and they portray the threat of reality improperly.
The instinct of worship is elusive, it simply seems to drive one to superstition and it is creating the separate god phenomenon. I have noticed that the desire for religious worship seems almost like an obsession to many people without even ignoring to ponder what kind of use the deity has for it, but the deity is given humanly properties and requires flattering like a human king would, i.e. it becomes hierarchical alignment. With the reptile brain enabled the deity becomes no more than a man on the moon. The instincts of materialism and hierarchical alignment as well as fear are involved in the driving of projecting the material god because what their imagination projects causes fear to them because it is not understandable and the imagination portrays a deity with something they can compare with, i.e. a human king which they can worship, but this king gives them things out of nothing so they draw the conclusion they are of no use to it in return and hence because of its ability they worship it even more and sees it as a being that is great in dominating because of the natural phenomena they see. The worship of divinities has changed over time, but it fundamentally the same as in the past. People cannot explain why they should worship or the logic behind it but still do it and they get emotional if you ask them why. Many people might say they do not worship but they clearly worship anyhow.
The sex drive is not exactly necessary to explain about, it is self-explanatory. But it will cause the person to have fantasies and lusts when beholding a sexually attractive individual and might cause the person to need to discharge the generated lust somehow through various means. It seems like a kind of sexual frustration is generated when the mind is wandering towards the images built up. This instinct is really primitive because it is hard to resist and has to do with mating, and it was made to end in a feeling of pleasantry in order to increase the incitement. The best way to detach oneself from this instinct (if they have this intention) is to not behold features of the opposite sex that might make the mind to wander and to force the mind to render sex distasteful and crude, and to somehow eat foods that will not sponsor the sex drive and to not be too bodily in shape because that sensation might be a factor. The images in the instinct of domination in both directions (being dominated or dominating) will reinforce the sexuality e.g. fantasizing about the ability of another. And their material composition. For someone with the drive but not desiring it it can be enslaving.
Be well
AmenuelI think there is no way to fully get away from some things of that brain part like fear, seeking mate, etc.
I am not sure if the sex drive was needed to be included in the author's explanation unless he or she takes Maslow's hierarchy of need seriously. There is something I always wonder about this one. What if tv was not mentioning and showing sex? Under such circumstances, will authors like this one think of sex as something worth to mention? I know many people who are virgin in their 40s and 50s.
-
I am guessing you still believe in this kind of creation
https//encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbnANd9GcTrCoUYTexVAM9sdyzmXf-MaGoyETYIdctrTGcgUZc7xTzEfgkI
No worries, I have been there. But verses don't seem to agree with it.no actually u dnt try to understand the difference between evolution and creation..
ok may b ill make it simple... what is the missing link where is the missing link? why science dnt have answer of missing link? is this missing link is inbetween evolution and creation , is it possible.. if not then what? confused
Don't you ponder why? Hint The slides above. You answered it here though
i m not much intelligent to solve things by hints , detail it please... if u can...
I don't think we are denying the event of Adam telling the names. I said we can't see it as a competition.
ok why angels did not tell the names... did you deny it... why angels after getting fail to tell the names prostrate/sujood adam.. will you deny it again? ok forget about it.. just give that situation a name... game , contest or just a story or tale of old ? anything ...
Exactly, hence, it would be probably a waste of time for God to write about whether they are being nice or bad in Quran.
? hmm
But humans can behave like animals. He can deny that he is responsible for his actions and we see that everyday on this planet. One of the reasons why many reject evolution is because it tries to market the misconception that there is nothing wrong in being like an animal.
human can behave like whatever he wish, animal, angel, sinner, pious, devil ... but again he wil get accountable when the judgement happen.. ... so yeh there is nothing wrong in becoming animal hence failed in test...
The test is only for Adam. Angels have no free will. If you do not believe Adam basically is the evolved sane version of blood shedders then there is nothing we can do. Strangely, the perfect human being Adam did slip to "taste the tree". I don't remember seeing it in the reply. So you believe in the incest assumption?
it would be better if you provide some reference from quran which i already ask.. then we will proceed with that... becoz after your refrences about the bloodsheeders already on planet is contradictory due to many reasons...
if one blooodsheeders are there why angels ask why are you creating more?
why angels did not ask at the first time when God was creating first bloodsheeders that were already present?
is that incident was before evolution or after evolution?
is this the creation of human being or evolution of human being... ?NOTE i want reference in which its is clearly mention before adam it was bloodsheeders on earth already... and more possibly the free will bloodsheeders not animals like dinosours lol
-
Salam Imran
Some us mankind use the word Animal in degrading way for Humans, but the Lord has put some of us even lower than Animals in following aya
Q546 There are many jinn and men who have hearts that fail to grasp the truth. We have destined for Hell, those whose eyes fail to see and whose ears fail to hear. They are like cattle. No, they are even less mindful of the right path. It is they who are oblivious.
peace brother.
look in to bold , and my post again please.. they have mind, they have life force, and they have conscious...
but what they dnt have is authority ....
so this verse what you reffer is a perfect example of disbeleivers who are like cattle becoz they dnt use their mind and authority which make them no different than animals... but instead of having that ability they did not use it which will cast them in to hell prison...
that case will not happen with animals... they dnt have any authority
did you ever see monkeys are creating space shuttles , and zebras are creating cell phones...?
human and animals and plants are three living things although with totally different features....
human being is a living thing , he have authority and this authority is our test how we use it...
we can create furniture from woods. we see animals are under our command... even some of them are very powerful than human but still we are ruling this planet ... thats what the authority is... and we will be asked what we did with our authority...i think there is a discussion already on this animal topic is somewhere i could not recall that thread...
why deer run away becoz there is a life force in it...
mountain never run away when see a hunter , becoz its without life force... but mountains have hidden side too.. they also refused to take the authority .. -
no actually u dnt try to understand the difference between evolution and creation..
He is Allah , the Creator, the Inventor, The Evolver (al bari); to Him belong the best names. Whatever is in the heavens and earth is exalting Him. And He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.5924
ok may b ill make it simple... what is the missing link where is the missing link? why science dnt have answer of missing link? is this missing link is inbetween evolution and creation , is it possible.. if not then what? confused
That was the reason why I rejected evolution before, but if the process was gradual then I do not think we will ever recognize the missing link. That said, if we don't know something now does not mean we will never know it. The problem is that it is hard to deny evolution. It is all around us in many forms. Quran also hints towards it. Even a bay in the womb is evolved in 9 months time.
i m not much intelligent to solve things by hints , detail it please... if u can...
Reptilian brain slide?
ok why angels did not tell the names... did you deny it... why angels after getting fail to tell the names prostrate/sujood adam.. will you deny it again? ok forget about it.. just give that situation a name... game , contest or just a story or tale of old ? anything ...
Now tie that to what you said earlier and see the loophole in it
Angels said God was making blood shedding human= they could see things well in advance
Allah introduced Adam to them and held competition=fair enough
Result Angels lost and that is also despite the fact they had the ability to see things in advance. Wonder why they didn't see the competition coming...why they didn't prepare their answers prior to the event!it would be better if you provide some reference from quran which i already ask.. then we will proceed with that... becoz after your refrences about the bloodsheeders already on planet is contradictory due to many reasons...
if one blooodsheeders are there why angels ask why are you creating more?
why angels did not ask at the first time when God was creating first bloodsheeders that were already present?
is that incident was before evolution or after evolution?
is this the creation of human being or evolution of human being... ?NOTE i want reference in which its is clearly mention before adam it was bloodsheeders on earth already... and more possibly the free will bloodsheeders not animals like dinosours lol
Your question reminds me of this verse
Has (there) come upon man a period of time not he was a thing mentioned? 761
I don't think the verse is about creating more blood shedders, but position of the creatures which is "successor".
And , when your Lord said to the angels, "Indeed, I will make upon the earth a successive authority." They said, "Will You place upon it one who causes corruption therein and sheds blood, while we declare Your praise and sanctify You?" Allah said, "Indeed, I know that which you do not know."230
I do not just yet know in which verses blood shedders (prior to Adam) are mentioned. However, some questions can still be raised from these verses
Except Iblees; he was arrogant and became among the disbelievers.3874
And "O Adam, dwell, you and your wife, in Paradise and eat from wherever you will but do not approach this tree, lest you be among the wrongdoers."229
Where did the disbeliever categorization come from?
Among wrongdoers?
You may also check out the detailed analysis of evolution here
http//www.academia.edu/9806605/The_Appearance_of_Adam_from_the_Quranic_Perspective_-_Creation_or_Evolution
http//quransmessage.com/articles/evolution.htmBefore Darwin, the earliest Muslims researched and wrote about theories of evolution, but they weren't the first
http//www.ascertainthetruth.com/att/index.php/al-islam/al-islam-and-science/871-evolution-was-an-islamic-theory-before-darwin-was-even-bornIncest still???
-
Peace reel, Imra.
Have a break,have a cup of tea.
Allow me to give you both a well earned break and let me make a fool of myself trying to reconcile your theories.Let us take our example first. The human comes from one single cell. A complex cell that divides and its" programme" is well designed by the Master programmer.He said to it "Be" and there it is dividing itself into different cells that gives different organs that forms the full human. Brain ,heart,lungs,stomach...the lot. Each carrying the DNA characteristics of the original cell ,yet each having a different role within the body. A miracle of miracles!
Now, Darwin had no idea how complex that "original cell"was????
Let me go on making a fool of myself. GOD does not have constraints like time!!!! a second,two years,millions of years,billions of years are all the same to Him! GOD has all the time He needs .Yes Eternity!!!!Going back to that single cell of Darwin. It was programmed by the Master programmer. Well designed to come up with all the species. Yes all the different species . Like your body ,remember!. He said "Be" and the cell was.
The missing link you say? Well the species started at the same time ,evolved in their own different ways and remained different to where they are now!!!! All having the main characteristics( some DNA) of that "Original cell" yet different in make up and purpose.
Mankind evolved( from that cell,over an amount of time as the special "species" intended by GOD to undergo the test when the time was right and the "shaping" completed.Enjoy your cup of tea.
GOD bless you both.
Peace. -
Peace reel, Imra.
Have a break,have a cup of tea.
Allow me to give you both a well earned break and let me make a fool of myself trying to reconcile your theories.Let us take our example first. The human comes from one single cell. A complex cell that divides and its" programme" is well designed by the Master programmer.He said to it "Be" and there it is dividing itself into different cells that gives different organs that forms the full human. Brain ,heart,lungs,stomach...the lot. Each carrying the DNA characteristics of the original cell ,yet each having a different role within the body. A miracle of miracles!
Now, Darwin had no idea how complex that "original cell"was????
Let me go on making a fool of myself. GOD does not have constraints like time!!!! a second,two years,millions of years,billions of years are all the same to Him! GOD has all the time He needs .Yes Eternity!!!!Going back to that single cell of Darwin. It was programmed by the Master programmer. Well designed to come up with all the species. Yes all the different species . Like your body ,remember!. He said "Be" and the cell was.
The missing link you say? Well the species started at the same time ,evolved in their own different ways and remained different to where they are now!!!! All having the main characteristics( some DNA) of that "Original cell" yet different in make up and purpose.
Mankind evolved( from that cell,over an amount of time as the special "species" intended by GOD to undergo the test when the time was right and the "shaping" completed.Enjoy your cup of tea.
GOD bless you both.
Peace.Oh no, I was just discussing and you are definitely not making a fool of yourself. When googling I found this very strange book
http//ebooks.rahnuma.org/religion/Allama_Mashriqi/Inayatullah.Khan_QuranEvolution.pdf I am still reading it, but he seems to be showing how natural selection is not exactly bad especially if the group being destroyed by it is not being useful to earth. -
He is Allah , the Creator, the Inventor, The Evolver (al bari); to Him belong the best names. Whatever is in the heavens and earth is exalting Him. And He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.5924
yeh no doubt about it...
That was the reason why I rejected evolution before,
there is no need of rejecting evolution , creation and perfection as well... all are different things and quran talk about them in different places...
Reptilian brain slide?
so thats what the answering in the reply of this... i m still confuse.... you quoted me for this...
RED is there is any human being before adam in quran is mention?
so according to you reptilian brain side is human being before adam... hmm
Now tie that to what you said earlier and see the loophole in it
Angels said God was making blood shedding human= they could see things well in advance
Allah introduced Adam to them and held competition=fair enough
Result Angels lost and that is also despite the fact they had the ability to see things in advance. Wonder why they didn't see the competition coming...why they didn't prepare their answers prior to the event!i m tied with what i said... you took out the word competetion from it... and get confused in between evolution and creation.. anyway...
so you agree about competetion /event and next question you ask is in bold....
the answer is yeh with the meanings of verses its clear that angels know some of the future what they predicted ... but they underestimated the creation thats what they dnt know... and God shows them in the shape of competetion/event /game /contest or whatever lol....
and they replied God you know what we dnt know... haha whats so hard understanding all this..
only God is the source of ultimate knowledge... that what they said after all this... its mean even after knowing the outcomes of human succession in earth they still unaware from the hidden side of that blood sheeder ...and after losing the competetion they pay honour /sujood ... to human.. obviously with the command of God...
why angels did not ask at the first time when God was creating first bloodsheeders that were already present?
is that incident was before evolution or after evolution?
is this the creation of human being or evolution of human being... ?Your question reminds me of this verse
Has (there) come upon man a period of time not he was a thing mentioned? 761this verse is not the answer of any of my question above... infact this verse is regarding the stages of evolution of human being ...
obviously human being did not magically come into existence.. but the character/realself is started from the creation of human being and first character in the history of mankind is adam... you are still in between evolution and creation thats y in the start i wanted you to focus on the difference .. in the end i try highlight somethings you may start understanding things from there... hope that will help... inshallah
I do not just yet know in which verses blood shedders (prior to Adam) are mentioned. However, some questions can still be raised from these verses
ok hope so you will find that verses then present these verses here we will discuss about them mean while .. what i learn from quran... about creation evolution and perfection here is a little bit summary of it...
the creation of body.... from the womb of earth...(first stage) evolutionary
the perfection of body.... with life force same apply to other species(evolutionary)after that a trust offer meanwhile the creation of the real character/real person come into existence... that suppose to emerged in the already created body what we usually call homo spahiens...(creation started)
and when God blow a spirit what is actually a real character of human being in the perfected homo spahiens body then its a perfection stage( perfection ).. some verses i will share although i m also a learner may be the links and things happen differently... God knows best...
761 Was there not a time in the past when man was nothing to even be
mentioned?(evolution)
762 We have created man from a mixed seed; We test him, so We made
him hear and see.(creation)
763 We have guided him to the path, either to be thankful or to reject.(perfection)6133 And your Lord is the Rich, possessor of Mercy. If He wished,
He could remove all of you and bring after you whom He pleases,
just as He established you from the seed of another people."While He created you in stages?"( stages of all evolution,creation and perfection)
"Did you not see how God created seven heavens in layers?"
And made the moon a light therein, and made the sun a radiant lamp.
"God made you grow from the earth as plants."
"Then He returns you to it, and He brings you out totally?"71 14-18We initiated your creation and then we shaped you...' (711)
He...designed you and perfected your design...' (643)
?We have offered the trust to the heavens and the Earth, and the mountains, but they refused to bear it, and were fearful of it. But the human being accepted it; he was transgressing, ignorant.? (3372)( all humanity obviously that is offer to our real selves/characters)
?And your Lord took for the children of Adam from their backs, their progeny; and He made them witness over themselves ?Am I not your Lord?? They said ?Yes, we bear witness.? Thus you cannot say on the Day of Resurrection that you were unaware of this.? (7172) (characters were already created)
perfection stage and start of perfected human being having a trust/authority
And your Lord said to the angels ?I am creating a human being from a hardened clay. So when I perfect him, and blow of My Spirit (Rouh) in him, you shall yield to him." (1528-29)
or?For your Lord said to the angels ?I am creating a human being from clay. So when I have evolved him, and breathed into him from My Spirit (Rouh), then you shall yield to him.? (3871-72)
so evolution then creation of characters then perfection ...
evolution what we read in science is just the study of human body the missing links what they have no answer if you ponder all of this then may b you understand what i was on about...
we are talking about three things here and all three things links together with eachother and its a process of billion of years... approx...
yeh but the story of bloodsheeders started from adam .. the first perfected human being... the story of first bloodsheeder is also in quran... when a crow suggest him how to dig the grave of his brother...lol
-
Peace reel, Imra.
Have a break,have a cup of tea.
peace GL
i had my cup of tea... lol but without sugar ...
thanx for you input , we all are here to learn something from eachother... so i also have some understanding as learner... hence i shared it... so you always welcome to share your knowledge sir...
-
Peace,
No one knows our true earthly origin/evolution.
However, we are free to guess/speculate/conject
and hypothesize. Quran Kareem is the best source.police
MY maan handshake
You are absolutely right, in that we are free to do all the above, but would believers conjecture and say about Allah what they do not know?
I see many of them conforming to modernity and hanging off Man of Faith's every word as if it were revelation, while a majority of his rhetoric is not referenced, unreasonable with Quranich context and Light. Most of his teachings are actually borrowed from the questionable Quran-exposed traditional doctrine from the Old Scripture partnership with God, claiming that we are sons of God etc...
When I say modernity, I am meaning scientific and sociopolitical norms of today's world homosexuality, transgenderism, big bang theory, astrophysics, big bang theory, dinosaurs, evolution, the age of the earth(geology) etc..
Most seemingly are going astray... -
By the way you are all terribly wrong about the reptilian brain premise.
You are so wrapped up in your belief that science is at the forefront of truth seeking, while in many cases it is not so.
I am disappointed in some of the statements some have made so glibly.
If you were earnestly researching truth instead piggybacking off each other's ideas that stroke your preconceived biases, you would have realized that the model of brain depicted in that post or the idea that the base of the brain/forebrain or basal ganglia is a part of the brain evolved from reptilian ancestors has been long rejected by the majority of neuroscientists.
MacLean whom you are following blindly (whom had no authority from Allah for which he conjectured) claimed that this part of the brain was present in reptiles and birds, well turns out that this portion is waaaaay much smaller in birds and reptiles it is only a small portion of their brains, and guess what it is found in the brains of all "modern" vertebrates (including many fish, mammals and amphibians).
Everything previously believed in the 1960's about the sauropsid behavior has been discarded.
Your theory and hypothesis of jinn or reptile being within us and being supported by science goes right where it belongs in the garbage.
Now if you are interested in the truth learn how to really research, if you want I can show you how to search for peer-reviewed journals articles, but do not ever try to deceive others based upon lazy half-assed "research" that is just Confirmation bias a logical fallacy many of you commit over and over.It is annoying to those who believe that people say about Allah what they have no knowledge of.
You are overstepping the limit, so beware.You all have been deceived and demonstrating how much of followers you are.
Evolution itself is a farce, however scientists themselves have discarded this dysfunctional and inaccurate model of the brain yet you against logic and reason you hang on to it, because you reject the existence of ethereal non corporeal beings which Quran clearly describes. Is Muslim what you call yourselves? Then start over the Book and abandon the footsteps you have been following.
-
Peace,
No one knows our true earthly origin/evolution.
However, we are free to guess/speculate/conject
and hypothesize. Quran Kareem is the best source.police
yeh absolutely we can only sure about the information which is written in quran...
although the era of evolution based on stages and it left blank for us to discover things . and work on it... and we just begin to understand things... age of earth, age of early life cell, species... so on...
our own history of character(what we have inside) is the relevant subject of quran... and it started from the event what is mentioning here... after that things are pretty clear...
the stage in between evolution/ creation and perfection is quite hard to make sure thats hwo things happen...
but key points are...the body of human(animal) evolved in stages... first birth from the womb of earth second birth from the womb of mother.. 71 14-18
the character/self of all humanity were also created and asked them about this trust which they accepted...33 72and the offer was not only to one person becoz the word bani adam clear more that the characters all of them were asked...
according to 7 172...
even its telling me not only body of human evolved the characters of human also evolved or the system which we cannot grasp... thats the missing link and from there the ways of science and religion seperated becoz science ask for evidence...
but the missing link always remain missing .. the missing link is actually how can human being become so smart to create things ... (thats what we call intelligence trust or whatever)
even some ancient aliens theories suggest it was aliens who come from sky and perfected the human being with intelligence... H2 channel documentry...
becoz the theory of darwin is critised by lot of people and its on the ending stage like this voodoo
but it does not mean evolution not exist and some parts of this theory is also matched with quran like process in stages and life started from single cell ..life started from water etc ..God knows best..but his cliam regarding this is unscientific that human evolved from apes...
if human derived from monkey , why there are still monkey there... lol
monkey was always monkey,,
goat was always goat...
humo saphiens was always homo saphine... -
yeh absolutely we can only sure about the information which is written in quran...
if human derived from monkey , why there are still monkey there... lol
monkey was always monkey,,
goat was always goat...
humo saphiens was always homo saphine...Good Point!
Anyway why would a monkey become a Jackass (human).
Human beings have always been what they are today, that is the reason
why none have found the missing link. And no, there was never giant people
roaming the earth until someone proves it by finding a giant human
skeleton or parts thereof.MY maan handshake
You are absolutely right, in that we are free to do all the above, but would believers conjecture and say about Allah what they do not know?
Many say "we believe" while their words betray them, this ayat
is a distinguisher from those who accept the clear verses and
the ambiguous verses without the need to solve the ambiguous
verses.He it is Who has sent down to thee the Book In it are verses basic or
fundamental (of established meaning); they are the foundation of the
Book others are allegorical. But those in whose hearts is perversity
follow the part thereof that is allegorical, seeking discord, and searching
for its hidden meanings, but no one knows its hidden meanings except
Allah. And those who are firmly grounded in knowledge say
"We believe in the Book; the whole of it is from our Lord"
and none will grasp the Message except men of understanding.So do I need to know who was the first man, no not really.
How many stars are there? uumm I have no idea.
Where is Allah? Let's see nope
Where is Jannah? uh I got nothingpeace