Homosexuality LGBTQI and the deen

Bender

So, Bender, rijal in 726 is feet of humans and feet of jinn?

No, ofcourse rijaal does not mean foot nor does it mean males/men

Cursed are those who're following deen of homosexuals and those who wanna do sin with angels.

RED what does deen of homosexuals mean?
BLUE I was not planning to do sin with angels, but in case one day when I am to drunk and want to do sin with angels, then how exactly am I going to achieve that?

Wakas

Bender,

For me 1 quranic word/root ==> 1 interpretation/concept

Perhaps you can clarify further. Which of the below

Are you claiming that an Arabic word should have the same meaning in every Quran occurrence?
Are you claiming that an Arabic word should have the same theme/concept (but perhaps slightly different shade of meaning depending on context) in every Quran occurrence?
Are you claiming that every derived word(s) from a root should have the same meaning in every Quran occurrence?
Are you claiming that every derived word(s) from a root should have the same theme/concept (but perhaps slightly different shade of meaning depending on context) in every Quran occurrence?
(1) or (2) or (3) or (4) and every root/word has its own distinct meaning
something else, if so please clarify.

Depending on your answer, it may be possible to test your theory.

Bender

Bender,
Perhaps you can clarify further. Which of the below

Are you claiming that an Arabic word should have the same meaning in every Quran occurrence?
Are you claiming that an Arabic word should have the same theme/concept (but perhaps slightly different shade of meaning depending on context) in every Quran occurrence?
Are you claiming that every derived word(s) from a root should have the same meaning in every Quran occurrence?
Are you claiming that every derived word(s) from a root should have the same theme/concept (but perhaps slightly different shade of meaning depending on context) in every Quran occurrence?
(1) or (2) or (3) or (4) and every root/word has its own distinct meaning
something else, if so please clarify.

Depending on your answer, it may be possible to test your theory.

Well I'm not claiming anything, just sharing how I study the quran.

For me it's like this
1 root has exactly 1 concept/theme, every derived word from that root has a strong correlation with the rootconcept/theme.
2 identical derived words have identical meanings but withing the concept/theme of the root.
2 (slightly) different derived words have 2 (slightly) different meanings but within the concept of the root.
The context has no influence on the meaning of the word.

Man_of_Faith

On this I agree with Bender.

Be well
Amenuel

huruf

Arabic I see it as german a word has a seminal meaning, wchih can be actualised in mny contexts. That meaning is always the same.

I see it in the light like the word jinn, can be anything, provided it responds to the actual meaning of the root which is covered or made unvisible by any contrption or reason or means. Anything which is subject to tht condition is a jinn. On translation there may bemani differnet words for it. From the same root janna, garden it is hidden by leaves and trees.

The root concept is the same, but it is ctualised in the context.

Salaam

Wakas

Bender,

Thanks for clarifying. I believe that gives us enough info to test your theory. It seems MofF also agrees with you, so perhaps he too will provide answers.

You may recall in the past you and mmkhan claimed (without evidence) there were no synonyms in Quran, and when I produced one simple example, both of you were stumped and could not explain any difference between the words. Reference thread.

Let's move onto your claim(s) in this thread. Please answer the following questions

what is the root concept of Daad-Ra-Ba AND the meaning of the first form verb DaRaBa
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=Drb
what is the root concept of Ra-Alif/Hamzeh-Siin AND the meaning of the word 'raas'
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=rAs
what is the root concept of Siin-Jiim-Dal AND the meaning of the word 'masjid'
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=sjd
what is the root concept of Ya-Dal-Ya AND the meaning of the word 'yad'
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=ydy

Once you provide the answers we will test them in Quran occurrences. If others have better test examples, feel free to cite them.

imrankhawaja

Yes, and every time I see you insult women again (in your case a much older woman) I will loose my dignity and tell you how pathetic it is.

well let me know where i insult any women...

imrankhawaja

rijaal does not mean men but foot.

hmm so according to your understanding...

interpretation should be like this..

why do you approach the foot(with lust) instead of women.. indeed you are ignorant people
or

why do you approach foot(footjob) instead of women , indeed you are intelligent people
tafseer by bender this verse indicates the invention of footjoob rotfl rotfl rotfl rotfl

this boy is funny ... i love his interpreatation he will bring a change in free minds by his reasonings and interpreatation...

look i already know it will be faulty interpretation so i already guessed it... aww i think my prediction was correct ... yay

you always welcome to bring your faulty interpreatation for this if you have any objection with this move...

anyway everybody have a right to beleive and understand what they want... handshake

it looks like wakas also raise some points lets see where the wind will blow..

imrankhawaja

Bender,

Thanks for clarifying. I believe that gives us enough info to test your theory. It seems MofF also agrees with you, so perhaps he too will provide answers.

You may recall in the past you and mmkhan claimed (without evidence) there were no synonyms in Quran, and when I produced one simple example, both of you were stumped and could not explain any difference between the words. Reference thread.

Let's move onto your claim(s) in this thread. Please answer the following questions

what is the root concept of Daad-Ra-Ba AND the meaning of the first form verb DaRaBa
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=Drb
what is the root concept of Ra-Alif/Hamzeh-Siin AND the meaning of the word 'raas'
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=rAs
what is the root concept of Siin-Jiim-Dal AND the meaning of the word 'masjid'
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=sjd
what is the root concept of Ya-Dal-Ya AND the meaning of the word 'yad'
Root http//corpus.quran.com/qurandictionary.jsp?q=ydy

Once you provide the answers we will test them in Quran occurrences. If others have better test examples, feel free to cite them.

excellent post wakas.. indeed God blessed you with lot of knowledge and understanding of scripture..

peace
God bless you

imrankhawaja

I think you missed my point.
If he (imran) uses corpus quran to make a claim then I am also allowed to use the same source to make a claim.

i think we missed your point and you missed your homework... or you are careless enough to check the previous reference... but this time i will make sure i will take you to the tour of words... lol look word tour and world tour just one letter difference make it so big and small... hmm

26165

26165 "Are you attracted to the males of the worlds?"

incase if you have some issues with the meanings of males...

1697

1697 Whoever does good works, whether male or female, and is a believer, We will give him a good life and We will reward them their dues with the best of what they used to do.

incase if you you are looking for arabic of foot ...

1694

1694 And do not use your oaths as a means of deception between you, that a foot will slip after it has been made firm, and you will taste the evil of turning away from the path of God, and you will have a great retribution.

you always welcome again to try foot, hand, or anything with this word ( )

interestingly this word we can methphorically use for move/advancement.. same like a move in chess !

peace.. peace

Man_of_Faith

How do you make into males by the way? Clearly a sectarian idea of the past. Dhekr is obviously a word with a completely different connotation. The sentence is beyond doubt meant to say something else. does have a connotation close to the meaning of "know" and is most guaranteed related to the word dhekr used in the context.

No reason to be around here with people who cannot use their brain. I will not discuss any further. And I had already abandoned my work on explaining Quran to most part in this forum in response to accusations.

Be well
Amenuel

Man_of_Faith

And the translation of 1694 seems pretty feeble.

The thing is, the right interpretation will look so wrong because the correction of what Quran wishes to convey is so vastly different from the sectarian conjecture of medieval times. There are myriad words to check for their true meaning in every section of Quran in order to puzzle the pieces together. And if one wishes to reach the true message of this writing then they cannot associate several different meanings to Arabic words, because the language does not work this way.

And I already decided after the threats not to continue any efforts in this forum related to relaying any of my work here nor discuss it. If anyone wishes to hear any more they will need to take it with me privately or elsewhere. In this forum I mainly focus instead on bringing forth remarks on the already established common interpretation in order to reach the consciousness of some witted people. The problem is that I do not seek for people to abandon Quran and lose faith in it but lose faith in the accompanying interpretation.

Be well
Amenuel

imrankhawaja

@ MOF i m really not in a mood to talk with you becoz in last one and half year... i come across with you plantey of times and you failed in proving your claims ... i have given you enough chances in past ... in every thread you cry on one thing like a stubborn kid... which make me feel sympathy for your/your mind so did u see me replying you anywhere in last month... ? if not then

its a hint for a witty person that someone is ignoring him and his ideas...

.. and you know what that thing is... secterian interpretation is wrong & & & & &

i just replied here to let you know i m not interested in your ideas and you tell your ideas to the one who wishes to listen..

this mazakar(urdu)/zakar(arabic)(male) monas(urdu)/onsa(arabic)/ (female) thing if somebody else will ask from me i will give him reply... so better not waste my and your time...

handshake

NOTE ( wakas ask something from you) waste your time there...

Man_of_Faith

Have I? As far as I can remember I have shown you each time concerning this. If something sounds weird in your version of Arabic it is because those semantics are entirely taken out of thin air by medieval clergymen.

However I told in the recent posts that I would also let you live in your little sphere of imperfection with a primitive deity who needs to be fed to its ego big as a mountain in comparison. That is your choice.

You have never proven me wrong except in your opinion, and that you can keep together with your fellows here being followers of a neanderthal god.

Be well
Amenuel

Man_of_Faith

And I answer your ranting as much as I would like since I asked a question that I never got any answer to. Answer my Question or one cannot take you seriously.

What is the logic in using a word with its root in memory, mind, remember, to say "male" in Arabic?

Answer how you can make it feasible according to some sane logic.

You never gave me an answer concerning "haram" that you say means both sanctified and forbidden.

You could start giving rational answers before you talk about any possible error in my interpretation.

imrankhawaja

look i dnt wanted to b rude with you...

your problem is obvious ... you know what ... your knowledge regarding language is very poor ... forget about past ,, how many times you failed..

even here due to your poor knowledge of language you did not pay attention on zakar and zekar ... dhakar/dhekar

now think about it ... what is the difference ... ?

and please .. dnt ruin this thread with your faulty interpretation...

look the topic , and then give reply..
the topic is lgbt in the lens of quran ?

for you
question is lgbt in secterian lens of quran?

according to you if secterian version is against homosex then you already gave your answer ... if not then provide reason with the same secterian interpretation?

example

if secterian interpretation is sayin .. God is one(wahid) then you have to prove from the same secterian interpretation that God is two(sani)... hope you got it...

what do you think secterian interpretation is in the favor of HOMOSEX?

Man_of_Faith

There is no difference between any zekar or zakar, the root is .

What do you base your claim about zekar and zakar on then? is pronounced the same no matter what kind of invented diacritical markers added to it.

You and your people have the faulty interpretation and not me.

imrankhawaja

There is no difference between any zekar or zakar, the root is .

in that case refer what waks ask you... about rooting

for me its a clear difference and i can see it clearly ... (sajud) rooting and masjid from same root is a good start...for begginers

You and your people have the faulty interpretation and not me.

ok thats another thing , but its not the answer ...
i repeat it once more .. i hate when i need to repeat my questions you was right people are behaving like primary kids in this thread... i agree with you on this..

question is , what do you think about secterian interpretion is in favor of homosex or no?

Man_of_Faith

Meem is prefixing Sejid, the root is still Siin-Jiim-Dal.

You are not answering my reply to my input from day one except rejection based without a valid counter-argument.

You are still not dealing with my question on and explaining to me how one same root can be mind, remember and male at the same time. You need a rational argument for that one or any intelligent person could find the whole Arabic language as your friends the medieval clerics invented as unintelligible. Instead of addressing my question you circumventing my question by saying how lost I am which is not relevant to the subject.

And yes, it is quite repetitive, and this is why I have previously also stopped responding after a few rounds because it is just circular reasoning, i.e. the discussion is not allowed to develop, and that is because the questions still stand unaddressed.

Homosexuality is breaking the directive of Moses on the parameter about vain sex (usually translated illicit sex). This is however in return misinterpreted as not to include marital intercourse, but all kinds of activation of the sex drive is included in the rule. Jesus did clarify it by saying even looking upon a woman with desire is wrong and against this rule.

On the other hand all directives are mostly misinterpreted and it is the root cause as to why someone transgresses which is the point.

Why you want to look upon a woman is because of the sex drive. Why you would like to defeat (kill) a person is because of your drive for domination. Why you would like to not to care for your neighbor like yourself is because you by instinct care for yourself the most. And then et cetera.

Be well
Amenuel

Man_of_Faith

There is just 10 laws of God and there will always be. There is no specific anti-gay law, but obviously it can be put under the heading of "vain sex" if the homosexual couple is interested in that. The decree will stand until the end of time.

People should watch themselves on not becoming aroused at all instead or at minimum, not being so bodily in their mind.