Homosexuality LGBTQI and the deen
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If you want to be a homo or trans stop bothering people about it or trying to justify it with religion. Do your $h! T in private and stop being so annoying.
Then you should also stop with bothering people with your believes on every subject, including this post of you, believe what you believe in private and stop being annoying.
Homosexuality is just a subject like any other which can be discussed, if some views on it bothers you then maybe it's better to stay away from such discussions. -
Greetings and Peace, all group
My comments in red.
AIDS part was just an example.. indicating medically having a relation with same sex is dangerous...
Promiscuity is dangerous, especially when (pardon the pun) coupled with unprotected sex. Regardless of sexuality, anal sex also carries additional risks.
When cases of AIDS started to emerge in the USA the majority of cases were among men who have sex with men (homosexuals), haemophiliacs and heroin users. Adding Haitians to this list made the 'Four-H Club' of groups at high risk of AIDS
http//www.avert.org/professionals/history-hiv-aids/origin
Yes, this is also true. Homosexuals were more at risk due to increased rates of transmission due to anal sex and promiscuity, hemophiliacs were exposed to HIV in blood transfusions before adequate protective measures were implemented, heroin users swapped contaminated needles and were more likely to engage in promiscuous behavior, and Haitians were disproportionately exposed to HIV from unhygienic blood transfusion equipment.
smoking is also injurious to health but people still use it... but quran did not forbid smoking isnt it?
That's true; smoking is dangerous and not forbidden. It doesn't mean that smoking is a good idea. However, a person has a choice before deciding to smoke and having to wrestle with addiction, a homosexual does not choose to be homosexual.
one more link
The widely accepted theory is that HIV/AIDS originated in a monkey or chimpanzee virus that "jumped species" in Africa. However, it is clear that the first AIDS cases were recorded in gay men in Manhattan in 1979
http//www.rense.com/general68/gayex.htm
Although the link is sketchy, the information is factual.
I don't disagree with any of the points made above; they are true. They still neither show that homosexuality nor homosexual acts are Qur'anically prohibited. That isn't the same as an endorsement. The Qur'an is silent on the matter. There is absolutely no reason to hate on homosexuals nor to turn them away from the deen.
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Greetings and Peace, all group
I don't disagree with any of the points made above; they are true.
They still neither show that homosexuality nor homosexual acts are Qur'anically prohibited. That isn't the same as an endorsement. The Qur'an is silent on the matter. There is absolutely no reason to hate on homosexuals nor to turn them away from the deen.ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
my brother,
i never hate you, even if you are athiest.. its totally your actions/deeds and only you are responsible...there is no point of hating you , or hating any homosexual , or hating any disbeleiver...
people claim themself muslims but still rob steal, murder,
people claim they are true but everysingle day they lie more than you imagine..lolthere are lot of other things nobody is fully perfect everybody have their weakness ..
this weakness did not automatically make him disbeleiver ...its just consider as wrong/unrighteous thing..but if you are bringing quran in it then you must be very careful...
if you consider the lust is not a good act and God dnt like fahash act or immorality then homosexuality is obviously an act of immorality/shamefulness/unrighteousness/lewdness/fahisha/unnaturalso i dnt think anywhere in quran these types of act are supported by God..
for just an example if i want to prove lie is not an immoral/bad act and i want to prove it from quran
i ll give you an example of abraham event when he breakk the idols...
or if a person is inside my house want his life spare from killers and i lied to save his life...things we need to understand through research and reasons of mind what God bless us .. so i again advise you to recheck your things alltogether once through each and every filter ...
God bless you
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Greetings and Peace, all group
Being homosexual is not a license to ignore what is clear. The Qur'an is clear that it is neither okay to be promiscuous, nor to have extramarital sex (outside of narrow circumstances, not important here), nor to approach others out of lust.
The Qur'an is also clear that it is unlawful to forbid what is not forbidden, to be bad to others, to be unjust, and a host of other things.
For any "gray areas" we have our own understanding and our own consequences. There is a time and place for violence, a time for lies, and a time for many things, ISA.
5332 They avoid major sins and immorality, except for minor offences. Your Lord is with vast forgiveness. He has been fully aware of you since He initiated you from the earth, and while you were embryos in the wombs of your mothers. Therefore, do not ascribe purity to yourselves; He is fully aware of the righteous.
I'm reminded of Musa/Moses (peace upon all prophets)...
2815 And he entered the city unexpectedly, without being noticed by the people. He found in it two men who were fighting, one was from his clan, and the other was from that of his enemy. So the one who was from his clan called on him for help against his enemy, whereby Moses punched him, killing him. He said "This is from the work of the devil; he is an enemy that clearly misleads."
2816 He said "My Lord, I have wronged my soul, so forgive me." He then forgave him, for He is the Forgiver, the Merciful.
If any person follows what is clear and strives towards goodness, it should follow that they are to be welcomed in the deen the same as anybody else. We should endeavor to invite others to the deen, and to better ourselves. If you want ALLAH to love you more, try not to love anyone less than another.
I don't want anyone to look at any of my posts and follow what I write. I want people to look at the evidences and make their own decisions. I want people to be aware of the harm that they do to themselves and others when they act without thinking, or think narrowly. Pushing another person down hardly pulls oneself up. Creation is vast, life is short, and we will all be Judged. If these words have helped anyone anytime, ISA, they are not wasted.
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Homosexuality does still not hurt someone else, except if you would rape them homosexually. If could however be included in sex which has no productive purpose and is purely performed for physical pleasure.
Be well
Amenuel -
homosex does not hurt anybody , bravo
hetrosex also does not hurt anybody..
speaking lie does not hurt somebody
borrow a credit money from bank and didnt give it back does not hurt anybody
buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year does not hurt anybody...and lot of more things .....
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Then you should also stop with bothering people with your believes on every subject, including this post of you, believe what you believe in private and stop being annoying.
Homosexuality is just a subject like any other which can be discussed, if some views on it bothers you then maybe it's better to stay away from such discussions. 54/37Agreed, thanks Bender. @All, this is only a discussion within forum rules,
for those who find this discussion abhorrent no participation is required.
My point is this The people of prophet Lot were engaged in something
that none had engaged in before, therefore there were no homosexuals
before the time of Lot? Or is the reference to "none had engaged in before"
a reference to something else? hmmpolice
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Hawk, exactly, I've raised that up previously on the board...it does seem like it's something other than just your run of the mill same-sex action.
But what thoroughly baffled me was this
homosex does not hurt anybody , bravo
hetrosex also does not hurt anybody..
speaking lie does not hurt somebody
borrow a credit money from bank and didnt give it back does not hurt anybody
buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year does not hurt anybody...and lot of more things .....
What does buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year even mean?
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Agreed, thanks Bender. @All, this is only a discussion within forum rules,
for those who find this discussion abhorrent no participation is required.
My point is this The people of prophet Lot were engaged in something
that none had engaged in before, therefore there were no homosexuals
before the time of Lot? Or is the reference to "none had engaged in before"
a reference to something else? hmmpolice
Salam,
The only people that were saved from the people of Lot were the family of Lot, except his wife.
1.They were a rejecting people; so this could explain why the women of the people of Lot were not saved; we aren't told if they were homosexuals too, unless I missed it.
2.All males (or majority, a huge majority) were homosexuals.Is there a city where all males approach men instead of women? No there isn't. The only city/town was of the people of Lot.
Salam
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But what thoroughly baffled me was this What does buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year even mean?
its mean , when u purchase a mobile and falsely claim it lost and get a new one .. does not hurt anybody .. so this act is allowed .or not.. can we give ourself satisfaction that what we did is nothing wrong...?
same the people who think if an action does not hurt someone its mean we are allowed to do it.. without any fear of consequences...
like illegal sex, dishonesty and other stuff..
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the acts of nation lot as per quran are
1 approaching men
2 murder/rape
3 robbery on highwaysmurder and robbery were acts already done by lot of nations and individual
so we left with option 1 ...although if we want to go with the flow with brother hawk then a question arise again what was the act?
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Peace all,
Homosexuality does still not hurt someone else, except if you would rape them homosexually.
Exactly. Even unwanted sexual harassment/advances/inappropriate touch can be very painful for a person to go through. Feeling trapped, like there's no escape either physically or mentally, developing a long-lasting and unhealthy relationship with sex and/or other people, seeing oneself or knowing you're being seen only as a sexual object, etc. I can't imagine. I would not wish anyone to be forced into something without their consent.
My point is this The people of prophet Lot were engaged in something
that none had engaged in before, therefore there were no homosexuals
before the time of Lot? Or is the reference to "none had engaged in before"
a reference to something else? hmmIn my opinion, that line refers to all of what the people of Lot did, as a collective whole. They made unwanted sexual advances towards the men/travelers (781; I'm not sure we can go so far as to say "rape" with certainty), they were criminals (155, it sounds like they were behaving highly inappropriately in front of Lot's guests (117, they sound like they were threatening to drive Lot out if he didn't stop trying to tell them the errors of their ways (26167), and as others have mentioned, they blocked the travelers from leaving (2929), and committed "evil" in their meetings (2929). I know some translations of 2929 also include the crime of robbery, and I know other "progressive thinkers" have suggested that the people of Lot had spouses (26166).
Like many other examples in the Qur'an, they were exceeding their limits - thinking they were invincible perhaps - and could do whatever they wanted with no consequence or concern for other people.
Salam,
The only people that were saved from the people of Lot were the family of Lot, except his wife.
1.They were a rejecting people; so this could explain why the women of the people of Lot were not saved; we aren't told if they were homosexuals too, unless I missed it.As far as I know, you didn't miss anything.
2.All males (or majority, a huge majority) were homosexuals.
Is there a city where all males approach men instead of women? No there isn't. The only city/town was of the people of Lot.
Salam
I remember reading a thread on homosexuality a while back in which someone wrote about their experiences of being in San Francisco
This topic interests me. Why? Well...... for one I just moved back from San Francisco this year. I was in San Francisco for nearly a year. For a lot of the people here, gay people are like an abstract theory- something thought about but not encountered in real life. I live in Texas now and there are, of course, gay people here but they're secretive and don't talk about that aspect of their lives in public. In San Francisco, they felt no shame in discussing intimate details and no shame in flaunting their life-style in public. Before I lived there, gay people were like an abstract concept to me and I couldn't understand why God seemed to prohibit homosexuality. It wasn't until I had personal experience of dealing with the "gay community" that I became against homosexuality. I believe in treating gay people with respect and kindness but that doesn't mean I have to alter my religious views to suit them. Anyways, for you who have not seen what I've seen, I will talk a little bit about my experiences in San Francisco. Some things I describe following this are gross; you might wanna skip it.
I remember me and my friends used to think that there was something vaguely Satanic about San Francisco. We felt uncomfortable. Later on, I found out Anton LaVey's Satanic Church was based in San Francisco. So Satanism definitely has influenced the city. And I would say more than 90% of the gay men I knew were extremely promiscuous. San Francisco was so gay as a straight male I was actually a minority and I felt kinda isolated (I knew there was gay people in San Francisco but I didn't know it was THAT gay!). And I knew a lot of gay people so I knew a lot of gay men. I once saw men having sex in public and I heard a man brag about having sex with five men in one night. I remember a man who looked like he was 50-something years old randomly came up to me and offered me money to perform oral sex on me. That kinda thing was actually kinda normal. I would get approached constantly by gay men. I remember sitting on a bus and noticing the guy across from me was (very blatantly) checking me out. You can imagine how uncomfortable that sort of thing made me feel.
Clearly, this is just one person's experience/opinion. I've never been to San Francisco myself. Still thought the above was worth noting. If someone wants to take the approach that homosexuality as a whole is bad, then this could be the "evidence" for a whole society - of predominantly homosexual people - being prohibited by God.
its mean , when u purchase a mobile and falsely claim it lost and get a new one .. does not hurt anybody .. so this act is allowed .or not.. can we give ourself satisfaction that what we did is nothing wrong...?
same the people who think if an action does not hurt someone its mean we are allowed to do it.. without any fear of consequences...
like illegal sex, dishonesty and other stuff..
Isn't that still hurting someone though? It's taking away people's time, people's resources/money, and people's trust if they ever found out?
the acts of nation lot as per quran are
1 approaching men
2 murder/rape
3 robbery on highwaysmurder and robbery were acts already done by lot of nations and individual
so we left with option 1 ...Why not consider that all of this combined is what made the people of Lot do something that has never been done before?
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Then you should also stop with bothering people with your believes on every subject, including this post of you, believe what you believe in private and stop being annoying.
Homosexuality is just a subject like any other which can be discussed, if some views on it bothers you then maybe it's better to stay away from such discussions.Please don't try to lecture me, it's not about if his views are bothering me or not. It's about LGBT was a taboo in the past, with time people like him have promoted these disgusting things and in today's world you get attacked if you even think about criticizing them. Sorry bro, but I don't want my son to be a fag or a tranny, If people here want that please keep it private because it's better for everyone.
A lot of the forum members here come from western countries that promote extreme liberal ideologies, then try to interpret the Quran in that fashion.
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supporting homosexuality through quran is indeed a wrong doing... (God did not order immorality)
and about personal life... its the matter between an individual and God... (we can debate on it)
we are mixing two things ...
if somebody say i am a thief. and quran also support theft then it is a problem as long about his thefft i dnt have any problem , but my problem/confusion start when he will try to justify it through the lens of quran..
theft/lie/dishonesty/immorality all things you can say...
if somebody say if i m doing one night stand , (hetrosex) i also dnt have any problem with him as i know its between him and her and their God..
but when they come and bring quran in it then i must need to ask them ... thats what is going on here
we are confused in two things...
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apart from all this , i have a logical question?
let put quran at the side for once..
if a person is transgender .. like i m also experiencing some frd requests now a days.. who are they medically , male or female...
people claim they are both , half male half female so they get operation for finding the right path whatever they want to become...
is it really possible... as we know everything is in pair either male or female.. what is this inbetween
and if there is really such a creation like this then its not a sin for them to approach anyone whatever suits them... its their need you can say that...
this is confused topic itself first we need to understand all the grounds of the subject then we can discuss further how we can deal with it...
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Greetings and Peace, all group
Please don't try to lecture me, it's not about if his views are bothering me or not. It's about LGBT was a taboo in the past, with time people like him have promoted these disgusting things and in today's world you get attacked if you even think about criticizing them. Sorry bro, but I don't want my son to be a fag or a tranny, If people here want that please keep it private because it's better for everyone.
2170 And if they are told "Follow what GOD has sent down," they say "No, we will follow what we found our fathers doing!" What if their fathers did not comprehend anything and were not guided?
A lot of the forum members here come from western countries that promote extreme liberal ideologies, then try to interpret the Quran in that fashion.
4911 O you who believe, let not any people ridicule other people, for they may be better than they. Nor shall any women ridicule other women, for they may be better than they. Nor shall you mock one another, or call each other names; miserable indeed is the name of wickedness after attaining faith. And anyone who does not repent, then these are the transgressors.
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Greetings and Peace, all group
My comments in red.
apart from all this , i have a logical question?
let put quran at the side for once..
if a person is transgender .. like i m also experiencing some frd requests now a days.. who are they medically , male or female...
Transgender can be medically male or female, but not both. Intersex are born with tissues of both male and female. In North America, about 1 in 2000 babies are born intersex. There are also people who have sex reassignment therapy.
people claim they are both , half male half female so they get operation for finding the right path whatever they want to become...
is it really possible... as we know everything is in pair either male or female.. what is this inbetween
Biological in between is intersex.
and if there is really such a creation like this then its not a sin for them to approach anyone whatever suits them... its their need you can say that...
this is confused topic itself first we need to understand all the grounds of the subject then we can discuss further how we can deal with it...
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_reassignment_therapy
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex
https//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender
ALLAH knows best.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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Greetings and Peace, all group
6104 "Visible proofs have come to you from your Lord; so whoever can see, does so for himself, and whoever is blinded, will be such. I am not a watcher over you."
May ALLAH see fit to Guide all seekers.
peace
~Abdul-Hadi
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homosex does not hurt anybody , bravo
hetrosex also does not hurt anybody..
speaking lie does not hurt somebody
borrow a credit money from bank and didnt give it back does not hurt anybody
buying a cell phone and making false claims two times a year does not hurt anybody...and lot of more things .....
What is your point? The three last arguments may hurt someone.