General Issues / Questions

Salam Sunna- hero well well well all the talk about satan like if he is a person with any power brickwall Honestly guys I dont even think he exsist El Shaytan is probably a section of every human being which we are told not to follow....... that section is doomed to misery and going near it or/and following it also lead to misery..... The only time you can probably personalize el-shaytaan is when you talk about sociopaths and psychopaths..... but their whole lives are also a big misery and whoever goes near them also take misery on himself.... thus El-Shaytaan is doomed to hell, will always be and there is no way out. Depressing take care of your head ;D can you tell my from where you get, that i take SATAN as A PERSON with POWER?? confused confused in fact i don't believe SATAN existe- i believe schaitan is a title and humans can be 'schaitan' etc . i think my english wasn't very good--- -[ Anyway thanks for your answer and peace salam mirjamnur you have to be aware that satan is a word that don't exists in Quran. where i speaked about satan?? Quran use word Iblis in adam creation episode and chaytan elsewere. i mentioned 'schaitan'=chaytan- sorry i mean the same. Traductors use word satan both for Ibliss and chaytan. But there is no reason to consider that it is the same entity. i came to this conclusion also- thanks Sunnah-hero is right. Shaytan is a section of human being that is in permanant war against the other section wich is rouh from god. i'm agree! Ibliss is the ancestor of all Jinns and "he died" before the tree episode of Adam. from where you get this? Community of jinns is just community of human imaginations and the shaytan in tree episode is just the part of jinn/imagination, who descent from Ibliss, that made him disobey to god and that is associated with human body of adam. please you can explain? tempt dear mirjamnur, since you understand french, i recommand you the series ibadat el chouyouks on nawaat.org. I recommand you episode 2 and 6.Thank you for the link- i will go there and have a deeper look at it the matter is very complicated. oh yes yeah Peace peace

Salaam, Youssef posted links to this chap's/ organisation's "Youtube" page some days ago http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9604895.msg318771#msg318771 Shalom!

peace bro MMKhan, where can we get the attawrat and injeel that The God is talking about. are they extinct? Peace brother kaamil, Nope nope they are not extinct. If you refer to the aayaat that I quoted i.e., 544 about alTawraat and 547 about alInjeel, you will see they still exist. But sorry, I don't know where and how can we find it. May Allah bless you and guide us to His path pr mmKhan

Salamun alaiki, This is rather most appropriate---who takes people first in the darkened areas and then fascinates with "indepth" information which is written nowhere. The Book is what is called "AlQaulu"--verbal narration of facts. Leaving it aside is to move back into layers of darkness. People have their choice, however.

Salaam mirjamnur, Oh thats nice ) I believe you have more then enough luggage to understand The Quran ) You may find it strange but my advice for you is to stop learning from those books. Try to create your own grammar rules only from The Quran. You are doing with this at least 3 things You are reading AlQuran instead of Fatima made pancakes for her children. You are not using any other source besides The Quran to learn it. You are sure you are not going to learn something that contradicts The Quran, this can have very big and false consequences for your understandings. SubhanAllah mayby Allah protects me from learning falsehood---Allah al hamdulillah! you know, how many times i ask myself, why i can't find a teacher?? ) Well actually it just says that AlQuran explains AlKitaab. With other words The Recitation explains The Text. And no it does not say in this verse that the Quran is part from AlKitaab There is this verse that says that AlKitaab is from AlKitaab. 548 "... " And I believe the second mentioned AlKitaab in 548 refers to Umm Al Kitaab, but not sure yet.. I understood this from these verses 431 432 433 434 thank you for these Ayas - i read yesterday an old topic Al Kitab /al Quran- and i found many answers- but need to study the subject more. I'm waiting for your answers! ) Salaam, Bender ps InshaAllah when I finish my study on them, I will answer your other questions. edit just want to add that ArRahmaan teaches AlQuraan. Yes i will never forget that- HE ALONE let us to see... hail Salam an Thanks

Peace farida, Is this thread a reference to brother Al Amiyr? I can only speak for myself, I am not as "frozen" in one spot as you alledge, I maintain that I am here to learn and enjoy the interaction of the forum. I am far far from knowing much, and free minds is a good vehicle to grow in knowledge as well as a person. Being wrong is not pleasant, but moving to the correct position even begrudgingly has it's reward. Peace Hawk Peace Hawk Please do not take this thread as something personal or a sweeping generalization; this is only my observation about the majority in this forum. Like you, I too have learned a lot from Free-Minds, which has helped me understand many concepts, which were otherwise untouched. And the search goes on as sister Huruf says above 'the longing for absolute, undisputable certainty,' only to arrive at absolute, undisputable knowledge. Peace PS I like your name; it's hawkish

I see stops is up to his old tricks again, never offering anything positive, pretending to have real interest. Atheist vs believer is his need, so to the atheist I say " to you be your way (deen) to us be our way(deen)". Peace

Salaam mirjamnur, Thank you for all aayaat. You contradict yourself, none of the aayaat that you quoted said that who are doing fasaad in earth should be killed or got their punishment as killing by you. Allah destroys them yes no, & because Allah states on other place the law for murder soul for soul - and Fassad can include murder. (see my answer down) I'm agree with you not all fassad is actuel murder. The topic from 27-31 is only about QTL not about FSD. Fasaad is added as another option in 532. yes, the Ayats speak of manslaughter. Cain, who killed his brother Abel was the first murderer. Manslaughter / murder is part of Fassad (see Faraun, the children killed). Allah did not ask Musa to give a punch to Firaun, but he drowned because of Allah's punishment. Zulqarnain did not kill yajooj and majooj, but he raised a wall between them and those people. Shoeb did not kill anyone for mischief or corruption in earth. Yes you are right, but we found in an other place the quranic law soul for soul. So,if someone commits Fassad by killing someone, it is allowed to Quranic law (justice), to kill the murderer. (Except one who is not responsible for his actions). However, forgiveness is better-I see the examples that you gave above in the light of the followGod shows us with these examples that it is better to find solutions other than revenge, and that HE is still here ....and at last, we will found ALL the reward for our deeds good or bad So, we cannot kill anyone for doing fasaad on earth, but Allah will punish them for sure. This is how I understand it. not agree. see above. I will give you an example what you think about http//libguides.udayton.edu/content.php?pid=108383&sid=818822 http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=GB2MalxaJDE]http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=0QMlt4Pc5iI http//www.youtube.com/watch?v=GB2MalxaJDE To cruelty, torture, child abuse, killing, there are millions of examples. It's better to forgive, but what do you think when your child is-dismembered or mutilated in front of your eyes---what you would do? Or want to do? From my perspective, God would not be just when he would not give us the opportunity to expiate a crime by a "revenge death can be in my eyes an humanitarian effort because there are monsters who delight in the agony of the victims and are enjoy and happy to torture and kill. May Allah increase our knowledge and guide us to His only path pr yes indeed. peace mmKhan

Salaam All, I agree with you Zenje. That is exactly why I enjoy watching The Matrix. D FREE YOUR MIND!!!!

Dearest mrsjiffysweeper, Let me just throw some ideas in your direction before I sleep... Relax your thinking and increase your feeling. I suspect that you have been having issues with faith in God for several reasons. Your heart however seems to "be in the right place". Many times, one rejects religions and gets pissed at it and God for the simple reason that the religion at hand was just giving confusion and very shallow images of God. What we reject is the false images of God we might have, that religions might teach. Perhaps you have not been rejecting what we could call the real connection with God, but rather some empty tenets of faith told to you. So don't worry! Give yourself a chance. I have noticed that the world freely speaks about divine creatures and gods and all sorts of "unseen" things.... but there is VERY LITTLE talk about the human mind. If you see your self as a soul which has been equipped with a body and a mind, then it brings great relief to understand that like we don't identify with a bruised wrist, we don't have to identify with our mind either when it throws it's tantrums and fills our consciousness with negative thoughts and emotions. Our mind gets its character through heritage as well as experiences, just like the body... but just like we can train our body, we can train our mind. Perhaps your mind is making things difficult for you. It would be odd if it didn't... your're only human like everyone else. Give yourSELF a break, and relax, and know that God is always there to help anyone who is willing to ask and receive help. Don't think so much, and don't try to figure out things so much. Just drop everything and ask God to show you the truth, whatever it might be. WhatEVER it might be. Ask God to let you be purified, more and more. Ask God for help, persistence and success. Ask for inner softness. Ask God to help you rid yourself of the resistance of the mind. The mind should be your tool, not your chaotic puppet master. It ALL starts with us approaching God. It all starts with the wish and desire to know the truth, because this will lead to God. Forget looking for proof. Ask God to let you FEEL reality. That's why I said that you should think less and feel more. Stop judging yourself. Ask God to remove fear from you... the destructive fear that only leads to confusion and negativity. Such fear is blind and leads no-where good. It seems that you want to believe, but you are filled with fear and confusion, and haven't really tasted truth as much as you would wish. If you can start feeling God and truth, then your fear will start dissolving. Ask God for softness and openness. I have done this and it has worked WONDERS! But it's a process and you need patience, sabr. God will show you that God is not much what people teach. Religions will start seeming empty, just like any other hobby. God is so much more, and different, from what it seems when you approach God through religion. Just ask and you shall be answered. Knock, and the door shall open. It starts with us. We have to initiate. We have to open up. Reality is here all around, but it is we who are blind. Don't fear. Throw your preconceived ideas about what God is. God is beyond all our images. Ask God to show your truth and reality, and ask God that you should be able to handle what you come to see, and ask God to let you love and find great joy in what you come to see. And know that this is a lifelong process. Let everything develop as per its own proper pace. You cannot rush it. Leave it to God. Leave it all to God, and fear will sink away. Ask God to open you. There can be nothing more wonderful that that. Truth shall set you free, as they say. Ihdina-sirat-almustaqeem. Cheers and salaam! sun

Peace, All those religions are submission to God's system, so that is why 262 allows the others paradise too. Christians, for example, is their own definition because they choose call themselves by this name. Christianity is submission, as long as you do not follow the blasphemy that came after Jesus died, that he was the part of a trinity. God means monotheism by all this, believing in only one deity, Christians, Jews believe in the same God and submission system as Muslims, though some associate partners with him, thus not following God's system. Islam, or submission, is not a proper name but a definition of those who accept God's system. Hope I could help. God is the best guide. Thanks! It totally makes sense now. yay

Sunnis and Shias claim that the Koran doesn't give the details of how to pray and this is why hadiths are needed. However, when I ask for the specific hadiths that provides the details as is claimed I am yet to get an answer. I am yet to have hadith follower show me just one hadith that is actually the saying of prophet Muhammed not what ali, Abu huraira, Aisha, and so on said or saw. I am still waiting. Shias don't accept Sunni hadiths. So which hadiths are true - the Sunni or Shia? Sunnis don't perform them ritual salat the same as the Shia. So, how did prophet really perform his ritual salat - like the Shia or the Sunni? Can either group provide evidence? If you look at Shafi's risala about the Sunnah being a revelation he actually claimed that 5 salat was there before hadiths were made available. Read Shafi's risala about the authority of the Sunnah. Excerpt On Legal Knowledge Someone asked me What is knowledge and how much should men know of it? Shafi?i replied Legal knowledge is of two kinds one is for the general public, and no sober and mature person should be ignorant of it. He asked For example? replied For example, that the daily prayers are five, that men owe it to God to fast the month of Ramadan, to make the pilgrimage to the House whenever they are able, and to the legal alms in their estate; that He has prohibited usury, adultery, homicide, theft, wine, and of that sort which He has obligated men to comprehend, to perform, to pay in their property, and to abstain from He has forbidden it to them. This kind of knowledge may be found textually in the Book of God, or may be found generally among the people of Islam. The public relates it from the preceding public and ascribes it to the Apostle of God, nobody ever questioning its ascription or its binding force upon them. It is the kind of knowledge which admits of error neither in its narrative nor in its interpretation; it is not permissible to question it. He asked What is the second kind? Shafi?i replied It consists of the detailed duties and rules obligatory on men, concerning which there exists neither a text in the Book of God, nor regarding most of them, a sunna. Whenever a sunna exists , it is of the kind related by few authorities, not by the public, and is subject to different interpretations arrived at by analogy. He asked Is replied There is a third kind . He asked Will you explain it, give its source, and state what of it is obligatory, and on whom it is binding and on whom it is not binding? replied The public is incapable of knowing this kind of knowledge, nor can all specialists obtain it. But those who do obtain it should not all neglect it. If some can obtain it, the others are relieved of the duty ; but those who do obtain it will be rewarded. https//www.fonsvitae.com/OnlineStore/tabid/58/pid/143/0863-Treatise-on-the-Foundations-of-Islamic-Jurisprudence-Al-Shafiis-Risala.aspx So the 5 prayers existed before hadiths came to the scene. Notice that the general public had no knowledge of the Sunnah and even did not know what to do with it. Sunnah hadith was an innovation introduced nearly two centuries after Muhammad.

We should be tolerant to such beliefs because the wife can take the matter to court if she is displeased. Many parts of the world does not view those as abuse eg. Wive(s) in Saudi Arabia take pride in their husband. I understand you! Personally I'm not a big fan of this "political correctness" attitude. Solomon, I don't agree with you and let me explain We all know that raping a woman is wrong. Physically restraining a woman using physical force or threats of harm is wrong. When people think about forced sex, they picture physical assault. They do not picture pressure, manipulation (making a woman feel guilty, insulting by calling her names, accusing of being unfaithful if she refuses, withholding affection, emotional threats to seek sex outside, etc) or sleep deprivation. Muslim men and women are taught that a man owns sex. It is the obligation or duty of a woman to please him having sex when he wants, the way he likes it with little regard or no attention to how she feels or what her needs may be. If her husband is into aggressive degrading sex, doesn't matter how she feels. Muslim men and women believe that a woman owes a man sex and gives up the right to decline sex. There are hadiths which state that a woman will be cursed by angel all night if she declines sex. The allegation is that it is coming from prophet Muhammed and either coming from God himself or endorsed by God. Hadiths portray Muhammed as being sexually dominant and powerful. Apparently, he had sex with all of his wives in a day. He was seen as a stud. So sex is about a guy. Being an alpha male. Pleasing a woman not because he is truly caring about her needs and wanting sex to be a mutually satisfying and connected experience but to be able to see himself as a great, an awe-inspiring lover. Hadiths teach that a man owns sex. Women owes a man sex. Sex is about a man. A woman is a sex object that a man possesses. So a woman who prides in her husband will cover herself head to toe, will cater to her husbands sexual needs when he wants, how often he wants and whatever he wants the way he wants. This is sexual abuse. When sex is about control, power, dominance, and there is coercion physical and/or emotional, it is abuse. I refer to the book "why does he do that? Inside the minds of angry and controlling men" by Lundy Bancroft. (A lot of what I said are excerpts from this book). And I refer to the ultimate book, the Koran which does not promote selfishness and coercion - physical or emotional. God promotes peace, mutual respect and compassion in a marriage. And this is what we should promote and when we see abuse, we should identify it and stop it. Sexual abuse is hard for a woman to talk about let alone take her husband to court. That young Yemeni girl who ran away and went to court asking for divorce because of sexual and physical abuse is an exception. Just because saudi women don't don't view something as abuse doesn't mean that it is not. In this climate of political correctness and being culturally sensitive, have we become too afraid to stand up and call things for that they are? We can dance around the issue, explain, rationalize or be defensive but it is what it is. Abuse is abuse. Nothing Islamic about it. And I don't respect or tolerate beliefs that promote abuse especially sexual abuse.

SALAAM Atheist take to much time trying to refute logical things.. in fact atheism is a religion like any other.. Surat Al-'Ikhl (The Sincerity) - 1121 Say, "He is Allah , One, 1122 Allah , the Eternal Refuge. 1123 He neither begets nor is born, 1124 Nor is there to Him any equivalent." SALAAM/SHALOM/PEACE/PAIX/PAZ

There are some basic directives that need to be followed regarding what we can write or what not, please read the Forum Rules. http//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=8177.0 Falsehood disappearing is magical thinking unless it involves a process allowing it to dissipate, sometimes a guideline as to what is acceptable and what isn't is part of the process. Whether we use that guide in our minds or have it pointed out by others. We've been through the discussion of allowing members to say whatever they want various times on this forum and the admin have voted for basic and specific guidelines as opposed to none. The issue however isn't about let whoever spews spew, natural selection, God, truth etc will prevail and so on...or the pro's and con's of different forums and their rules. Or how sectarian's do whatever. This is a simple matter of someone who's made claims and has yet to deliver. And/or the claims themselves suspect/not evidence based etc. That's it. The furor surrounding this simple matter, involving different tangents serves to confuse the issue. There are different aspects to this, it would be wise not to conflate them. At this point in time, the focus should be on the core issue of what are the claims, are they valid, are they being delivered, if not...why and if so are they valid and so on. The extra issues are issues as well obviously, as to why someone would need different accounts to bolster their threads, why they spend inordinate amounts of time dilly dallying and delaying the apparently inevitable etc but whatever. I myself not only find the extra issues coupled with the core issues problematic but it also points to a certain type that I've seen on forums and different platforms before in different forms. The important thing to note is there is nothing stopping him from posting his knowledge. Nothing. We've been exceptionally lenient, encouraging, overlooking and preaching patience and tolerance. If he bows out gracefully, that's alright. However, if he sticks around making the same claims on multiple threads flooding a section, asking people to believe in him based on secret knowledge and blood ties, keeps multiple accounts for the pretence of popularity which also affect the forum and it's performance, refuses to deliver, delays and prevaricates...then we have a problem. That's not on. Not on this forum and not on any forum that wants to keep a minimum standard of sanity and smooth running. This topic is now locked. The advice is to stop the drama and address the core issues. Any other provocative threads will also be locked. Posters are encouraged to deal with the core issues on the relevant threads.

Actually, one man could undergo all those facial hair arrangements in different times of his life. Then one or all the muhammads would have involved their entire life doing facial and head hair style. What a life style for a prophet! Wretched buhari et al.

The exchanges between StopS and al-miyr is like ego and alter ego talking. I was watching the movie "lord of the rings" and thinking about the character gollum..... Now you've done it! I will forever wonder who is who....

Sorry may I ask that you please hold your questions for the next 9 days peace Peace farida, For next 9 days? hmm Is something gonna happen within these 9 days or after these 9 days? Oh! Sorry for questions again. BTW, my questions were addressed to justamuslim not you. May Allah bless you, mmKhan

Let us turn to Allah for Guidance and learn more and more from Him, by the day. salam bender.

Despite growing up in a church, I almost never think of Jesus (pbuh) as the blonde haired, blue eyed version in the paintings.