Salat & Zakat

Peace I can't help but believe that God wants us to perform ritual prayers. I've recently read these verses except the people of the right, 7439 who will be in Gardens, asking one another 7440 about the wicked ˹who will then be asked˺ 7441 “What has landed you in Hell?” 7442 They will reply, “We were not of those who prayed, 7443 nor did we feed the poor. 7444 We used to indulge ˹in falsehood˺ along with others, 7445 and deny the Day of Judgment, 7446 until the inevitable came to us.” 7447 Okay, so the above demonstrates we have to pray but it does not specify how to pray... And mention the name of your Lord morning and evening 7625 And during the night prostrate to Him and exalt Him a long night. 7626 So here we should mention the name of our lord morning and evening. We should prostrate to Him and exalt Him in the night. I can't help but interpret this as literal prayer. It just makes the most sense to me. Woe on that Day to the deniers! 7747 When it is said to them, “Bow down ˹before Allah,” they do not bow. 7748 Woe on that Day to the deniers! 7749 So what message after this ˹Quran˺ would they believe in? 7750 Yet again, verse 48 demonstrates that we have to literally 'bow'... I find it peculiar how so many verses on bowing, and prostrating can all coincidentally be misinterpreted by Sunni translators? I mean, it would have made more sense if there were only a couple of verses mentioning bowing and prostrating but there seem to be soo many? I also researched more prayer verses 4103 And when you have completed the prayer, remember Allah standing, sitting, or on your sides. But when you become secure, re-establish prayer. Indeed, prayer has been decreed upon the believers a decree of specified times. We have to pray at specific times. I remember reading that some interpret salah as 'following closely'. How are you supposed to 'follow closely' at specific times? 56 O you who have believed, when you rise to prayer, wash your faces and your forearms to the elbows and wipe over your heads and wash your feet to the ankles. And if you are in a state of janabah, then purify yourselves. But if you are ill or on a journey or one of you comes from the place of relieving himself or you have contacted women and do not find water, then seek clean earth and wipe over your faces and hands with it. Allah does not intend to make difficulty for you, but He intends to purify you and complete His favor upon you that you may be grateful. If there's no prayer and you simply have to 'follow closely', then HOW are you supposed to perform wudhu whilst following closely (general term)? 7170 But those who hold fast to the Book and establish prayer – indeed, We will not allow to be lost the reward of the reformers. If I remember correctly, some interpret salah as reading the Qur'an. If that's true, why does it say to hold fast to the book and to pray? I do admit, I don't know if the Arabic in this verse specifically mentions the words salah so please forgive me if I'm wrong. I admit that I do not know Arabic and I also do not know all the verses on prayer but for now, ritual salah being false seems like a wrong interpretation to me. It seems like people don't want to perform ritual salah and therefore try to interpret the verses in such a way as would fit their desires. Again, I am sorry if this is not the case but I just haven't been convinced that bowing, prostrating, etc. is not required. If you don't believe in ritual salah, what made you come to that conclusion? Even if the arabic words for bowing and prostrating can be translated into different words, what makes you sure that YOUR interpretation is correct and the traditional ones are wrong? I don't believe the traditional translations are wrong on every single matter. It was not plain ritual without any meaning, but a ritual for one Promising to God to do good things, act morally, remembering God, the goodness provider. So we learn whats good and remind ourselves whats good and Zakat is the delivery of our promises. The act of bowing everywhere is to express our obedience to our master the God. We spend some time on our work in the day, and rest at the night, we eat and do specific things at specific times, so everything in life becomes a ritual. Peace.

peace

I believe a total commitment is only a wishful thinking for presence of sins within ourselves (body/soul) is definitely due to the will of God. Had he wanted to create a sinless nation, it would have been done. So one can have an intention to COMMIT NOT to do ABC.. XYZ but in actual fact we all commit sins and we all forget allah that is why he is most forgiving... meaning there needs be us humans full of sins to be forgiven. Hence I believe salat is a congregational affair in which we need to meet with others on a regular basis and hope to create a better society, a better of us to make an effort to change for the good. Be it any one from any field, the onus is to do good on gods earth. I found some link useful https//www.ahleaqal.com/2019/02/understanding-root-word-of-salat-part-1.html https//www.ahleaqal.com/2019/02/understanding-root-word-of-salat-part-2.html Nice articles, Yes connection gives the right meaning, many culture do salat, I believe its no different here, the ritual is also part of this, the important part of Salat i think was people to promise something to God in return of some blessings/wish, the Zakat is the result of it. Its a way to connect with God, praise and ask for specific blessings, promise to do zakat/service/goodness for the community/family/near ones. In a way it brings our focus to our duty. Those who establish Salat should have a compiled list of promises to be recited on Salat.

Assolatu zakka to me means PURE COMMITMENT ️ Salam.. But be committed and purify self but ensure that within self... Not easy except those who have patience. . Salah is prayer as well.. Allah didn't create men and Jin except to worship Him... So ensure doing the timely Salat prayer as well.. Yes most verses of Salat is moral/ethics/commitment thus purify /zaka... Dude commitment part is harder than ritual salah.. Every action in life is salah so that only we can purify ..

Good for you. Oh, by the way, the form of salat is not spelled out in the Quran, nor expected to be recreated from the Quran. We all know how that ended up. The commandment is prescribed in a manner that the reader already knows how to do it. Ignore this simple fact, and then the scurry to dig up "details" that just aren't there becomes an obsession. An addiction. That hasn't cured in 2 decades. I have changed my views on Salat, as my understanding changes with age, now i think, Salat is a ritual, a ritual to show our unity and support to the outside, the outside is everything other than the me, every living and non living should be doing its own Salat, people dance synchronously to express their support to the other, birds do support one other while flying, animals do by practicing unity, like the ants and many other animals following one other, ie. how I express that I am a muslim(being submissive to the outside) is by Salat, I repeat the outside includes even our body and all external to the ME. Yes Salat can be practiced anyway to express that submissiveness. Islamic salat is one of the best ways and could change as per the need.

Peace brother Wakas. I can see that you mean well and that you are making an effort to understand and study Qoran I hope you do not mind me sharing some of my experience I see Qoran as a living book. We can never say that we have grasped it fully , all we can say is" grant us more knowledge" and continue to strive to understand more and better with GOD s help. Many things that I thought I understood in the past have been understood wrong ,but that does not mean I reached the best understanding . My mind is open and I keep pondering and learning more if GOD wills. Let me give you one example about just one verse 314 Adorned for the people are the worldly pleasures, such as the NISSA and BANINE, and piles upon piles of gold and silver, trained horses, livestock, and crops. These are the MATERIALS of this world. A far better abode is reserved at God. زُيِّنَ لِلنّاسِ حُبُّ الشَّهَوٰتِ مِنَ النِّساءِ وَالبَنينَ وَالقَنٰطيرِ المُقَنطَرَةِ مِنَ الذَّهَبِ وَالفِضَّةِ وَالخَيلِ المُسَوَّمَةِ وَالأَنعٰمِ وَالحَرثِ ذٰلِكَ مَتٰعُ الحَيوٰةِ الدُّنيا وَاللَّهُ عِندَهُ حُسنُ المَـٔابِ Many translate NISSA as women and BANINE as children in the verse. Then it makes no sense at all Because NIssa as women and Banine as children are not materials of this world and GOD already have addressed the women and children at the start of the verse as AL NAAS .which includes men / all humans. For me ,in this case NISSA is the plural of the word NASSII- A thing that we seek and wish/ expect to have. like for example all the new things that people desire/want to have according to the age gadgets and tools/ like phones/televisions,gadgets of our age for example. Also BANINE does not mean children here, but from BANNA -felt good to have/keep. This at least makes more sense to me and is consistent with Qoran s words and context and can match other similar verses. so I would understand the verse as follows Adorned for the people are the worldly pleasures, such as new gadgets/tools/cars/etc, shows/entertainment/games..etc., piles upon piles of gold and silver, trained horses, livestock, and crops. These are the materials of this world. A far better abode is reserved at God. زُيِّنَ لِلنّاسِ حُبُّ الشَّهَوٰتِ مِنَ النِّساءِ وَالبَنينَ وَالقَنٰطيرِ المُقَنطَرَةِ مِنَ الذَّهَبِ وَالفِضَّةِ وَالخَيلِ المُسَوَّمَةِ وَالأَنعٰمِ وَالحَرثِ ذٰلِكَ مَتٰعُ الحَيوٰةِ الدُّنيا وَاللَّهُ عِندَهُ حُسنُ المَـٔابِ And it does not stop there. one keeps pondering and striving for better understanding. Or someone more knowledgeable will have a different and more suitable explanation. in the future. We are all humble servants trying to understand something from the perfect being . GOD says O you hidden secret.*. يٰأَيُّهَا المُدَّثِّرُ Come out and warn. قُم فَأَنذِر Extol your Lord. وَرَبَّكَ فَكَبِّر Purify your garment. وَثِيابَكَ فَطَهِّر Forsake what is wrong. وَالرُّجزَ فَاهجُر Qoran is live for each generation, and in this high tech generation the Qoran is coming out to warn , millions and millions are starting to ponder this book and the garnment/interpretations that was put on it by the older generations is being purified /improved by this generations and continues for the next generations. We can never say never. May the lord bless you and grant us all more knowledge. Peace.

Sejda as a word is not used in the Qur'an (same is for rukoo&#039, but 32nd surah is called Sejda. There's only one usage of words from s-j-d in 3215 from which we can understand the whole concept of Sejda. Prostration is best described through the verb kharre خَرَّ, which is used with words from roots s-j-d and r-k-'. Kharre can mean both, physical prostration or lowering self in front of Allah as opposite to istikbar mentioned at the end of 3215. But 3215 is crucial to understand when, why and how. Unfortunately, I don't know many people who could help me and remind me on Allah's aayaat. Root s-j-d is about accepting, welcoming somebody or something with full support and friendship. Jaada جادة is a broad road (as today avenue or boulevard) and harf seen is headway, or all mean that somebody is going towards something/somebody with his wide heart and mind, not with narrowness and enmity (as Iblees towards Aadem). Prostration should be due to our realization about errs we done and regretting, asking for forgiveness, but it can be non-physical.

Root q-S-r describes restraining. This is why a verbal noun qaSr and its plural quSoor can be used for fortifications, castles. As a verb it means "to be restrained", and it's intransitive; but form IV verb means "to cease" (or not to, since it's used with a negation laa). Verb form II generally means "to cause main verb", and since the main verb is intransitive verb form II is reflective also and it can be understood as "to refrain". The question about 4101 is very important, since this usage of eS-Salaat is showing that this noun has nothing with any physical performance. The context is showing that there's nothing wrong if we restrain from eS-Salaat while travelling if we have fear of being attacked by kaafiroon; this shows that eS-Salaat with people is a connection, nearness, and so. If we travel through the land of kaafiroon and fear of them, there's nothing wrong if we restrain of/from getting connected with them.

I think that all should be split in fifths one fifth for Allah and His resool, one for the nearest, one for the orphans, one for the disabled ones, and one for the homeless (not "travellers&quot. For Allah and His resool is for spreading His message and messenger should take care of that.

notice words with bi ("in&quot cannot wash no water (dry ablution) 56 فاغسلوا fa-ighsilu/so washes ye of وجوهكم faces yours واىدىكم and hands yours الى to المرافق the elbow وامسحوا wa-imsahu/and wipes ye of بروسكم in heads yours وارجلكم and feet yours الى to الكعبىن the ankles two فامسحوا fa-imsahu/so wipes ye of بوجوهكم in faces yours واىدىكم and hands yours منه with it 443 فامسحوا fa-imsahu/so wipes ye of بوجوهكم in faces yours واىدىكم and hands yours https//corpuscoranicum.de/en/verse-navigator/sura/4/verse/43/manuscripts/73/page/15v The use of "bi" is a good point, as it is used when wiping is discussed, both for water and pure ground. Thus strengthens the argument for wiping feet not washing them.

Thank you Waqas for the links, and I will certainly go reading them in detail. Cheers

peace uq, Re 2945 You said "how likely is that individual going to engage in evil and bad things?" Whilst I agree your analysis suggests it is very unlikely, but as you know the Arabic is firm (dare I say unequivocal) on this that salat stops/prevents. To me that seems an unusual statement. As you can see from GL's response he takes at another way as he recognises it would be near impossible for it to mean times outwith salat. As a side note, I do not translate "tanha" as "stop/prevents/wards off" as I go with its most common meaning in Quran and that is "forbids". Of course if one translates it as "forbids" this results in some very interesting consequences. Re 95 As you may know I wrote an article on this issue. For your explanation to work it involves a conversion/reversion or as you put it "their embracing of the truth". No matter which way you slice it, that would have to be considered an exception, not only to the usage of "taba" but also in terms of no compulsion in deen . I find that problematic but others may not. Re 1187 Exactly, you have to interpret/assume the statement they made is somehow incorrect. Note how in 1188 Shu'ayb does not respond in a way that suggests they were mistaken about salat, and by coincidence anha/forbid pops up in use again. Re 999 Yes, this is an interesting one. Not sure how much we can conclude on this usage. Re 2240 This is an interesting usage. I haven't concluded on this one yet. But yes if we go by CA then what you said is definitely possible. It is good that you have pondered over some "anomalous instances" but I don't think your admission of 5 "anomalous instances" warrants the certainty of your previous statement which may give the impression it is impossible for it to mean anything other than "prayer". What if there are more than 5 "anomalous instances"? We must be careful not to fall afoul of a false dichotomy / either/or logical fallacy, i.e. the only option is it means A or B, i.e. prayer or else. What if the truth lies somewhere in between? Let's take a closer look at the verse that is commonly cited to support salat means prayer and that is 4102. "And if you are among them so uphold the salat to/for them..." What does "to/for them" mean and imply? "...then when they have SJD then let them..." Why do only "they" SJD? Reference http//mypercept.co.uk/articles/meaning-of-SuJuD-from-Quran.html

From your comments, I can sense that you are also awaiting the "Promised Messenger of The Covenant" as mentioned in the Quran. If that's the case, you might really enjoy my video about him Who is "The Promised Messenger of The Covenant" according to the Quran? | Quranic Conversations https//youtu.be/YDaIYZQdons I am hoping that with his advent as promised to us by Allah, we will have the final clarification that we are all waiting for. Salam ThelosttruthsofIslam, I'm interested and enjoy your video regarding Promised Messenger of The Covenant. I've also watched your latest video regarding Rasul Ahmad. Thank you for sharing that. Your video make me ponder, that someone in the past really knew about it. Let me explain to you what I mean. That there was a figure of a person or group of people who really understands God's messages, but they didn't want the messages to be widely spread and understood by people. For example the pattern of 19 cycle or Metonic cycle of the luni-solar had explained in the Quran as kind of "God signature's" is inline with the musical major scale pattern. Please see my posts regarding this in here https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606077.msg381103#msg381103 And then they put a ban on playing the instrument as "haram" except for the drum (which has no major scale) in what they called hadith books, just to prevent people to think about it. Now after watching your videos, I'm thinking the same on what they called "Imam Mahdi".. Why it's not Rasul Ahmad as mentioned in Quran? Before watching your video, I think that Rasul Ahmad = Rasul Muhammad or Prophet Muhammad, but I still have questions in my mind. If you familiar with the Apocrypha books you might be notice that in the Enoch's dream vision said that there will be a sheep with a great horn who will stand tall against evil until the day of judgment. https//www.sacred-texts.com/bib/boe/boe086.htm The Book of Enoch Chapter XC But behold lambs were borne by those white sheep, and they began to open their eyes and to see, and to cry to the sheep. Yea, they cried to them, but they did not hearken to what they said to them, but were exceedingly deaf, and their eyes were very exceedingly blinded. And I saw in the vision how the ravens flew upon those lambs and took one of those lambs, and dashed the sheep in pieces and devoured them. And I saw till horns grew upon those lambs, and the ravens cast down their horns; and I saw till there sprouted a great horn of one of those sheep, and their eyes were opened. And it †looked at† them , and it cried to the sheep, and the rams saw it and all ran to it. And notwithstanding all this those eagles and vultures and ravens and kites still kept tearing the sheep and swooping down upon them and devouring them still the sheep remained silent, but the rams lamented and cried out. And those ravens fought and battled with it and sought to lay low its horn, but they had no power over it. To me this is the last piece of the puzzle. I could recognize this dream vision parable fable style, from Adam up to prophet Musa and Isa, but still confused for the remaining story. Who will be the last sheep with the great horn standing until the last day? It could not be prophet Isa or prophet Muhammad. And then I remember this verse, 4361 And he <Isa son of Maryam> was a knowledge for the Hour. So have no doubt about it. And follow Me; this is a straight path. And Isa was the one who told us regarding Rasul Ahmad, 616 And when Isa, son of Maryam said "O children of Israel, I am a messenger of God to you, affirming what is between my hands of the Torah and bringing good news of a messenger to come after me whose name will be AHMAD.'" But when he showed them the clear proofs, they said "This is clearly magic." From verse 4361 we know that Isa had knowledge of the Hour, not about the Rasul who will come after him which has not related to the HOUR. Means that he didn't know about Rasul Muhammad since Rasul Muhammad was not lived in the age of HOUR. So the 616 verse is about Rasul Ahmad which will come after him and lives in the age of HOUR. It will be inline with Rasul Enoch dream vision. So brother, if you have any other ideas regarding this please let me know. Peace

Thanks ) Physical prostrating is okay if its an expression of devotion. Mental one is like 24/7. If you naturally feel the need to physically prostrate, thinking it is an instance of being sincere to God, the Perfect, then do it. If you don't, then why be insincere to God/Perfection? You cannot force yourself to be in awe of God. Either God Has Mercy on you such that you become in awe of God/Existence and existing, or God Chooses not to do this. If God Chooses not to do this, it is because you do not deserve this. If God Chooses to do this, it is because you deserve this. If God Chooses to do this, then be appreciative. If God Chooses not to do this, then do not act as though God Chose to do this. Do not act as though God Has Blessed you by Making it such that you are in awe of it, when this is not the case. I'm confident that some people who physically prostrate are either being pretentious (pretending to be in awe of God without actually being in awe as a result of not having a good understanding of God...which is as a result of not being sufficiently sincere to God and Goodness and Perfection), or they are doing something pointless. They do it because they think they're supposed to do without having any genuine reasons for doing it. A man who is able too see for the first time, may be so in awe of God/Existence, that he may feel the need to physically prostrate. He should do this.

hi, I researched this issue because the position of the sun, as you know, changes throughout the year. So how the sun rises to the right of the cave and when it sets, it hits the bodies of the boys. The Analemma is a diagram showing the position of the Sun in the sky as seen from a fixed location on Earth at the same mean solar time, as that position varies over the course of a year and it look like 8 But there is a miracle in the verse and the sun continued to rise and set and hit the children's bodies at sunset for 309 years. How can this happen? and what about the Analemma it saying it No way. But remember it is a miracle and it occurs in one place of the world. But there must be conditions. the Analemma pattern and which it look like 8 must be Horizontally and that happen only on a certain part of the world. In fact, Analemma changes degrees around the world , so you may see 8 vertically In a country of the world and in another country it Slightly tilted till we reach where the cafe the 8 is Horizontally and What also helps is that the cave is in a mountain and high above sea level. https//www11.0zz0.com/2020/10/30/11/615996401.png https//www4.0zz0.com/2020/10/30/11/723309627.png

Do you believe praying/salah is obligatory or not? I believe that the regular/timed salat is obligatory upon the mumineen, as per 4103. You may find this thread interesting https//free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=9606648.0

salam layth thank you very much for your reply peace

salam ohhh there was no arrogance or judgement plse forgive me if that was the intonation that you felt...it was not my intention i just shared my opinion which is that i truly think it is really incorrect to say what you said and one should not say it, that is all the only judge is The God peace sister houriya

Thanks brother jkhan for your thoughts. I agree that a small fee should be charged or(an appropriate ) a donation to cover the costs incured for books that copy GOD s message or interpret it. GOD in Qoran forbids making money out of His words- Liyashtaru Bihi Thamanan Kaleela- But It is up to people and only GOD knows their motives. GOD bless you. Peace.

Dear 777, welcome. To begin with, my whole family line is 'quranist' as in we give the highest importance to it and follow its teaching etc, however this term 'quranist', I found out from this website, my experience from observation is my grandfather, father and I, that would be 3 generations of experience of being a 'quranist' I have. Like I mentioned I just found out this term from this website and this whole group over here I doubt you would have found this term 'quranist' being propagated on this website - most of us here are 'Muslims,' while Quranist sounds like a sect that worships something other than God alone (I assume they worship the Quran by the name you have given them). Anyways, as tremendous as your experience has been with the ritual Salat - I have read similar ideas from people who do Yoga (the clarity, the discipline, the lack of depression, etc..). In fact, even just normal disciplined excersize will give a person clarity and focus... God will judge His creation by them adhering to the 'Straight Path' He has given - not for perfecting the art of a ritual.