What is Islam?

[muslims]

Peace Muslims,

I gave the english definition not an esoteric, mystical, obtuse definition.

As far as 109/6 is concerned, it is not directed at other believers but non-believers

Sahih International For you is your religion, and for me is my religion."

Pickthall Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion.

Yusuf Ali To you be your Way, and to me mine.

Shakir You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

Muhammad Sarwar You follow your religion and I follow mine.

Mohsin Khan "To you be your religion, and to me my religion (Islamic Monotheism)."

Arberry To you your religion, and to me my religion!'

And please, no links, videos, etc., speak for yourself

God bless

Salam hawk99,

What is your conclusion?

The English translation represents the true meaning of the Qur'an?

And what is the definition of "Believer" and "Non Believer" in the Qur'an?

And he possessed much wealth

so he said to his companion, while he disputed with him

I have greater wealth than you, and am mightier in followers <- Shirk? This is what most people
https//www.google.com/help/hc/images/sites_icon_arrow_up_small.gif would say. Greater wealth,
And he entered his garden https//www.google.com/help/hc/images/sites_icon_arrow_up_small.gif knowledge, skills, family etc.
while he was unjust to himself, He said <- On the issue of justly balanced within ourselves.
I do not think that this will ever perish <- This is also what most people would say.
And I do not think the hour will come i.e. not come within the next few hours, days, years etc.
and even if I am returned to my Lord <- Same, and most people believe they will be in Paradise.
I will most certainly find a returning place better than this Proof that he believe in Allah and the
Hour will come, but not in his lifetime.
His companion said to him while disputing with him

Do you disbelieve in Him <- Shirk?
Who created you from dust
then from a small seed
then He made you a perfect man?

But as for me
He, Allah, is my Lord
and I do not associate anyone with my Lord <- Who is "anyone" in this story context? Self?

Please also compare your opinion with the Qur'an.

You say...

If you all are referring to a language other than english, Islam may mean many things,

Arabic is a "language other than English".

Therefore and according to you, "Islam may mean many things" in Arabic language.

Now, what does the Qur'an say?

an Arabic Qur'an
without any deviance
that they might become righteous
(392

It is inconsistent with the Qur'an.

Further and since I cannot find the word "Madhab" anywhere in the Qur'an, we might also consider that maybe Allah never spoke or place any significance about religion in the Qur'an. The Qur'an talks about way of life, ie. division or human unity, justly balanced or unjust.

God bless.

[nonplus]

an Arabic Qur'an
without any deviance
that they might become righteous
(3928)

It's actually safe here to translate "arabic" into "perfect" which is but a meaning for the word. This also fits perfectly with the statement that follows (ie "perfect without any deviance.&quot

[muslims]

It's actually safe here to translate "arabic" into "perfect" which is but a meaning for the word. This also fits perfectly with the statement that follows (ie "perfect without any deviance.&quot

Thank you for making it clearer.

[hawk99]

Peace Muslims,

What English word would you replace the word "religion" with according to your understanding?

God bless

[jhonsonmustafa]

Salam jhonsonmustafa,

Okay.

I already asked you this question.

What about 22?

What's it got to do with Allah prohibit us to follow what is justly balanced to humanity?

Religion of Islam vs. Deen of Islam

Please look at the actual content..

The real issue is whether it is justly balanced to humanity?

and this is the Deen of Islam.

Do not generalize (fallacy of generalization) and view the matter on a sectarian's perspective.. Quranism, Sunni, Shia, Hadither, Wahhabbism, Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism etc. This is religious perspective, a religion.

It doesn't matter if you label yourself as Quranism or Qur'an Alone or whatever it is.

It is still a sectarian, a religion.

It is not the Deen of Islam.

Peace brother.

Peace Brother,

PLease Read 1788

Say "If the mankind and the jinns were together to produce the like of this Quran, they could not produce the like thereof, even if they helped one another."

[muslims]

Peace Brother,

PLease Read 1788

Say "If the mankind and the jinns were together to produce the like of this Quran, they could not produce the like thereof, even if they helped one another."

Salam jhonsonmustafa,

So what?

What's it got to do with justly balanced?

Do you understand what is the issue?

Peace brother.

[muslims]

Peace Muslims,

What English word would you replace the word "religion" with according to your understanding?

God bless

Salam hawk99,

Is this your argument? )

1. "Madhab" is religion.
2. "Deen" is not "Madhab".
3. Therefore, Deen is religion (Madhab) in English.

Why? You are going to blame the Qur'an because you cannot find the accurate translation for the word "Deen" in English?

Further, I answer all your questions when you asked me. However, when I ask question relating to your conclusion, you ignored, and instead of supporting your conclusion with an ayat, you ask me with a new set of question. Now please answer my question and stick to the issue (refer here).

1. Why are you saying the English translation of "deen" as "religion" represents its true meaning in the Qur'an?

2. What is the definition of "Believer" and "Non Believer" in the Qur'an?

3. What is the ayaat to support your conclusion that the meaning of (Deen of) Islam is deviated in Arabic; ie. It is deviated and Islam should mean religion in Arabic.

Peace brother.

[hawk99]

Peace Muslims,

I am only asking one question.

What English word would you replace the word "religion" with according to your understanding?

God bless

[muslims]

Peace Muslims,

I am only asking one question.

What English word would you replace the word "religion" with according to your understanding?

God bless

Salam hawk99

You still don't get it?

Who cares what it means in English.

Allah never asked me to believe in the translation.

There is only one Qur'an, and it is in Arabic. It is not in English.

If you cannot find the accurate translation for the word "deen", then refer to its true meaning in Arabic. Why you want to distort and replace it with meaning not associated with the word "deen"? (root for deen dayn = debt)

And please give reasons for your conclusion (refer here).

Peace brother.

[Sabina]

Peace Brother Muslims,

The Quran was ofcourse descended in Arabic (native)language on our prophet/messenger Mohammad. Please note that according to Ayats

4458 - We have thus made it easy in your language, perhaps they may take heed.

144 - And We have not sent any messenger except in the language of his people, so he may clarify for them. But God misguides whom He wills, and He guides whom He wills. And He is the Noble, the Wise

16103 - And We are aware that they say "A human being is teaching him." The tongue of the one they refer to is foreign, while this is a clear Arabic tongue.

Suppose if Prophet Mohammad was born in France, then the Quran would have descened in French (native language of Prophet Mohammad to warn people going astray or to assure heaven for people who do good deeds).

Language is not important. But the MESSAGE is.

Sabina

[muslims]

Language is not important. But the MESSAGE is.

Salam Sabina,

I agree but the issue to my discussion with hawk99 are as follows

You say...

If you all are referring to a language other than english, Islam may mean many things

Arabic is a "language other than English".

Therefore and according to you, "Islam may mean many things" in Arabic language.

Now, what does the Qur'an say?

an Arabic Qur'an
without any deviance
that they might become righteous
(3928)

It is inconsistent with the Qur'an.

Therefore, the issue is whether the word (deen of) Islam is deviated in Arabic?
(and the english translation is not deviated? ie. deen of Islam is religion of Islam)

Do you understand what is the issue to our discussion?

Peace.

Main issue..

Whether Allah accepts "Religion of Islam" or "Deen of Islam"?

And whoever seeks a "dnan" (&#1575 other than Islam
it will NEVER be accepted of him
and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers
(<a href="http//corpus.quran.com/wordbyword.jsp?chapter=3&verse=85">385</a&gt

This begs the question What is islam..

And no - it is not a RELIGION. All religions are MAN MADE.

Peace

Salam hawk99,

Is this your argument? )

1. "Madhab" is religion.
2. "Deen" is not "Madhab".
3. Therefore, Deen is religion (Madhab) in English.

Why?

[hawk99]

Peace Muslims,

I am only asking one question.

What English word would you replace the word "religion" with according to your understanding?

If you do not have an answer why not just say so? Millions read the Quran translated in
various languages, so your point is nil. Until you can come up with a better translation
than the word "religion" it will stand. No offense intended.

109/6 I am not calling anyone kafir, but just an example of translations.

Sahih International For you is your religion, and for me is my religion."

Pickthall Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion.

Yusuf Ali To you be your Way, and to me mine.

Shakir You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

Muhammad Sarwar You follow your religion and I follow mine.

Mohsin Khan "To you be your religion, and to me my religion (Islamic Monotheism)."

Arberry To you your religion, and to me my religion!'

God bless

peace

[muslims]

Peace Muslims,

I am only asking one question.

What English word would you replace the word "religion" with according to your understanding?

If you do not have an answer why not just say so? Millions read the Quran translated in
various languages, so your point is nil. Until you can come up with a better translation
than the word "religion" it will stand. No offense intended.

109/6 I am not calling anyone kafir, but just an example of translations.

Sahih International For you is your religion, and for me is my religion."

Pickthall Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion.

Yusuf Ali To you be your Way, and to me mine.

Shakir You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion.

Muhammad Sarwar You follow your religion and I follow mine.

Mohsin Khan "To you be your religion, and to me my religion (Islamic Monotheism)."

Arberry To you your religion, and to me my religion!'

God bless

peace

Salam hawk99,

How many times I have to answer you?

Who cares what it means in English.

Allah never asked me to believe in the translation.

There is only one Qur'an, and it is in Arabic. It is not in English.

In other words, your conclusion is irrelevant to the Deen of Islam. It is not Islam, and no real Muslim should be bothered to answer what is the true meaning of the Qur'an in the English language.

Therefore, If you wish to believe the English Qur'an, no one is stopping you. One thing for sure, Allah only accepts Deen of Islam, and not Religion (Madhab) of Islam (385).

And please give reasons for your conclusion (refer here).

Peace brother.

[hawk99]

Peace Muslims,

I understand, no offense intended handshake

God bless

[muslims]

Peace Muslims,

I understand, no offense intended handshake

God bless

Peace hawk99

God bless handshake

[muslims]

I dare not call myself spiritual or materialist or a cynic or christian or atheist or pagan or hindu or buddhist or taoist or muslim or whatever, because I am all those things, at one time or another; Suelo's Blog

This guy understand the concept of life... bravo

[muslims]

Objective

The recommended method for obedience of the Qur'an is initially through mastering the ibada of fasting (days), sadaqah, reading the Qur'an or dzikr and while doing good to others.

This is the Book (the Quran)
whereof there is no doubt
a guidance to those who are Al-Muttaqun <- The first condition to understand the Qur'an.
(22) Other than Al-Muttaqun?

Therefore, first objective = becoming Al-Muttaqun

Method

and basically, the objectives of Ibada are as follows

Fast "..decreed upon you is fasting as it was decreed upon those before you
that you may become righteous.." (2183)
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Sadaqah "..Take from their wealth a charity by which you purify them
and cause them increase.." (9103)
http//api.ning.com/files/uGCxg7sZSOsBbNwvSUN0m6uFBP5OUvR7e-3lYPcnfzzdki1NKdfBKiMBEzKhhqFLbCaNgzbOCTwHTwBFp0cz3nyqUP-l7F1/arrowDownSmall.png
Hajj (or else) "..That they may witness benefits for themselves
and mention the name of Allah.." (2228)
http//api.ning.com/files/uGCxg7sZSOsBbNwvSUN0m6uFBP5OUvR7e-3lYPcnfzzdki1NKdfBKiMBEzKhhqFLbCaNgzbOCTwHTwBFp0cz3nyqUP-l7F1/arrowDownSmall.png
Salat "..prayer prohibits immorality and wrongdoing.." (2945)
http//api.ning.com/files/uGCxg7sZSOsBbNwvSUN0m6uFBP5OUvR7e-3lYPcnfzzdki1NKdfBKiMBEzKhhqFLbCaNgzbOCTwHTwBFp0cz3nyqUP-l7F1/arrowDownSmall.png
Shahada Alhamdu lillahi rabbi alAAalameen

...

Primary importance

Command War zone Objectives (primary importance)
(illusion) (reality)
Sawm/Fast -> How -> - become righteous (ourselves)
Sadaqah to - to purify ourselves
Hajj (or else) perform? - witness benefits in ourselves
Salat etc. - prohibits immorality/wrongdoing in ourselves
Shahada - understanding of reality (ourselves)

Requirement

Example on the standard required to attain righteousness

By no means shall you attain to righteousness
until you spend (benevolently)
out of what you love
and whatever thing you spend
Allah surely knows it
(392)

And they ask you as to what they should spend (sadaqah)
Say What you can spare
Thus does Allah make clear to you the communications
that you may ponder
(2219)

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Sadaqah Objective (Self Improvement)

100% (what you love) Attain to righteousness
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90% Attain what? futility?
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80% Attain what? futility?
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70% Attain what? futility?
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60% Attain what? futility?
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50% Attain what? futility?
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40% Attain what? futility?
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30% Attain what? futility?
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20% Attain what? futility?
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10% Attain what? futility?
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2.5% Attain what? futility? <- Zakah

Similarly...

Sawm/Fast Objective (Self Improvement)
(Level of starvation)
100% Attain to righteousness? <- Near to death experience?
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90% Attain what? futility?
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80% Attain what? futility?
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70% Attain what? futility?
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60% Attain what? futility?
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50% Attain what? futility?
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40% Attain what? futility?
http//static1.cargurus.com/gfx/cargurus/inventorylistings/circle_arrow_up_green_small.gif http//static1.cargurus.com/gfx/cargurus/inventorylistings/circle_arrow_up_green_small.gif
30% Attain what? futility?
http//static1.cargurus.com/gfx/cargurus/inventorylistings/circle_arrow_up_green_small.gif http//static1.cargurus.com/gfx/cargurus/inventorylistings/circle_arrow_up_green_small.gif
20% Attain what? futility?
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10% Attain what? futility?
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2.5% Attain what? futility? <- Fasting in the month of Ramadhan

[jhonsonmustafa]

Salam hawk99

You still don't get it?

Who cares what it means in English.

Allah never asked me to believe in the translation.

There is only one Qur'an, and it is in Arabic. It is not in English.

If you cannot find the accurate translation for the word "deen", then refer to its true meaning in Arabic. Why you want to distort and replace it with meaning not associated with the word "deen"? (root for deen dayn = debt)

And please give reasons for your conclusion (refer here).

Peace brother.

Peace Brother,

No intention of picking up fight. You neglected 22, 178 and supporting Hadith.
Quran is the Root in language. Its only for reference. The Quran is available in 1000+ plus languages.
Those who wish Allah will reveal in native language.

144
And We did not send any messenger except in the language of his people to state clearly for them, and Allah sends astray whom He wills and guides whom He wills. And He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.

434
And verily, it is in the Mother Language of the Book, in Our Presence, high (in dignity), full of wisdom.

[jhonsonmustafa]

Peace Brother Muslims,

The Quran was ofcourse descended in Arabic (native)language on our prophet/messenger Mohammad. Please note that according to Ayats

4458 - We have thus made it easy in your language, perhaps they may take heed.

144 - And We have not sent any messenger except in the language of his people, so he may clarify for them. But God misguides whom He wills, and He guides whom He wills. And He is the Noble, the Wise

16103 - And We are aware that they say "A human being is teaching him." The tongue of the one they refer to is foreign, while this is a clear Arabic tongue.

Suppose if Prophet Mohammad was born in France, then the Quran would have descened in French (native language of Prophet Mohammad to warn people going astray or to assure heaven for people who do good deeds).

Language is not important. But the MESSAGE is.

Sabina

Excellent Sister. God Bless you

[muslims]

Peace Brother,

No intention of picking up fight. You neglected 22, 178 and supporting Hadith.
Quran is the Root in language. Its only for reference. The Quran is available in 1000+ plus languages.
Those who wish Allah will reveal in native language.

144
And We did not send any messenger except in the language of his people to state clearly for them, and Allah sends astray whom He wills and guides whom He wills. And He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.

434
And verily, it is in the Mother Language of the Book, in Our Presence, high (in dignity), full of wisdom.

Salam jhonsonmustafa,

So am I, and please read and understand the issue to our discussion (refer here) before you bring any irrelevant assertion to the existing discussion.

Peace brother peace