The Message - Update
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Salaam all,
I agree with arnoldyasin and /JM/ on this issue.
Also, I think the numbering of verses should be reinstated as before. With all due respect as to how and why you have come to your conclusions on the verse numberings and order, it is still an inescapable fact that those who claim to follow the qur'an are familiar with the standard verse numbering, and thus, makes for much more conveniant referencing when having discussions with others about the qur'an and it's verses.
My 2 cents.
Salaam,
Damon. -
Peace Layth, All,
My opinion on this matter probably carries the least weight since I'm still quite torn on the understanding. My one cent then how about not translating it at all. Just leave it as "salat" and save yourself the pressure of trying to encapsulate the term into one word, and also save the reader from preconception. Perhaps a disclaimer in the foreword outlining all the possible meanings, encouraging the reader to use the Qur'anic method of tasreef and context in understanding how the term may apply.
Peace,
Tay -
Salaam Layth,
I just skimmed the new translation. Well, the first thing to be noticed is the difference in the introductory essays. Especially in the section where it is listed what the quran is, any reason why you took out the one that talks about revealed by a higher power?
The next one is the numbering of ayats. I second to Damon in this one. Perhaps it will be easier for us and people who are interested in learning the quran to have a translation whose numbering follows the one used most. I know this does not mean that the popular numbering is the most correct; it's easier that's all.
Also, I agree with Tay on the issue of shalat. Just leave it untranslated, so the readers are free to draw their own conclusions about this concept. Perhaps zakat, haj, and a few others as well.
Just my Rp 2 ;D
=adley=
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Peace,
Awesome! yay I like the word Bond more than contact-method just because the word contact-method is a bit too awkward in my opinion.
I've checked those verses mentioned by Wakas, and I agree that those translations actually sound better and fit the context better also.Peace and Kia Ora
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Leaving it as "salat" is not an option I would consider.
Why is the word jinn left untranslated ?
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Salaam /JM/,
You raise an interesting question and this is too, probably, a problem if we want to translate "Salat" but leave this one untranslated.
Even though I understand "Salat" as bond (among other meanings) I still think it will be a lot more fun for people to research this "Salat" issue themselves. D
I understand though that leaving it untranslated may cause confusion, especially to those who haven't read the quran at all before.
=adley=
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Also, I think the numbering of verses should be reinstated as before. With all due respect as to how and why you have come to your conclusions on the verse numberings and order, it is still an inescapable fact that those who claim to follow the qur'an are familiar with the standard verse numbering, and thus, makes for much more conveniant referencing when having discussions with others about the qur'an and it's verses.
The next one is the numbering of ayats. I second to Damon in this one.
Me three! http//i28.photobucket.com/albums/c236/zenje/yes.gif
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Leaving it as "salat" is not an option I would consider.
Salaam Wakas
I'm curious why wouldn't you consider leaving it as is in the Qur'aan which is "Salaat"?
I am finding it interesting how people are translating "Salaat" differently. The Progressive Muslim now changed it to "Bond" and Safar translates it as "the commitment"...
Salaam
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I'm curious why wouldn't you consider leaving it as is in the Qur'aan which is "Salaat"?
I do not consider it an option as a translation is just that, a translation. It is not a proper noun in 'al quran', so why the capital "S"?
I am finding it interesting how people are translating "Salaat" differently. The Progressive Muslim now changed it to "Bond" and Safar translates it as "the commitment"...
I strongly recommend you looking up any Classical Arabic dictionary and seeing what it says about "salat" and its root "sawd-lam-waw", and reflecting upon how they too have seemingly translated "salat" differently.
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Salaam Wakas,
I do not consider it an option as a translation is just that, a translation. It is not a proper noun in 'al quran', so why the capital "S"?
Even though this was not addressed to me, I sometimes write it as "Salat" due to the letter Sawd used. Most of the times, I write it as "shalat" however this may confuse some people. The thing is, in Indonesian, Sawd is transliterated as "sh" while for a lot of English speaking person, "sh" means letter Shiin and "s" means the letter Siin. Thus, I use "S" to indicate Sawd. So, I always try to write it "muSaliina" rather than "mushaliina" whenever I'm conversing in English.
And yes, it is just a common noun. D
=adley=
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Peace all,
Also, I think the numbering of verses should be reinstated as before. With all due respect as to how and why you have come to your conclusions on the verse numberings and order, it is still an inescapable fact that those who claim to follow the qur'an are familiar with the standard verse numbering, and thus, makes for much more conveniant referencing when having discussions with others about the qur'an and it's verses.
This has already been done nearly 2-3 months back...If you check the on-line version of The Message you will see it follows the old Hafs numbering.
Why is the word jinn left untranslated ?
I recall there was an impass on which translation fits best some years back on this issue...
If you can provide the best translation for the word, it would gladly be changed in The Message as we want to avoid using Arabic words in an English translation.
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Peace,
Can anybody here who is directly involved with the Progressive Muslims organization provide myself with a list of names of the ones who are responsible for translating the Qur'aan for the Progressive Muslims?
I did the base translation originally, then amendments/changes were continually made based on the input and suggestions of a large number of members (you can see who if you search for old posts with the title or wording
The Message. -
Peace,
just skimmed the new translation. Well, the first thing to be noticed is the difference in the introductory essays. Especially in the section where it is listed what the quran is, any reason why you took out the one that talks about revealed by a higher power?
I don`t recall this change...Do you have the original essay or reference so that I could look at it?
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Salaam Layth,
I took this from the previous version (Updated August 21st, 2005).
The numbering of ayats, of course, will be different from the current version.The Scripture and The Quran
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Some of the features of the ?Quran? have been recorded as follows- Quran can humble a mountain (5922).
- Quran cannot be replicated by men and Jinn (1789).
- Quran contains a healing for the hearts (1783).
- Quran is what the prophet?s followers have abandoned (2531).
- Quran is without doubt revealed by a higher power (277).
- Quran is to be paid attention to when read (7205).
- Quran disturbs the disbelievers with its words (1016).
- Quran gives detail to the Scripture (103.
- Quran is related to the 7 pairs (158.
- Quran creates a barrier of for those who disbelieve to understand it (1746).
- Quran alone makes the disbelievers run away in aversion (1747).
- Quran is recited at dawn (1779).
- Quran is full of examples cited for mankind (1790).
- Quran contains the ?Zikr?/Reminder (382).
- Quran disturbs the rejecters, they seek to speak over it (4126).
- Quran is to be used to warn people with (621).
- Quran has been made easy to learn (541.
- Quran is preserved in a tablet (8522-23).
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Hope that helps.
=adley=
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Salaam Wakas
I capitalize the "S" in Salaat to place emphasize on the word.
Wakas are you one of the members of the Progressive Muslims who helped translated the Qur'aan in English?
Can anybody in here provide myself with a list of names of the people who translated the Qur'aan for the Progressive Muslims?
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Salaam Al Khidr,
I thought Layth has already answered your last question. Just check his post above. Or you can use the search feature of this forum. Just input "the message" (quotes inlcuded) and choose the General and the Projects forum. You should hit some helpful threads. Hope that helps.
=adley=
