Polygyny - a new understanding from Quran?
-
Hello my respected dear friends. sun Hope you all are doing well. sun
I sometimes believe that some muslims who follow the Quran only are unconsiously influenced by the sects and therefore tends to take some of the sects beliefs for granted. Polygyny is an example of that. How many 'quran only' muslims questions the allowance of polygyny? Well actually I recently saw a blog from a 'Quran only' muslim who seems to have a very rare understanding of polygyny from a quranic perspective. He actually claims that Quran does not allow polygyny and that the verse 43 actually does not refer to polygyny and that the muslims have taken the polygyny idea from the bible where several men have multiple wives. I wanted to share his views with you in order to hear what you guys have to say about it.Here are some basic points made by him
Here Allah is telling us to take care of the orphans. Don?t mix their properties with your (kum plural) property.
43 And if you fear that you are not fair with the orphans, then marry them off, what is easy for all of you (plural), from the women, twos and threes and fours. Then if you fear you cannot be fair then just one or what you have control over with your right hand. That is better, that you do no injustice.
Please read the last verse 43 again carefully. Note the word ?FA-INKIHUU? which means ?MARRY THEM OFF?. Marry off the mothers? of the orphans so that they can have new homes and families.
It does not mean ?YOU GO AND MARRY THEM YOURSELF?. That is not the meaning of this verse. Also pay attention to the word ?KUM? which means all of you (plural). Not singular ?KA? which means you (a single male).
Here Allah is referring to the whole community, that the community must take care of their parents (41), the orphans (42-3) and the widows (43). Lets look at the verse again word by word
Wa-in khiftum And if you fear
alla tuqsitoo that you are not fair
fee alyatama with the orphans
fainkihuu then marry them off
ma taba what is of ease / goodlakum for all of you (plural)
min alnisaa from the women
mathna twos
wathulatha and threes
warubaa and fours
fa-in then if
khiftum you fear
alla ta?diluu you cannot be fair
fa wahidatan then (marry off) just one
aw ma malakat or what you have control over
aymanukum with your (plural) right hand
thalika adna that is better
alla ta?uuluu that you do no injusticeNow lets see the phrase mathna, wathulatha, warubaa = twos, and threes and fours.
Dr Zakir Naik will say that this is the license to marry up to four wives. But this exact phrase also appears in another part of the Quran. Here it is
Surah 351 Praise be to GOD, Initiator of the heavens and the earth, and appointer of the angels to be messengers with wings - two, three, and four. He increases the creation as He wills. GOD is Omnipotent.
Alhamdu lillahi fatiri alsamawaati wal-ardi jaaili al malaa-ikati rusulan uuli annihatin mathna wathulatha waruba?a yazeedu fee alkhalqi ma yashao inna allaaha ala kulli shay-in qadeer
So the malaikat have ?wings? in twos, and threes and fours? So do the malaikat have two wings (mathna) sometimes? Other times they may have three (wa thulatha) wings? Or sometimes they have four (wa ruba?a) wings? Can Dr Zakir Naik answer?
Clearly mathnaa, thulatha and ruba?a refers to a plurality, indicating many. It is not limited to just two or three or four. It means many.
Going bak to Surah 41-3, the community must take care of all the orphans, the aged people and the widows (mathnaa, thulatha wa-rubaa). The whole community has an obligation to take care of the less fortunate.
There is absolutely nothing about marrying two wives, three wives or four wives.
Here is another verse from the Quran that a man cannot have two wives.
Surah 334 ?GOD did not give any man two hearts in his chest. Nor did He turn your wives whom you sideline as if they are (only) mothers for you. Nor did He turn your adopted children into genetic offspring. All these are mere utterances that you have invented. GOD speaks the truth, and He guides in the (right) path.?
God did not give any man TWO HEARTS inside his chest.
Here God is clearly referring to the dirty Arab custom of sidelining a wife when she gets old, leaving her to play the role of a mother only while the husband goes out and gets a new younger wife to entertain himself. God is saying that He did not give a man TWO HEARTS to do such things. You cannot even marry a second wife. There is no polygamy in Islam.
You can read his whole blog here http//biblical-islam.blogspot.com/2009/03/polygamy-answering-dr-zakir-naiks-book.html
-
peace,
This topic has been discussed in significant detail on the forum. I recommend the search function.
I find it interesting however, that the author you quote fails to cover "Then if you fear you cannot be fair then just one or what you have control over with your right hand. That is better, that you do no injustice."
I often wonder why those who promote alternative understandings fail to cover some rather obvious points that seemingly conflict with their view.
-
Hello waqas. I know it has been discussed much. However I wanted an answer to his arguments. I think he means that the word 'but if you fear you can't make justice then only one ' refers to that you shall marry them off justly otherwise just marry off one orphan or whom you have an oath to
-
Hello waqas. I know it has been discussed much. However I wanted an answer to his arguments. I think he means that the word 'but if you fear you can't make justice then only one ' refers to that you shall marry them off justly otherwise just marry off one orphan or whom you have an oath to
And the logic being............ ?
-
I believe that polygamy is only allowed for the protection of orphans ( to provide economic support for widows with children)
42 Give the orphans their money; do not replace the good with the bad, and do not consume their money to your money, for truly it is a great sin!
43 If you fear that you cannot be just to fatherless orphans, then marry those whom you see fit from the women, two, and three, and four. But if you fear you will not be fair then only one, or whom you already have contract with. So that you do not commit injustice and suffer hardship.
Overall no man can do justice in having more than one wife. However that does mean that men can?t have more than one wife. God?s law is clear( Yes they can do so). Personally I wouldn't want to have more than one wife because it can cause a lot of confusion and stress during my young days. And besides, women tend to be a bit bossy sometimes. Who needs the extra trouble? One is more than enough.
Peace,
Kevin.
-
Peace,
43 And if you fear that you are not fair with the orphans, then marry them off...
Who has authority to marry them off especially underage fatherless orphan girls?
Perhaps like this modern day story an old woman told how when she was only 12 years old her parents told her to dressed up because they were going to attend a wedding so she got all excited it being her first party ever and they drove to a village hours away and upon arrival her mother told her "this is your wedding!" and they left her there with the older bridegroom -- is that what is meant by marry them off?
43 and if you fear that not you will be able to do justice in the orphans so marry what choice to you from the females twos and three and four so if you fear that not you can do justice so one or what possess your right hand that minimum that not you oppress
-
Peace all,
Regarding having multiple wifes, I think that no woman that is selfprotected and financialy independent would accept that her husband marry a second woman. Generally, She would leave him and ask for divorce.
Now, for those women that are weak financialy and with no family support, it can be a good alternative for them to marry a wealthy enough man to provide for them with protection and financial support. Certainely, the man should not abuse these women but should treat them with dignity. Life can be hard sometimes for some women, a man's protection is generally needed, although in modern societies such protection can be alternatively provided by the different government services.
To cut it short, some women accept to live in a marriage along with other women because it suits them in one way or another, else they would ask for divorce or simply leave the house. Financial means and social pressures play a great role in such cases. Also, polygamy is not equivalent to women oppression, it is benefecial in some cases, and it is certainly better than prostitution.
Anyway, the man have to be muscle enough financialy, emotionaly and physically in order to accomodate multiple wives, if not, in most cases he would end up alone with no wife at all. nope
In the end, it is all a matter between 2 consenting (hopefully) adults that agree to the terms of the mariage contract.
Do it if you can handle it.
laugh
-
Peace all,
Also, polygamy is not equivalent to women oppression, it is benefecial in some cases, and it is certainly better than prostitution.
Anyway, the man have to be muscle enough financialy, emotionaly and physically in order to accomodate multiple wives, if not, in most cases he would end up alone with no wife at all. nope
In the end, it is all a matter between 2 consenting (hopefully) adults that agree to the terms of the mariage contract.
Do it if you can handle it.
laugh
So nice to see that you are very concerned about prostitution. Of course we can not accept women being prostitutes even if they like it. But you see, the problem is just that there are some poor men in this world as well. How can we then stop these men from becoming prostitutes also? Isn't it then better that these men become the second or third or fourth husbands of a rich lady ? After all, its certainly better for a man to become the fourth husband of a rich lady then to become a male prostitute or some gay. And as you mentioned the important thing is that its between consenting adults, so if a rich lady can afford to protect some men financially in stead of letting them become public propterty and if she can handle it, then she should go for multiple husbands bravo
Salam
-
I know a lot of women do not like the idea that a man can have more than one wife. I know I wouldn't like it if my 'future wife? (God willing) had more than one husband (I'll be mad as hell). However those who consider themselves believers are not in a position to argue or forbid what God has permitted. The Quran is quite clear that polygamy is allowed only for men. This is God's law. For those women who a have a problem with there husband having more than wife they are free to leave the marriage. No one is compelled to stay in a marriage if he or she doesn't love there spouse. Men who practice polygamy are not allowed to abuse it. Polygamy is only allowed among widows (with children) and no one else.
42 Give the orphans their money; do not replace the good with the bad, and do not consume their money to your money, for truly it is a great sin!
43 If you fear that you cannot be just to fatherless orphans, then marry those whom you see fit from the women, two, and three, and four. But if you fear you will not be fair then only one, or whom you already have contract with. So that you do not commit injustice and suffer hardship.
4127 They ask you for divine instruction concerning women. Say, "God instructs you regarding them, as has been recited for you in the book about the rights of orphans whose mothers you want to marry without giving them their legal rights. You shall observe the rights of powerless children, and your duty to treat orphans with equity. Whatever good you do, God has full knowledge of it.
Personally I wouldn?t want more than one wife because it would be unfair to my spouse, it would cause confusion, and most likely carry up my blood pressure to an unhealthy level. Today the practice of polygamy is not as necessary as it was ?back then?. If you remember ?back then? women didn?t have that many rights as they do today. The practice of polygamy (when practiced by the Quran) was a means to provide and protect the widows and the fatherless orphans. This practice was meant to do good and not for men ?to have a fun time?.
Peace,
Kevin
-
I know a lot of women do not like the idea that a man can have more than one wife. I know I wouldn't like it if my 'future wife? (God willing) had more than one husband (I'll be mad as hell). However those who consider themselves believers are not in a position to argue or forbid what God has permitted. The Quran is quite clear that polygamy is allowed only for men. This is God's law. For those women who a have a problem with there husband having more than wife they are free to leave the marriage. No one is compelled to stay in a marriage if he or she doesn't love there spouse. Men who practice polygamy are not allowed to abuse it. Polygamy is only allowed among widows (with children) and no one else.
42 Give the orphans their money; do not replace the good with the bad, and do not consume their money to your money, for truly it is a greaoj
t sin!43 If you fear that you cannot be just to fatherless orphans, then marry those whom you see fit from the women, two, and three, and four. But if you fear you will not be fair then only one, or whom you already have contract with. So that you do not commit injustice and suffer hardship.
4127 They ask you for divine instruction concerning women. Say, "God instructs you regarding them, as has been recited for you in the book about the rights of orphans whose mothers you want to marry without giving them their legal rights. You shall observe the rights of powerless children, and your duty to treat orphans with equity. Whatever good you do, God has full knowledge of it.
Personally I wouldn?t want more than one wife because it would unfair to my spouse, it would cause confusion, and most likely carry up my blood pressure to an unhealthy level. Today the practice of polygamy is not as necessary as it was ?back then?. If you remember ?back then? women didn?t have that many rights as they do today. The practice of polygamy (when practiced by the Quran) was a means to provide and protect the widows and the fatherless orphans. This practice was meant to do good ad not for men ?to have a fun time?.
Peace,
Kevin
Why do you say that polygamy is only allowed for men ? Is it your personal opinion or can you back it up with quranic evidence ? Can you please tell me where quran says that a woman cannot have more then one husband ?
-
Why do you say that polygamy is only allowed for men ? Is it your personal opinion or can you back it up with quranic evidence ? Can you please tell me where quran says that a woman cannot have more then one husband ?
No it is not a personal opinion.
42 Give the orphans their money; do not replace the good with the bad, and do not consume their money to your money, for truly it is a great sin!
43 If you fear that you cannot be just to fatherless orphans, then marry those whom you see fit from the women, two, and three, and four. But if you fear you will not be fair then only one, or whom you already have contract with. So that you do not commit injustice and suffer hardship.
4127 They ask you for divine instruction concerning women. Say, "God instructs you regarding them, as has been recited for you in the book about the rights of orphans whose mothers you want to marry without giving them their legal rights. You shall observe the rights of powerless children, and your duty to treat orphans with equity. Whatever good you do, God has full knowledge of it.
Unless women can marry other women then I'm wrong. However this is not allowed Quranically as you and i both know. What i think you're forgetting Miss is that polygamy is a tool that is meant for good and not to satisfy the lusts of men. At least that is how i interpret it. It is only meant to protect mothers and fatherless orphans.
Peace,
Kevin.
-
KDC501 you have not answered my question so I will repeat can you tell me where the quran states that a woman cannot have more then one husband ? Quran is perfectly detailed right? So it shold be clear about whether a woman can marry one or more. If women have multiple husbands its not necessary for the sexual lust of women. A woman can marry multiple widow men and in that way protect and give motherhood to their children. This can be even more significant in societies where there are more men then women.. Depriving children from a mother is opression
-
Dear Sister,
I already answered your question.
43 If you fear that you cannot be just to fatherless orphans, then marry those whom you see fit from the women, two, and three, and four. But if you fear you will not be fair then only one, or whom you already have contract with. So that you do not commit injustice and suffer hardship.
4127 They ask you for divine instruction concerning women. Say, "God instructs you regarding them, as has been recited for you in the book about the rights of orphans whose mothers you want to marry without giving them their legal rights. You shall observe the rights of powerless children, and your duty to treat orphans with equity. Whatever good you do, God has full knowledge of it.
The above verses are addressed only for MEN.
Ask yourself this question sister Are 'men' mothers??? No men who have children are called fathers not mothers.
Second question Can a woman marry another woman or a man another man.
Answer Absolutely notHence, logical interpretation shows that men alone are meant to enter into polygamist relationships from the above verses since marriage is between a woman and a man ONLY The verse shows that clearly, so why are arguing when God law is made plain and easy to understand. I know that some women have a problem with this law (which is quite understandable since i would have a problem with it myself) but it is not for any of us to argue with what God has permitted. You and I are not lawgivers. God is.
Peace,
Kevin.
-
KDC501 dear brother you missed the point. Again you are providing me with verses about how men can do polygyny. I am asking you about what quran says about how many husbands a woman can have. Can you tell me from the quran how many husbands a woman can have ? Well otherwise it can be argued that tue limit of four wives are For men but quran does not put any limit for women so she can have 10 husbands if she wants. If god wanted a woman to marry only one husband then he would say that in the quran right ? I know that a man does not like to share his wife but polyandry can in some cases be very practical just like polygyny. Hence polyandry (a woman having more husbands) have been practised throughout history. So who told you that a marriage is between a man and a woman only ? That's a relative new western idea. But history tell us that the difination of marriage is different from culture to culture and time to time. And all knowing god should be aware of that and since quran is for entire humanity it shall clearly states whether women for instance in tibet can continue to marry multiple husbands as this practise have existed in their culture for centuries. So Can you give me quranic verses who says that a woman can marry only one?? ?
-
As a side note, Quran does not allow a husband to marry more than one wife without the permission of the first wife etc.
See www.Quran434.com for discussion on various aspects.
-
KDC501 dear brother you missed the point. Again you are providing me with verses about how men can do polygyny. I am asking you about what quran says about how many husbands a woman can have. Can you tell me from the quran how many husbands a woman can have ? Well otherwise it can be argued that tue limit of four wives are For men but quran does not put any limit for women so she can have 10 husbands if she wants. If god wanted a woman to marry only one husband then he would say that in the quran right ? I know that a man does not like to share his wife but polyandry can in some cases be very practical just like polygyny. Hence polyandry (a woman having more husbands) have been practised throughout history. So who told you that a marriage is between a man and a woman only ? That's a relative new western idea. But history tell us that the difination of marriage is different from culture to culture and time to time. And all knowing god should be aware of that and since quran is for entire humanity it shall clearly states whether women for instance in tibet can continue to marry multiple husbands as this practise have existed in their culture for centuries. So Can you give me quranic verses who says that a woman can marry only one?? ?
Dear WITT,
If one to read Q2221 and try to see the context of the verse as rightfully understood as related to marriage, perhaps one can also understand that the prohibition to marry polytheistic women/polytheistic men from the triliteral root shn r kf, is simply a prohibition to marry those who already have partner, i.e married and not as traditionally understood as someone who setup partner with god.
Hence, the verse, i.e Q2221 addresses the issue of polygyny as well as polyandry.
Regards,
-
phil Hello respected brother phil. I have been looking on the verse you mentioned and I agree with you that it can be understood in that way that a person whether its a man or woman shall not marry a person with a partner even if that person 'just' has a girlfriend. We should marry a single person. Hence polygyny and polyandry can be prohibited. But in that case verse 43 does not talk about polygyny just as the muslim boy argues in his blog. It's just simply talking about being just with orphans even if you marry them off to someone.
-
Peace,
To raise a point. Any contention you have with a clear law in al-quran is based on fear. I understand women will have an issue with polygamy what with the whole women's rights movement and the general status of women in society.
However your dislike of any quranic commandment is intrinsically based on a subconscious fear that the rejectors of truth could be correct or lack of knowledge. There is no need to fear the correct application of ALLAH's command, what bad could possibly come from following the instructions of he who designed us all and knows us better than ourselves?
Look inside yourselves and find the source of your discontent. Assuredly it is a hole in your knowledge. You trust your computer's manufacturer to give you correct instructions on how to use it. Then wherefrom comes your distrust of he who is ultimately just?
Hence, logical interpretation shows that men alone are meant to enter into polygamist relationships from the above verses since marriage is between a woman and a man ONLY The verse shows that clearly, so why are arguing when God law is made plain and easy to understand. I know that some women have a problem with this law (which is quite understandable since i would have a problem with it myself) but it is not for any of us to argue with what God has permitted. You and I are not lawgivers. God is.
-
And the logic being............ ?
That you shall be just with orphans even when you marry them of. You can not marry one orphan off to a handsome rich young guy and marry another orphan off to a old man or you can not be stingy with one orphan regarding marriage expenses while showing generosity to another orphan regarding marriage expenses etc. But if you fear that you discriminate between them then marry just one orphan off or the domestic people in your area since the quran in other places encourages single people to
Marry. So marry other people off who cannot afford to marry is kindness and charity. -
Peace All,
In response to Where is the Truth, I take her point. No, the Koran does not tell women they cannot marry more than one husband. There are verses in the Koran, however, that imply that under normal circumstances both men and women may marry only one person. The verse that directs us, for example, not to commit adultery.
Dawn.
