The Search for Muhammad has Ended
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Whe Godex expels adam fromthe garden He tells them in the plural "iHbitu".... And it is always adam and mate...
Look a little yourself. I am short of time. And look at actual people and animals.
Salaam
so it was more than one person , i.e adam and mate... what so indifferent in it...
peace
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Notsingular, ot dual, but pluural,more than two. Ithought that muchwas clear.
Salaam
when a thing is not single by default its plural... whether its two or two million...
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3166 What you suffered on the day the two armies met was by God's leave, and to let those who acknowledge know.
238 We said, "Descend from it all of you, so when the guidance comes from Me, then whoever follows My guidance, they will have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve."
same root word used on otheer occassion clearly tell its two
plural is plural in grammer and its mean more than one..
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its you who bring a language discussion in between,
wheras i was asking something else... anyway come back to the topic and tell me the possible outcome of anything that start ,, is it not a single enitity at some specific point... that was actual topic... or God create adams of every color .. ethinicity lol
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You want to invent a new Arabic language,
Salaam
hahaha , no , the language references which i posted is 1400 years old..
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41 O MANKIND! Be conscious of your Sustainer, who has created you out of one living entity, and out of it created its mate, and out of the two spread abroad a multitude of men and women. And remain conscious of God, in whose name you demand from one another, and of these ties of kinship. Verily, God is ever watchful over you!
peace
Nafs is not Adam, nafs is btw feminine (of course IF we take "HA" to represent "femininity".
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Nafs is not Adam, nafs is btw feminine (of course IF we take "HA" to represent "femininity".
yes in daily language its feminity... either the rooh/nafs of male or female ... its feminity... same like earth lol
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3166 What you suffered on the day the two armies met was by God's leave, and to let those who acknowledge know.
238 We said, "Descend from it all of you, so when the guidance comes from Me, then whoever follows My guidance, they will have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve."
same root word used on otheer occassion clearly tell its two
plural is plural in grammer and its mean more than one..
Salaam Imran
May I write something if you allow me. In Arabic plural is not more than one rather there are three different rules for pronouns. If it is two then a dual pronoun is used and for more than three a plural pronoun is used.
In 3166 has a plural noun "KUM" showing more than two.
What huruf is saying is what we can find in Quran. Adam seems to represent mankind which developed from a single cell. Initially single cell reproduced asexually and at a later stage of development it started bisexual reproduction. This is how this ayat appears to depict. Otherwise you have to accept hadithi interpretation that a single man was created and his mate was created from his rib and then human race expanded through incest.
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May God help us understanding His book.
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In 3166 has a plural noun "KUM" showing more than two.
you are targetting a wrong word my brother...
Initially single cell reproduced asexually and at a later stage of development it started bisexual reproduction.
please clairfy it..
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you are targetting a wrong word my brother...
please clairfy it..
My target was not wrong word but I was trying to say that in Arabic pronouns are either single or dual (only two) or plural (more than two).
Our present scientific knowledge says that life originated from single cell organisms in marshy areas from inorganic matter. Brother consider following verses and see what is said here.
( ( (
It is translated traditionally as
So, let man consider of which stuff he is created. (5) He is created of spouting water (6) That comes out from between the loins and the chest-bones. 2
Does this translation make any sense?
God bless you.
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Peace
I want to give my two cents to imran, huruf and Novice
We were all created from before and we were made to bear witness that Allah is our Lord,
that is why Allah says man will be sufficient as a witness against himself on the day of account.Since the Quran and the topics concerning Adam and the expulsion are not all in sequential order, it means it takes a patient and reasoning mind to put the pieces together.
Think about the following events
Not in any particular order, just my mind way of assembling.? -Allah announced to the Malaika He was going to create man
? -Angels questioned Allah's decision
? -Allah told them that He Knows what they do not know
? -Allah tells Malaika that when He is finished creating man and blows of His Spirit then they should fall prostrate
? -Adam was created
? -Adam's mate was created from the same soul
? -Allah taught Adam All-Names
? -Allah presented something to the Malaika
? -Allah challenged the Malaika to name these things if they were truthful (meaning if they were right in questioning God's decision for creating man whom some or maybe one of them saw as unfit to place on Earth as a vicegerent)
? -Malaika acknowledged that Allah Knows All-Things and more and that they only know what Allah shows them
? -Allah told Adam to inform them of their names! So he did
? -Allah told the Malaika to make obeisance to Adam
? -All the Malaika made obeisance to Adam together except Iblis
? -Allah questioned Iblis on his insubordination
? -Iblis revealed his arrogance, bigotry and jealousy for Adam who was placed above the Malaika
? -Iblis was among the jinn (I speculate a type of Malaika before expulsion)
? -Iblis asked Allah for respite to prove that he was right about man being unfit to hold the Trust and vowed to mislead all of Adam's offspring except for the righteous servants of Allah (as vicegerent on earth)
? -Allah granted him respite and declared that He would fill Hell with him and all those who followed him
? -Allah told Adam and his wife to dwell in the garden for a time and to beware of the Satan because he is to them a clear enemy perhaps alluding to both the desire and the entity known as Iblis
? -Allah told Adam and his mate to dwelled in the garden and eat of every fruit except for the tree
? -Adam was approached by Iblis and he deceived him and his wife into disobeying Allah
? -Adam repented and sought forgiveness from His Lord
? -Allah the All-Forgiver forgave for him
? -Allah took Adam and his wife's descendants from their backs and made them bear witnesser themselves "Am I not your Lord?" Seriously read 7172-174
? We all answered( me, hurt, imran all of us) " Yes we have testified" Quran 7172-174 THIS IS KEY TO UNDERSTANDING why ALLAH says GET DOWN ALL OF YOU!
? -Allah told Adam and WHOMEVER else (his mate, his offspring, possibly Iblis and his children) to ALL get down 20123, 724, 236, 238, 261
? -Adam received words from His Lord and established the Covenant of upholding and supporting Messages and Messengers
? -Here we are...
What happened in the time between Adam and the rest being expelled and the first recorded human civilizations is knowledge we do not have. Is it important? What difference does it make?
Although, if you desire clarification read further in the Quran Noah told the people from before that Allah caused us to GROW from the earth as PLANTS/GROWTHS 7117-18
It is then plausible that men and women were "seeded" in the Mother of the towns, (2859, 2143) the secure city "baladan aminan" (953, 901-2, 2791,1435, 2126 ), the secure town/city "qryatan aminata"(16112), the safe haven established for mankind and grew and spread over the four corners from there. Or another possibility is that we were seeded in all different regions of the earth. Something tells me the first assumption is nearer to reason.
Don't argue over these things without evidence brothers. Brother Imran I agree with both you and huruf. Come together brother and sister. I will explain, as Novice indicated if the subject is two or dual the language in the Quran uses dual form, here in this context of expelling Adam from paradise in all the verses above Allah purposely uses plural not dual plural. In fact, just to clear any doubt you Lord in 20123 uses jamian ALL!!
But I also side with you Imran because Allah addresses Adam as single when He is speaking to Him and commanding him to give names and commanding malaika to prostrate to him
Huruf you are wrong in that aspect Allah clearly addresses Adam in the singular masculine pronoun.
Read these verses 20117, 3872? find all the other relevant ones on your own easily go on corpus.quran.com and look at the occurrence of the word adamu.
The malaika are addressed in plural while adamu is addressed as singular.Now I do not deny the possibility that Adamu might be addressing ONE specific nation of insan while the malaika being possible MULTIPLE tribes/nations jinnati being a distinct than other malaika after all Allah made the malaika messengers having wings two, three or four.
There is no denying, however that Adamu can be both understood as one individual and representative of a nation.
So why are you both right?
Because Adam as one individual and he had one mate and they dwelled together in the garden until they were made to slip. Once they disobeyed our Lord then we all were summoned as a nation for the following reasonsWe were all brought out of our parents? backs to be witnesses over ourselves and to testify that Allah is our Lord and to testify as to the Covenant of God?s Guidance in form of Scripture and Messengers.
This includes Iblis and the jinn.
Then we were all told to get down from there some of us to others as enemies.Novice I disagree with the alternatives you present. The possible alternatives are not confined by neither hadith or the cell theory you present.
The above explanation proves that.1)Nafsin does not even remotely mean cell. Wrong
2)I am a biologist and your rendition of cell biology is horrendous no offense.
3)There are cells that reproduce asexually and cells that reproduce sexually not Bisexually lol
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Cells don?t have a gender Novice! A cell that is sexually reproducing simply means that it goes through mitosis and meiosis (while an asexually reproducing cell only goes through mitosis)
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I think you imagine one asexual cell ?> becoming sexually reproducing?> then having two sexes that?s a big no no
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Meiosis for sexually reproducing cells only means that the cell divides so to give rise to offspring that are genetically different than the parent cell, essentially giving new genetic combination
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Mitotsis which is akin to all organisms but unique to asexually reproducing organisms means the offspring cells are going to be identical to their parents
Therefore sexually reproducing cells belong to only animals, plants and fungi
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Do you understand the implication of this?
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It means that today we don?t know of any type of single cell organisms that can reproduce sexually. We only know of gametes from animals and plants!
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This means to me that it is farfetched to believe that a prokaryotic cell(asexually reproducing) could have evolved into a human gamete or eukaryotic cell able to undergo meiosis. This theory is so far-fetched that scientists themselves are starting to see the light and have come with a theory that states these two had different origins!
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Away with the theory that all cells came from one cell!
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We humans have eukaryotic cells, while bacteria and archaea are prokaryotes
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This means then that in scientific terms your notion of man being one asexually reproducing cell and then becoming sexually reproducing is absurd
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Let us not even mention that the conventional theory for the origin of the eukaryotic cell states that a prokaryotic cell swallowed another prokaryotic cell and instead of digesting it decided to keep it inside itself for its own benefit! If you swallow these lies as scientific facts you are just being deceived by shaytan my friends. I am the utmost sincere advisor to you.
I study these subjects and cringe in horror at the bs they invent? -
I am not sure if you yourself understand what you are proposing brother. Why would Allah create a prokaryote (asexually reproducing organism who has been indicated by some scientists to not share the same common ancestor as eukaryotes) then make it into a eukaryote (again for which there is weak scientific evidence of eukaryotes originating from prokaryotes) and then per your interpretation give rise to bisexually reproducing cells(no such thing)?
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Science is not in favor of your argument Novice. People unfortunately assume science is reason while they are not well acquainted with it. Science as we think of it is not indisputable truth or facts! When you only know conjecture or assumptions about anything and you use that as your basis for believing something this is problematic, with Scripture, science and everything in life. Beware.
By nafsin or soul Allah is describing something of the unseen, metaphysical.
I challenge you Novice to try to replace cell with soul in Quran and if it makes sense post it! Never will you do it!
As a young aspiring scientist I want everyone to know that most of what we consider scientific fact is pure conjecture! Most of it is pseudoscience, but I do not want you to just take my word for it, study it yourselves like I am and you will find me Allah willing truthful!
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Peace be upon you all,
Alhamdullilah.
HP_TECH may The All Mercifull reward you for your striving. it does help to put all the parts together in one place, as due to the nature of the quran, i can be sometimes a jigsaw puzzle, all the pieces fit together perfectly, though only with an open heart to Gods guidance can we see how they fit together.
I agree with your reference to science , with much being conjecture. In my understanding, science, and what it entails is just a theory, one which if i recall correctly should be falsifiable, or able to be proven wrong. However just because we have not falsified something, or proven it wrong does not mean it is true. in fact all we can say about 'scientific facts' is 'they have not yet been disproven' this does not mean that they are true, it does not mean they are false, it is a assumption, or conjecture based on evidence.
the only true evidence is that which is from God, that which is without doubt the absolute truth. there is a large margin of error though, due to the interpretation, or limited understanding, the nature of human beings, however we should all strive to base ourselves soley on the proven truth, God's 'clear evident signs'
rather than the scientific method of claiming as 'fact' something which has supporting evidence, and has not been falsified, but is falsifiable, i am much in favour of the 'cartesian doubt' method of methodical skeptisism, check it out on wikipedia, but here is the jist of it....
"Cartesian doubt is methodological. Its purpose is to use doubt as a route to certain knowledge by finding those things which could not be doubted. The fallibility of sense data in particular is a subject of Cartesian doubt."
The only thing that cannot be doubted in the Clear and Evident Signs of God.
what can be doubted is our knowledge, understanding or interpretation of them, and pretty much everything else.Peace be with you all.
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Peace, by the way, i am not advocating doubt in God, or His signs, theese are the absolute truth, proven again and again, and clearly evident even in our own souls we know the truth, but many deny..
I am advocating that we do not accept any knowledge that cannot be proven without doubt.. In terms of our understanding of the quran, it is helpfull to not rely on your own understanding, i.e to doubt your own understanding, but rather to rely soley on God, because he proves his proven word to us, If He has so willed, and if we are open to seeing it.
proverbs 33-6
Mercy and truth will not forsake you; tie them on your neck; write them on the tablet of your heart; and you shall find favor and good understanding in the sight of God and man. Trust in YHWH with all your heart, and lean not to your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him, and He shall direct your paths.
Peace.
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HP TECH he masculine is used for males and words that are of masculine gener but there is a form of address and reference which form is the same as masculine bu which is used whenn gender is not itended to be shown and which is used for that purpose wither when the sex of the perso or animal is not intended to be shown or because it is kunknown. Of Course quer'an raders of certai type soon as there is not a cler cut markof feminine and it iterests them make everythig masculine but that is not so. Also adam's mateis nor named in the feminine. So o sex is give to ay particuar individual of the adam. Adam is the human vaariety that is give revelatio at that time thus making them insaan not just bashar. The ue of gramatical gender sinn te Qur'an is the same as in Spanish nd grammarias traditionnally mostly men make evrythign masculine that is to their advantaag, but the fact is that there is anothr ggender, which is like masculine, but is used for unknown or unrevealed subjects and also for mixed occurrences of both sexes or genders.
Of course I will not even attempt to convince anybodyof that. I know the reactions. But please do show some femenine form of address for the purported "wife" of adam.
As to that nafs we all come from is to a person it would be a species any time in volutionn who showed the traits of mammals. Mammals do whoe in their bodies the traces of having had the sexual traits of both sexes.
Salaam
Salaam