Proof that the HELL IS ETERNAL
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We cant make any approach to His logic neither poitivist nor empiric nor of any other kind, we have to believe wat He says or forget it. And He says He is just, fair, who will take ito account exactly everything we do and willnot wrong anybody, condemnig somebody eternally is to wrong somebody in the must unjust unfeir, cruel excessive way, and not only it is unjust but for a being who says and insist undendingly on his being utmost mercy and compassion, to punnish to the most horrible suffering another being eternally is pure crulty, not mercy. Itwould kee see to punishh, no question there, but eterally. Where is the need, does He need it does he exlai anywhere how that is a match for any human deed.
Al your proof f eternal hell is you decision, yours, and yours only that kh-l-d must be eternity, but again, how can anything other than God be eternal. Have you really thought thouroughly onn what eternity can be, we annot even conceive it forget make ay dogma out of it. So hell would be i a par with God existing eternally.
Salaam
It is so merciful to torture who is unable to understand and believe that a staff it is turned into a snake, or that we are surrended by djinns...
This Allah is a liar isn't? He make Mankind, and He will we believe in the unseen.
I know Qur'an is true, but I can't recognize the unseen.
My everlast torture in the Hell will be so fair yeah
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And He says He is just, fair, who will take ito account exactly everything we do and willnot wrong anybody, condemnig somebody eternally is to wrong somebody in the must unjust unfeir, cruel excessive way, and not only it is unjust but for a being who says and insist undendingly on his being utmost mercy and compassion, to punnish to the most horrible suffering another being eternally is pure crulty, not mercy.
SalaamHe is a childish God, just and fair only with the ones who believe in the unseen.
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It is so merciful to torture who is unable to understand and believe that a staff it is turned into a snake, or that we are surrended by djinns...
This Allah is a liar isn't? He make Mankind, and He will we believe in the unseen.
I know Qur'an is true, but I can't recognize the unseen.
My everlast torture in the Hell will be so fair yeah
you are in a state of doubt, u said quran true , but u are not believing in unseen, u must beleive in unseen scientificaaly u cannot see something which is out of the limit of ur eyesight , but you know its exist,
can you see air, why u beleive in air? now you will say becoz i feel,, its ur body that feel it, if u dnt have body , u will never feel air , you will never beleive air,
about Allah if he is a liar , how can he predicts a lot of things that happen exactly how Allah told you,?
and at the first place u dnt need to afraid if you dnt beleive in him, just wait for the consequences,
look in ur finger tips, look at the sun moon stars, the fragrance of different flowers , are these things are not enough to ponder even athiest space scientist agree its an intelligent design and there is a designer behind all of this, who is this
my brother your eyes did not have a capacity to see allah but ur innersense have ability to reallise Allah u can only realise Allah , answer of this thing is in quran when mosa wanted to see Allah ,
why are you so afraid of being unfair , everything is fair in love and war just kidding,,,
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He is a childish God, just and fair only with the ones who believe in the unseen.
why Allah grants you a mind, according to dna ,our mind is blessed in several ways which no creation have .
becoz he wants you to ponder on his signs, even the special prophets and messenngers see the signs just the signs not Allah himself,, its a term appointed why are you so unjust with yourself, if he wanted to show himself tou you nd them make you beleive , then there is no point of creating all this stuff,
Allah said , we didn not create all this heavens and earth and whats between them in mere play
its ur own fault if you are not reasoning with your mind, he already granted you a blessed thing
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about Allah if he is a liar , how can he predicts a lot of things that happen exactly how Allah told you,?
You have misinterpreted my sentence. He is not a liar regarding the Qur'an or the scientific miracles inside; He is a liar calling Hitself Rahman.
and at the first place u dnt need to afraid if you dnt beleive in him, just wait for the consequences
Of course I believe in his existence, and in the consequences. There is the specific reason why I'm posting this stuff.
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why Allah grants you a mind, according to dna ,our mind is blessed in several ways which no creation have .
becoz he wants you to ponder on his signs, even the special prophets and messenngers see the signs just the signs not Allah himself,, its a term appointed why are you so unjust with yourself, if he wanted to show himself tou you nd them make you beleive , then there is no point of creating all this stuff,
Allah said , we didn not create all this heavens and earth and whats between them in mere play
its ur own fault if you are not reasoning with your mind, he already granted you a blessed thing
My mind did have busy with this staff-snake affair.
This is the most difficult thing to believe. Why? Because Angels and Jinns are unseen, so we can insist believe they are from a parallel dimension which we can't see. Thus, their existence it is possible.
But this phenomenon sorry, I can't believe.
Allah hitself must submit to the laws that Hitself have created.
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Lostintheworld,
Reread what I wrote; it shows you did not comprehend what I have said. I did not say test God but I said test logic. Logic is logic and there is no special God logic but it is one and the same.
I gave you logical arguments and you see what would appear most sound in terms of logic.
You and other people who have faith in the sectarian interpretation and translation of Quran claim God is "most merciful" and "most gracious", but you contradict that notion with your eternal Hell. It does not make any sense. It does not lead to anything productive at all but merely seems like some primitive revenge. Is that your God?
God as according to the sectarians for centuries has been a very cruel and hateful and it absolutely does not make any sense at all. Why would God bother?
If you grow fine specimens then you save the best and you either destroy the unfit or replant their seeds. Why would you burn those failures in an eternal fire but not just burn them quickly to vanish or even better replant them again to see if they would develop from scratch again in a better manner while retaining whatever imprint was in their soul?
The above paragraph is exactly what God is doing in a brief parable. It is the most efficient method. If God would judge every person only once an extremely low percentage of people would even make it into Heaven. It is questionable whether there would be any person there at all.
Prophets have come a long way. It is not like Jesus was just wondrously born like a powerful prophet without earning the authority beforehand, for example. He had already spent time in the world.
Whatever you do for your God is not sufficient you know, you need to do more, much more. You must forsake the Flesh, the bodily completely, to be even remotely close to ascension. The bodily impulses (the instinct) does ruin one's possibility to merge/join with Heaven. The famous (so-called) "Ten Commandments" were ever made written just to give contemplating people a remedy to pass straight through and are more than only sterile laws to obey. The Decree is intended to help one combat the instinct (al-shaytaan).
Worship is futile when it is not evident in your actions. And God is not as primitive as having any need for your primitive worship either. God's intention was for you to develop to be completed and if you like to be in His "sunnah" (image) you need to be perfected.
You can only get into a worsened case of Jahennom (attachment to bodily), feel its force (fire) utterly.
Heaven is at hand, just repent and reform and join it. No waiting is necessary and if you have not joined until the death you will have failed (that cycle) albeit your good deeds will affect your fate nevertheless.
Be well
Amenuel -
You have misinterpreted my sentence. He is not a liar regarding the Qur'an or the scientific miracles inside; He is a liar calling Hitself Rahman.
Of course I believe in his existence, and in the consequences. There is the specific reason why I'm posting this stuff.
ok now i understand , basically you are saying he is not rehman, defiantely he is rehman and there is one full chapter on this name , chapter 55 as a coincidence my signature is one of the theme of that chapter,
read this chapter from the very first verse he wants you to ponder on it,
after three four verses he said, he imposed balance , if balance distrancts whole thingie distratct, we need to understand our balance,its only human being who transgress the balance, rest of the things are subjected to his commands , a tree of fruit will definately gives a fruit , stars sun moon definately run their courses, every things prostrating to him not literally or physically but by obeying his commands and the purpose, due to which Allah creates them,
we human being spend 50 60 years and cannot find our purposes of this life and get died , consequnces will occur to us accordingly its a law,mezaan ..
Allah is not a liar , a balance of chair is on four legs but if one of them break , chair cant stand,
if you deny him and make wrong use of your sense what he giives you , your soul will never get relaxed results.
what happen if tree will not give u fruit, sun will not give u ennergy, mom will not give u food, ur father throw you out of fear of hunger, bad results defiantely,
whhy dnt you think this he is owner of majesty owner of your body movement character, why dnt we listen to him , yeh there are somethings i have questions as well , but the time of these answers are not here in this worldy life inshaLLAH WE will get the answers on appointed term,
and he will will not tortute people , he is rahman as well as just , if all the people who rapped , robbed, murder innocnet people if he forgive them, people like us willl say to Allah u r unjust why they are here , they did these things to us,
try to understand punishment is logical and understandable, if there is no cooncept of punishment no body will afraud of doing whatever they want,
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My mind did have busy with this staff-snake affair.
This is the most difficult thing to believe. Why? Because Angels and Jinns are unseen, so we can insist believe they are from a parallel dimension which we can't see. Thus, their existence it is possible.
But this phenomenon sorry, I can't believe.
Allah hitself must submit to the laws that Hitself have created.
a circus master can make a duck into hen ,
david copperfield vanish the statue of liberty,
david copperfiled cut the body of human in to two.
and these all are tricks,, not magic
why dnt people spend their monies on watching these types of shows,
so if a hidden force visible to you by perfoming the function which need to show our human eyes what so indifferent in it,, my brother cant you see the heavens without pillars, what is a greatest than that,
sanke thingie is veryyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy smalll with respect to the majesty of lord
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You and other people who have faith in the sectarian interpretation and translation of Quran claim God is "most merciful" and "most gracious", but you contradict that notion with your eternal Hell. It does not make any sense. It does not lead to anything productive at all but merely seems like some primitive revenge. Is that your God?
This is PRECISELY the reason posting this stuff.
I DO NOT CONSIDER Allah being so ''Rahman" because He will torture people who are unable to understand and recognize the paranormal phenomenon like staff turned into snake.
Allah is a childish God with no "rahma" toward people who are unable to understand and recognize His miracles.
If He is so "rahman" why created people who haven't asked to born that He know they wouldn't able to accept His signs?
Rahman... yeah yeah nope
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Allah hitself must submit to the laws that Hitself have created.
Why?
So you do not think Miryem (Mary) conceived without a physical male present either?
Virgin conception with no added seed (sperm) is against the laws of nature.
Or Yesu (Jesus) did not heal sick people?
Healing this way is impossible by the laws of nature.
There are more examples...
Mosa (Moses) did present several weather phenomena to Feroun (Pharaoh) which is against the laws of nature as one would not be able to just afflict people with disaster by will alone.
God does not need to obey the laws of nature and does so not either, and prophets with authority do not always have to obey the laws of nature either.
God is in those who are Him/Her/It and thus those who have God in them will be able to present wonders that would appear paranormal.
The sole struggle for everyone is to separate the bodily from their spirit and hence have that merging with God. These will sense the elevation. Most importantly they will realize what it is to exist as an individual and pity those who do not.
Be well
Amenuel -
You can only get into a worsened case of Jahennom (attachment to bodily), feel its force (fire) utterly.
Heaven is at hand, just repent and reform and join it. No waiting is necessary and if you have not joined until the death you will have failed (that cycle) albeit your good deeds will affect your fate nevertheless.
Be well
AmenuelUnfortunately, Jahannam is not the "attachment to body" but a very real place in an another dimension.
I know people like you, your opinions; like Malaika being only the good intentions or instinct impulse you to do the goods acts; or being the good people surrond you, like your friends, etc. But no, Angels are creatures from other dimension.
I know people like you believe Heaven are the world that you creates around you acting good, but no; Heaven is a real place in another dimension.
I advice you to forget all these Sufi and philosophical things and starts believe in the physical and extra-dimensional reality of the quoted things.
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Why?
So you do not think Miryem (Mary) conceived without a physical male present either?
Virgin conception with no added seed (sperm) is against the laws of nature.
Or Yesu (Jesus) did not heal sick people?
Healing this way is impossible by the laws of nature.
There are more examples...
I know there are more examples, and these ones are the cause of my fate and my destiny into Hell elektro brickwall
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This is PRECISELY the reason posting this stuff.
I DO NOT CONSIDER Allah being so ''Rahman" because He will torture people who are unable to understand and recognize the paranormal phenomenon like staff turned into snake.
Allah is a childish God with no "rahma" toward people who are unable to understand and recognize His miracles.
If He is so "rahman" why created people who haven't asked to born that He know they wouldn't able to accept His signs?
Rahman...
That is because you have let yourself be convinced by an interpretation of Quran that was literally fabricated by a bunch of ancient clerics/scholars.
Rahm means complete. This is why a woman's uterus is called aRaham because it is the place where the fetus is completed. Arabic is a very painting and descriptive language. Merciful is an invented definition because the ignorant clerics needed something that made sense in their regard with the basmala (because they did not know what Allah means either, see below).
Rahman is an adverb of the same root which means something like 'totally ', e.g. al-rahman al-raheem is a phrase that means "totally complete".
Allah means 'Who Is'.
That being said, Rabb is merciful, but the grand majority of Quran needs a serious reinterpretation. There is no eternal Hell but a conditional "development ground" and in it one will remain until mature/ripe. The ancient Jews which the sectarian interpretation of Quran attacks were perfectly wise and correct.
If God was not merciful, everyone would immediately be thrown in Hell for failing a brief number of years. A grand majority of people would utterly fail and burn forever for no apparent gain and productive result.
The amount of people truly managing the passage to Heaven is small and this is because they do not understand their part and why they were made in the first place. This world means utterly nothing actually and was just made as a kind of distraction, a contradiction. Some people in the past have even called the world evil. This place is nowhere someone would like to be if they knew their true selves.
During the past 2000 years something disturbing has happened and faith does not look anything like it once used to. Jesus as seen in the Biblical Gospels presents a faith very incompatible with mainstream Christianity despite that Jesus is quite clear on what he says. Quran's sectarian interpretation is incompatible utterly with those Gospels, but Quran does not make any sense logically meaning something is seriously wrong. An eternal Hell has absolutely no practical use at all since nothing ever improves because there is no change.
And God is less merciful than I am, does that sound plausible? I would never have even considered letting anyone even Hitler or Pharaoh burn for endless hours in molten lava because I could never bear the knowledge of the pain they endure. No atrocity done is to be punished more than the full value of the misdeed. Obviously it does not add up. It only makes God more primitive and hateful than I am which obviously seems contradictory given the magnitude of God.
Be well
Amenuel -
I know there are more examples, and these ones are the cause of my fate and my destiny into Hell elektro brickwall
make it easy for urself,
very carefully plz ,,
a process of birth happend with the drop of sperm, and then into shapes bones and spirit,
what we know today,
thats the law of God.this law can be different , and what we know sperm today if oil is a cause and our bodies generates oil instead of sperm , it is understood as well,,,
color of grass is green , becoz its green, it can be red, may be it is red somewhere in far far dimenshions of universe..
law of God is , he creates whatever he wills. whatsoever ways he chooses,
thats another form of miracles, y you beleive in sunlight. where sun is getting energy from can you see any wire connects to sun with some solar power ,
and the requirement of beleiving is to beleive on the hihgness of lord, beleive on judnement day, do righteous deeds and do worship( obeying his commands) then u dnt need to fear about anything ,
about miracles , is it not enough from a drop of water a living being come into existence after 9 months how come it happen ,, just think about it,,, plz, dnt make urslef distract,
about the laws of miracles we dnt have answers as well , wait for the result , we will get answers,
same when u give exams you cant get marks before result dates,
just for one random person laws will never change
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@ mof sometimes your posts are interesting to read but sometimes it really make me feel sick when u claim something which is totally illogical , irrelevant and without any evidence, u need to immprove urself on lot of things as a brotherly advice i like ur talenet but i dnt like a talented person just deny something on his personal choice. try to make people understand what they are asking dnt bring sectarians issues all the times, there are lot of interpretations of quran and researchers know how to recitfy the errors of language, its not a great deal my brother,
peace
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Lostintheworld,
Everything is possible, nothing is impossible.
But, God does not show miracles directly to an unworthy person unless there is a reason for it. People need to have reached a certain level of self-realization and development before the paranormal things will occur. This is because this is also a test of our intellect and how we can process information unaffected by the bodily, by Satan which is the innate drive which likes for us to "enter firmly". Read definitions for Shiin-Tay-Nun in ancient lexicons, you will find that the least used are the most plausible when delivering a thought-through rendition. You can also compare the alternative with Sanskrit which has a word quite similar.
Shaytaan is just the desire of the body you have which is not the real you and it does entice you to activities you are almost like a slave to, e.g. your potential desire to mate. You like to be it if you follow Shaytaan. Homo Sapiens is nothing more than a primate, an animal, despite being more advanced than other animals. Just like the World, the body is also imposed on you like a kind of contradiction.
You need to separate yourself from the impulses that the body gives you in order for you to be sound/whole (al-eslam). When you are like that you can become complete as a person, just as your God made for you to be.
The remedy
- Find your One identity, join God inside of you.
- No representation and love for what is in this world to idolize it.
- Stand by your words.
- Contemplate frequently.
- Treat your neighbor as yourself.
- Avoid getting angry
- Avoid sexual arousal
- No exploitation of others for your own gain.
- Be true, do not lie
- Avoid being jealous.
Above is a explanation of what each directive really means, their background.
Be well
Amenuel -
If He is so "rahman" why created people who haven't asked to born that He know they wouldn't able to accept His signs?
Rahman... yeah yeah nope
lol my brother if you read quran , humanity was already there , and we been asked to accept the offer which every creation deny. me you everybody who will come untill day of reckoning, they accepted this offer , because we are fools ,
when you are in examination hall teacher will never give you answers , he already gave his lecture.its you who accpeted that test and now screaming at the fault of teacher. do you want that teacher will give you book so that you will recall your answers, no never,
but see how rehman is our lord he already gave us a book fully detail and fully logical with history and reason , and this life is our test our examination is going on, what we already accepted at first place, all of us,
you are giving a exam with a book in hand , but about first creation of manking refer evolution you will get more answers inshAllah first birth is from the womb of planet and second birth is from the womb of mother after accepting thre offer, hope this will help you
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Imran,
I am rising the point based on logic and logic is logic and it is a powerful tool. When I cannot convince you based on insight into Quran then logic is a good tool.
I have raised good points to the senseless nature of many sectarian fabrications without using Quran. It is on an abstract plane, but exposing things explicitly by dealing with the key issue instead of on a level of interpretation of a scripture.
And I am trying to make 'lostintheworld' understand and for that he needs to first realize Quran is a dead end unless seriously reinterpreted.
I am not denying anything on personal choice but after due information. And if I know something and I know others have the wrong information, even disinformation, then I obviously pity them and feel obliged to intervene to help them, right?
Disinformation is a severe and means people believe in something which will not help them but potentially even have adverse effects.
No one is forced to listen to or heed anything I am telling, it is just sincere advice.
I am outspoken about illogical nature here and illogical nature there, but that is a highlight I make. I would not say it is illogical if it was not against logic. Often people are not aware of how illogical their belief is until they challenge it especially in a new line of thought, and for that it takes a lot of psychology and pedagogy, especially on a subject that has no physical empiricism possible. It is a bit like studying psychology because you can only abstractly analyze based on observation drawing logical conclusions. Just like that is the religious topic.
But people are not analyzing their faith, challenging it against logic
You see, in that scope I am both more merciful than God and I am much friendlier. Does that sound logically feasible? God is supposed to be better than me, is God not?
You know, God, in the sectarian view, has a persona very similar to a person with megalomania, very similar to powerhungry human kings (dictators) and influential clerics. It is strange that a human interpretation of a religious scripture takes a so primitive attitude. It is like if a human cleric or scholar thought instead of God of what God Himself is based on primitive views of the world and hierarchy.
Be well
Amenuel -
when you are in examination hall teacher will never give you answers , he already gave his lecture.its you who accpeted that test and now screaming at the fault of teacher.
I not remember enter into an agreement with Allah confused