Fasting in North Pole
-
This question of God not followign the rules of grammar reminds me of another kind os questions which are in themselves not proper, like the one forcig us to follow either God or the NASA. That is an artificial problem before which nobody finds him or herself. There are such things and itllect ad understanding. It is obvious that if God convicnes people of anything it is not because someone coes and tells you God say thhis therfore if you do not say this you are foollowing someone else.
We fllow what we unerstand to be true, to be a fact, o mater whether someone tells us it is God, who says or it is the tree who says who has spoke to me.
Same with grammar, it is ot that grammarians or God say, it is that we find it intelligible and logic and conducive to our uderstanding. Grammar rules exist not because aybody has spend time orulatig them ad telling us to follow them. Grammars rules exist because they are an inherent ondition og language. There i o languag without grammar rules. The collecting and systematization of those grammar rules may be the work of grammarians or of ppeople who like doig it, but they did not invent any rules, the language is developped with rules, just as we are born with a heart, eyes, etc. etc.
Would anybody ask us who gave you those eye and heart God or the doctors? For somebody who already has lived and known about God and logic and the world the question would be silly, becaue ev that question is a creature of God, that that is not the question but whether anything w care about is true or not.
Rules of grammar exist, no language lacks them, the questionn would be what is the proper rule for ay given situation, getting out of the issue by saying that God has His own rules is evading ommpletely the question at hand, so that we do nnot get any further.
Also, anybody can say God says this. It is so easy... But the question is convicing an honest person, and to convince an honest person you have to have more arguments that "God says this", like that "God says I follow this rule or I do not follow it and why either way, unles of course it is obvious why.
Salaam
-
The holy month for the holy month, and the sanctities are subject to retribution. So when anyone commits aggression against you, be aggressive against him in the like manner as he did against you, and fear Allah, and be sure that Allah is with the God-fearing.
In this traditional translation what "The holy month for the holy month"means? Does this translation make any sense?
Hi Novice,
There are no holy months, months are not holy.
btw the word used for holy is from the same root as the word they use for "forbidden" hmm -
Peace/Salaam be upon you, Novice,
All our Thanks are absolutely and only to AL-LAH.
I do not follow traditional arabic grammar rules, my dear Friend, when reading QURAN TESTAMENT,
because I believe that AL-LAH has no obligation to follow those man-made traditional grammar rules,
but we have an absolute obligation to follow GOD-Made Perfect Grammar Rules in their rightful Context in QURAN TESTAMENT,
because I witness that AL-LAH can clearly break those man-made traditional grammar rules, many times throughout QURAN TESTAMENT.But even if we had to follow that traditional grammar rule above and had to refer that pronoun (="hu"
exclusively and only to that closest noun (="al-Shahr" above,
I think we can still understand it the exact same way (even though it would take a little bit longer) as I tried to clearly explain it above.My basic understanding with regard to this root above ( م is as follows
it is used as "Fasting" (=i.e. abstaining from all eating and drinking)
specifically in this form (="Siyaam" throughout QURAN TESTAMENT (=2/183, 187, 196 & 4/92 & 5/89, 95 & ....),it is used as "Fasting" (=i.e. abstaining from all speaking and talking)
specifically in this form (="Sawm" throughout QURAN TESTAMENT (=19/26),My basic understanding in this regard is as follows
al-Shahru al-Haraam bial-Shahri al-Haraam = the Holy Month is (equally respected) as the Holy Month!
i.e. the Holy Month (of yours especially Month of Ramadan in which we should fast as it is written unto us in QURAN TESTAMENT here)
is (to be equally respected) as the Holy Month (of previous Congregations Jews and Christians
= especially their Month of Abib in which they should fast as it is written unto them in TORAH and GOSPEL).QURAN TESTAMENT 5/44-47, 48, 68-69
*Please, also absolutely see these Verses above in QURAN TESTAMENT here
http//www.19covenant19.com/mucize_detay_id165.html
Remain in peace/salaam.
========================
(*Whatever I say that is perfectly RIGHT and CORRECT
is absolutely and only from AL-LAH Alone,
but if there is any mistake in what I say
is absolutely and only due to my own shortcomings (i.e. unintentionally inaccurate/incorrect understandings).
(=QURAN TESTAMENT 34/50)Thanks brother I respect your freedom to understand things in your way and to your satisfaction.
Peace
-
Hi Novice,
There are no holy months, months are not holy.
btw the word used for holy is from the same root as the word they use for "forbidden" hmmHi Bender
Yes you are correct months are not holy. Al-shahr does not seem to mean month otherwise holy month for holy month makes no sense.
-
Hi Bender
Yes you are correct months are not holy. Al-shahr does not seem to mean month otherwise holy month for holy month makes no sense.
makes no sense untill you read the next two sentances!, or the 10 verses surrounding it, or the rest of the quran, or the rest of Gods revelations..
there is always a context.. lets not forget that. usualy the context makes it clear what its talking about
-
makes no sense untill you read the next two sentances!, or the 10 verses surrounding it, or the rest of the quran, or the rest of Gods revelations..
there is always a context.. lets not forget that. usualy the context makes it clear what its talking about
What does holy mean that a month can be holy? A month is just an abstract concept.
imo only what lives can be seen as holy, holy in a sense that we are not allowed to misuse it. -
What does holy mean that a month can be holy? A month is just an abstract concept.
imo only what lives can be seen as holy, holy in a sense that we are not allowed to misuse it.Peace
nowhere does the actualy verse say holy
haram does not mean holy
a month is not an abstract conceptnoun
1.
Also called calendar month. any of the twelve parts, as January or February, into which the calendar year is divided.
2.
the time from any day of one calendar month to the corresponding day of the next.
3.
a period of four weeks or 30 days.
4.
Also called solar month. one-twelfth of a solar or tropical year.
5.
Also called lunar month. the period of a complete revolution of the moon around the earth, as the period between successive new moons (synodic month) equal to 29.531 days, or the period between successive conjunctions with a star (sidereal month) equal to 27.322 days, or the period between successive perigees (anomalistic month) equal to 27.555 days, or the period between successive similar nodes (nodical month or draconic month) equal to 27.212 days.
6.
an unusually long period of time of indefinite length
I haven't seen him for months. -
Peace
nowhere does the actualy verse say holy
haram does not mean holy
a month is not an abstract conceptnoun
1.
Also called calendar month. any of the twelve parts, as January or February, into which the calendar year is divided.
2.
the time from any day of one calendar month to the corresponding day of the next.
3.
a period of four weeks or 30 days.
4.
Also called solar month. one-twelfth of a solar or tropical year.
5.
Also called lunar month. the period of a complete revolution of the moon around the earth, as the period between successive new moons (synodic month) equal to 29.531 days, or the period between successive conjunctions with a star (sidereal month) equal to 27.322 days, or the period between successive perigees (anomalistic month) equal to 27.555 days, or the period between successive similar nodes (nodical month or draconic month) equal to 27.212 days.
6.
an unusually long period of time of indefinite length
I haven't seen him for months.Peace,
Holy or forbidden does not really matter, a month can never be holy or forbidden.
And time or a period of time is an abstract concept. It's like you say holy number 7. -
Peace,
Holy or forbidden does not really matter, a month can never be holy or forbidden.
And time or a period of time is an abstract concept. It's like you say holy number 7.well the quran does not say holy or forbidden, it says HARAM, or whichever form it happens to be in..
i do not say holy number anything.. thats your own saying.
Peace, i seek not the ignorant.
-
well the quran does not say holy or forbidden, it says HARAM, or whichever form it happens to be in..
usually haram is translated as "forbidden" or "holy" thats why I used those words, but good to hear you have a better defintion.
i do not say holy number anything.. thats your own saying.
the you was not you but a general you, thus that the concept time is as abstract as a number
Peace, i seek not the ignorant.
I do not understand why you respond like this.
Anyway peace -
This is a very interesting topic. Orthodox Jews observe the Sabbath at Friday sunset which also poses problems above the Arctic Circle and I recall a rabbi saying that one should ideally go by the nearest place where there's a defined sunrise and sunset. However, when it comes to Ramadan this can be quite problematic. Even at places just below the Arctic Circle with sunrise/sunset the "night" may only last an hour or so. I am yet to fast, but I could only imagine how difficult and possibly dangerous that could be.
As for winter Ramadan, going by the same rule one would be permitted to eat 23 hours a day, which I would hardly consider fasting. Mecca time sounds like a reasonable compromise, but then again Mecca is very far from the Arctic Circle so I'm personally unsure about that. Maybe twelve hours eating and twelve hours fasting? My view is do whatever you feel okay with as long as you are not in danger.
-
usually haram is translated as "forbidden" or "holy" thats why I used those words, but good to hear you have a better defintion.
the you was not you but a general you, thus that the concept time is as abstract as a numberI do not understand why you respond like this.
Anyway peacePeace, i have certainly erred, but this topic, and many others, this forum in fact, is so much just vanity, and pointless tail chasing..
2855
and when they have heard vain conversation they turned well away from it, and they say "to us, our deeds, and to you, your deeds. Wellbeing upon you, we do not wish to regard the ignorant."
this is why i respond like this. i have erred. Lord knows. i do see you as a doer of good, but i do tire of vain and pointless argument or conversation..
Prehaps i need a break from this place.. or to not even join in on the topic in the first place..
peace..
-
Peace imrankhawaja I agree with you in regards to salat, zakat is as you mentioned,
but it is a form of purification as well. Your views about hajj I think are misinformed.
Hajj is the fulfilment of Allah's command, do not be so quick to cast a negative
light on what Allah has instructed the believers to do IMHO.God bless you
Peace Hawk.
I agree and heed what you say. Let me add the following
To each their understanding and their rights and rites
Do whatevever you wish GOD is aware of everything you( we) do.
Ask the questions by all means but do not dig your heel and follow your own ego.Understanding/questioning is one thing,throwing the bath water with the baby is another.
What does not suit us is what is usually better for us?GOD bless you.
Peace.Well said. I'd like to add
33/35 Indeed, the Muslim men and Muslim women, the believing men and believing women,
the obedient men and obedient women, the truthful men and truthful women, the patient men
and patient women, the humble men and humble women, the charitable men and charitable
women, the fasting men and fasting women, the men who guard their private parts and the
women who do so, and the men who remember Allah often and the women who do so -
for them Allah has prepared forgiveness and a great reward.peace
This is a very interesting topic. Orthodox Jews observe the Sabbath at Friday sunset which also poses problems above the Arctic Circle and I recall a rabbi saying that one should ideally go by the nearest place where there's a defined sunrise and sunset.
Peace Celt The rabbi gave good advice IMHO!
-
Mecca time sounds like a reasonable compromise, but then again Mecca is very far from the Arctic Circle so I'm personally unsure about that. Maybe twelve hours eating and twelve hours fasting? My view is do whatever you feel okay with as long as you are not in danger.
Yea, because if we feel we have to go by the timings of another location, then why don't we just skip the locations and just decide on a number of hours to fast. It's rather unnecessary to pick another location to follow the timings of if they don't represent your actual location anyway. Seems like people think they can "save" the situation by picking another location, not realizing that once you divert from the timings of your actual location, then you have diverted 100%. You cannot divert "just a bit" by picking another location as opposed to not picking any location at all. Just decide on a number of hours and go for that. If it (real timings) doesn't work, it doesn't work.
Peace peace
-
there could be another theory.
the timing should start from masjid al haram and throughout the world wether its north pole or south, same like there is a focal point direction.. throughout the world..
is this theory fit or not..?
-
Peace imrankhawaja I agree with you in regards to salat, zakat is as you mentioned,
but it is a form of purification as well. Your views about hajj I think are misinformed.
Hajj is the fulfilment of Allah's command, do not be so quick to cast a negative
light on what Allah has instructed the believers to do IMHO.God bless you
peace hawk,
i m human being and human being = possibilty of errors,
and these are just my understanding of the purpose behind rituals. what you can say the advantages of rituals...
you asked it and i told you according to my view , and all are Allah commands not only hajj,but also zakat, salat, soum, honesty , kindness, paying respect to others, and all have results and advantages as well... hope u got it now..
for example , there is a command of God to guard our private part and stay away from illegal sex, but we know its a weakness in human body one can stay away from it with hurdle and most of the people find it hard to stay away.. and they actually wanted to do it...
is there is any apparent purpose of staying away from illegal sex, or can annybody prove it logically its wrong.. its only the matter of honour in some traditions , rest of the world like western people dnt give a dam about it... but we as a beleiver we try our best not to involve in it.? what you will say about it
God bless you too..
-
makes no sense untill you read the next two sentances!, or the 10 verses surrounding it, or the rest of the quran, or the rest of Gods revelations..
there is always a context.. lets not forget that. usualy the context makes it clear what its talking about
Well the verses before or after 2194 show that Al-shahr is referring to fighting and unrest. In that case yes Al-shahr can be replied with Al-shahr but only to the same extent. Next part says do not cross limits. Al-shahr for/with Al-shahr as the month does not make sense when studied in the context of surrounding verses.
Peace